Author Topic: How high are $$$ now (Read 8899 times)

beet1e · « **Reply #225 on:** May 02, 2006, 10:32:28 AM »

BigGun - the three best selling passenger cars are indeed Japanese imports, but these are outsold by three trucks - Ford F150, Dodge Ram and Chevy Silverado. In other words, the three best selling cars rank 4th, 5th and 6th in terms of total vehicle sales volumes. So yes, the US has a large portion of fuel efficient japanese cars, but it also has an even larger proportion of not so fuel efficient American trucks, and some variants are indeed gas guzzlers that don't even make 12mpg on the highway. Review my sources, and if you can find anything wrong with what I said, I'll consider making a correction.

Skuzzy · « **Reply #226 on:** May 02, 2006, 12:17:30 PM »

You are saying a significant number of trucks are on the roads, but you are only comparing it to unit sales for *each* model of car.

Total up the unit sales of all the cars sold in this country, versus the units sales of light trucks. Then you will find trucks are indeed a fairly low percentage (*low* being in the eye of the beholder) of the overall unit sales in the U.S.

Allow me to spell it out. Say you have 10,000 light truck sales (arbitrary numbers) and the next vehicle is a car which only has 8,000 unit sales, but the next is another car, which has 7,000 unit sales and so on and so forth.

If it went:
10,000 trucks
8,000 car
7,000 car
6,000 car
5,000 car
4,000 car
3,000 car
2,000 car
1,000 car
9,00 car

Let's stop there. 10,000 truck sales versus 33,900 car sales. Get it? Just because a truck is number one in unit sales, does not make it a significant portion of all vehicle sales in this country.

beet1e · « **Reply #227 on:** May 02, 2006, 12:50:26 PM »

Yes, skuzzy. But that doesn't make any difference to what I was saying, which was that sales of 12mpg guzzlers are going to be the hardest hit by rising gas prices, in the mpg spectrum. BG seemed to be saying that such vehicles are in a minority, which they probably are. All I'm saying is that some variants of the three best selling models are indeed 12mpg gas guzzlers.

Nashwan · « **Reply #228 on:** May 02, 2006, 01:07:29 PM »

Quote

Just because a truck is number one in unit sales, does not make it a significant portion of all vehicle sales in this country.

Light trucks (SUVs, pickups and minivans) actually outsell cars in the US.

In the first 3 months of 2006, for example:

Car: 1,838,976
Truck: 2,095,907

http://www.ucsusa.org/news/press_release/sales-of-suvs-minivans-and-pickups-surpass-cars-for-first-time.html
http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D8GOQM383.htm?campaign_id=apn_asia_up&chan=gb

Skuzzy · « **Reply #229 on:** May 02, 2006, 01:32:33 PM »

Sure, when you toss in SUV's and minivans. They are by far and away the most popular. Can't drive 100 feet without seeing a SUV or minivan around here.

But those are far from the 12mpg vehicle beet likes to lament about. The 12mpg vehicle has never been a dominant sales unit and yet it is always beet's focus.

BigGun · « **Reply #230 on:** May 02, 2006, 01:42:08 PM »

Of coarse 12mpg vehicle is going to be harder hit than a 20mpg vehichle with higher gas prices. But you imply with often used 12mpg number that is the majority of what is driving around.

beet1e · « **Reply #231 on:** May 02, 2006, 02:33:41 PM »

BG - just think of my hypothetical "12mpg gas guzzler" as a euphemism for any OTT gas hog.

lazs2 · « **Reply #232 on:** May 02, 2006, 02:41:41 PM »

beet... now you lost me... in another thread you had suggested that we artificialy raise the price of fuel with taxes... now you appear to be saying the same thing that I am.... to let the price depend on demand.

Also... you would be hard pressed to find any American vehicle or one sold her that got an average of 12 mpg unless it was a brit or itallian car.

Toad... yep... give the awards but we don't need to tax anything to come up with a few paltry billion....

straffo... I think that the current defenition of socialism and socialistic programs is not merely mine.... Any division of wealth based on need rather than worth is socialism. Taking from those who earn to give to those who do little or nothing..

Beet... your own mrs thatcher said it... "the problem with socialism is that eventualy you run out of other peoples money." Apparently she subscribes to the same dictionary as I do.

But.... maybe I have wronged you.... maybe you don't really think the government should grow and tax to pay for thinks like research into alternative fuels and halting global warming....

What were your solutions again?

lazs

beet1e · « **Reply #233 on:** May 02, 2006, 03:48:39 PM »

I don't think I ever suggested an additional tax on road fuel. Indeed, I believe that diesel tax in Britain should be cut to levels seen in other EU countries, which is why only about 34% of cars in the UK are fuel efficient diesels, as compared with 60% in Austria and Italy. I do however agree with Rolex in believing that the profligate waste of oil would be a very bad thing economically, and I also maintain that the high cost of road fuel in European countries has meant that we've never fostered a gas guzzling culture. Admittedly, there are some high performance European cars like Aston Martin, Ferrari and Porsche which consume huge amounts of fuel, but because these cars are very expensive, relatively few of them are sold.

Quote

now you appear to be saying the same thing that I am.... to let the price depend on demand.

hehe, I think it will be the other way round - demand will depend on price. But it's a chicken/egg situation. The difference is that we KNOW demand is going to be high because of China. I wouldn't be surprised if you saw gas at $4/gallon in July.

