Atheist the way SOME see them?

[IgnorantJoe]

Again, you are aetheist, no?

Article concerns Wiccans, yes?

Originally posted by Chairboy
I figured he was talking about Wiccans the whole time, what does atheism have to do with this?

Help understand my perspective?

Originally posted by lukster to Chairboy
I will add that the typical religious symbol conveys meaning in regards to the afterlife. If YOUR religion (no idea what wiccans believe) has no faith in an afterlife then what's the point of a symbol on your grave marker?

lukster discussing aetheist continually, yes?

Originally posted by Chairboy
I know lukster wouldn't be dumb enough to troll atheism into the conversation about grave markers, why do _you_ think he would?

[Chairboy]

Nah, we were talking about wiccans, I doubt he'd bring up atheists suddenly.  I read it as 'yor' to be the wiccan in question.  Rhetorical and whatnot.

[wrag]

Originally posted by sveno
the writer of above linked text is an extremist, a christian one - seems to live in a very small world, roughly the same world as every extremist (religious, national, etc), filled with fear, denial, ignorance and hatred.

the article itself cannot be taken serious in any way. i do respect subjectivity in most cases - but this is worse than the messiest UFO-report. my greatest fear is that actually someone believes in such things (takes loads of ignorance and denial).

loads of ignorance and denial?????????????????????

What do you know of communist?

What do you know about the history of KGB training of agents they intended to send to the U.S.

You are of course aware that Tsun Tzu is required reading in the Chinese intellegence community?  And was required in the old Soviet regime?

You have also read and understand Tsun Tzu?

Do you know where, and how, those agents were trained.

Are you aware of just how far they are or were willing to go to achieve their goals?

You are of course aware that one of the major Soviet techniques was the use of DIS-information?  You are aware of what dis-information is right?

Have you ever seen their handy work?  I have.

I was stationed at Phu Bai.  I saw one of the mass graves of mostly school teachers, police officers, public officials etc near Hue in 1968.  They shot some at 1st.  Guess they wanted to save ammo.  They started clubing them with their rifles then, but apparently after breaking a few rifle stocks (bloody broken rifle stocks were found at the site) they stopped doing that.  Did you know they buried many of those people alive?  If I heard correctly,the article about it was in U.S. media for maybe 2 or 3 days then forgotten.  Can't say I wasn't here to see how long the talked of it.

I could tell you far more, but I don't think you want to hear it.  Many Vets could tell allot about communist and their methods.  Sadly many Vets of Korea and Viet Nam prefer not to speak of it.  You could ask why, and I could tell you they don't want to relive it, and I could tell you too many people upon hearing CAN'T deal with it and turn away in DISBELIEF and HORROR, and then are angry with the Vet for telling them.  I KNOW, been there done that.

Look up the history/story of S/Sgt Larry Dring U. S. Army.  His story is quite interesting.  He started out as a Medic.

The claims in the article sound, or seem, pretty far out there.  I'm NOT saying the article is accurate.  Not saying I agree with it.  Not saying I disagree with it either.

"loads of ignorance and denial" hmmm............  perhaps a bit of research is in order?

My Father used to say to me over and over "You can tell what kind of tree it is by the fruit".

[wrag]

Originally posted by x0847Marine
They mingled freely with nude males, topless females, and sadomasochists.  Simulated sex acts were performed along the parade route

I dont see a problem.

Is it true?  Did it actually happen?

[wrag]

Originally posted by detch01
The idea that there is some grand athiestic conspiracy to destroy western civilization is at best, absurd. What is there to discuss? I mean beside the paranoia of that particular author.



asw

Not sure the author was claiming it is grand athiest conspiracy?  Is that what the article says, or what you see?

[wrag]

Originally posted by Ghosth
"Some will tie in the (ok our) run away media with a very strong leftward slant.
I've seen just this argument and I'm inclined to think You have too.
The claim would be, will be, is? Most of the media is inclined to look the other way or even help................."

To me which way the media is biased is another like expecting schools to be right wing/christian. They are the way they are, your not going to change it.

Comes back to the old chesnut, "Only believe 1/10 of what you hear, 1/4 of what you read, and 1/2 of what you see"

You need to weigh every sentence in your head as your reading. Is this plausable? Probable? Can it be substanciated? Does it ring true? Or does it smell like horse droppings? What does the writer hope to gain? What proof does he offer?  The difference between real journalism and rabble rousing lays in the answers to these and other questions.

The answers to such questions would rely heavily on each individuals knowledge base.

If you stand up in a crowded movie theater and yell fire you can be held liable for resulting damages. In spite of your "freedom of speech" You are expected to use it honestly, and considering consequences.

Our current media  is in no way held accountable for what it puts out.
They let anyone yell fire in a crowded theater,  indeed it happens every day.
Like a runaway train there is no one at the controls. If there was the article you wish to discuss would never have seen daylight. (which is my point btw)

IMHO Gotta be REAL careful with that!  Could easily find ourselves with a muzzled freedom of speach.  But I agree nothing within the constitution relieves anyone of the responsibilty for their freedoms. (Although some in congress and the senate have voted to exempt themselves from some of the laws thay impose on most Americans)
 
Snip "I find myself somewhat in disagreement with you on the education portion of your answer, the deffinition, that you seem to pose is what I have the most trouble with. That and the facts pointing to the steady dumbing down of our young people. The SEEMING failure to teach, to give our young people the basic tools such as reading, etc........"

