FOV view Default

[Randy1]

Short of Hitech giving us an invisible cockpit, can you describe with Hitech's current process, how he would solve the issue you are telling us is a problem?

I started this thread to post results of my testing of the beta default fov setting.  My point was the default fov, which a newbie was most likely use is a disadvantage since the SA is reduced due to view restrictions.  I have not asked for a new view system just questioning the current beta fov default.  Keeping players is paramount.  Making it harder on newbies will not help.

Chili hit the nail square on the head.

Bustr,
It is just simply going to be a point of discussion that will not go away.  85-90 does not include enough peripheral view to adequately track in combat without TrackIR or VR movement of some type.  . . .  The best possible solution for a new player's convenience would be a default FOV much wider (non VR headset users), and a default zoom back to 80.

Edit:  Note, making the 1:1 zoom a default setting, will in effect, make the statement this is what size your target SHOULD be (at a button press).

[FLS]

Why would a new player know to zoom in but not know they could change FOV to their preference?

[Lazerr]

Why would a new player know to zoom in but not know they could change FOV to their preference?

I used the zoom feature in this game for years.

I probably didnt figure out what field of view was until 2010.

The point is,  the game is difficult to learn that way it is,  not everything needs to be difficult.  Remember the upcoming generations also,  you want things to look good and function well right off the bat, otherwise ADD kicks in and they are down the road

[FLS]

...  you want things to look good and function well right off the bat, otherwise ADD kicks in and they are down the road

That's why the default FOV is 80 now. New players complained the aircraft were too small at 106.

[ImADot]

That's why the default FOV is 80 now. New players complained the aircraft were too small at 106.

Plus, isn't it pretty much the same FOV used in other flying games that new players seem to have no trouble with (or complain about)?

I think some players here have gotten used to their unrealistically wide FOV settings that lets them see both their wingtips.

[bustr]

I used the zoom feature in this game for years.

I probably didnt figure out what field of view was until 2010.

The point is,  the game is difficult to learn that way it is,  not everything needs to be difficult.  Remember the upcoming generations also,  you want things to look good and function well right off the bat, otherwise ADD kicks in and they are down the road

In this case if they really are self inflicted attention span gnats, the menu presentations on the clipboard from the opening splash screen into the full game need to be dumbed down. Currently the presentation is for people who read versus twitch. On the main screen "Video Settings" has to be changed to: !CHANGE YOUR SCREEN SIZE HERE!

Then other parts of the clip board menu system needs to follow suit to take them by the hand and get them past that awful reading requirement that gets in the way of fun. It has been obvious over the past 15 years that many players don't read the well thought out menus and web help HTC provides for players to self help by "reading". Our game, even as a kiddy game, is a bit slanted towards adults who read. That simply reflects the background of the creator and how he views menu creation along with the look he wants communicating "this is my dream".

Still making the menu any easier to devolve with the self inflicted attention span deficit generation would back fire by making the game look purpose designed for xbox kiddies and not very appealing to adults. Even in the face of the past 15 years, I've been constantly amazed how many adults don't want to read menus or the web help.

It is a subtle perceptual presentation thing about the feel of what you see. We could end up chasing the WT look for the kiddies with attention spans of gnats, and loose the overall, what makes us different and unique form WT. At that point the adults will ask them selves, why pay $14.95 for AH chasing WT when WT is free. 

 

[Wiley]

In this case if they really are self inflicted attention span gnats, the menu presentations on the clipboard from the opening splash screen into the full game need to be dumbed down. Currently the presentation is for people who read versus twitch. On the main screen "Video Settings" has to be changed to: !CHANGE YOUR SCREEN SIZE HERE!

Then other parts of the clip board menu system needs to follow suit to take them by the hand and get them past that awful reading requirement that gets in the way of fun. It has been obvious over the past 15 years that many players don't read the well thought out menus and web help HTC provides for players to self help by "reading". Our game, even as a kiddy game, is a bit slanted towards adults who read. That simply reflects the background of the creator and how he views menu creation along with the look he wants communicating "this is my dream".

Still making the menu any easier to devolve with the self inflicted attention span deficit generation would back fire by making the game look purpose designed for xbox kiddies and not very appealing to adults. Even in the face of the past 15 years, I've been constantly amazed how many adults don't want to read menus or the web help.

It is a subtle perceptual presentation thing about the feel of what you see. We could end up chasing the WT look for the kiddies with attention spans of gnats, and loose the overall, what makes us different and unique form WT. At that point the adults will ask them selves, why pay $14.95 for AH chasing WT when WT is free.

Respectfully, what people expect from a UI has changed drastically over even the last 3-5 years, never mind since the UI for AH was designed.

It's not about "chasing WT" nearly as much as it is about modernizing the interface to make it more inline with what some people apparently expect.



Yes, they're simpletons, but they might become paying simpletons if things are presented in a way they can understand.

Personally I think the FOV thing is a mountain out of a molehill.  106 is what Randy learned, so it's what he thinks is "normal".  So did I.  I also think there's something to the fact that HTC looked at the FOV of the other games and what people are useful, and chose to start them off with that.  The canopy bars appearing to cover 4% more relative screen real estate at default is not going to be the reason newbs die.

Wiley.

