Author Topic: Snuggle up to this teddy bear  (Read 4458 times)

Offline Soda

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« Reply #60 on: December 05, 2001, 05:09:00 PM »
Notice he emptied the gun into the bear.... anyone who as seen a Griz that's pissed off knows how fast 1,200 pounds can move, it's amazing.  No idea how many rounds this guy squeezed off, or how fast he can cycle his bolt/aim/fire but he had some time to do it.  Brush that thick (looking at the picture) is prime for close encounters since it's too thick to see far if you are being quiet.  Still, it's a questionable story brush like that is also perfect for hiding in.

I have a uncle (actually a second uncle) who is a provincial game warden and he says that 90% of the calls for bear encounters he gets are either stupidity (open food) or accidentally on purpose (maybe even to the point of baiting).  The problem is it's basically impossible to tell.

"Yeah, there were 8 of us all sitting around the fire and maybe we had 2 open coolers of peanut butter and a dead deer hanging in the campsite... good thing we all had 12 gauge shotguns with us loaded with slugs when the bear wandered into the campsite and attacked."

Funny side-note: had a black bear in my inlaws apple tree last fall.  Bad summer so no berries to eat, the bear climbed right up into the apple tree.  Appletrees aren't really designed to take that much weight.  After letting it leave (you don't try and scare off a bear that's eating) we inspected the tree... where there were limbs left the bark was pulled off in sheets from the bears claws trying to get traction.  Nothing like seeing a black bear fall 10ft when the limb it's trying to stand on lets go.  You could feel the thump on the ground from the house.  Wish I'd filmed it.

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Offline eskimo2

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« Reply #61 on: December 05, 2001, 09:32:00 PM »
Curval,
I don't hunt, been there, done that, don't really like killing things.
But I'm certainly not one too pretend that some critter didn't get butchered so that I could have peperoni on my pizza tonight.
Kill em yourself, or pay someone to do it, either way something died because you wanted meat on the table.

I grew up in Alaska.
In fact, the hospital that I was born in (Cordova) is the closest one to where this bear was shot. Hunting is a way of life in Alaska.  I know and have met many folks who have no jobs and live off the land.
I grew up around hunters, hikers and all sorts of outdoorsy folks.
I grew up with bear-tales, many bear tales.
I have one distinct opinion about bears, they are unpredictable.
I have seen slides of relatives feeding wild bears by hand.  
I have heard of many folks getting mauled and killed by bears.

eskimo

Offline Oosik

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« Reply #62 on: December 05, 2001, 10:20:00 PM »
For the record:

The gentleman that shot the bear is a soldier station at Fort Wainwright Alaska (just outside of Fairbanks) and was interviewed by a local (Anchorage) radio station this morning.

He stated that the bear was between 10 and 11 feet, and wieghed between 1100 and 1200 pounds.  He was on a "deer" hunt but also bear was on his list and he was prepared for the bear.  It did not "charge" him, but was heading his direction.   Note that the near by streams were still full of salmon, so the bear never really caught scent of the hunters.  YES he did shot every round - he started shooting and did not stop till it stoped moving, even the hairs.  After his heart stopped trying to pound through his chest he and his partner creeped up on it from behind - ready to empty their guns if needed.  He said it was not a record for this type/location somewhere around 150th.

As reported on KBFX (100.5) the Fox, Anchorage Alaska.

Yes it is a big hugger.

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Offline Curval

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« Reply #63 on: December 06, 2001, 08:04:00 AM »
eskimo2 - I was waiting for someone to mention that fact...and you are absolutely right...I'm not a vegetarian, I do eat meat.  I just don't do the killing myself....

I have thought about this fact and tried to come up with an argument justifying that position....and I can't.  Hypocritical?  I guess so....but just like you I don't like killing animals and seeing such a beautiful animal as this particular bear being shown off as some form of trophy turns my stomach.  

I have hunted also - ONCE.  I begged my father to take me when I was about 10 years old.  The first (and only) thing I killed was a rabbit - from about 100m away...it was a great shot...knocked the poor thing about five feet from his hole.  Then my Dad insisted that I go and collect the rabbit...and skin it myself.  Suffice to say that that ended our hunting trip - I had no desire to kill a deer or even a mouse after that....I vowed i would never kill any animal needlessly again - because that it what it was  - needless.  Something died because a ten year old kid wanted to try hunting...that was the only reason.
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Offline Ripsnort

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« Reply #64 on: December 06, 2001, 08:10:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Oosik:
For the record:

The gentleman that shot the bear is a soldier station at Fort Wainwright Alaska (just outside of Fairbanks) and was interviewed by a local (Anchorage) radio station this morning.

