Author Topic: Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release  (Read 10755 times)

Offline Glasses

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #150 on: February 18, 2006, 01:03:40 AM »
Difference is the figures you quote are operations in all theaters those I quote are against the LW in the ETO :-)

Offline BUG_EAF322

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #151 on: February 18, 2006, 02:02:58 AM »
Its getting biased and unrespectfull looks like some still regret the LW lost the war.

Sigh

The LW was a tool of the nazi's nothing to be proud of.
I just like the allied conqoured freedom sorry guys.

Remember where just virtual pc chair pilots some not even allowed in a real plane.
(to fat wearing glasses not able to withstand the G's)
I like flying the american P38 but i dont imagine im a american Bong super vet.

Im just a lousy unsuccesful real life pilot.
With all comfort in my chair with a cup of coffee with no death danger around.

get a grip wabbles.

Offline Wilbus

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #152 on: February 18, 2006, 02:03:59 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by BUG_EAF322
arent bombers with their bigger wingspan a bit more air huggin at bigger alt.

The u2 comes into my mind with its enormous wingspan to fly at extreme alt.
So might high wingloaded planes have some disadvantage up high.

It should not be only the FW that can be outturned at that point if it is only the FW than u may have a point.

what a points :)


Actually BUG I wasn't quite clear there, I used the 190 only as example (bad idea as I am a 190 fan). No what troubles me is that all bombers can easily outmaneuver most fighters like that up high. In this case I don't give  a rats a** about wingloading. I never heard of no B17 or B24 or Ju88 trying to outmaneuver a fighter at 30k and giving the fighter the finger saying "I've got bigger wings then you tard".

Hell, the B17 and B24 (etc) have both got the P47 and Ta152 beat at 30k+ part from speed really.


Quote
Originally posted by Toad We agree. Wholeheartedly. I'd even say it would cover just about all multiengine aircraft in the game.    Bombers turnfighting? Successfully?!?!?    Come now.


Yup! Sorry was unclear. I'll just point you to the text above :)
Rasmus "Wilbus" Mattsson

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Offline Waffle

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #153 on: February 18, 2006, 02:35:43 AM »
FWIW - I was tolling around in an 190a5 at 95 TAS less than 1000 feet off the ground according to the E6b...that was with flaps and gear retracted....

The controls still worked as I could apply rudder to correct when I started to stall...

According to that document that Jawwzy posted, I should have hit the ground once getting below 110 TAS. Maybe the 190s are porked and that stall limit needs to be raised from 95 up to 110 TAS? Or maybe the pilot knows how to ride a stall?

Offline JAWS2003

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #154 on: February 18, 2006, 08:25:35 AM »
A-5 is lighter then it should be and the lower stall speed is the direct result of it.

This list made by Kwessa tells the true about the stability of the aircraft close to the stall. He tested all of them. And it has nothing to do with who the pilot is. This is how the planes are modeled.

Quote

The results are in the turn radius thread, linked at my sig. But for you, I'll compile them here for easier comparison.


Fighter Name (SL setting normal / SL one notch flaps / SL full flaps)
* fighters listed without SL settings for flaps are those that can use one setting throughout the entire testing

List of entire fighters
A6M2 (0.05)
A6M5b (0.05)
Bf109E-4 (1.0/1.1/1.2)
Bf109F-4 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109G-2 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109G-6 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109G-14 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109K-4 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf110C-4 (0.05)
Bf110G-2 (1.0)
C.202 (0.05)
C.205 (1.0)
F4F-4 (0.05)
FM-2 (0.05)
F4U-1 (1.0)
F4U-1D (1.0)
F4U-1C (1.0)
F4U-4 (1.0)
F6F-5 (1.0)
Fw190A-5 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
Fw190A-8 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
Fw190D-9 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
Fw190F-8 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
Hurricane Mk.Ia (0.05)
Hurricane Mk.IIc (0.05)
Hurricane Mk.IId (0.05)
Ki-61-I-Tei (0.05)
Ki-84-I-Ko (0.05)
La-5FN (0.05)
La-7 (0.05)
Me163B (0.05)
Me262A (0.05)
Mosquito Mk.VI (0.05)
N1K2-J (0.05)
P-38G (0.05)
P-38J (0.05)
P-38L (0.05)
P-40B (1.0)
P-40E (1.0)
P-47D-11 (0.05)
P-47D-25 (0.05)
P-47D-40 (0.05)
P-51B (0.05)
P-51D (0.05)
Spitfire Mk.Ia (0.05)
Spitfire Mk.V (0.05)
Seafire Mk.II (0.05)
Spitfire Mk.IX (0.05)
Spitfire Mk.VIII (0.05)
Spitfire Mk.XVI (0.05)
Spitfire Mk.XIV (0.05)
Ta152H-1 (1.0)
Typhoon Mk.Ib (0.05)
Tempest Mk.V (0.05)
Yak-9T (0.05)
Yak-9U (0.05)

