I must think diferently than all of you

[Ghosth]

Put me in the same corner with Nash & Apache!

Well said on both posts Nash!

[Yeager]

I think its funny as hell zig.  I just hope you dont feel a need to act as nath and towds  replacement.  I have noticed your inclination to be a real dork at times.  Great *pilot* though...hehe

Saaaaaa-lute!

Y

PS great post nash.  Totally astute!


[This message has been edited by Yeager (edited 04-06-2001).]

[LePaul]

 

Originally posted by StSanta:
BD5Pilot:

From your post, I get the distinct feeling of schadefrau - being happy about the mishaps of others.

Whatever rocks your boat, I guess.

StSanta (and all)

You are welcome to think what you like about me, but you also do not *know* me.  So if you are going to judge me on one posting, you are not getting the entire picture.

I've been on both ends of the customer/software provider spectrum.  I've been a user, and I also work for a software firm and head up the tech support department.  I understand frustrated customers and I also understand that some customers will get way out of hand.  While the software we make isnt an on-line game (its navigational software for boats), we do our best to take care of our users and based on knowing how *I* like to be treated, that is how I treat my users.

With that said, if a customer is going to stand in the midst of 100 of my users and be nothing but a big mouthed menace, you have to do something.  You guys are so quick to defend Nath, its rather pathetic.  Yet in the same message board and threads earlier, you guys are complaining you are weary of the mouthing off going on in channel 1.

You can't have it both ways.

What Nath did is quite indefensible, and if you guys get your jollies flaming me, so be it.  Again, if you werent there to see it, you missed a lot.  Nath showed his true colors to me and everyone on, and you can only kick the dog so many times.



------------------
Paul J. Busiere

Aces High Arena handle:  BD5Pilot
 http://bd5.checksix.net
BD-5 "T" (TurboProp) 90% complete, first flight in 2001 (We hope!)

[ra]

Zig,

I agree it's sad to see good pilots go, NathBDP was one of the best and I enjoyed getting killed by him many times.  And these guys in a way earned the right to mouth off because they were good, while quite a lot of other people mouth off even though they suck.  But you are saying that because they are good pilots they shouldn't be banned?  What if we were talking about crappy pilots, would it be OK to ban them then?  If a lousy kill-stealing Niki-driving no-6-calling sub-1-K/D pilot was banned for abusing CH1, would that be OK?  Or what if a great pilot was constantly calling your mother every vile name in the book over CH1?   Should HT not ban him?  The fact is, CH1 can be abused, this is a commercial game and there is no unlimited right to say whatever you want.

My impression from hearing HT talk about this online is that he hates doing it, but the atmosphere on CH1 is getting out of control.  Many new people are joining the game and are under the impression that being obnoxious on CH1 is the way to go, so HTC wants to try to clean things up.  Squelching is really an afterthought, because a new player only knows who to squelch after he's been exposed to the CH1 dribble for quite a while, and the act of squelching because of the content of the text buffer is itself a sign that things are getting out of hand.  I am pretty thick skinned and I only squelch CH1 when there's too much talk and the text buffer is filling up, never because of what's being said.  That's the way it should be, IMHO, but it seems that more and more people are squelching because of what's being said.  HT as creator of this game has the unpleasant duty of deciding where to draw the line.

I too wish NathBDP and TOWD were still flying, but I understand that HTC has to do what it thinks it must to maintain a decent playing atmosphere for its customers.  You can disagree with HTC's reasoning, but the fact that the players in question were good is not relevant.

ra

[Revvin]

This is no roadkill ego trip by HT Paintmaw its HTC policing their service, their business. Its up to them to ensure that the MA is a place that players can play their sim without having to listen to other users tirades on the global channel, just the same as a guy in a pub being asked to leave if he stands on a chair in the middle of the bar and insults the landlord. If that guy then apologised to the landlord the next day then he would be allowed to frequent that bar again, I'm sure if Nath or Towd apologised then HTC would allow them back in.

[Toad]

Kieran, Funked, Nash, Ra  have pretty much covered the bases for me. I'll stand with them on this issue.

Community.

Not skill at manipulating pixels on a computer screen, not friendship, not six calls, not whether this or that feature of the game is as you prefer it.

The issue is "was the person detrimental to the community as a whole".

Westy, I also find this thread illuminating in much the same way. Self or community?

Both of these guys know how to get a new IP and new credit card and rejoin the community. The question is how will they act the second time around.

I'd also wager that THEY could work it out with HTC, if they really wanted to.

OUT.

[R4M]

 

Originally posted by Westy:
Now if Ram would just leave. And take Paintmaw with him.
 
  -Westy
 

I will bite my tongue on this one, westy. On this one. You are more damaging for this community that Paintmaw, me ,TOWD, or even Macboy. I dont know anyone who has left because attitudes like Naths' -tho I'm sure there have been examples- but I know POSITIVELY that there have been many guys who have left because attitudes like yours.

Now cut it and forget about me because I have already to name you in this or the other thread, and you alredy have done twice in the two threads when I had nothing to do with you.