He stated that the bear was between 10 and 11 feet, and wieghed between 1100 and 1200 pounds.  He was on a "deer" hunt but also bear was on his list and he was prepared for the bear.  It did not "charge" him, but was heading his direction.   Note that the near by streams were still full of salmon, so the bear never really caught scent of the hunters.  YES he did shot every round - he started shooting and did not stop till it stoped moving, even the hairs.  After his heart stopped trying to pound through his chest he and his partner creeped up on it from behind - ready to empty their guns if needed.  He said it was not a record for this type/location somewhere around 150th.

As reported on KBFX (100.5) the Fox, Anchorage Alaska.

Yes it is a big hugger.

0osik

Thanks for the update Oosik!  Can you supply me with some sort of link for that story?

Thanks!

Offline Suave1

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« Reply #65 on: December 06, 2001, 08:23:00 AM »
Growing up in NW Montana I had too many encounters with bears, climbing on our house, getting in our trash . The most memorable encounter was when I was about 12 years old, the fish and game dept had set a culvert type trap in our back yard to catch a black bear that kept emtying the contents of our dumpster all over the place. Anyway the trap had been sitting there for a few weeks empty . I came home from spending the weekend at a friends and walked right in front of the cage door on the trap, having grown accustomed to its presence. At this time an adult sow black bear lunged at me from inside of the trap slaming into the cage door about 2feet from me . Surprisingly I didn't soil myself, my father found it quite amusing none the less.

 Never had problems with grizzly bears though, as the really seem to hate being around humans .

Offline Eagler

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« Reply #66 on: December 06, 2001, 08:35:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Curval:
eskimo2 - I was waiting for someone to mention that fact...and you are absolutely right...I'm not a vegetarian, I do eat meat.  I just don't do the killing myself....

I have thought about this fact and tried to come up with an argument justifying that position....and I can't.  Hypocritical?  I guess so....but just like you I don't like killing animals and seeing such a beautiful animal as this particular bear being shown off as some form of trophy turns my stomach.  

I have hunted also - ONCE.  I begged my father to take me when I was about 10 years old.  The first (and only) thing I killed was a rabbit - from about 100m away...it was a great shot...knocked the poor thing about five feet from his hole.  Then my Dad insisted that I go and collect the rabbit...and skin it myself.  Suffice to say that that ended our hunting trip - I had no desire to kill a deer or even a mouse after that....I vowed i would never kill any animal needlessly again - because that it what it was  - needless.  Something died because a ten year old kid wanted to try hunting...that was the only reason.

had a similar experience in my backyard woods about 13 years old with a pellet gun and a redheaded wooddonut. Took many hits to put it out of its misery while it dangled 40ft above me stuck upside down in the moss. Last time I shot anything living (cept my little brother with the BB gun  :)).

I justify my cow eating by thinking of them as being "processed" anyway, whether I eat/buy them or not. They are still plastic wrapped in the meat dept. Where as if I don't pull the trigger, that deer/bear would live.. Beside the fact that anytime I've eaten wild deer, pig, duck (sorry no bear  :))it has had a gamey taste which I found less appealing than store bought.

To each his own. I'd rather do my hunting with a camera than a rifle.

Now fishing is a whole nother story ...
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Offline Ripsnort

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« Reply #67 on: December 06, 2001, 08:39:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Suave1:
Growing up in NW Montana I had too many encounters with bears, climbing on our house, getting in our trash . The most memorable encounter was when I was about 12 years old, the fish and game dept had set a culvert type trap in our back yard to catch a black bear that kept emtying the contents of our dumpster all over the place. Anyway the trap had been sitting there for a few weeks empty . I came home from spending the weekend at a friends and walked right in front of the cage door on the trap, having grown accustomed to its presence. At this time an adult sow black bear lunged at me from inside of the trap slaming into the cage door about 2feet from me . Surprisingly I didn't soil myself, my father found it quite amusing none the less.

 Never had problems with grizzly bears though, as the really seem to hate being around humans .

Suave, where'd you grow up?  I have a 30 acre ranch in Ennis, MT on the Gravelly Mt range, I belong to a property owners association that gives up hunting and fishing rights to 10,000 acres.  I plan to retire there one day (13 years and counting!).  Then I can invite my AH buds out for hunting season!  :)

Offline Suave1

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« Reply #68 on: December 06, 2001, 08:55:00 AM »
A tiny old berg named Libby .

Here is another story, when I was in the army stationed at Ft Lewis. I had just got back to the battalion from living in a hole out in the woods for four days, walked into the Headhunters' orderly room where the XO informed me that the battalion was being deployed to fight some fluff'n forest fires . I swore and asked him where . "Libby Montana", was his answer . I thought he was messing with me so I kept bothering him about it for ten minutes untill top walked in.

 How do you like them apples, join the army on active duty and get deployed to you're own tiny bellybutton home town .

Offline Ripsnort

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« Reply #69 on: December 06, 2001, 09:05:00 AM »
OMG, lol Suave! Maybe they knew, nothing better than to have a local boy that knows the area....