List of those cannot use minimal settings
Bf109E-4 (1.0/1.1/1.2)
Bf109F-4 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109G-2 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109G-6 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109G-14 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf109K-4 (1.0/1.2/1.2)
Bf110G-2 (1.0)
C.205 (1.0)
F4U-1 (1.0)
F4U-1D (1.0)
F4U-1C (1.0)
F4U-4 (1.0)
F6F-5 (1.0)
Fw190A-5 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
Fw190A-8 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
Fw190D-9 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
Fw190F-8 (1.0/1.5/1.5)
P-40B (1.0)
P-40E (1.0)
Ta152H-1 (1.0)

- Bf109 variants (6)
- Fw190 variants (5)
- F4U variants (4)
- Miscel. (5)

So, while 20 planes cannot use thes settings, which seems a lot, actually half of them are 109s and 190s.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2006, 08:33:27 AM by JAWS2003 »

Offline BUG_EAF322

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #155 on: February 18, 2006, 08:34:03 AM »
I have seen/heard storys of lancasters doing the corkscrew to evade fighters at night in wich the fighters couldnt follow offcourse they dissapeared in the dark also.
I guess the biggest problem with  those bombers in AH is that they run at fullspeed all the way but fighters can do this also.

In real life i guess they had more time and took more time to setup an attack working to gether with aircontrol to setup the attack.

And maybe they only had one good chance than had to leave the area or take the time to setup the attack again.
Or another group setup took over the attack.

But mostly those bombers ran in big formations having to keep speed at 150 mph cruising. Not like in AH.

AH is a game runned by individuals not like the team disipline in WO2.

Offline Glasses

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #156 on: February 18, 2006, 12:10:53 PM »
Well Bug I don't regret anything  of the LW losing the war yeah it was  a toool of the Nazis like it was a tool for any other nation on the War that was set out to kill  anyone , No single  person in WW2  that fought in the war is clean form causing human suffering, that and beyond the war. Despite this I have great admiration for all pilots from any side that fought in the war, and in fact several of my former JG54 squaddies can attest to that.

I just find it  quite frustrating watching   Planes that were no turn fighters either pulling maneuvers that would cause an A6M Zero turn green with Envy, and those planes which were heavier  and being to fluter around like nothing more like they have said like a very fast C152  with a very gentle departure from controlled flight.

Yeah the 190 can be  somewhat controllable at low airspeed no doubt about that, but then you look in contrast to what it faces and you find the slow speed handling of other kites to be quite exagerated  even to the pooint of being ludicrous while the  190A5 might still be controllable at 95mphTAS ( I don't even know why are we using TAS)  you'll find that an airplane like  a P-47 in AH will go below that and can keep pulling quite some G s and even pull up to a rear quarter shot at even less airspeed and pull even higher AoA, just by dropping the magical Vstol flaps.

 I have several hours flying time in small planes, I don't pretend to be an expert,but I do know  enough to know that something's off in the modeling of not only LW planes but the rest of the plane set.  

  Seems people get  filled with hatred whenever they see a post of mine and even take parts of it out of context, to start a flame war, and accuse me of wanting to LW to  Win almost every battle, that's not simply the truth, you can see my K/D for the past couple of months and you can see I do reasonably well when  I'm forced to fly the airplanes like the missiles with guns  as they're modeled, what I find frustrating is that even with 6 years flying in AH, even if I'm reasonably skilled it won't matter anyway  because the LW planes  single engine fighters cannot in almost any situation out fight any planes and get  them to reverse, there's no way. The acelerated stall in 190s and 109s start at 300mph and at that speed most planes that are not like that gain a considerable amount of advantage by not being and not having any performance to be gained, since most 190s and 109s actually perform best in that 250 350 mph range, yet in AH they simply cannot do anything.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2006, 12:14:23 PM by Glasses »

Offline Charge

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #157 on: February 18, 2006, 01:08:57 PM »
"The LW was a tool of the nazi's nothing to be proud of."

