F6F Recall

[lagger86]

From a squaddie:

(Image removed from quote.)


Deal with it!

I see how it is.....that's a sweet view. Forgive me for having an opinion. I guess I'll have to "deal with it"

Stop whineing. You guys asked for the F6F to get fixed, now it is fixed historically even with the bad Six view now You're STILL complaining to turn it back into it's broken stage? Go fly some other plane if you can't handle the new view.

Do what i do, when we do F6F runs, fly with a WINGMAN. It's more of a teamwork oriented plane now anyhow so suck it up and stop crying like 3 year olds who's mother took your favorite toy for being bad.

Was waiting for that one, and I actually agree. I wanted it updated because I flew it more than any other plane. I like carrier planes and always had a "thing" for the hellcat. I guess I'm just a crying 3 year old because I can't see anything behind me...oh well.. I never looked anyway. It's a great plane to fly...and other than the 6 view, it is better than ever.



 

[kotrenin]

I don't know, maybe the problem is with the size of the "pilot's" head.  Don't laugh.  Unlike the later Jugs and Ponys the Hellcats did not have a bubble canopy, just a little blister on top.  Essentially the glass was smooth and flowed right into the armor and fuselage behind the pilot.  The widest part of the cockpit glass appears to be just aft the instrument panel, making it impossible to get your body in a position to take advantage of the slight angle in the glass from front to back.  Also if you press your face or ear against a window in your house you probably won't be able to see the outside wall because the distance between the side of your head and your eye is enough to prevent a good viewing angle.  I know if I press my cheek and nose against the window at the same time it is better but HTC probably has not programed this into the views we have (when we look out the back at an angle we might be able to see it if we had peripheral vision maybe now with the 3 screen support that would be possible.).  I also don't know what measurements they have used to determine the diameter of the pilots head, if they have used pumpkin head dimensions it is going to affect how close to the window your eyes can get.  I imagine pin-head dimensions would help the rear view the most without spoiling the accuracy of the 3D model.

There is a reason the Americans developed defensive maneuvers such the Thatch weave and flew with wingmen and in the finger four formation.  The F6f was an offensive weapon with lots of armor to make up for the poor defensive visibility.

[CAP1]

ok, leme ask you guys this then?

i spent most of my first flight trying to adjust my views. i got the side views almost bearable.

 now i get over a vbase, and in on a p38. he goes for the typical ho shot, which i dodged....didn't hear, feel, or see any hits on me. he tries to line up another, and in this dodge, i try to set myself up to come round on him, but he gets around faster, and gets off a quick snapshot. it didn't seem like too much, and he was about 400 or so out(i think). no major sounding hits, but my right wing was suddenly gone.
 it just seemed as if the cat didn't take the damage she used to take, or should take.
 you guys that like the historically right stuff, weren't the hellcats notoriously tough?

[Anaxogoras]

If a P-38 landed hits on your wing, there's no convergence issues, so that's the full 4x.50cal + 1 hizooka effect.

[MjTalon]

Lagger, i wasn't pointing fingers at anyone sir. I'm a P47 pilot but since the new update I'm in love with the new F6F... Just because it's a sparkling image of the F6F-5 in my plane book " American Warplanes of WW2 ". it just looks like a winner and flies like one too!

It's a wingman plane now. So i suggest if you're a carrier based hellcat squadron you gent's had better start some hardcore wingman training to battle that deadly six view. It's not impossible because i've personally started running more and more hellcat runs on rook nation to get the guys into the habbit of flying with a wingman and working as a team or group.  

Much fun

[MjTalon]

ok, leme ask you guys this then?

i spent most of my first flight trying to adjust my views. i got the side views almost bearable.

 now i get over a vbase, and in on a p38. he goes for the typical ho shot, which i dodged....didn't hear, feel, or see any hits on me. he tries to line up another, and in this dodge, i try to set myself up to come round on him, but he gets around faster, and gets off a quick snapshot. it didn't seem like too much, and he was about 400 or so out(i think). no major sounding hits, but my right wing was suddenly gone.
 it just seemed as if the cat didn't take the damage she used to take, or should take.
 you guys that like the historically right stuff, weren't the hellcats notoriously tough?

I'm with gavagai here. I don't think any plane in the game ( besides bombers ) can take a concentrated pass of the P38s guns.  If he got a good burst on you, you were going down anyhow. But yes the Hellcats were tough... Not again 4x50 cals and a Hispano 20mm cannon with no convergence issues.

[CAP1]

I'm with gavagai here. I don't think any plane in the game ( besides bombers ) can take a concentrated pass of the P38s guns.  If he got a good burst on you, you were going down anyhow. But yes the Hellcats were tough... Not again 4x50 cals and a Hispano 20mm cannon with no convergence issues.

