FPS

[titanic3]

Here's the thing, though.  The point he was making regardless of whatever else has been said, if vsync is on and your FR is not capped for your monitor (59-60), it means something in your PC is bottlenecking for whatever reason.  Your in game settings and/or hardware are not allowing it to reach maximum FR.

I'm used to adjusting my settings to keep reasonable eye candy while maintaining frame rate because my systems are rarely top shelf.  I've found that in this game, shadows at max setting have a huge impact on frame rate and shadows on buildings as well.  Dropping shadows one notch below max and turning off building shadows (maybe shadows on other vehicles too, been a long time since I checked) has let me keep everything else on in the game, running maxed FR.  This is on a mere 2500k, 4GB RAM, ATI5770.

I'd bet if you knocked your shadow size down a notch and/or shut off building shadows it would be instant 60FPS under most if not all circumstances, but I could be wrong.

Wiley.

I do do that. Shadows at 512, no self shadows, no shadows on others, no shadows on buildings. And I'll keep a steady 55-60FPS, even in massive furballs. Once I bring it up to 4096 and self shadows, my FPS drop to 40-50 but with only minor lag/stutter in *large* fights. The moment I bring shadows to 8192 and/or smooth shadows, my FPS turns into single digits.

if it was the game then i would have the same problem.  he's got a better computer than I have with a better graphic's card and yet I can play with no problems.  so it's either two things.  computer or connection not the game.  If it was the game it would affect all of us and it wouldnt make sense for ht to make the game so everybody can have problems.  I was able to play this game with everything on and shadows at 2048 with an e8400 using a single evga 465 oc video card.  and I would play aces high on one monitor while watching netflix on the other and never had a problem.


semp

You and tunnelrat keep thinking that it's not the game. Then explain how coombz and myself and others, can run games with graphics that are 10s of times better than Aces High, with no lag, no stutter, no nothing, yet we can't max out AH with its dated graphics? Explain that.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Then explain that. ^

[Wiley]

I do do that. Shadows at 512, no self shadows, no shadows on others, no shadows on buildings. And I'll keep a steady 55-60FPS, even in massive furballs. Once I bring it up to 4096 and self shadows, my FPS drop to 40-50 but with only minor lag/stutter in *large* fights. The moment I bring shadows to 8192 and/or smooth shadows, my FPS turns into single digits.

That's what makes these conversations really weird.  My shadows are second from the biggest (so... 4096?), no smoothing, no building shadows, self shadows on.  I think pretty much everything else on/maxed.  Resolution 1680x1050.  I don't notice FR drops unless I'm sitting on the runway in fso as 40+ planes roll at once.

I've really done nothing to optimize this system, no overclock...  It's odd when guys with way more system than I've got run into FR issues, unless they're running multiple monitors or somesuch.  If that's the case, I could see hitting the limit on performance and having to be careful with settings.

Maybe the video drivers I'm running just happened to sit well with this hardware and the newer cards/drivers are fighting with themselves more when it comes to AH.

I'm glad I don't have to support a game for a living.  Performance with 3D hardware really does seem to be a game of inches(microns).

Wiley.

[guncrasher]

I do do that. Shadows at 512, no self shadows, no shadows on others, no shadows on buildings. And I'll keep a steady 55-60FPS, even in massive furballs. Once I bring it up to 4096 and self shadows, my FPS drop to 40-50 but with only minor lag/stutter in *large* fights. The moment I bring shadows to 8192 and/or smooth shadows, my FPS turns into single digits.  dood I dont know of anybody that can play the game with shadows at 8192.  that takes so much resources that only a few computers with high end video cards can do it.

You and tunnelrat keep thinking that it's not the game. Then explain how coombz and myself and others, can run games with graphics that are 10s of times better than Aces High, with no lag, no stutter, no nothing, yet we can't max out AH with its dated graphics? Explain that.

