Author Topic: To provide for....  (Read 1846 times)

Offline Charon

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« Reply #60 on: September 07, 2005, 07:24:12 PM »
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How dare you be so level headed at a time when what is clearly called for is more rhetoric and soundbites!


I wish I was levelheaded now. You just keep waiting for one of these events to cause the lightbulb to go off.

People are dying (but not enough to really impact most) billions are pissing away in the wind (but not enough for a 1929) -- but the day is coming when we won't be able to ignore this **** anymore. We've let it run on autopilot for 20 years, just like we did between 1945 and Tet. Maybe when the housing bubble goes the way of the tech bubble. Too bad it will have to come to that.

Charon

Offline Shaky

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« Reply #61 on: September 07, 2005, 07:53:53 PM »


Political correctness is a doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Offline DREDIOCK

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« Reply #62 on: September 07, 2005, 08:30:57 PM »
Bravo Charon,
bravo
Death is no easy answer
For those who wish to know
Ask those who have been before you
What fate the future holds
It ain't pretty

Offline Shuckins

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« Reply #63 on: September 07, 2005, 10:25:57 PM »
If you bleeding hearts have never worked in a disaster area you can't possibly imagine how difficult it is to move convoys of heavy equipment through it.  It's nothing like taking a Sunday drive into the country for a picnic.

Relief convoys heading to New Orleans had to move through two states devasted by a category 4 hurricane.  Not only were many of the highways covered with debris that had to be cleared, but all the power was out, making it almost impossible to refuel the relief vehicles.  The convoys had to bring every drop of fuel they needed with them.

For several days after the hurricane passed the only access to many communities along the coast was by helicopter.  

Under those circumstances, I'd say two or three days to make the journey, in force, would be just about right.

I wonder what effect the complaining and tirades by Nagin and Blanco had on the overall relief efforts.  Considering the extent of the disaster, FEMA had probably planned a broad-based effort to reach as many of the victims in southern Louisiana and Mississippi as possible.  I suspect that Nagin's complaints and "racist" rant changed all that, guaranteeing that the feds HAD to make a maximum effort to reach NO as rapidly as possible...to the detriment of the victims in southern Mississippi.

You wouldn't know it by listening to the news media, but Mississippi was hit harder than Louisiana.  Wonder what southern Mississippian's think about Nagin's asinine rant?

Offline Gunslinger

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« Reply #64 on: September 07, 2005, 10:29:53 PM »
Yup what shukins said.  Only three main highways go into NO.  ALL of them go over water, two of them were wiped out.  The third goes under 20 feet of water halfway through the city.

Considering they were air evacing people as soon as the winds were under 45kts....

The one thing I heard was they could have had more helicopters in but the red tape took a while.  It took one USAF reserve unit 36 hours to get PERMISSION to fly into the area.

Offline Toad

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« Reply #65 on: September 07, 2005, 10:30:47 PM »
From what I saw of Southern Mississippi in/around Gulfport, I think a lot of Mississippians were thinking "God helps them that help themselves" or something to that effect.

They were cleaning up and making progress before anyone got to them.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Edbert

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« Reply #66 on: September 08, 2005, 07:19:52 AM »
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
Yup what shukins said.  Only three main highways go into NO.  ALL of them go over water, two of them were wiped out.  The third goes under 20 feet of water halfway through the city.
 


The argument against your point (which I do not hold, merely playing devil's advocate) was that news reporters and reporterettes were all arriving in force, and if Geraldo could get there so could supplies.

I'll leave the floating fastball over the plate for you.

Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #67 on: September 08, 2005, 08:24:41 AM »
This is not a failure of logistics. It is a failure of LEADERSHIP. Bush should have been on the ground the next day, not on vacation and not flying to San Diego. Help got there too slowly, and maybe for good reason. But if Joe Reporter can get there so can Marine One.

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #68 on: September 08, 2005, 08:28:43 AM »
geeze mt... first you compliment charon on not being a soundbite robot and then you let your wife tell you what to post in the very next post "you" make.

lazs

Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #69 on: September 08, 2005, 08:36:38 AM »
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Originally posted by lazs2
geeze mt... first you compliment charon on not being a soundbite robot and then you let your wife tell you what to post in the very next post "you" make.

lazs


Sherlock Lazs ^

Offline Gunslinger

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« Reply #70 on: September 08, 2005, 08:39:19 AM »
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Originally posted by Edbert
The argument against your point (which I do not hold, merely playing devil's advocate) was that news reporters and reporterettes were all arriving in force, and if Geraldo could get there so could supplies.

I'll leave the floating fastball over the plate for you.


most of the reporters were allready in New Orleans.  If they weren't their equipment was.

And it's alot bigger deal moving a convoy of supplies and heavy equipment over hurrican hit highway than it is a couple of reporters in vans

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This is not a failure of logistics. It is a failure of LEADERSHIP. Bush should have been on the ground the next day, not on vacation and not flying to San Diego. Help got there too slowly, and maybe for good reason. But if Joe Reporter can get there so can Marine One.


MT,

Bush's exact words were.  "I don't want my arrival to any way interfere with releif efforts currently underway"

Makes perfect sense to me.  Secret service has to stop people from what they are doing to screen them.  Air space around AF one and Marine one has to be cleared.

Offline Edbert

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« Reply #71 on: September 08, 2005, 08:39:20 AM »
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Originally posted by midnight Target
This is not a failure of logistics. It is a failure of LEADERSHIP. Bush should have been on the ground the next day, not on vacation and not flying to San Diego. Help got there too slowly, and maybe for good reason. But if Joe Reporter can get there so can Marine One.

Interesting point of view. When I saw Bush on the ground there touring the site and hugging victims I thought his mere presence there was a detrimental thing, he was wasting resources (fuel, and security mainly) that could have been better spent elsewhere. I also thought it was a shamelss photo-op, one of those "I feel your pain" things that does nobody any good.

I guess you wanted more of that, goes to show you cannot make everyone happy.

Offline Edbert

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« Reply #72 on: September 08, 2005, 08:44:00 AM »
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Originally posted by Gunslinger
most of the reporters were allready in New Orleans.  If they weren't their equipment was.

You hit a double, the home-run would have been to point out that the news agencies could get there becuase they are relatively small private interests which are self-motivated instead of a byzantine governmental agency or conglomerations of various beurocracies. The goverment cannot do ANYTHING well, never has and never will, if you rely on them to save you you are gonna die.

Offline midnight Target

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« Reply #73 on: September 08, 2005, 09:02:54 AM »
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Originally posted by Edbert
Interesting point of view. When I saw Bush on the ground there touring the site and hugging victims I thought his mere presence there was a detrimental thing, he was wasting resources (fuel, and security mainly) that could have been better spent elsewhere. I also thought it was a shamelss photo-op, one of those "I feel your pain" things that does nobody any good.

I guess you wanted more of that, goes to show you cannot make everyone happy.


Getting there 5 days late is a shameless photo op and probably spin control. Getting there right away to tell the people they haven't been abandonded is leadership.

Offline Eagler

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« Reply #74 on: September 08, 2005, 09:08:03 AM »

the ffof is pointing at the dem leadership of NO & LA but keep spinning it to the feds, some will believe
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