What the hell are you talking about, BUG?

Are you suggesting we are NAZIs because we like to fly and gather knowledge about LW iron?

Stay out of the discussion if you do not understand what is talked about, kid.

-C+
"When you wish upon a falling star, your dreams can come true. Unless it's really a giant meteor hurtling to the earth which will destroy all life. Then you're pretty much screwed no matter what you wish for. Unless of course, it's death by meteorite."

Offline BUG_EAF322

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #158 on: February 18, 2006, 01:49:19 PM »
Kid/s ? i just put them in bed.
Are u an expert?

im not im just just talkin on my feeling.
Since i was a litle kid i been into aviation because my dad was a ground engineer and spend alot of time in and around planes.
even flew at times in em and jumped out of them.

maybe after i done my aviation JAR B1 study wich i start next year but than still not able to talk about whats real.

Its just the way some talk about 50k death allies calling em peasants unskilled etc.
anyway the reaction from Glasses is a very mature one not like urs
dont be an arrogant joker.

I pay for this game since 1.03 and i have all rights like u to talk and give my thoughts.

actualy u just pushed me again to stick in this thread.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2006, 01:55:20 PM by BUG_EAF322 »

Offline Charge

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #159 on: February 18, 2006, 02:19:17 PM »
"dont be an arrogant joker."

I'm not -you are.

You are calling us NAZI symphatizers.

-C+
"When you wish upon a falling star, your dreams can come true. Unless it's really a giant meteor hurtling to the earth which will destroy all life. Then you're pretty much screwed no matter what you wish for. Unless of course, it's death by meteorite."

Offline Krusty

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #160 on: February 18, 2006, 10:55:19 PM »
Charge is right. You are calling all LW pilots Nazi sympathizers, all simply because they fly these planes. That's taking the emphasis from the main point and saying "It doesn't matter anyways, if I'm wrong or right, you're all neo-nazi wannabes and that's wrong!" -- it's diverting the argument.

Please leave such accusations out of it.

Offline Guppy35

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #161 on: February 18, 2006, 11:23:36 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Glasses
Difference is the figures you quote are operations in all theaters those I quote are against the LW in the ETO :-)


You miss my point.  somehow using the real wartime dead in an argument about a flight sim doesn't work for me.  Nothing remotely humorous about the loss of anyone's son or daughter regardless of which side they were on.
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Offline BUG_EAF322

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #162 on: February 18, 2006, 11:32:30 PM »
where did i say that ?

The one who fits the shoe take it

The LW was a tool of the nazi's its no way or other.

U guys should look at ur own place texts and try to imagine how u can take it.

"I fly german stuff because they where experts so i must be an expert.
Guys that fly allied planes mostly suk because they where simple inexperiand peasants."

I have seen enough threads greatly defending the uber luftwaffe how great they where with an almost disapointed emphasis they couldnt win the war.

I have been called ****  for that by the banned guy coz i shot him down in the ct.
Yeah i hate that attitude.

I dont hate guys that fly german planes i dont hate real lw pilots either its just that wanna be attitude some guys show it makes me sick.

and love

Offline Lye-El

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #163 on: February 19, 2006, 01:07:22 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Glasses


Apparently the only  way those 50k allied aircrews died against the LW, where from exposure to Polio, Tuberculosis,and Anthrax,from screwing the farmer's Sheep .   :D


Most were due to flack. And the Germans died  much more when the bombers were escorted by fighters. So one could draw the conclusion the LW did pretty good...against bombers... and against allied fighters they didn't do so good. If one wants to make asinine statements.:D


i dont got enough perkies as it is and i like upen my lancs to kill 1 dang t 34 or wirble its fun droping 42 bombs

Offline Wilbus

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Will 109s and Fw-190s be fixed before ToD release
« Reply #164 on: February 19, 2006, 01:56:23 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Lye-El
Most were due to flack. And the Germans died  much more when the bombers were escorted by fighters. So one could draw the conclusion the LW did pretty good...against bombers... and against allied fighters they didn't do so good. If one wants to make asinine statements.:D


Yet another not too clever comment by you.

If you wanna argue how well LW fighters did against Allied fighters and bombers escorted by fighters you might wanna add in the equation of numbers.

You're conclusions are quite obviously not based on anything.
Rasmus "Wilbus" Mattsson

Liberating Livestock since 1998, recently returned from a 5 year Sheep-care training camp.