Author Topic: Your profession?  (Read 6555 times)

Offline Cthulhu

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #210 on: June 03, 2014, 04:09:28 PM »
Funny... My experience was that Grad school in Eng was hard and so was sophomore year, but, in the last two of undergrad, I had an eerie (it pissed off my study buddy no end) ability to perform so-so right up until the final. There, I'd rack something perfect or near-perfect.

Different strokes I guess. My roommate could solve any differential equation known to man, but he flunked freshman English FOUR times.  :lol  Most people complained about Economics being a pain, but I went to class TWICE and got an A. Go figure.
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Offline VuduVee

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #211 on: June 03, 2014, 06:56:22 PM »
Sure, you can study art history along with something useful.  Of course, someone who didn't spend a portion of their college time studying a hobby will have an advantage in knowledge.  But on it's own, what's the job market for an art-history major?
the idea that something is useless because its not as monetarily or materially productive as this or that career, is in my opinion only, based on ignorance. the produce/consume mentality, in time, will be shown as the bane of our existence. this world needs artists, art historians, museums and the like. there are many reasons, one is that sometimes we need someone from the outside looking in to show us what is right in front of us. i could go on and on.

Offline PJ_Godzilla

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #212 on: June 03, 2014, 08:57:15 PM »
the idea that something is useless because its not as monetarily or materially productive as this or that career, is in my opinion only, based on ignorance. the produce/consume mentality, in time, will be shown as the bane of our existence. this world needs artists, art historians, museums and the like. there are many reasons, one is that sometimes we need someone from the outside looking in to show us what is right in front of us. i could go on and on.

Agreed... And, actually, I suspect Brooke would probably agree as well. I think his only point is that, before you make that career choice, you need to understand the financial trade off you may be making. Otherwise, you're making an uninformed decision. It's kind of like the person who buys property near the airport, then spends the next several years complaining about the noise. Better to understand what you're doing...
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Offline Brooke

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #213 on: June 03, 2014, 10:36:10 PM »
the idea that something is useless because its not as monetarily or materially productive as this or that career, is in my opinion only, based on ignorance. the produce/consume mentality, in time, will be shown as the bane of our existence. this world needs artists, art historians, museums and the like. there are many reasons, one is that sometimes we need someone from the outside looking in to show us what is right in front of us. i could go on and on.

My opinion might be incorrect, but it isn't incorrect based on ignorance.  ;)

I do think that art, history, art history, artists, musicians, museums, etc. are vital.  There are two problems, though.  

First is that there are many more people who go into those fields than the world wants or needs, as evidenced by their salaries and how many of them never work in the field in which they trained; and a lot of people who go into those fields don't learn this easily researched situation until after they graduate.  This is unfortunate, as they end up being unhappy, disillusioned, and not well off financially, and that is no good for anyone.

Second is the idea that, since those things are so important, college students should spend a substantial portion of their time in those courses.  But are they more important than additional education in the field that will be your profession?  In most cases, no.  Also, are they more important than other things that are neglected?  For example, the information in Basic Economics, by Sowell (or Economics in One Lesson, by Hazlitt), With the Old Breed, by Sledge, basic finance, basic information on what a corporation is, the history of Rome, the information in How to Win Friends and Influence People, the information in You Can Negotiate Anything, and basic logic are unknown by the vast majority of college graduates.  Those items are of vastly more worth to the non-arts graduates and to the nation than having read The Iliad, the Sound and the Fury, the Great Gatsby, a music class, an art class, and a language class.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2014, 01:25:58 AM by Brooke »

Offline vorticon

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #214 on: June 04, 2014, 12:00:44 AM »
shit, i just put nails in wood.

i'd call myself a carpenter but i don't have that piece of paper that says i am...but i'm doing pretty good without it, and there's still a lot of upward movement available.

Offline JTs

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #215 on: June 04, 2014, 01:22:42 AM »
been otr driver since 02-1-1978. working for the same company for 35yrs. coming up on 4 million miles. its still fun if it ever becomes a job i'll park it.

Offline mbailey

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #216 on: June 04, 2014, 05:32:59 AM »
shit, i just put nails in wood.

i'd call myself a carpenter but i don't have that piece of paper that says i am...but i'm doing pretty good without it, and there's still a lot of upward movement available.

Its how i started out....and am thankful every day that i did it.   :aok

People working in the trades in my area are starting to dry up...If my son wanted to go into a trade, id absolutely encourage it....has anyone had to hire a carpenter, electrician or plumber lately?  Not cheap at all.....Heck a friend of mine that became an electrician is making well into the 6 figures, and a family member thats a plumber same story. Heck even me having started out in construction just hit that in the last couple of years working as a Property Insurance Adjuster.....It was my construction skills that opened that door.........Many many kids comming out of school are going right into college hoping to come out and make huge salaries...im not saying it doesnt happen, but not to the majority....The majority are comming out with huge debt, and making average money ( when they can find a job.)


