Author Topic: Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?  (Read 2534 times)

Offline Hazzer

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #60 on: November 21, 2006, 09:54:49 AM »
The united states will never be able to leave iraq and save face.Like vietnam before you failed to learn the lessons of history.Dien bien phu.
"I murmured that I had no Shoes,till I met a man that had no Feet."

Offline x0847Marine

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #61 on: November 21, 2006, 10:52:08 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hazzer
The united states will never be able to leave iraq and save face.Like vietnam before you failed to learn the lessons of history.Dien bien phu.


We had it right during WWII, they knew in order to quash years of civil unrest... the populations of Germany & Japan had to be on board. They got on board by being fire bombed to the stone age & nuked... knowing if they tried any flapdoodle, it would rain fiery death upon them once again.

We have lost our nerve to end war, for real, thanks to our idiot nut-less leaders being more concerned about appearances..

My plan; Adhere to the proven WWII method of winning and ending war; systematic and mid-evil destruction of any and all insurgent strong holds by overwhelming force; "Operation linebacker 06"... including any civilians not smart enough to separate themselves from the bad guys.

Show them no mercy, for they will show you none, then leave.

Offline john9001

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #62 on: November 21, 2006, 10:59:06 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hazzer
The united states will never be able to leave iraq and save face.Like vietnam before you failed to learn the lessons of history.Dien bien phu.


you so funny, dien bien phu was down in a valley surrounded by mountains, it was undefendable, the french were badly defeated and gave up all of indo-china.

the NVA tried to do the some thing at KEH SAHN, only KEH SAHN was on a mountain top, the NVA sent 30,000 battle hardened regular troops at only 3000 US marines defending KEH SAHN.

the 3000 marines destroyed the 30,000 NVA troops. (ok, the marines had a little help from air power).

what about the tet offensive? the NVA and viet cong hoped to over run south vietnam with that country wide attack.  Instead the viet cong were wiped out as a effective fighting force for the rest of the war and the NVA suffered severe loses.

maybe our enemys should "learn from history".

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #63 on: November 21, 2006, 01:08:41 PM »
very well said john9001

Offline Maverick

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #64 on: November 21, 2006, 03:21:46 PM »
Is hazzer another one of beetles shades?
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Offline lazs2

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #65 on: November 22, 2006, 08:43:58 AM »
the more I look at it the more I like dividing iraq into 2 or three countries... then divide iran into two or three..

If they can't get along then at least let em wallow in it.. if they are allways terrorizing this or that little chunk of sand they will be no trouble to the rest of the world.   If one starts to take over too much sand or oil.... we help the other guy  by wiping out most of the bad guys war machine in one or two strikes.

If they ever drop their religious biggotry and act civilized... we can let em form bigger countries.

lazs

Offline Sixpence

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #66 on: November 22, 2006, 09:37:28 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by x0847Marine
We had it right during WWII, they knew in order to quash years of civil unrest... the populations of Germany & Japan had to be on board. They got on board by being fire bombed to the stone age & nuked... knowing if they tried any flapdoodle, it would rain fiery death upon them once again.

We have lost our nerve to end war, for real, thanks to our idiot nut-less leaders being more concerned about appearances..

My plan; Adhere to the proven WWII method of winning and ending war; systematic and mid-evil destruction of any and all insurgent strong holds by overwhelming force; "Operation linebacker 06"... including any civilians not smart enough to separate themselves from the bad guys.

Show them no mercy, for they will show you none, then leave.


But there is one thing you fail to take into account...oil. We have been spending billions every year to secure middle east oil, the world economy depends on it.

To fire bomb Iraq into the ground would defeat the purpose of being there.
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

(and I still say he wasn't trying to spell possum!)

Offline Choocha

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #67 on: November 23, 2006, 12:54:49 PM »
Vietnam and Korea were battles in a larger war: the Cold War.  We won the Cold War.


Period

Offline Suave

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #68 on: November 23, 2006, 01:44:10 PM »
Wow you mean Shinseki was right? Who would've thought that the best and most experienced people in the military would have better plans for things military?

I know it's crazy right? It's an idea so ridiculous it made Rumsfeld and Wolfawitz chuckle.

Offline FiLtH

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #69 on: November 23, 2006, 11:34:22 PM »
Not a bad idea laz.

~AoM~

Offline Mr No Name

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #70 on: November 24, 2006, 03:53:25 AM »
I say go big and long...  

You know... Iraq has become our own "Terrorist nutjob BugZapper"  It seems that every lunatic in the region cant resist the appeal to go there rapidly to die.  There have been many tens of thousands of them die there since 2003.  I just wonder how they keep getting in?  Maybe the border there is in as sad of a shape as our own southern border!

