Best Heavy Fighter

[Brooke]

Brooke,
Those Droop Snoots didn't fly alone you know,
& those were mass-type medium bomber missions..

Tempests  never flew them..

It is irrelevant as to whether or not the P-38 or Tempest were good fighters.  They could have been used as target towers -- it doesn't matter at all to the discussion at hand.

[J.A.W.]

Ok, Brooke,

The Tempests,

- in the tactical role - were specifically tasked to shoot down German jets.

'Rat catching' it was called & they did it, successfully.

P-38 got zip, zero, nix, nada, nil... jets..

While the P-38 got the sorry medium bomber gig.

Guess that shows relative performance attributes huh..

[J.A.W.]

& '100 out of 10,000' ..

I don't think there were that many P-38s in the ETO.

But - did Droop Snoots operate anywhere else?

[Tank-Ace]

No, P-38s were superior to LW twin engine types in A2A combat,

109s & 190s, not so much..

As a 109 and 190 pilot in the game, I have to say you're an absolute moron to assert as much. The 190 had problems maneuvering at altitude, and both were slower untill the high altitude As verisons came out, and the 190D was introduced.

The P-38 can hold its own against the 109K at high altitude as well, and is superior to all other 109's.

At mid altitude, it is my opinion that the P-38J/L are the equal or better of all but the 109K. At medium altitude, the P-38 is obviously the equal or better of any 190, save the Ta-152, and possibly the 190D.

At low altitude, the P-38 J/L is inferior to the K4, equal to the G-14, and slighty superior to the G-2 and G-6. It is the equal of the 190A-5, superior to the A-8 and F-8, and is inferior to the Ta-152 and 190D.

[Brooke]

Ok, Brooke,

The Tempests,

JAW, I'm not arguing that the Tempest isn't great.  I *agree* with you on the Tempest being awesome and admirable.

I'm arguing that the P-38 was a decent fighter, a good long-range escort, and a great fighter bomber, not that it is better than a Tempest in all regimes (which isn't so).

By your own stats, it held its own against 109's and 190's (and so was at least as good as they were in fighting and thus a decent fighter), was one of the few aircraft that could do long-range escort (the Spit, Typhoon, Bf 109, and FW 190 couldn't do that, and the P-47 couldn't initially do that, so it was clearly good in that capacity compared to the other aircraft), and it was a sturdy plane that had a successful history of *a lot* of fighter bomber work in the ETO, MTO, North Africa, and PTO (so was a great fighter bomber).

[J.A.W.]

See Rule #4

[Brooke]

See Rule #4

[J.A.W.]

Brooke, those stats are - by USAAF standards - pretty shocking,
compare them to how well the P-38 did in the PTO..

& on a cost analysis alone, it shows a significant win for the LW..

They could not do that against the top fighters,
& [from memory] the Spit XIV was running 'bout 7-1 ahead..

[BaldEagl]

See Rule #4

[J.A.W.]

See Rule #4

[J.A.W.]

See Rules #2, #4

[Tank-Ace]

See Rule #4

[J.A.W.]

Pretentious,  - Moi?

L.O.L.....

[SirNuke]

See Rule #4

[save]

P38 was good in its role as an escort fighter in ETO , and as an attack plane.

190 and 109 pilots knew they could always dive away from the p38s when at disadvantage, escaping the p38 meant they could not attack the buffs, in return making the 38 successful as an escort fighter.

Germans always preferred to fight the P38 at low altitude from 1943 onwards compared to other allied fighters.
Source jg26 war diaries.

JAW, I'm not arguing that the Tempest isn't great.  I *agree* with you on the Tempest being awesome and admirable.

I'm arguing that the P-38 was a decent fighter, a good long-range escort, and a great fighter bomber, not that it is better than a Tempest in all regimes (which isn't so).

By your own stats, it held its own against 109's and 190's (and so was at least as good as they were in fighting and thus a decent fighter), was one of the few aircraft that could do long-range escort (the Spit, Typhoon, Bf 109, and FW 190 couldn't do that, and the P-47 couldn't initially do that, so it was clearly good in that capacity compared to the other aircraft), and it was a sturdy plane that had a successful history of *a lot* of fighter bomber work in the ETO, MTO, North Africa, and PTO (so was a great fighter bomber).