Then explain that. ^

explain to me why the rest of us dont have a problem.  I dont know about you exactly but  if you are trying to play with 8192 shadows  makes me think you really need to read a bit about how everything works. I know coombz shouldnt have any problems at all playing with shadows at 4096.

semp

[MrRiplEy[H]]

If you have a high resolution and high shadow textures + only 1 - 1.5 gigs of videoram your card will run out of ram and go to single digit performance. Also if you run antialiasing high it will help with exhausting the resources.

I really have no clue why AH needs such massive amounts of memory to run decent shadows, maybe they have to use very primitive techniques to keep support for old hardware or something.

It's all about the gaming engine anyway. If anyone has tried F1 2002 on a modern computer, it will still not run very fast all graphics maxed out despite being totally dated graphics wise.

[gyrene81]

Taxing my components? I've seen my GPU's temp, I've seen my GPU/Case fan speed. Temp never went above 50C and fan never went past 50%. And this overclocked with the use of MSI Afterburner. Been this way for 2 years. I manually raised my fan speed to 100% to test it before, and I could hear through the case. I have never, ever, heard my fan while playing games, meaning it never got to a point where it was spinning like mad just to keep the GPU cool.

didn't realize coombz and titanic were programmers. so your temps are good, what about cpu, gpu and memory usage? from that screenshot you posted, 1600x900 with no anti-aliasing isn't quite "maxed out". the fact that you're only getting 30-40 fps should tell you something. the aero interface can and will interfere with video game graphics if the game does not disable desktop composition, some do, some don't. it can make a game "stutter" or "get choppy".

not that i don't think ah has some coding issues but, take a real close look at the how much data actually gets loaded on startup between wop and ah with all max graphics settings. if wop was actually massive multiplayer, you would not be able to run the settings you have now, especially online. if/when ah moves to directx 10 or 11, a lot of the graphics problems would go away because of the differences in how video memory is handled.

I do do that. Shadows at 512, no self shadows, no shadows on others, no shadows on buildings. And I'll keep a steady 55-60FPS, even in massive furballs. Once I bring it up to 4096 and self shadows, my FPS drop to 40-50 but with only minor lag/stutter in *large* fights. The moment I bring shadows to 8192 and/or smooth shadows, my FPS turns into single digits.

You and tunnelrat keep thinking that it's not the game. Then explain how coombz and myself and others, can run games with graphics that are 10s of times better than Aces High, with no lag, no stutter, no nothing, yet we can't max out AH with its dated graphics? Explain that.

Then explain that. ^

what makes you think ah has "dated graphics"? it uses the directx 9 api just like wop, big difference is massive multiplayer and what is getting loaded when the game starts. these forums are full of posts by skuzzy and hitech about what settings will affect your frame rates and how. just so you don't have to trouble yourself to do something besides "assume you know what you're talking about", some search results for you, key word shadows...

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,326802.0.html

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,50426.0.html

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,328079.msg4297028.html#msg4297028

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,330693.msg4342429.html#msg4342429

[titanic3]

If you have a high resolution and high shadow textures + only 1 - 1.5 gigs of videoram your card will run out of ram and go to single digit performance. Also if you run antialiasing high it will help with exhausting the resources.

I really have no clue why AH needs such massive amounts of memory to run decent shadows, maybe they have to use very primitive techniques to keep support for old hardware or something.

It's all about the gaming engine anyway. If anyone has tried F1 2002 on a modern computer, it will still not run very fast all graphics maxed out despite being totally dated graphics wise.

And that is the WHOLE POINT OF THIS THREAD, Aces High has out dated graphics AND a gaming engine. It takes too much resources to run even though the result is less than spectacular.

And semp, you continue to dodge the explanation that I have demanded when the answer is obvious, AH's game engine, is not optimized as well as it should be.

