Knocking out HQ

[Lusche]

Actually I've seen it maybe seen it only eight times give or take a time or two since 2001. I can say the times I've seen it I thought it was gamey roadkill.

When I played for the first time in 3 weeks last Saturday, I saw a HQ going down 4 times - 3x Knight and 1x Rook. I was barely able to save our (Bish) HQ, because the ib Lancaster pilot did not go NOE and I was able to spot early. Still it was a close call, as the Komet field is located at quite some distance on that map. It would had been impossible to stop him in a conventional, non 100 point plane.

In this particular map situation, the only way for Knights (and later rooks as well) to effectively"defend the HQ" would be a constant high altitude cap over it.
Who's going to do that?

"Just fly a goon".

Ni's had at one point 165 minutes downtime. One goon takes away 4 minutes. No think about what will happen at low times when there are less than 30 people on your country at all. Compare that stuff to the effort it takes to kill the HQ...


Don't get me wrong - usually I'm one of the "If you want to keep it, defend it" faction. But as I pointed out earlier, the combination of low player numbers, HQ placement, City connection  and game impact vs effort necessary to kill HQ is very much out of balance at times.

[bustr]

12 years ago I thought your field dar circle showed everything inside of it unless that tower was killed. I thought the HQ dar filled in the spaces between the dar circles. Boy was I confused the first time the HQ went down and all dar was out.

This would be a bit much more realistic, and make getting the more important dar depending on the combat circumstance back up sooner.

[pembquist]

I am thinking that bombers go after hq because it has a nice payoff in terms of a feeling of accomplishment that does not attend hitting the other strats. It is a PITA for everyone else. I think a new reward that isn't such a PITA but still provides a singular reward or prize would be a nice revision to the game.

[guncrasher]

Have no problem with it or the effects of HQ going down. Honestly, how often does this happen? In my time of playing I've seen it happen 3 times to the side i was on. Resupply the HQ and/or start flying high cover for the HQ till dirt burglars push the other sides back or the map is won.

in some small maps hq is so close to the front lines that it stays down for hours.  I normally will not play in those maps.


semp

[Aspen]

I don't mind HQ getting hammered if resupping it is reasonable.  When down times are crazy and its a long flight to resup, its just sucks the fun out of playing.  I want to be shooting at stuff.  I'll take 2-3 loads to HQ when its down but thats it and obviously many players aren't interested in running any.  When its a long flight or taking a load has a tiny effect, even less people are interested.  I have a whole day of crappy stuff I have to do but I get paid to do it.  Paying to do unfun stuff at night is sorta silly. 

[save]

Resupply is only successful if bomber escorts don't drop low and kill incoming C47s,and m8 the easiest way in AH to land freebie kills in numbers ( specially on small maps).
This way attacker can ensure total blackout for longer time than many can endure ( I have already logged before it's up again).

In that sense its probably best strategy ever to win a map by reducing enemy on-line number, done by one set of NOE  Lanc's and 2-4 fast cannon Jabo coming in to clear out  re-supplier C47's and M8's.

The effort to defend against double-trouble is high, remember you don't see the enemy at all (and not your own planes).

You probably have to spawn fighters and on-top of that ,Wirbies to protect against a few marauding fighter-bombers  and one set of Lanc.

-------------------------
My recommendation is to see only friendly planes on radar  (IFF-only radar (much like a transponder)) and still be able to see full radar-bar if HQ is down, and no base-take possible until HQ is up to 50% again.

[mbailey]

I'm pretty sure you can dig up such a thing from different sides in the past. And for the record I, having commented in this thread, am a Bishop this tour

Which would explain why the HQ was down. Our secret weapon wasn't there defending it 

[Lusche]

Which would explain why the HQ was down. Our secret weapon wasn't there defending it 

If I had been knight, the HQ would still have been down. Airfield was just to far away to launch even a Me 163 in time against a NOE raider. You would have needed a constant 2 element cap to ensure defense.
It's also a very hairy to fly a Me 163 against NOE raiders there - you will end up with very little fuel on the deck and the next airfield is quite far away... I guess few players will try this a 2nd time

[caldera]

I am thinking that bombers go after hq because it has a nice payoff in terms of a feeling of accomplishment that does not attend hitting the other strats. It is a PITA for everyone else. I think a new reward that isn't such a PITA but still provides a singular reward or prize would be a nice revision to the game.

What he said.


 
My personal favorite options for an alternate result of a destroyed HQ:

1. Disable all AA.  This means fields, towns and even CV groups.  This would be a big incentive for the long and dangerous trip to the HQ and also much more incentive to defend it.  HQ battles would have a huge significance, as they should.

OR

2. Disable base capture.  Supplies would still work and troops could be deployed, but an arena setting would keep any bases from being taken.  Most people like to be on offense.  If their troops are going to be nullified, they will be more inclined to defend the HQ.  Big fights at the HQ would happen, especially when a map is almost won.


What he said, too. 

[whiteman]

Disable AA and capture, how does that correlate to the HQ? HQ down should disrupt the flow of information, not prevent guns from being fired and keeping a capture from happening.

[caldera]

Disable AA and capture, how does that correlate to the HQ? HQ down should disrupt the flow of information, not prevent guns from being fired and keeping a capture from happening.

If you want to use the "realism" angle: the HQ should have no effect on any darbar or dot dar at all; considering that information would be locally sourced from radar towers, ground spotters and radio/telephone communication.

Since Aces High is just a game, it would be nice to give attackers a worthwhile reward, other than pissing off 1/3 of the players.  Bombing the HQ is griefing, nothing more.

[JunkyII]

Disable AA and capture, how does that correlate to the HQ? HQ down should disrupt the flow of information, not prevent guns from being fired and keeping a capture from happening.

How about if HQ goes down that side gives up their armchair generals for a tour....if that were the case I would gladly keep the system the same. (A tour without LTown, Jayro, or Grill man barking orders at people.....would be so nice)

[waystin2]

How about if HQ goes down that side gives up their armchair generals for a tour....if that were the case I would gladly keep the system the same. (A tour without LTown, Jayro, or Grill man barking orders at people.....would be so nice)

I am so tired of you bossing me around Junky...

[whiteman]

I don't see it as griefing, it's just part of the game. This all sounds more like whining, but how about no info available on if hangers, troops, ord and fuel are up or down at any field, and no info on all Strat percentages?

How about if HQ goes down that side gives up their armchair generals for a tour....if that were the case I would gladly keep the system the same. (A tour without LTown, Jayro, or Grill man barking orders at people.....would be so nice)

no thanks!

[caldera]

I don't see it as griefing, it's just part of the game. This all sounds more like whining, but how about no info available on if hangers, troops, ord and fuel are up or down at any field, and no info on all Strat percentages?

no thanks!

It is part of the game but hardly a good part.  Making it more difficult to find combat action in a combat action game seems counter-intuitive.  It is whining.  Highly justified whining.

Info on enemy down times shouldn't be available at all.  The basic status of radar, ords, troops and hangars was quite sufficient.  Not sure how having up to the minute intel on every minutia of enemy property helps the game.