No icons for AH3

[Wiley]

All you're effectively saying when you say "I want no icons" is, "I want to be invisible to a segment of the population in the arena."

They're an equalizer.  They make it so configuring your hardware is not the single most important aspect of playing the game.  I would consider that a good thing.

Wiley.

[guncrasher]

I have a 27in monitor 1440.  a computer that is better than the average ah player.  and I still cant see the planes without icons.

when I go target shooting with my handgun, I cant see the gun sights.  I have a choice between seeing the sights or seeing the target.  I have 20/20 vision on long distance but anything within 3 feet of me I need glasses.  and even then playing ah is hard.


semp

[Volron]

Hey AvA guys, think you can set up the AvA to be the same as the MA, only with no icons (and no perk rides for obvious reasons unless you can somehow restrict them like the MA), and run that for a week?  I know it will be a pain, but it should give folks that want no-icon a solid idea of how it would really end up working.  Just a thought.   Oh, and of course make sure kill shooter is on.

[LCADolby]

(Image removed from quote.)

You're wasting your time replying to semp.. Regardless of the subject matter. As long as AcesHigh stays stuck in 2004 he is happy.

[JunkyII]

People need to start understanding that a wish for AH2 gameplay is the same as a wish for AH3....as of now gameplay seems very similar in Beta and a lot of problems from 2 will carry over to 3...I feel like this is should be a known fact....and yes it will have more.(bet the first day playing 3 I'll see an M3 up before anything else to "defend" a field)

I agree with getting rid of the +- indicators....don't see how they would effect the visually impaired because the only time they really help, the plane is as large as the icon itself. If your looking at an icon when a plane is less than 2K away (about the time the plane is pretty large on the screen) than that is probably why you are having problems progressing in Aces High.

[bustr]

Unless semp has a macular degeneration problem, prescription glasses will make it possible to see the monitor 16-62 inches from his face. As you get into your 40's though, all of the physical functions of your eyeball begin to slow down while the lens becomes less pliable along with loosing clarity. When you get an eye checkup they do a test for cataract which is a determination of how your lens clarity has deteriorated with time. All of this is why some people starting in their late 30's and early 40's with 20\20 start using readers. Glasses or not, this effects your ability to play video games to varying degrees as you age. Also, at any age, spending long hours staring at a fixed focal distance ages your eyes faster while effecting over time your ability to rapidly change focus.

So ask yourself, is this hostility to icons in the MA or, to the MA being full of 40-70 year olds? 

[Lusche]

Wasn't there a Cohen movie about this stuff?

[bustr]

Lusche,

A 15in monitor at 36 inches.........  Is it monochrome to......

[Plawranc]

-1

But

+1 for shortening Icon Range.

Icons at 3k would be a good thing I think. Would also make radar more valuable for guided intercepts.

[MK-84]

The "no icons" falsehood was propogated by an elitist faction of IL2 that proclaimed that anybody flying with icons is cheating, a lesser pilot, holds their manhood cheap compared to those that use "no icons" and so forth.

It's a blatant lie and basically just ego-stroking.

We have had discussions on these very forums before detailing the science of optics, distances and details visible at those distances. We have referenced real life air traffic personnel at airports, commercial, private, and military pilots, we have referenced anecdotal WW2 reports of being able to ID planes at distances using the fuselage codes and all of these details.

What we can see in-game is a joke compared to reality. It's nice, but it's not REALISTIC. The icons make up for a massive loss of detail that would equate to all players in this game playing like legally BLIND pilots in real life. They never would have been able to get pilots licenses at any point with eyesight like this game portrays. There are many reasons for that: including pixel dots, sizes, the need to have a wider FOV for rendering screens and depictions. The icons make up for that.

Removing the icons doesn't help gameplay at all, despite what the AvA crowd tried to push for so long. It hurts gameplay. In every respect from WW1 onwards, BFM have been a part of dogfighting. Before-Fight-Maneuvers. The posturing and positioning you undertake to get an advantage on your opponent BEFORE you're in lethal kill range. It's a massive part of air combat, and with no icons you literally cannot even determine a very rudimentary shape, range, or even orientation and angle of an enemy plane until it's already inside kill range.

No icons leads to unaware picks, simulating legally blind pilots and/or the baby seal clubbing effect. That's the only true reason to ever demand/request it be forced on everyone. The demander/requester wants easier kills for their own benefit.

I think this perfectly explains it.

Edit:  I would like them to disappear when an airplane flies through a cloud.

[BowHTR]

I think this perfectly explains it.

Edit:  I would like them to disappear when an airplane flies through a cloud.

they do if the cloud is thick enough

[jimson]

It certainly doesn't belong in the "all planes from all countries all the time" arena.
but...

No icons leads to unaware picks, simulating legally blind pilots and/or the baby seal clubbing effect. That's the only true reason to ever demand/request it be forced on everyone. The demander/requester wants easier kills for their own benefit.

This is just BS!!
Some people just like not seeing glowing red icons.  They think it's an immersion killer and without them, find it easier to slip into their WW2 fantasy.
You just can't seem to accept that some people just prefer it without ascribing bad motives to them.

AvA used to be 3k and none, I think they are back to 3k and 3k to get people to play in there. That voting with their feet thing customers do when they don't like something.

Not really
There have been times where groups have come in and wanted a specific setting and other times when certain staffers turned them on for their set up. Also one time an update made it impossible to turn icons off.
 

That was the problem in the AH2 AvA that made players vote with their feet.

No it wasn't. There is no icon setting that ever made any sustained difference in consistant AvA attendance.
There's just not enough players to constantly populate 24/7 arenas other than the main one.

All combinations have been tried numerous times.

[Wiley]

This is just BS!!
Some people just like not seeing glowing red icons.  They think it's an immersion killer and without them, find it easier to slip into their WW2 fantasy.
You just can't seem to accept that some people just prefer it without ascribing bad motives to them.

If that were the case, you can do that right now today. The fact is people want other people to not be able to see them coming.

Wiley.

[Oldman731]

If that were the case, you can do that right now today. The fact is people want other people to not be able to see them coming.

Which is far more realistic than the neon sign icon.  And it leads to more realistic tactics as well.

No icons isn't for everyone, or even for most people, I think everyone agrees on that, but ascribing bad motives to no-icon proponents is low.

- oldman

[BowHTR]

Which is far more realistic than the neon sign icon.  And it leads to more realistic tactics as well.

No icons isn't for everyone, or even for most people, I think everyone agrees on that, but ascribing bad motives to no-icon proponents is low.

- oldman

We have to have some type of icon in the MA. You cant get rid of them without causing problems.