THAT CULD BE AS HE WAS FARL CLOSE. i just didn't think the hits sounded that hard. i think i had film running, so i'll go check it tonight. i've been heistatnt on running film sometimes, as my puter seems to freeze for about 3 seconds when i hit alt r for the first time after i logged in.

side note, i think i have mr non-ho'in king of happiness on film hoing....but then again, so did i.

[kotrenin]

Cap1, there also may be an issue with the sound after the new version of the F6f came out.  Maybe not all the hits are being associated with the appropriate sound bite.  Are you using the stock sounds or USRanger's or Mitsu's custom sound packs?  If you are using custom sounds maybe you need to reload the sound pack.

*edit*  USRanger mentioned in his sound pack sticky thread in the "custom sounds and skins board" on the 17th of this month that he needs time to update the sound pack for the new version.

[CAP1]

Cap1, there also may be an issue with the sound after the new version of the F6f came out.  Maybe not all the hits are being associated with the appropriate sound bite.  Are you using the stock sounds or USRanger's or Mitsu's custom sound packs?  If you are using custom sounds maybe you need to reload the sound pack.

i have all the stock sounds......i'm a lazy bastage....even too lazy to d/l the better soundpacks

[Fruda]

because this is a GAME you asssshole, not r/l

 

[Widewing]

F6F isn't broke, it's historically correct whiners. Couldn't say it any better than what Fruda said.

How do you know that it's historically correct? What's your source?

The fact is that you don't know. Neither does Fruda or MjTalon. However, that doesn't appear to prevent them from appointing themselves experts.

I have had the opportunity to sit in and ride the brakes on an F6F-5 we were towing and I could see to the rear much better than I can in this new graphic modeling. Head movement is far too restrictive in the new reworked model. There's only about 6" of lateral head movement to each side, about 1/2 that of the F4Us. You cannot get anywhere near the glass on either side, whereas you can with the F4U. Indeed, the rearward view from the F6F wasn't great, but it was "adequate" according to those who flew it in combat. In our case, rear vision is virtually nil, with about a 45 degree blind area, as opposed to the real Hellcat's actual 20 degree blind area (10 degrees to either side).

Rear vision suffers because you cannot lean far enough to the sides to see around the armor plate. This is a problem that needs to be fixed.

My regards,

Widewing

[A8TOOL]

Told ya.....Widewing is the expert, many hours of outside testing using actual fact from reliable sources you can trust. He's spot on and a without a doubt a true WWll war plane enthusiast.

Search out his testing posts ,..... they go way back.

My opinion remains:

The F6 is tolerable, from where it was enjoyable

[Widewing]

Stop whineing. You guys asked for the F6F to get fixed, now it is fixed historically even with the bad Six view now You're STILL complaining to turn it back into it's broken stage? Go fly some other plane if you can't handle the new view.

I don't recall anyone ever asking to fix anything about the F6F beyond its performance curve (speed over altitude). As far as that goes, it wasn't corrected in this update. We still have an F6F-5 that is slower than Navy test data shows for the F6F-3.

Let's stick to true facts instead of those you invent in your head.

Fact: The F6F modeling offers very limited head position adjustment, about 1/2 that of the F4U.
Fact: A real F6F had a 20 degree (inclusive) blind area behind. The current modeling is around 45 degrees (again, inclusive).
Fact: Real F6Fs had a mirror installed to eliminate the 20 degree blind area.
Fact: Mirrors are not modeled in Aces High.

Solution: Provide enough head movement range to get close enough to the canopy glass to see around the armor plate and pull back far enough to see all instruments (temp gauge).

Rear of cockpit on actual F6F-5:


Rear of cockpit, current F6F modeling:


My regards,

Widewing

[Shifty]

Fact: Mirrors are not modeled in Aces High.

I've heard that Hitec has mentioned mirrors are not modeled because of the effect it would have on frame rates. I'm wonering instead of actually putting mirrors in the cockpit, if making the six view a mirror view in aircraft that depended on mirrors to enhance the six view would work instead. If I remember right this feature was used in the Old Kesimai Air Warrior. Just an idea, not saying it's a good one.

[RATTFINK]

A8TOOL, I may be a CM but I am expressing my own opinion on the subject.  There may be CM's that don't agree.


=WW=, I agree that the F6F-5 is slower than the F6F-3.


I am loving the new F6F.  If you take the 6 view and bars around the cockpit out of the equation (which are historically accurate) the F6F is even better then it was.  It is smoother and maneuvers a lot better.

I will adapt to this new version.