Author Topic: Kill Stealers  (Read 2165 times)

Offline Ghosth

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Kill Stealers
« Reply #30 on: September 04, 2007, 07:23:48 AM »
Simplest answer, don't fly in a horde.

Anyone can make a mistake once, steal from me twice and you go on my stay away from list. No 6 calls, no clears unless its a sure kill for me. And most times, I won't even up from the field he's flying from if it happens consistantly.

I'll go elsewhere and find some other action.

Offline Devonai

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« Reply #31 on: September 04, 2007, 08:05:17 AM »
I agree with Humble.  Also, you can't accept help from your squaddies when you're in trouble and then complain about "stolen kills."  That's simply hypocrisy.  You're either on a team or on your own.
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Offline 5PointOh

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« Reply #32 on: September 04, 2007, 08:56:07 AM »
I sort of experience the same thing last night.  I was in a B24 on return trip home when CVA noticed me, I had ran into heavy fighters on the first part of my trip and had exhaust most of my ammo, and received a few dead gunner positions.  CVA killed one of my two remaining 24s with a nice slashing attack in a 38, as I tried to get away.  Down to my last 24, CVA comes in at a blistering rate and turns my last bomber in to a roman candle, so I am about to die, its only a matter of time...so as I continue to fly out over the water blazing away a Niki comes diving in and misses.  In an act to save CVAs kill I dive my 24 to the deck. Here comes the Niki again, and luckily for CVA the Niki goes under my 24 and crashes straight into the ground.  I got the kill on the Niki and CVA got the kill on me.  The point is when a plane is on fire, let him explode unless he is a direct threat.  Personally if I was CVA I would have been a little irritated at the Niki.
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Offline 68ROX

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« Reply #33 on: September 04, 2007, 09:49:19 AM »
Personally...

I do not care about "stolen" kills.

Usually I go in and do enough damage to get the kill....

If the NME plane goes off as a Roman Candle and someone else finishes them off...I do not care.

If it's the other way around, I'll finish them off.  If I get nothing, or an assist, great...I helped my country's cause by killing the foe.

I'm ususally on the bad end of a 4v1 (or more) so if they get a kick out of ganging up, fine.  I deserved it for getting into that situation.

If you want the kill...do the most damage.


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Offline Shuffler

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« Reply #34 on: September 04, 2007, 10:48:17 AM »
Some stay in a disabled plane at alt to see if a friendly will kill the one who shot him. Kill steals do not happen that often so I do not worry about it. I know I shot the plane down and that is good enough for me!
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Offline Simaril

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« Reply #35 on: September 04, 2007, 11:17:14 AM »
Don't forget that planes that are going to die, "aren't dead yet." As long as they have guns, they are  a threat to others...and to me.

This applies way more to the burning plane than otherwise. Once a zeke starts burning, its PROBABLY going to die. (I've loved the few times I can lower and slow a burning plane enough that I can get a ditch when the wing falls off!) But some planes burn a really long time -- and while we're waiting for it to go, it can very easily drop its bombs or get a kill (or 2, since people may stop paying attention to it). So even if you've "earned" the kill on the torch, it isnt dead YET and its a fair target.

However, it also applies to other damage. I've often pulled off a target called out as "dead," that later turned out to be fine and quite deadly. (The caller landed some pings, then saw the plane spin out and thought critical damage was done.) I've landed planes with only wing stubs often enough to know that even losing major chunks can be overcome -- so if looks like its responding to controls, and it flies in front of me, it gets a burst.

So while I don't try to steal kills, my operating principle is now that if its still a danger, its a target. And, if it pops up in my gunsight, I will shoot.

And I don't care if "my" kill gets stolen -- its my fault, because if I had killed it well enough it couldnt have been stolen.
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Offline SEraider

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« Reply #36 on: September 04, 2007, 11:20:52 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by 5PointOh
I sort of experience the same thing last night.  I was in a B24 on return trip home when CVA noticed me, I had ran into heavy fighters on the first part of my trip and had exhaust most of my ammo, and received a few dead gunner positions.  CVA killed one of my two remaining 24s with a nice slashing attack in a 38, as I tried to get away.  Down to my last 24, CVA comes in at a blistering rate and turns my last bomber in to a roman candle, so I am about to die, its only a matter of time...so as I continue to fly out over the water blazing away a Niki comes diving in and misses.  In an act to save CVAs kill I dive my 24 to the deck. Here comes the Niki again, and luckily for CVA the Niki goes under my 24 and crashes straight into the ground.  I got the kill on the Niki and CVA got the kill on me.  The point is when a plane is on fire, let him explode unless he is a direct threat.  Personally if I was CVA I would have been a little irritated at the Niki.


