If you consider yourself a Top Stick in the game...

[Bruv119]

I whined about a HO shot today from a Spit16.   

Whilst I know better sometimes it gets tiresome when your fighting 2, 3 , 4 guys at once and that is the first option people take instead of doing the next step up of extending until their buddy saddles up and then turning around when you break.   Of course they are all valid tactics but one must attempt to see the light and try and master more advanced ACM to become a better pilot. 

Otherwise your KPH and awesomeness will suffer greatly by seeking the easy way out of the fight.   

[The Fugitive]

Yak 9T:
 - small airframe hard to hit. Quite a tough we bird too.
 - 37mm centerline nose cannon can lob holy hand grenades a couple of K's out
 - relatively underpowered and nose heavy compared to contemporary airframes
 - Not the best turner either
 - Bleeds E like a small boat dropping a big anchor

Now you said: "Any competent fighter pilot would maneuver for a shot that would give himself the highest rate of success with the lowest possibility of taking any damage."

Think about it.

The quoted line was in reference to real pilots, not us who play a game.

In a game where the idea is compete in an air combat situation why wouldn't you try to "fight"...... think about it.

[Vulcan]

The quoted line was in reference to real pilots, not us who play a game.

In a game where the idea is compete in an air combat situation why wouldn't you try to "fight"...... think about it.

Do you not get how much pleasure/entertainment I derive from you everytime you cry from a HO?

[The Fugitive]

Do you not get how much pleasure/entertainment I derive from you everytime you cry from a HO?

Do you understand how much like a little girl you sound when ever you open your mouth? 

[Toad]

Second, "if" they went for the HO I'm sure it was a "do or die" situation and had no other choice. Any competent fighter pilot would maneuver for a shot that would give himself the highest rate of success with the lowest possibility of taking any damage.

I can't remember if there has ever been a discussion on the validity of the HO as a real life tactic on this board before.

Oh...wait...yes I can....we have had such discussions.

Why, way back on May 24, 2007, 10:43:54 AM there was this:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,206283.msg2442377.html#msg2442377

I met this gentleman at his Flight School Class's (43-C) reunion, held at our CAF hangar. These guys all started in PT-19's and we got 3 -19's together to give them all rides.

Dick Hewitt engaged two FW-190's (on separate missons) with true HO tactics. His comment to me was "we couldn't let them get to the bombers".

Read his book: " Target of Opportunity - Tales and Contrails of the Second World War"


Richard A. Hewitt, a second year college engineering student in New York State, like so many Americans after the December 7, 1941 Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, chose to volunteer for service to his country. He joined the Army Air Corps in February, 1942. As a member of the Army Aviation Cadet Class, 43-C, Dick was commissioned as a second Lieutenant and received his wings on March 23, 1943.

After further training, he was assigned in the ETO to the 78th Fighter Group, 82nd Fighter Squadron, stationed at Duxford, Cambridgeshire, England, in September, 1943. Dick flew a total of 144 combat missions, combining a total of 400 hours of combat in the P-47 Thunderbolt and P-51 Mustang fighter aircraft.

During his combat tours with the 82nd, spanning over two years, he was credited with 8.3 victories, including 4 in the air; promoted to the rank of Major; awarded the Air Medal with 17 oak leaf clusters, awarded the Distinguished Flying Cross with 4 oak leaf clusters, and the Silver Star. He commanded the 82nd Fighter Squadron from March, 1945 through June, 1945.

So was the HO a valid tactic used in WW2? YEP.  There's statements that 16 of Dick Bong's victories were from HO attacks. Anybody think Bong was a "competent fighter pilot?

Now, is this Real Life? Do we have to protect the bombers at all costs? Nope. It's a game.

Probably pointless to compare RL to an online game. If something is in the game, people will do it/ use it.