[bustr]

Hitech did respond back in the alpha that he chose 80 because of other games. So he is looking at the industry for such things to help AH3 and a newer generation feel comfortable. The UI appears to be an icon of the AH look and not chasing the look of the new generation.

Having worked at an airfield and grown up in the civil aviation world. AH looks like the high end exotic where millionaires park warbirds on the field like other feilds are crammed full of old Cessna's and Pipers with a few antiques in hangers. Always felt like were flying around Texas during the summer the last 14 years. My father was stationed at Kelley and belonged to the Ft. Sam Houston flying club. I saw a lot of Texas from the air.

[Bizman]

---I think some players here have gotten used to their unrealistically wide FOV settings that lets them see both their wingtips.

Somehow that made me think of Marty Feldman

[Randy1]

. . . Personally I think the FOV thing is a mountain out of a molehill.  106 is what Randy learned, so it's what he thinks is "normal". . . .

Wiley.

I spent the last year fiddling with my FOV setting.  I have not used 106 in a long time.  In all my experiments, the simple truth is higher FOV improves SA and tracking, lower FOV improves aiming when the red is insight and has a better immersion.  An FOV setting of 90-93 seems to be the sweet spot for me but there have been times I wished i could push a button in flight to pop back to 106 when I could not find the red chewing on me.

Now what ever HTC wants to set the default fov to is fine with me.  The point of the thread was beta feedback and nothing more than that.

[Chilli]

Plus, isn't it pretty much the same FOV used in other flying games that new players seem to have no trouble with (or complain about)?

I think some players here have gotten used to their unrealistically wide FOV settings that lets them see both their wingtips.

Do other games allow players to increase their FOV?  Serious question, because I wouldn't know.... guess I am all in with Aces High.  The bigger question arises, will a new player be more disadvantaged (defenseless) at default FOV and no VR tracking movement against those with tweaked views?  (LOL Marty Feldmans of the air - Thank you Bizman).

Respectfully, what people expect from a UI has changed drastically over even the last 3-5 years, never mind since the UI for AH was designed.

It's not about "chasing WT" nearly as much as it is about modernizing the interface to make it more inline with what some people apparently expect.

Yes, they're simpletons, but they might become paying simpletons if things are presented in a way they can understand.

Personally I think the FOV thing is a mountain out of a molehill.  106 is what Randy learned, so it's what he thinks is "normal".  So did I.  I also think there's something to the fact that HTC looked at the FOV of the other games and what people are useful, and chose to start them off with that.  The canopy bars appearing to cover 4% more relative screen real estate at default is not going to be the reason newbs die.

Wiley.

I really applaud HiTech for making the statement that FOV 80 is definitive 1:1  actual scale for views (and answers a lot of long standing questions for me, having been a player since 2001 or earlier).  I am just of the opinion, why would an inexperienced player give up situation awareness of where the enemy contact is, in order to have a larger target to shoot at if they could get guns on him?

Practically everyone that is not using VR tracking of some type, admits they ditch the default FOV.  That includes me, BUT.... I wish for a "snap view" one click button that will give me the 1:1 default view when target is available to focus on.  This is separate from zoom, which I consider to be a pair of binoculars searching the terrain for targets.

[hitech]

Chilli, there is no such thing as a simple 1:1 setting when looking at a monitor, the 1:1 changes with your distance from the monitor and the monitor size.

With VR head sets the size and distance are fixed.

HiTech

[bustr]

Randy what it sounds like you should have asked for is this:

The ability to set your zoom toggle for a first time toggle with the same settings of 45-152 from the front page custom FoV input. So you can set your custom FoV to 90-93 and then set your first time zoom toggle FoV to 106.

That might get even more confusing for the newbie versus knowing the default FoV is 80, and the first time zoom toggle is some percentage less of that. Then as they know to look for it or, told how to adjust FoV larger, the zoom toggle percentage scales with their custom FoV. That has been pretty standard in games since I can remember.

So why not set your FoV to 106, then toggle zoom in the cockpit to 90-93 and leave it toggled for your mission? Hitech could even add a FoV line to the alt\speed HUD for FoV. Then you could always return zoom to 90-93 while saving 106 for those special moments.

[Chilli]

Chilli, there is no such thing as a simple 1:1 setting when looking at a monitor, the 1:1 changes with your distance from the monitor and the monitor size.

With VR head sets the size and distance are fixed.

HiTech

Thank you.  I am still learning.  Now that you explain it, makes it entirely clear that I meant to refer to the 80 FOV.  Even then it is clear that not for all monitors and seating distances would this be equal.

What I have taken away from all of these many discussions, is there are hard technical facts that support the FOV decision.  Any FOV beyond the 1:1 calculated settings seem to be a matter of preference and without statistical and neurological study of peripheral vision representation on a monitor (with size and seating distances included), it is unclear as to what such a default peripheral vision representation would be.

[Randy1]

Randy what it sounds like you should have asked for is this:

The ability to set your zoom toggle for a first time toggle with the same settings of 45-152 from the front page custom FoV input. So you can set your custom FoV to 90-93 and then set your first time zoom toggle FoV to 106.

I do remember a wish asking for a saved default zoom much like saving head position maybe a year or so ago.  Maybe two.