For the first time in GWB's term history...

[Delirium]

Originally posted by Spooky
We have two solutions as a civilized western world : kill them -ALL-  or buy them off,

Well, we know what happened the last time we tried appeasement instead of confronting groups hellbent on controlling the world through fear.

Oh, but 'Peace in our time' worked after all, didn't it?

[-Concho-]

Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Our military needs to get better at counter-insurgency.  

In reality, what does the average grunt know about counter-insurgency?  99% of the soldiers can't speak arabic, how are they going to build relationships and communicate with the locals?

The best book I've read on counter-insurgency is one called "Lost in translation".  You have to have the support of the local population, they are the ones who tell you when movements are going on, where booby-traps and IEDs are, and other vital information.  But if the local pop is afraid, if they suffer retaliation because they give you intel, then you have lost.

Interesting point.

What is your expirence within the military?

[Thrawn]

I swear, Bush himself could say the Iraq is a disaster and the Bushophiles would deny it.



"Abizaid: I believe that the sectarian violence is probably as bad as I've seen it in Baghdad in particular, and that if not stopped, it is possible that Iraq could move toward civil war."

- General Abizaid, August 2006.


In November 2003 Abizaid said there were less than 5,000 insurgents in Iraq.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1006232,00.html


In Austust 2006 Abizaid said there were about 20,000 insurgents in Iraq.

http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/viewArticle.asp?articleID=2744



"An overwhelming majority of 72% of American troops serving in Iraq think the U.S. should exit the country within the next year, and more than one in four say the troops should leave immediately, a new Le Moyne College/Zogby International survey shows."

http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1075


...and magikallly it's the fult of teh Librals!  

[BigGun]

Originally posted by Fishu
It's not quite that simple. You're thinking it simply from your point of view, with your cultural background and your way of thinking. The western way of thinking. To them we're nothing but aggressors with empty promises. Whether the terrorist, or whatever people likes to call them, right or wrong, it doesn't matter to the people, because they are part of the people down there in the middle east. There's a much bigger threat against them all - the west - which they see as a threat or an aggressor.

What has the west brought to the people in the middle east; Wealth? Jobs? Pleasure? Luxury?
The west has brought them nothing of those. Instead, on the daily news they're every day hearing about people having it bad in several different places in the middle east and all of those have one common factor: The western influence.

To them it's similar situation as the communism was for the west. It has little to do with what the west really wants, when the people down there hears nothing but bad whenever it's about the west and the middle east. We can tell them all we want about the human rights and the benefits of democracy, but we haven't done any of it, on the contrary. To them our talk of freedom etc. is same as their promises of peace etc. to us - empty words. People reacts to acts, not to words of promises one after another.

People react to these acts. Bad acts cause bad things and vice-versa. We can criticize their reactions all we wan't, but that doesn't help if we keep doing something that creates the response. Exageration and ignorance most definitely won't help with the issue. We're not going to get rid of them, so why are we trying to make our situation even worse? Let them be the fools instead. Eventually the people down there will question the support for their terrorists. That just doesn't happen if we don't question our ignorance on the results of our actions first.

You speak as if you know what "they" think. You are just making this crap up, and trying to pass it off as some sort of fact. Problem with the middle east is the crusades were not more successful. If crusaders had finished the job, we wouldn't have so many radical islamic fundamentalists.

[Shifty]

Originally posted by Thrawn


...and magikallly it's the fult of teh Librals!  

 Who in this thread said that it was the liberals fault? Or did that come from the same place you learned to spell?

[Sandman]

Originally posted by john9001
the terrorists love people like you, in fact they need people like you to win.

What's that smell?

[texace]

Smells like...rotting meat?

[Edbert1]

Originally posted by Sandman
What's that smell?

...that "gasoline" smell?