[titanic3]

I will never understand the idea here that no criticism is allowed . Some people around here jump to HTC defense like they simple minded children unable to defend their position on why things are the way they are . Now had your criticism been "AH2 sucks!" . I would understand . It wasn't . I don't .

didn't realize coombz and titanic were programmers. so your temps are good, what about cpu, gpu and memory usage? from that screenshot you posted, 1600x900 with no anti-aliasing isn't quite "maxed out". the fact that you're only getting 30-40 fps should tell you something. the aero interface can and will interfere with video game graphics if the game does not disable desktop composition, some do, some don't. it can make a game "stutter" or "get choppy".

not that i don't think ah has some coding issues but, take a real close look at the how much data actually gets loaded on startup between wop and ah with all max graphics settings. if wop was actually massive multiplayer, you would not be able to run the settings you have now, especially online. if/when ah moves to directx 10 or 11, a lot of the graphics problems would go away because of the differences in how video memory is handled.
what makes you think ah has "dated graphics"? it uses the directx 9 api just like wop, big difference is massive multiplayer and what is getting loaded when the game starts. these forums are full of posts by skuzzy and hitech about what settings will affect your frame rates and how. just so you don't have to trouble yourself to do something besides "assume you know what you're talking about", some search results for you, key word shadows...

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,326802.0.html

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,50426.0.html

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,328079.msg4297028.html#msg4297028

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,330693.msg4342429.html#msg4342429

Can't take criticism? If I didn't love this game I wouldn't be paying and playing it. I *want* Aces High to look like this

[tunnelrat]

Can't take criticism? If I didn't love this game I wouldn't be paying and playing it. I *want* Aces High to look like this
(Image removed from quote.)

Again, how many players does that game support in multiplay?  I keep asking you this for very, very important reasons.  Why do most beautiful multiplayer titles (not counting actionless-mmo's like WoW) cap out at 32 players, and often only play well with 24 or fewer?

Once you explain what "not optimized" means, I will be more than happy to spend some time explaining the myriad reasons that you aren't going to see DX10/DX11 effects in Aces High as soon as you'd like, as well as how one man's UBER MACHINE can slideshow a game that one with 1/4 of the resources of that machine runs smoothly.

[titanic3]

Again, how many players does that game support in multiplay?  I keep asking you this for very, very important reasons.  Why do most beautiful multiplayer titles (not counting actionless-mmo's like WoW) cap out at 32 players, and often only play well with 24 or fewer?
The same amount of planes and GVs you'll find in a busy tank town is the same amount of planes and GVs you'll find in a mission in Wings of Prey. Aces High might have 300+ players at the same time, but it would be impossible for anyone's PC to draw ALL 300 players at the same time. It only draws whatever is within your view, which is usually around 10, sometimes extending into 30 or 40 in a very populated area. The same amount of planes are in almost every mission in WoP. Here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7i75nsLlKY, one of the first missions involves a formations of He-111s, there's at least 30 planes in the area. I can play through that with no lag, yet in AH, in that same situation, if I even dare to turn on self shadows/shadows on others (4096), then it turns into a stutter fest.

Once you explain what "not optimized" means, I will be more than happy to spend some time explaining the myriad reasons that you aren't going to see DX10/DX11 effects in Aces High as soon as you'd like, as well as how one man's UBER MACHINE can slideshow a game that one with 1/4 of the resources of that machine runs smoothly.
Not optimize means use a crap ton of resources more than what is needed. Optimized means it looks good and runs great at the same time. Fallout, Mass Effect, Battlefield 3, Dirt 2 are all perfect examples. They all look great but don't require a monster machine to run them. Aces High is using the same engine from 2000, no way is it going to keep up with these newer technology.

[gyrene81]

Can't take criticism? If I didn't love this game I wouldn't be paying and playing it. I *want* Aces High to look like this
(Image removed from quote.)

doesn't matter to me one way or another, but if you're going to criticize or compare, do so knowing something of what you're talking about.  

And that is the WHOLE POINT OF THIS THREAD, Aces High has out dated graphics AND a gaming engine. It takes too much resources to run even though the result is less than spectacular.

