Author Topic: Enough Is Enough (Read 5035 times)

mussie · « **Reply #75 on:** June 22, 2005, 03:03:57 PM »

I wasn't getting aggro there super, there is more to the planes than the numbers. thanks for your input

LePaul · « **Reply #76 on:** June 22, 2005, 04:55:18 PM »

So how is it you reply to my posts here but not in the Bug Forums?

Seriously, when Im in my little area of the map, its almost all I see. Your posting of arena stats is nifty and all...but doesnt exactly represent what I see in the areas I fly.

We agree to disagree, I suppose.

Captain Virgil Hilts · « **Reply #77 on:** June 22, 2005, 06:24:02 PM »

The reasons people complain about the LA-7:

1. Numbers. Many almost never fly a sortie without seeing at least a couple.

2. Performance. There are planes that have no where near the LA-7's performance at low altitudes and in the standard MA environment that are perked.

3. Useage. Meaning the way it is used the majority of the time. Most often, the LA-7 is used to cherry pick people out of a good fight. Or to kill them after they win a good fight. Or to force a single plane to face a horde of friends of the LA-7 pilot. And finally, to attempt a cherry pick and then run, spoiling a good fight, usually with an HO.

The three planes I see most these days are the LA-7, the Spit V (now that many know about the revised performance with higher boost), and the Tempest. They all have a decided edge over a lot of the planes in the MA Quake with planes environment.

Will perking the LA-7 solve the balance issue? Possibly. Is perking the LA-7 fair on the basis of performance and numbers? Going by the supposedly valid reasons for perking other planes, YES.

Let's face it, the MA has nothing at all to do with history or reality. It is for some, likely the majority, Quake with planes. That's sad. But it's true. More and more I look forward to events, and TOD.

These days I look at what plane killed me, and realize that when I consider the plane and the circumstances, it is a hollow victory in my opinion when I get killed by a Quake pilot in a Quake plane.

My secret to enjoying the game despite the Quake pilots in their Quake rides is knowing that under most circumstances, I kill them when they aren't in their Quake ride, and I hold a positive K/D ratio against most everything but the Quake planes. And usually when I die to them, I start out with at least a marked disadvantage to them in one way or another.

It ain't that I'm all that good, I'm not. But I figure I ain't all that bad either.

Guppy35 · « **Reply #78 on:** June 22, 2005, 06:27:00 PM »

Interesting how far the Spit IX has fallen down the list.

Now about that clipped wing LFIXe?

Dan/CorkyJr

Loddar · « **Reply #79 on:** June 23, 2005, 01:33:41 AM »

Most fly La7 and not La5 because only
when ENY is in use La7 is unavailable
quicker than La5.

Why they should use a plane with lesser
performance than the other one when
both planes are available at no cost ?

dedalos · « **Reply #80 on:** June 23, 2005, 08:27:40 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Loddar
Most fly La7 and not La5 because only
when ENY is in use La7 is unavailable
quicker than La5.

Why they should use a plane with lesser
performance than the other one when
both planes are available at no cost ?

Because speed is not everything?

Loddar · « **Reply #81 on:** June 23, 2005, 09:27:52 AM »

Aha !

But speed helps alot.

And what's the reason then to prefer the
La7 over the La5 ?

mussie · « **Reply #82 on:** June 23, 2005, 09:44:53 AM »

7 has three Cannons
5 has 2

7 is faster
5 is smaller and harder to hit

I fly the 5 a bit cause its small and nimble

SlapShot · « **Reply #83 on:** June 23, 2005, 09:46:09 AM »

Sure ... perk the La-7 and take it out of the picture ... and what has already been pointed out in this thread and the other 1,000,000,000 threads of the same topic ... another plane will slide into its place.

From the data that HT presented, the next plane that would take over the crown would be the N1K. oooooo ... shudder !!!

You would think that if the La-7 is as good and as prevelent as everyone makes it out to be, then we all would be getting into some real good fights ... but it appears that most really don't want to actually fight ... they want to hit and run and get real upset when the "run" factor is eliminated by an La-7 in the same airspace.

I can't remember the last time I lost a 1 v 1 against the La-7 or the N1K. The deaths that I experience at the hands of these planes is usually a "pick" when engaged with someone else, but that is no different than all the times that I get picked by P-51s, P-38s, 109s, 190s, etc.

Grow a pair.

LYNX · « **Reply #84 on:** June 23, 2005, 10:25:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by hitech
From the current Tour.