I am fully aware of M. Thatcher's beliefs. I voted for her three times, remember - in 1979, 1983 and 1987. And I've never been ashamed of that, and would do the same thing again under the same circumstances.

And Lazs... if I could just "solve" the world energy crisis at a stroke, or "just like that" as Tommy Cooper used to say, I'd be very rich. I could even afford a 12mpg Aston Martin! The high price of oil is going to mean that other fuels are developed - bio fuels from renewable sources are a good example, especially as growth of the source eg. wheat would reduce CO2 and global warming. Our own government (which is currently in meltdown - LOL) has mandated that by next year (I think) 5% of fuel sold on a garage forecourt must come from a renewable resource. That proportion will increase as time goes by. And... I think we're going to be taking another look at Nukes. I think we should do what Finland has done and increase our proportion of nuclear generated electricity, instead of burning fossil fuels to generate it.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #234 on:** May 02, 2006, 04:24:14 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by beet1e

Jackal - I'm not going to type it all out again. Go to http://www.fueleconomy.gov In 2006 models look up Dodge Ram, which is (according to forbes.com) one of the three best selling vehicles in the USA. In 2WD you will see one variant that gets 12 city/15 hwy, and another which gets 9 city/12 hwy.

One variant.

Here`s a hint. Yes, the Dodge Ram in all "variants" are pretty popular. The kicker is the majority of these trucks are used for work. A tool, in other words. Sometimes they serve double duty. So, exctly what is your point?

Quote

but these are outsold by three trucks - Ford F150, Dodge Ram and Chevy Silverado. In other words, the three best selling cars rank 4th, 5th and 6th in terms of total vehicle sales volumes. So yes, the US has a large portion of fuel efficient japanese cars, but it also has an even larger proportion of not so fuel efficient American trucks, and some variants are indeed gas guzzlers that don't even make 12mpg on the highway.

LOL Three days ago I had a new F150, four wheel drive sitting in my driveway. I asked out of curousity what actual fuel mileage they were getting. 22 to 24 mpg. Go figure.

You have to know that fuel ratings in the U.S. are placed on the conservative side.

beet1e · « **Reply #235 on:** May 02, 2006, 04:52:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Jackal1
One variant.
Here`s a hint. Yes, the Dodge Ram in all "variants" are pretty popular. The kicker is the majority of these trucks are used for work. A tool, in other words. Sometimes they serve double duty. So, exctly what is your point?

If you'd done as I asked, and actually gone to check my source, you'd see that not one, but four variants of Dodge Ram have city/highway gas mileages that span the 12mpg mark. But I guess it's asking too much to expect you to show any interest in the facts.

And I'm fairly confident that sales of the 8.3 litre V10 version will soon be in decline.

Mr Big · « **Reply #236 on:** May 02, 2006, 07:07:33 PM »

Beetle, I LOVE big trucks.

Right now my company has:

1. 2003 F350 4 door 4x4, V-10 ( The one I drive)
2. 2006 Chevy 3500, dualy flatbed, big V-8
3. 2006 F350 4 door King Ranch 4x4 p/u, turbo Diesel
4. 2006 F450 4 door dualy flatbed, turbo diesel
5. 2002 F250 crew cab p/u, v-8

All of these trucks except the '02 F250 hall dump trailers with a gross trailer loads of about 14,000 pounds each, plus 3-4 man crews and up to 1.5 tons on the trucks. Not much else I can buy is going to get that done everyday.

Granted, 4x4's are not needed (most of the time). Also, I wish my truck had the turbo diesel rather than the V-10. The lift and big tires/wheels are just to give it character, like me!

A lot of people around here buy these big trucks because they actually need them.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #237 on:** May 02, 2006, 08:15:07 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by beet1e
If you'd done as I asked, and actually gone to check my source, you'd see that not one, but four variants of Dodge Ram have city/highway gas mileages that span the 12mpg mark. But I guess it's asking too much to expect you to show any interest in the facts.

Like I have said before if all your links were followed the intardnet would slow to a grinding halt. Google has a brown out every time you log on.

If you had actualy read what was posted instead of going on another Google the Evil U.S. Empire crusade it was explained to you that the majority of these trucks are used in work. A tool. Some serve double purpose.
Also I think you would find that most of the owners of these trucks would tell you they get waaaay better mileage than the rating. Of course you don`t wish to hear that.
Now, back to your Googledom.

Mr Big · « **Reply #238 on:** May 02, 2006, 08:26:30 PM »

Almost forgot. Guess who pays for 100% of the gas in all of these/my trucks?

bkbandit · « **Reply #239 on:** May 02, 2006, 08:47:53 PM »

Ill i want to noe is that i can drive my camaro with out havein to turn to crime to feed it.

Trucks are nice but a number of the new dodges arent used for work here. I seen alot of them all fully detailed just cruzin the streets, not yet have i seen one towing or with anything in the bed. BUt hey....... i dont care its a nice truck, i like them and with the right exhuast they sound great. I see alot more of the smaller trucks with 6s doin alot of the work unless its a big load but what ever is towin will be a 2000 or so, nothin new or as nice as that dodge. I friend of mine saw that a dodge(the one with the viper engine

) racing on the park way, he told me it was reallllllll fast.

Somethin needs to be done, a new fuel has to come out or thing. If not transportation in general is goin to suffer.