And semp, you continue to dodge the explanation that I have demanded when the answer is obvious, AH's game engine, is not optimized as well as it should be.

again, the game you keep comparing to ah is also a directx 9 game...that would make both graphically "outdated". take a real close look at the shadows between the two...





not too shabby for "outdated graphics". on the other hand, the fact that your system can't run ah fully maxed out without problems and only gets 30-40 fps in the game you're trying to compare to it should tell you something about the capacity of your hardware.

[tunnelrat]

The same amount of planes and GVs you'll find in a busy tank town is the same amount of planes and GVs you'll find in a mission in Wings of Prey. Aces High might have 300+ players at the same time, but it would be impossible for anyone's PC to draw ALL 300 players at the same time. It only draws whatever is within your view, which is usually around 10, sometimes extending into 30 or 40 in a very populated area. The same amount of planes are in almost every mission in WoP. Here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7i75nsLlKY, one of the first missions involves a formations of He-111s, there's at least 30 planes in the area. I can play through that with no lag, yet in AH, in that same situation, if I even dare to turn on self shadows/shadows on others (4096), then it turns into a stutter fest.

Wait.  So, all of these planes and GVs in a mission in Wings of Prey are individual players?  Or are you still talking about AI?

Not optimize means use a crap ton of resources more than what is needed. Optimized means it looks good and runs great at the same time. Fallout, Mass Effect, Battlefield 3, Dirt 2 are all perfect examples. They all look great but don't require a monster machine to run them. Aces High is using the same engine from 2000, no way is it going to keep up with these newer technology.

So, you do in fact have no idea what you are talking about. Use a "crap ton" of "resources"... absolutely awesome.  This is all just because AH's code is "not optimized".  

We haven't even BEGUN to get into the economic tenability of moving beyond DirectX9 for AH.

And you, once again, list out a string of single-player or intensively small scale mulitplayer games as your examples.  Now, go and look at the MINIMUM requirements for Fallout, let alone BF3.

There is so staggering a difference between what you are comparing here that it's simply impossible for me to begin to address the many misconceptions you have.  Go find a game that allows, in a SEAMLESS arena, regardless of the average number of human players in close proximity, the numbers that AH does and we can start an apples to apples comparison there.  What you are throwing out there are absurdly invalid as competition for AH.

And stop attributing your blatant lack of comprehensive multiplayer game engineering knowledge on people being HTC fanboy simpletons, it's bush league.

[titanic3]

umadbro? 


You're getting all worked up over my opinion of the game. If Aces High one day, ever manage to look like Wings of Prey, Battlefield or Crysis, lemme know. 

[ACE]

I have solid frames all the time with my setup.

8Gb RAM
Nvidia Gts 450 1 Gb
1TB also at 32 GB SSD that i dont use?? Lol
Liquid cooled
Quad core Phenom 2.8 Ghz
22' LCD

[gyrene81]

Not optimize means use a crap ton of resources more than what is needed. Optimized means it looks good and runs great at the same time. Fallout, Mass Effect, Battlefield 3, Dirt 2 are all perfect examples. They all look great but don't require a monster machine to run them. Aces High is using the same engine from 2000, no way is it going to keep up with these newer technology.

really? look at the minimum hardware requirements and that will tell you what needs a "crap ton of resources"...

http://www.hitechcreations.com/Help-Section/Getting-Started/gameinfo-gamereq-art.html

http://www.mysystemrequirements.com/wings-of-prey-system-requirements/

http://www.shacknews.com/article/55221/fallout-3-pc-system-requirements

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/07/08/battlefield-3-system-requirements-revealed/

http://www.systemrequirements.in/system-requirements-for-pc-game-dirt-2.html

http://www.shacknews.com/article/52243/mass-effect-pc-system-requirements

[Shuffler]

Aces High is using the same engine from 2000, no way is it going to keep up with these newer technology.

Wrong