« Last Edit: June 04, 2014, 05:57:01 AM by mbailey »
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Offline SIM

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #217 on: June 04, 2014, 06:39:19 AM »
Wow....just wow......

A topic about what profession people work hijacked by a conversation debating what degree program is more advantageous......

There's your higher education at work........enjoy your debt.

Offline PJ_Godzilla

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #218 on: June 04, 2014, 08:18:06 AM »
Wow....just wow......

A topic about what profession people work hijacked by a conversation debating what degree program is more advantageous......

There's your higher education at work........enjoy your debt.

Debt? Not me, man. The last grad degree program I did for which I actually had to put up any money (and it was only partial) was done in '87. My second grad degree was purely sponsored by my employer.

But you raise an entirely valid point, and it relates to what we were talking about: what good is a degree that doesn't pay for itself? The point raised by the Finnish gent is that there may be some non-monetary payoff in some of this stuff - he cited art history. My counterpoint: Yes, but its best to understand the financials so that you make the decision to forego the income in an informed way, as opposed to an ignorant one. You then appeared and actually reinforced the point, albeit by way of criticism of those who took the academic path.

Me, I've got nothing against the trades. One of my better buds is a guy we'll call Rick the Porsche Plumber ( he married well, too...). Does he report all his income? Probably not... but I don't ask. And that's one of the great things about the trades. Mind, I can do framing, electrical, drywall, and most plumbing (I shy away from black iron/gas lines) as well as many of those guys because I've got a more or less perpetual basement project going. The only thing that changes is the house in which I'm doing the basement. I "get" the trades. But it's more a hobby for me,. Not every engineer wants to get into putting hands to tools, even less a managementized engineer. However, it is still a good career path for guys who can handle actually having to deliver a result.
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Offline Changeup

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #219 on: June 04, 2014, 09:40:00 AM »
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Offline pembquist

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #220 on: June 04, 2014, 09:57:25 AM »
I always have a hard time answering when somebody asks what I do. Right now I'm trying not to lose money in the stock market. I always hesitated to call myself a carpenter as I only once worked for an incompetent contractor for a couple months and other than that have been a jack of all but since technically I can't legally do plumbing or electrical work I guess I'm an unprofessional something. The money I've made has been from moving into the kind of neighborhood where people would get shot from time to time, buying the wreckage of neglected houses, destroying my body renovating them and then having kind fortune smile upon me with the decidedly mixed blessing of gentrification. I am the worst landlord, in that you could probably walk all over me to a point and while I could have made a fortune during the stupid years I found the whole debt fueled house flipping phenomena repulsive and destructive so I pretty much sat out the housing bubble/crisis.

The tangent regarding education deserves it's own thread so I won't comment here except to say that I'm largely an autodidact who always had trouble with attending classes in college for reasons unrelated to intelligence. Fortunately for me that was in the days before the current absurd student loan situation so I was able to pay off my student debt quickly however without a degree.

Regarding the trades, there are tradesmen and then there are tradesmen. A lot of people think that they can do any trade (like me) but really, for instance, to be a decent carpenter takes five years of steady and varied work and a respect for the trade that is often lacking among the hirers and the hired.

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Offline PJ_Godzilla

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #221 on: June 04, 2014, 10:05:17 AM »
Yep. Pretty tightly reasoned by the observant one... A flipper, i'd call you. That's a big balls role.

As for your comment on the student loan situ: education is a bubble. Ask yourself: what constituency benefits from artificially distorted demand for higher education?

THen understand who the new helot class is... and all to fund a vocal minority that lives very firmly in a particular political pocket, about which I will say nothing more publicly.
Some say revenge is a dish best served cold. I say it's usually best served hot, chunky, and foaming. Eventually, you will all die in my vengeance vomit firestorm.

Offline Zerstorer

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #222 on: June 04, 2014, 10:09:23 AM »
10 years experience systems administrator / network engineer.
5 years experience as a information security / network security engineer and analyst.
Somehow transitioned to technology auditing over the past 10 years.
Now a bank technology examiner with one of the financial regulatory agencies.

It's been a bit of an odd career path...  :uhoh
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Offline Bizman

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #223 on: June 04, 2014, 01:22:27 PM »
My brother in law has a theory which I haven't yet been able to prove wrong: Economically it doesn't actually matter what your profession is as long as you're the best in it.
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Offline Changeup

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Re: Your profession?
« Reply #224 on: June 04, 2014, 01:45:58 PM »
My brother in law has a theory which I haven't yet been able to prove wrong: Economically it doesn't actually matter what your profession is as long as you're the best in it.

If you have a job you love, you'll never work a day in your life.

"Such is the nature of war.  By protecting others, you save yourself."

"Those who are skilled in combat do not become angered.  Those who are skilled at winning do not become afraid.  Thus, the wise win before the fight, while the ignorant fight to win." - Morihei Ueshiba