As for the endless HO discussions: plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

[caldera]

After many years of avoiding HO shots, I have joined the club.  Certain times, like when you aren't fast and end up FQ to FQ, you can either dodge and get drilled or take the shot.  I always used to die in this scenario by being "honorable" and not HOing.  Other times like being outnumbered, or faced with a plane that is better in every way than yours and he wants to BnZ/E fight you.  Those are legit IMO.

Also a certain F4U pilot who doesn't use tracers blazes away on FQ shots from 600+ out, even while holding all the advantages.  Because of this. I reserve the right to HO any F4U at any time.

No need for concern though, my HO-Fu is terrible.  Lost a HO to a Ki-84 the other night.  While flying a 410. 

[JunkyII]

So... you're complaining because a guy that was ganging you gave you the opportunity for a shot?  You anti-HO guys are incredibly weird.  The problem is not the HO at that point, it is the gang.

Yes because browbeating a guy about his tactics right after you've killed him is exactly the way to get him to see the error of his ways.

It is worthless.  It is also the way about 75% of the people I see on a daily basis merge.  The problem I see is people see people complaining about the HO, so they think it has power.  They think it works.  If more people would work out how to avoid the HO and kill the guy doing it, maybe it would be used less often because unless your gunnery is stellar, it's really not a good strategy.

Wiley.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think me doing that is working on the majority out there, like you said some probably see it as it has some credibility....which is why I want to make a video on HOs.


As far as it takes 2 to HO....HO is a Head on pass....where does it say it has to be nose to nose guns blazing???

[whiteman]

HO complainers aren't trying to avoid the HO but they expect the enemy to avoid the HO.

That's the feeling I get. I'll go ahead and send a few rounds out early when I see someone is coming in for it, if they stay on path I'll take the shot.

[JunkyII]

F4Us...minus the 1D have higher K/Ds then most of the planeset...throwing that out there 

Easy Mode confirmed.

[Bong40]

I love turning a low fuel D11 around on the deck.... But the pickers never fail to fly through and take potshots at the fat low Jug. So it's just not worth the time to fly into a low fight. starting high and fighting to the deck is the way I prefer to fight then if I can scoot out after with all my parts.. It's a plus.

[MickDono]

I disagree...

 

[Wiley]

I love turning a low fuel D11 around on the deck.... But the pickers never fail to fly through and take potshots at the fat low Jug. So it's just not worth the time to fly into a low fight. starting high and fighting to the deck is the way I prefer to fight then if I can scoot out after with all my parts.. It's a plus.

Some of the best fun in the game.  For added challenge, try the same trick in a 190A8.

For real picker drawing power, fly a 110 or a 38 though.  They'll run past a money printing machine, an all you can eat pie smorgasbord, and a brothel to shoot at a low slow 110.

Wiley.

[Mister Fork]

Junky - sometimes I HO just to get the other pilot into a disadvantage merge position.  I know I have a zero chance in hell of hitting them - but they don't know that and then position themselves out of the path of my fire stream. Other times it's again about positioning advantage - I'll try off-centre shots to get the other pilot to react (or over-react) - again, positioning. 

I never enter a merge to HO kill - unless I'm in a Bf-110G2, Fw-190A8, Tiffy, or Hurri-IIC/D.  Then if you wanna HO, you're an igiot. Though I did run into a situation years ago where I was in a 110, and so was the opposing player. We both went poof.

[pipz]

Gentlemen. It appears I have made two conclusions based on the information provided in this thread.

1. When Junky is liquored up don't give him access to the forums. 

2. Corsair pilotz will never admit that their ride leans towards the EZ mode side of the meter. 

Thank you all for participating! Canada signing out.

 

[Wiley]

Corsair has the most versatile flight envelope in the game.  Everywhere from high speed BnZ to stallfighting.  Wonderful plane.

Fork-  I have to admit one of my happiest memories in this game was watching a 110G come at me from 6k out looking for the HO, and HOing him down in my Zeke without taking a ping.  You've gotta hit em to hurt em.

Wiley.