Good point.  This is what I am arguing about.
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Offline Murdr

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« Reply #37 on: September 04, 2007, 11:44:42 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by humble
The true measure of your flying is in your mind....and your adversaries. Earn your opponents respect and let the less talented chase your cripples...you'll come out ahead in the end in more ways then one.
Umm, the flaw in that being that your opponent doesn't know who they were fighting, or for all they know they assume they were fighting the kill stealer.
Quote
Originally posted by Ghosth
Simplest answer, don't fly in a horde.
That doesn't always apply either.  I've dewinged an enemy at 12k with no other plane in sight, and later watched a supposedly good player come along in a typh an steal the kill at 2k.  There was no 'mistake' about it.  I've also many times thought I've drug a fight away from others to look back after flying though the debris field and watch two lame arses following the falling wreck down, blasting away.
Quote
Originally posted by humble
The bigger question is does it really matter?
It seems to matter to raider, and it seems to an extent to matter to ghosth.  It does matter to me.  I don't often actually have a kill stolen where it is cut and dry no misunderstanding what is happening.  I do see attempts often enough though, where there is no mistaking that the 'kill' is cut in half, or missing one or both wing roots, or missing stabs.  I will continue to make a loud spectacle when I see it happen.  I will continue to note the said lame arse players ID's and never help them, and give the enemy on their six time to shoot them down before I go guns hot.  If I am in the falling wreck in that equation and I see it happen, I will go on 200 and ID the lame arse plane types who tried to steal, and/or the GameID of the lame arse player if it was stolen.  There are players know for consistantly attempting to steal credit on planes that can do nothing but fall.  Simple gratification of personally knowing who really shot the plane down, has no bearing on affecting other players poor behavior.

Also, IMO, flaming fighters are fair game (if it has controlled flight, it's a target).  Targeting a flaming bomber is just rude unless it happens to be seconds from dropping on a friendly target.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2007, 11:50:19 AM by Murdr »

Offline FBplmmr

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« Reply #38 on: September 04, 2007, 07:27:15 PM »
It can happen, but its not a big deal to me unless the guy is a perpetually shooting at falling debris.


Planes on fire still = dangerous  and should be dealt with.

Here is a short clip that shows how confusing it can be... a spit appears to be hurt but is only stalled/spin he recovers and begins firing at another plane.


1 of the 68s got some pings on him.. I took off his wing .. I got the assist.

oh well, I got a few more kills later I'm sure (just not in that passenger airliner I was flying for the film)


anyway short film (46seconds AHF)


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Offline SEraider

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« Reply #39 on: September 04, 2007, 07:50:36 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by FBplmmr
It can happen, but its not a big deal to me unless the guy is a perpetually shooting at falling debris.


http://www.filecrunch.com/file/~5yuo4s


That's the blatant thing that makes me mad, somebody shooting at fallin debris when someone else did the hardwork.
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Offline Delirium

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« Reply #40 on: September 04, 2007, 08:43:26 PM »
I'm happy enough to get a kill, if some noob score monger wants to come in an steal it, it doesn't bother me much.

Plenty of scalps out there, quit watching your score page and eagerly awaiting the 'congrats' when you land victories, you'll find you might enjoy the game more.
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Offline pluck

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« Reply #41 on: September 04, 2007, 08:51:35 PM »
well if it's a good fight and someone steals the kill, you can still salute that person/pm or vice versa.
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Offline ink

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« Reply #42 on: September 04, 2007, 10:16:13 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Delirium
...Plenty of scalps out there, quit watching your score page and eagerly awaiting the 'congrats' when you land victories, you'll find you might enjoy the game more.





good call Delirium

Offline shamroc

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« Reply #43 on: September 04, 2007, 10:40:54 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Delirium
I'm happy enough to get a kill, if some noob score monger wants to come in an steal it, it doesn't bother me much.

Plenty of scalps out there, quit watching your score page and eagerly awaiting the 'congrats' when you land victories, you'll find you might enjoy the game more.


Well said - I mean, it's just a stinkin kill - not like there isn't a boatload of them out there for the taking...  Annoying ?  Maybe a little, but it's sand off the beach the way I see it.  Besides, if it can be stolen, it really wasn't a kill to begin with.

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Offline Snubby

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« Reply #44 on: September 05, 2007, 12:11:45 AM »
i had a nice one today that kinda got under my skin, nothing that does not happen all the time, but still.  I was in my 1A at around 14k and came across a lone 47-d25 co-alt and we mixed it up, for a solid 5 min it was back and forth.. finally it got to the deck and I clipped a few chunks off of him, he pulled up for the last ditch effort and stalled, i came up right under him D400, still 200mph of airspeed....his entire plane silhouetted against the blue sky, I'm just relishing the hosing I was about to deliver..  then sure enough a 51 and a spixteen come blasting in guns blazing.. pull right in front of me.. both overshoot the jug, either didn't hit him or didn't do enough damage.. and i ended up getting him after he dove..  

granted it wasn't a "kill steal" in the sense that it is being discussed here, but i would have been LIVID if after all that work these 2 goobers had shot him down..

that would be like.. spending hours seasoning a steak, getting the coals just right, slathering on your special home made BBQ sauce that you made from a recipe your grandfather gave you just before he lost his last marble and starting having arguments with the cat, sitting down at a nice picnic table on a beautiful sunny day.. and as your fixing to make the first juicy cut.. a bird flies over poops on your plate..  so instead of eating your steak (kill) you end up eating McDonald's (assist)..


P.S. upon proofreading this I have come to the realization that I might be just a little bit weird.