Name Kills Planes %Total %Plane
Panzer IV H 30840 0 8.63% 0.00%
La-7 22736 22736 6.36% 8.68%
Ship Gunner 21950 0 6.14% 0.00%
N1K2 19411 19411 5.43% 7.41%
Ostwind 16088 0 4.50% 0.00%
Spitfire V 14953 14953 4.19% 5.71%
Typhoon IB 14221 14221 3.98% 5.43%
SeaFire 14148 14148 3.96% 5.40%
Tiger I 11732 0 3.28% 0.00%
P-51D 11158 11158 3.12% 4.26%
Bf 109G-10 10789 10789 3.02% 4.12%
Spitfire Mk I 9866 9866 2.76% 3.77%
Bf 110G-2 9699 9699 2.71% 3.70%
Fw 190D-9 8734 8734 2.44% 3.33%
F4U-1C 7748 7748 2.17% 2.96%
P-38J 7033 7033 1.97% 2.68%
Il-2 6685 6685 1.87% 2.55%
B-24J 6592 6592 1.85% 2.52%
F6F-5 6440 6440 1.80% 2.46%
F4U-1D 6311 6311 1.77% 2.41%
P-38L 6151 6151 1.72% 2.35%
Hurricane IIC 5450 5450 1.53% 2.08%
M-16 4827 0 1.35% 0.00%
A6M5b 4646 4646 1.30% 1.77%
C.205 4269 4269 1.19% 1.63%
Tempest 4120 4120 1.15% 1.57%
Fw 190A-8 4040 4040 1.13% 1.54%
Ki-84-Ia 3772 3772 1.06% 1.44%
PT Boat 3686 0 1.03% 0.00%
P-47-D30 3478 3478 0.97% 1.33%
Lancaster III 3462 3462 0.97% 1.32%
Bf 109F-4 3325 3325 0.93% 1.27%
La-5FN 3257 3257 0.91% 1.24%
Fw 190A-5 3049 3049 0.85% 1.16%
Yak-9U 2707 2707 0.76% 1.03%
B-26B 2574 2574 0.72% 0.98%
B-17G 2369 2369 0.66% 0.90%
A-20G 2311 2311 0.65% 0.88%
F4U-1 2266 2266 0.63% 0.86%
Me 262 2189 2189 0.61% 0.84%
Mosquito Mk V 2179 2179 0.61% 0.83%
Bf 109G-6 2106 2106 0.59% 0.80%
Chute 1393 0 0.39% 0.00%
Bf 109G-2 1293 1293 0.36% 0.49%
P-47D-11 1229 1229 0.34% 0.47%
FM2 1178 1178 0.33% 0.45%
P-47-D25 1123 1123 0.31% 0.43%
F4U-4 1101 1101 0.31% 0.42%
T-34 1101 0 0.31% 0.00%
P-38G 1084 1084 0.30% 0.41%
P-51B 1047 1047 0.29% 0.40%
M-3 966 0 0.27% 0.00%
Yak-9T 892 892 0.25% 0.34%
Ki-61 857 857 0.24% 0.33%
Fw 190F-8 832 832 0.23% 0.32%
Me 163B 812 812 0.23% 0.31%
LVTA2 752 0 0.21% 0.00%
Ju 88 700 700 0.20% 0.27%
M-8 699 0 0.20% 0.00%
LVTA4 651 0 0.18% 0.00%
Gunner 591 0 0.17% 0.00%
Spitfire Mk X 483 483 0.14% 0.18%
P-40E 456 456 0.13% 0.17%
Hurricane IID 426 426 0.12% 0.16%
P-40B 418 418 0.12% 0.16%
Ki-67 410 410 0.11% 0.16%
F4F-4 407 407 0.11% 0.16%
Ta 152H 404 404 0.11% 0.15%
A6M2 375 375 0.10% 0.14%
TBM-3 354 354 0.10% 0.14%
Bf 109E-4 338 338 0.09% 0.13%
Hurricane Mk 196 196 0.05% 0.07%
C-47A 195 195 0.05% 0.07%
Bf 110C-4b 195 195 0.05% 0.07%
Spitfire Mk I 171 171 0.05% 0.07%
C.202 166 166 0.05% 0.06%
Ju 87D-3 128 128 0.04% 0.05%
D3A1 122 122 0.03% 0.05%
SBD-5 121 121 0.03% 0.05%
Ar 234 112 112 0.03% 0.04%
Boston III 58 58 0.02% 0.02%
B5N2 56 56 0.02% 0.02%
Total 357259 261983 100.00% 100.00%

LePaul: I do not see any of your statements as a whine.

But I have a very hard time with your statement

When only about 1 out of 10 planes in the air is an LA7. [/B]

There are Lies, damed Lies and Statistics.... but thanks anyways. No offence meant by next statement but HTC you gotta come in the game and check it out. It's getting ridiculous at times. Just the other night there was a raid by 15 (lost count at 15) to 25 LA7's, on a base I was defending. Yer ok 15 to 25 Hurri 1's would have had the same effect against the 8 to 10 of us but it shows a "Mind set".

You say 1 in 10 planes is a LA7. Well, take your XYZ jabo over an enemy field and count the buggers. Is it 1 in 10 because 7 guys are taking 15 min to get somewhere while the LA7 up's and inside 1 min has equal speed / alt chacing you into his 2 friends?

Who uses LA7's the most and what for?

I suspect newbies use LA's the most and it's becoming a crutch.
I encounter them by guy's mostly chacing me down after bashing their base. Forcing me into a 2,3 or 4 on 1 situation. I also see LA7's alot on short field hops as active fighters.

Can I kill them?