(to all the rest, this is what I mean when I talk about the flame starter and the flamethrower "respected guy")

[Staga]

 

Originally posted by Westy:
This topic sure brought out into the light the some of warts and over all ugliness some folks have inside them.
  -Westy
 

Westy I really agree with you, strange isn't it  

In other topic you wrote:
 

You, Glunz, are also and bellybutton and idiot.
-Westy

[Animal]

 

Nash said:
And a new guy... totally green... Gets gunned down by Nath. "You squeak you were owned, you handsomehunk"

Welcome to Aces High.

OH MY GOD i almost shat my pants when I read that. That is SO nath I almost miss him when I read it  
Good one Nash, if i take that S and put a T..

[Westy]

 Fine with me. I'm beyond being tired with the crap posted by like of you Ram, Staga and the Hristo's.  It's not a language barrier or issue as I really think you folks believe the crap that you few write. I faile to see how any of you think your'e right.

 This ubb is becoming septic with 'poepl' such as yourselves. The pathetic whines about who's guns are better than anothers or how there is an Allied conspricy by HTC by thier neutering the LW aricraft FM's  are bad enough but then to listen to the support you jack-asses give to anarchy and social dysfunction is more than I want to deal with any more.

   I'm removing myself from these boards voluntarily to see if that will help but I already feel I know the answer. As long as the simple selfe ctnered and blind ignorant can trumble through here and post garbage such as Hristo, Ram or  several others are able to  then this place will continue to slide into the gutter.

  -Westy

  OUT!
 
 

[Badger]

Hello guys... <S>

For obvious reasons, I don't pass personal comment here anymore while being a guest in someone else's house, but on this issue I feel compelled to say that it is positive for the entire flight simulation community, to see the HTC crew taking an initiative to set common sense adult "community" standards as to appropriate on-line behavior.

As usual, lots of good people on here like Kieran, Funked, Nash, Apache, Lephturn, Ra, Toad etc, expressing what I'm sure most feel should be obvious to everyone.  For the most part, this is an excellent community with a terrific product, which should not be permitted to be diminished by the actions of the few.

We have three golden rules about customer interaction and managing a sense of community.  I think this issue is covered by number 3.

3. Treat everyone like adults and in-return, expect a mature and adult oriented approach to communicating with us ,as well as other members of this community. In fairness to the majority who wish to communicate in this kind of environment, we will remove any posts or anyone who wishes to compromise this civil and common sense approach to discussing the hobby we all love so much. Age is not a sign of maturity, public actions and community interaction are.

A salute to Dale and Doug for having the courage to draw a line in the sand.

Best Regards to all.....

Badger

[R4M]

Heh, Westy...you know I said I was going to bite my tongue only once...

You know what?. You are not worth a single second of my time. This time I dont bite my tongue this time I dont give a ratz bellybutton  

 So I'm glad you "self-remove" from the forums. Is the only more or less decent thing I've seen coming from you during some 15 months.

[J_A_B]

"i read AGW and WWIIOL boards and there seems to be a consensus that AH community is mean, hostile and rude in general. "

--fd ski


This is true.  I hope it changes.  

J_A_B

[Zigrat]

ra and fd-ski both have good points

my prompt for posting this thread was the other in which many people were overjoyed to see these two guys go.

i am not.

[Jigster]

 

Originally posted by LePaul:
StSanta (and all)

You are welcome to think what you like about me, but you also do not *know* me.  So if you are going to judge me on one posting, you are not getting the entire picture.

I've been on both ends of the customer/software provider spectrum.  I've been a user, and I also work for a software firm and head up the tech support department.  I understand frustrated customers and I also understand that some customers will get way out of hand.  While the software we make isnt an on-line game (its navigational software for boats), we do our best to take care of our users and based on knowing how *I* like to be treated, that is how I treat my users.

With that said, if a customer is going to stand in the midst of 100 of my users and be nothing but a big mouthed menace, you have to do something.  You guys are so quick to defend Nath, its rather pathetic.  Yet in the same message board and threads earlier, you guys are complaining you are weary of the mouthing off going on in channel 1.

You can't have it both ways.

What Nath did is quite indefensible, and if you guys get your jollies flaming me, so be it.  Again, if you werent there to see it, you missed a lot.  Nath showed his true colors to me and everyone on, and you can only kick the dog so many times.

LePaul, and I mean this entirely inoffensively, read the first paragraph of what you wrote very carefully. That is an amazingly concise point. Reread the rest of what's there keeping that phrase sharply in mind.

Substitute anyone's handle in place of "me".

It would do this community a world of good to take such words into consideration before they engage in any type of communication. Lately however, the trend has been stereotypical and prejudice to an extent.

I am not at all suprised at HiTech or Pyro's reactions as of late. I do not agree with it but I can understand the motivation. What I cannot understand is the reaction of the community. I have seen no one quick to defend Nath. I have seen the members of the community attack like buzzards on an issue that should of been dropped. Including people who were not subject to the event, or those who do not know Nath but still decide to pass judgement anyway instead of relying on HiTech's judgement on what is best for the community. I knew Nath outside of his act in the game. How many people that are beating that dead horse did? People are condemning him for his persona. I'm sure his squad mates would agree with me on that. His actions aren't excusable in their compilation, neither is the reaction of this community to his banning.

We say we want the community better, but such negative reactions only show we are digging the hole deeper.

There is an air of hipocrasy and it stinks.

I trust in HiTech's judgement in what is best for the community.