I say stay there and give 700,000 or 800,000 Islamofascists a chance to be killed, that's what they want and I feel we should not deprive them of this opportunity.
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Offline Nilsen

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #71 on: November 24, 2006, 04:11:28 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mr No Name
I say go big and long...  

You know... Iraq has become our own "Terrorist nutjob BugZapper"  It seems that every lunatic in the region cant resist the appeal to go there rapidly to die.  There have been many tens of thousands of them die there since 2003.  I just wonder how they keep getting in?  Maybe the border there is in as sad of a shape as our own southern border!

I say stay there and give 700,000 or 800,000 Islamofascists a chance to be killed, that's what they want and I feel we should not deprive them of this opportunity.


So you think it attracts terrorists like flypaper?
If so then you are using your own troops and the civilian Iraqi population as bate for terrorists. Is that right?

I belive it is creating new terrorists rather than just killing off excisting terrorists.

The "old" hardcore terrorists are prolly staying away and doing their bit in directing and recruiting now.

Offline JB88

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #72 on: November 24, 2006, 04:13:46 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
the more I look at it the more I like dividing iraq into 2 or three countries... then divide iran into two or three..

If they can't get along then at least let em wallow in it.. if they are allways terrorizing this or that little chunk of sand they will be no trouble to the rest of the world.   If one starts to take over too much sand or oil.... we help the other guy  by wiping out most of the bad guys war machine in one or two strikes.

If they ever drop their religious biggotry and act civilized... we can let em form bigger countries.

lazs


dividing things up has done wonders in the middle east...just ask the ottomans or on a smaller scale, the lebanese.  

it has solved everything up til just now hasnt it?...and it's only because we havent divided them up enough that it is failing now right?

i see now that while you are wholly "AGAINST" government intervention with regards to your own rights and responsibilities, you are totally "FOR"
governmental intervention in someone elses...

not sure how that transcribes, or works out it the end...but it is certainly fascinating to see them exist side by side in your philosophy with so little percievable degree of difficulty.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2006, 04:19:28 AM by JB88 »
this thread is doomed.
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word.

Offline lazs2

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #73 on: November 24, 2006, 10:07:16 AM »
but wait 88...is not I nor my government that wants the intervention in personal freedom...  they would be allowed to divide.  They can't get along.. they don't want to get along.. one nut job faction wants to wipe out one or 3 other nut job factions of the same backward barbaric religion..


sooo... I am saying... allow them all the freedom of forming their own states.  

I want the same for the U.S. in that I want more autonomous states here..  I would even welcome secession by a few states.

We have somewhat the same thing in that we have taxi riding metrosexual sardine people all wanting to make laws for rural people when the worlds are totaly different.

The arabs tend to bunch up into nutball sects anyway and treat anyone not of that particular insanity as some form of devil so...  it would be an easy thing...  everyone would be happy.

lazs

Offline -dead-

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Iraq War: Go Big, Go Long, or Go Home?
« Reply #74 on: November 26, 2006, 02:07:50 PM »
They way I see it:

Going Big would result in the most dead Americans and Iraqis, and the most animosity against the US from the subsequent Iraqi state/states, which also implies the most subsequent terrorist attacks. It's essentially the Vietnam option, and would be equally successful. On the plus side the US economy will do well from the brisk trade in arms and materiel, but the defecit will be enormous -- it is currently set to be the most expensive war since WWII.

Going Long would result in less dead Americans and Iraqis, although the permenant bases that this will lead to may lead to about the same amount of animosity against the US (and thus terrorist attacks) from the subsequent Iraqi state/states. On the plus side many of the terror attacks may well be directed at the US bases rather than the US itself.
This is the course the US will take. It will end with the subsequent Iraqi government imploding, a decent into chaos and then an anti-US government/s arising.

Going Home would result in the least dead Americans and Iraqis and the least animosity & terror attacks.  It would end with the subsequent Iraqi government imploding, a decent into chaos and then an anti-US government/s arising. Just like the other option. I'd go with this one -- you're going home anyway, and whatever government you leave will collapse anyway, so why prolong the agony? Although if it were left up to me I would have chosen the optimum option: "Don't go in the first place".

As to the "what if..." WWII scenario: given the circumstances surrounding the start of the Iraq war, perhaps a more analogous question would be "Should Germany/Japan have gone home instead of invading and occupying Europe/Asia?" There the same scenario does at least apply, no "what if?" is required: they did endure insurgency and uprisings when their troops were "rebuilding". So which was the right choice for Germany & Japan? Go Big, Go Long or Go Home?
“The FBI has no hard evidence connecting Usama Bin Laden to 9/11.” --  Rex Tomb, Chief of Investigative Publicity for the FBI, June 5, 2006.