Part of what your bringing up has nothing to do with the education system. And has everything to do with todays parents & children.  It in no way reflects on the topic, that the education system has been liberalised.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can NOT make him drink.
You can put a child in school, but you can NOT make him want to learn.
That has to be accomplished by parents and the child itself.

I will say that not letting teachers disiplene children that need it has made this problem huge, epidemic in size. We are reaping what we have sowed, and will continue to do so.

Snippage  
As to descended on the schools, ROFLMAO.
Change has ALWAYS happened through the education system.
Thats what its there for, thats its reason for existing.
So now a minor change is happening they someone doesn't agree with.
Yet if you gave them the chance they'd do the exact same thing only in their favor. Can anyone say double standard?

Not sure I agree with this viewpoint.  To me education is reading, writting, arithmatic, etc... more along those lines then teaching them to have sex with whoever and/or whatever.  Not sure they should be required to become muslim for a week study the Quaran and face meca and pray either.

Schools, colleges & university's have always been on average more liberal than the rest of the country at any given point you want to pick. Its the way it is, the way its always been. Tis the nature of the beast, so get over it.
Sniippage

Exactly what part of this do you disagree with wrag? You didn't exactly say.
The fact that Colleges & University's have always been harbours for the Liberal? Why do you think they call them "Liberal Arts" ???


They're not so liberal anymore.  I stood with many when the accuzations was against the right for muzzling free speech in colleges, I find it seems now we have only traded a right muzzle for a left.  Now the left has become the tyrants and are muzzling students freedom of speech with the famous Political Correctness theme.  They seem to do it to the conservatives, christian, and white males mostly.

Or the fact that change tends to come from the Universitys and trickles down through society? Again proveable if your willing to dig. All the way back to the founding of this country!

No I'm not accusing you of taking a side Wrag. I mean exactly what I said. That is no one seems to want to play this particular game with you, & I wonder why. Gee, you suppose they've played this game before?

Maybe they think you don't play fair? Or just don't like the rules you play by.

Rules I play by?  Not sure I understand that???

Either way its no big deal her. Beats going outside to rake leaves & get ready for winter.

& enjoy

[wrag]

Originally posted by Booz
Of course not, you haven't made it your job to protect constitutional rights. Disparaging those that do seems to be your gig.

You KNOW this for a fact?

You KNOW he doesn't vote?

You KNOW he doesn't send mail, or emails.

You KNOW he doesn't call.

Pretty broad statement there................

If he served in the military then it was at one time his job to protect the constitution.  He even took an oath to do so.

One does NOT have to join a protest to make themselves heard.

[wrag]

Originally posted by Booz
I've already asked to hear what you think you read.

The EAC is curious too (if it existed, which it doesn't)

What I saw, or read in the article?  There is a pretty good chance we both read the same thing.  What I saw is perhaps different from what you saw.

Start with my reply to sveno 1st then we can discuss more.

And be ready cause we'll be getting into some history.

[lukster]

Originally posted by IgnorantJoe
Maybe I'm confused?

He said aetheist wouldn't want grave symbols, yes?

He expressed ignorance about Wiccan beliefs, yes?

I read again but maybe missing something?

Why would ANYONE that does not believe in an afterlife want a symbol representing that nonbelief on their gravemarker? I believe that Christians want their symbol to remind others that death has no power over them.

Don't get me wrong, I think everyone is entitled to whatever symbol they want on their grave marker. I'm just trying to understand.

[Chairboy]

The Wiccans don't believe in any sort of afterlife?

BTW, once again, it's a marker of religious affiliation, not a forwarding address.

[lukster]

Originally posted by Chairboy
The Wiccans don't believe in any sort of afterlife?

BTW, once again, it's a marker of religious affiliation, not a forwarding address.

Let's back up. Why note religious affiliation on a grave marker? Do people put their education or job on 'em?

Seems I've read that Wiccans believe in reincarnation.

[lazs2]

the fact that so many athiests are liberal socialists and commies is not lost on the run of the mill citizen.

Most of us grew up with communism and knowing that when the athiests get in power... they "supress" religion and a belief in god.. they do it in the harshest terms.

to most.. the attacks on nativity scenes and "in god we trust" and not allowing children to pray in school all smack of this kind of repression.

right or wrong... the media and the education system are heavily lefty with more than their share of athiests... they control education and information and yet.... they still can't win.   they never will in my opinion.

We can't do much about the media but the internet and cable have blunted the liberal athiests sword...

We need to work on education now... vouchers are the solution.

The thing about cable and the internet and vouchers is that they are about choice... given a choice..  the vast majority of humans avoid athiesm as a religion.

lazs

[Chairboy]

Lazs, I'm neither liberal, socialist, or a commie.  How do I fit in your stereotype?

[x0847Marine]

Originally posted by wrag
Is it true?  Did it actually happen?

Yup, during the parade. This fruit cake chick who wrote the article has her panties in a bunch over it for some reason.

[lazs2]

chair.. I would submit that you aren't even stupid or fervent enough to be a real athiest.

lazs