Offline indian

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« Reply #70 on: December 06, 2001, 10:25:00 AM »
Hey Rip!! the indian like to hunt with a BOW so hrry up and retire will ya!!!  :D

Curval some of us that hunt like to get in the woods and just sit I dont always find the need to kill some thing sometimes just watch it walk by. I like animals and I am not blind to the fact that we are meat eaters. I dont believe in trophy hunting but wont pass up a trophy either as long as the meat is eaten. Hunting here in the U.S. is also a way of population control, thin the herds and the helthier the rest will live. Tags are sold on a population type bases the more dear the more you can get the less vice versa. But if I saw a bear and had a gun I would shoot it first with out any thought, my life before his.

Offline Ripsnort

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« Reply #71 on: December 06, 2001, 10:41:00 AM »
Ironic you mention that Indian, my father, who now is 70, sits in his deer stand every fall, armed with bow and arrow. He then calls me and tells me about the 6 point buck that stood 10 feet away from him downwind, but Dad just likes the hunt nowadays, not necessarily the kill.  He's had many chances in the last few years, but opts for the hunt, not the kill.


I gave up big game hunting a few years back.  I was a meat hunter, not a trophy hunter.  It was all consumed too, and deer starve off naturally every 5 years due to cold winters and food source deparvation as well as over-population, so I never had a problem with 'thinning the herd'...however, now when I go back to Montana for hunting with my inlaws that live back there, they give me so much meat from their hunts that I can't justify taking anymore.  Still love to bird hunt though!  I can cook a Canadian goose that'll make ya quit eating chicken and start eating goose!  Love to hunt and cook birds.

Indian, seriously, if you want to do a hunt back in Montana some fall, gimme a shout. Not sure what out of state licenses are these days, but if you're interested in bird hunting, its very cheap!  You can fly out to Seattle, then we'll drive back there (10 hours)  Brother will put us up in his place, and the ice fishing is incredible. Two years ago we caught 16 rainbow avg. size 18" in alittle over 45 min of ice fishing, earlier that morning we each limited on Canadian Geese.  :)

Offline Oosik

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« Reply #72 on: December 16, 2001, 07:38:00 PM »
Rip - Sorry for taking so long - butthere was only the radio interview.  But in todays (Sunday Dec. 16, 2001) Anchorage Daily News, Outdoor section there is an article about the bear and Theodore Winen (the hunter)

Anchorage Daily News Article

0osik

Offline Maverick

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« Reply #73 on: December 16, 2001, 11:04:00 PM »
Oosik,

Good article, thanks!

 
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Offline StSanta

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« Reply #74 on: December 17, 2001, 05:30:00 AM »
Hm, as far as hunting goes: it is necessary.

I'll use Sweden as an example. Most large predators have been hunted quite much are their numbers are small. The elk population, being little threat to humans in general, haven't been hunted because of an irrational fear that seems to be innate in the human animal.

The elk population thrives. Actually, it sort of explodes when it's not hunted. It grows to such a large population that it's not sustainable long term - effectively, it's doing the human thing of overdoing something and therefore killing off future use of an item or food source. Combine with a timber industry that under law msut replace the trees they cut down and you have a problem. The elks love these ypung saplings, and if there's too many elks around, they'll soon die in huge numbers due to limited food. And the saplings won't become trees because they'd be consumed by now dead elks.

So, you have the hunters. A group of old guys with guns. Some cannot shoot worth toejame. Most aren't out strictly to kill elks. It's a social thing - you're out in the woods with your freinds, in touch with nature. You're in touch with the caveman inside of you (and, we DO have this trait still in us - might be less prioritized than other instincts, but it is there).

It's not a fair match at all. There's nothign particularly manly about sitting for hours on end waiting for an elk to come by, and then line up at 80 meters and shoot it with a hi power rifle with a scope. But, it is for the hunter a thrilling and rewarding experience.

Hunters eat what they kill. Elk meat is delicious. Compare a pig or cow that has lived its entire life on a few square meters, with a monotonous life only interrupted by getting a big bolt to the head, to that of an elk that has lived in freedom.

For that reason, I prefer eating meat from animals that have been hunted, instead of meat from the meat factories.

Regarding the grizzly: if it was self defense, the guy did the only thing he could have done.

I deplore the practise of hunting carnivores - their meat isn't good to eat. To hunt them for their hide is just Golly-geened ugly. Predator illustrates it nicely. That's just an ugly macho thing where some men and women think they're all macho and hard for sneaking up on another animal and blasting it with a rifle. Nothing macho about it: doing it with a knife would be, but not with a rifle. Bow hutning seems to be the best to me in terms of nature experience, but that's against the law here I think, because there's too little killing power in a bow (or rather, it requres too much skill for the average hunter).

Hunting is necessary, and it's bloody much better than raising cattle and slaughtering 'em.