If the LA7 don't run and it's 1 on 1 I win 99% of the time becuse they are newbies or guys that don't know alot. I'll tell you something else. Those LA7's are bullet proof soaking up the ammo. Devilishly hard to kill at time. (my vid card is ok & PC is Ok)

It's without doubt and, I suspect the majority feel the same, the only none perked plane with megga gun / damage package. It is like a darn dragster. The sprint speed is unequalled.

Spit 14 is perked yet the LA7 isn't. The F4UC1 is perked yet the LA7 isn't. The TA152 is perked yet the LA7 isn't. All 3 have their individual reasonse to be perked yet the LA7 doesn't?

Sorry friend but alot of folks feel different. In my mind the "Sprint speed" is enough to get the LA7 a mild perk let alone the 3 gun damage pack.

dedalos · « **Reply #85 on:** June 23, 2005, 10:39:59 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by SlapShot

I just wanted to quote your sig

humble : Those of you who are "plane dependent" will always worry about what the other guy is in...the rest of us just worry about WHO the other guy is.

Kev367th · « **Reply #86 on:** June 23, 2005, 10:57:18 AM »

La-7 22736 22736 6.36% 8.68%
N1K2 19411 19411 5.43% 7.41%
Spitfire V 14953 14953 4.19% 5.71%
Typhoon IB 14221 14221 3.98% 5.43%
SeaFire 14148 14148 3.96% 5.40%

Seafire - Used from CV so would expect to see high usage.
Typhoon - I suspect a lot of guys like me transistioned from the Spit IX to the Tiffy, as the MA became later war orientated.
Spit V - Well, it's a dam sight better than the mongrel IX.
N1K - Normally see a lot during base defence, prob because of its guns.

Onto the stats - (round to nearest thousand for ease)
La7 -23
N1K - 19
Chasing pack - 15

Ignoring the N1K the La7 has 8000 more sorties than the chasing pack.
By the end of the tour this should be closer to 11000 if current usage holds up.
i.e. up to HT's post on the 22nd 8000 diff, so 8000/22*8(days remaining).

So 1 plane being used 11000 more times than the main chasing pack isn't a problem, I guess we have different thoughts on what OVERUSE is.
Considering overuse is one of the reasons for perking.

If it were couple of thousand or so I don't believe we'd have threads like this.

You really need to play the game peak time to see what people are talking about.

dedalos · « **Reply #87 on:** June 23, 2005, 11:04:27 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
La-7 22736 22736 6.36% 8.68%
N1K2 19411 19411 5.43% 7.41%
Spitfire V 14953 14953 4.19% 5.71%
Typhoon IB 14221 14221 3.98% 5.43%
SeaFire 14148 14148 3.96% 5.40%

Seafire - Used from CV so would expect to see high usage.
Typhoon - I suspect a lot of guys like me transistioned from the Spit IX to the Tiffy, as the MA became later war orientated.
Spit V - Well, it's a dam sight better than the mongrel IX.
N1K - Normally see a lot during base defence, prob because of its guns.

Onto the stats - (round to nearest thousand for ease)
La7 -23
N1K - 19
Chasing pack - 15

Ignoring the N1K the La7 has 8000 more sorties than the chasing pack.
By the end of the tour this should be closer to 11000 if current usage holds up.
i.e. up to HT's post on the 22nd 8000 diff, so 8000/22*8(days remaining).

So 1 plane being used 11000 more times than the main chasing pack isn't a problem, I guess we have different thoughts on what OVERUSE is.
Considering overuse is one of the reasons for perking.

Don't forget that half those lalas died on the runway vulched by the people that want them perked.

Kev367th · « **Reply #88 on:** June 23, 2005, 11:05:59 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by dedalos
Don't forget that half those lalas died on the runway vulched by the people that want them perked.

Prove it.
HT posted hard cold facts, your guessing, surmising, or assuming.

dedalos · « **Reply #89 on:** June 23, 2005, 11:31:55 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kev367th
Prove it.
HT posted hard cold facts, your guessing, surmising, or assuming.

I play the game too you know. My observations are a guess as much as yours are. I can tell you for sure that when I see a full darbar and a field blinking, I will try an up a lala. After dieing on the runway repeatedly, I will make it off the grownd and kill a couple of uber non lala flying vulchers. So, I know I am contributing to the number of lala sorties.

Seems to me that you are using the hard cold facts to support your cause. HT gave numbers. Up to you to interprit them anyway you want.

Quote

Typhoon - I suspect a lot of guys like me transistioned from the Spit IX to the Tiffy, as the MA became later war orientated.

Hmmm, what can catch a Typh after the typh is done vulc. . . .er supressing the enemy? A D9? nah, the Typh would probably kill it in a turn fight. A 51? it would never excelerate on time to catch the typh or avoid the vulchers. Hmmm, what else is there that could stop you from getting your WTFGs? PERK IT!!!!! NOT FAIR!!!!!

I think I see where you are comming from.

Answer this question honestly. Would you rather have a hord of spits chasing you or a horde of lalas? I am guessing sppits cause you would not have to wory about them catching you right?