Climate change

[Arlo]

[TequilaChaser]

TC you are both right and wrong.

Yes, the Earth has a natural cycle and warming / cooling is a part of that.  However, to ignore the part that us Humans influence the climate is folly.  We are an unstoppable, destructive force and yes, we do influence the climate.  To do nothing is to condemn the Earth to death.  To adopt more natural practices is much more sustainable.

Respectfully.

I can accept that, FESS...

Yes man / humans are a destructive force

But there will always be a Spring, Summer, Autumn/Fall and Winter seasons as is written and the earth will be rejuvenated back to the way it began

and there are all kinds of cycles (read as history repeating) like 10 year, 20 year, 30 year, --- - - 100 year, 1,000 year weather cycles

I don't know it all, I learn something new everyday and science (all categories) as well as history intrigues me

Respectfully,

TC

[Mister Fork]

I think ya'll are missing a big point here.  Isn't climate change a symptom of a larger problem?

7 billion living on a planet meant for 200M - 1 Billion.

What could go wrong?

Consumption of all the world's natural resources? Destruction of our fragile environmental ecosystem? A lifestyle based on consumption of these resources that destroy said environmental ecosystem?

For example, if the Amazon forests are cut/burnt down, the planet loses 6% of its oxygen-producing capabilities. The Amazon forest helps regulate the weather - keeps temperatures cooler, oceans cooler, lands moist, produces rain, drives the gulf stream, and a lot of unrefutable scientific facts on how it influences weather in the America's. That's just science. Kinda cool. Very boring.

If our oceans get too warm, the phytoplankton that produces 50% of the world's oxygen will die. At 15% of oxygen in the air (20.1% is normal), people start to suffer from hypoxia. 

At 10% oxygen, mass extinction. If you can't breathe, you die right?

To complicate the oxygen issue, we have these outliers of sensitive ecosystems...

If the trees die, the planet dies.

If the bees die, the planet dies.

If the birds die, the planet dies.

If the phytoplankton dies, the planet dies.

If we pollute the ocean and environment too much, and one of those occur, the planet dies.

And if the planet dies, we die. And you can't wrap yourself in money to help breathe if the planet cannot produce oxygen.

[SysError]

Changed house heating and warm water from oil to geothermal heating ( before 3.5 cubic meter oil /year)
Changed to car that use Ethanol (E85) instead of gasoline
Work from home all days in the week.
Changed most of my customer meetings to Skype meetings.
Changed 90% of lights in house to LED.


Still fly sometimes but my fossil footprint is quite less, since 95% of all electricity in Sweden is either hydro- or nuclear powered.

Done some of the same, but decide to not replace 20 yr old van (w/300k).

I haven't done more kids than they have parents. They don't seem to want to make me a granddad. There's too many of us already.

I also don't push hot air outside my house. When it's hot, it's hot.

 



Also joined our local CSA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community-supported_agriculture


I don't know what they are called in other parts of the word.



Almost forgot, also cut out a LOT of plastic use.

[Shuffler]

The people who blindly say that it's nothing, or that this is just a "cycle" selectively ignore certain facts. This has happened in a 100 year or less period, which is NO CYCLE. It's a result of artificial(abnormal) influence put on it by humanity. Cycles happen over thousands of years, and there has been no asteroid strike or supervolcanic eruption. You can continue to delude yourselves, but I have no doubt that God will deal with those who ignored and continued to destroy His earth. The rest should think about what they are leaving their posterity....Eden or Hell.......

 In the 70s everyone was talking about the cooling.

[Chris79]

The perfidious Anglo sure kicked over the wasps nest on this one.

[puller]

The trees and plants on earth are going to thrive with warmer weather and higher CO2 in the atmosphere... Chew on that...warm earth more plants...its called cyclical... Recorded history for weather can only be relied on for the last 100 years...more people die from cold than will die from warm or hot weather....the earth was way warmer when the dinosaurs walked the earth...

[Bizman]

...the earth was way warmer when the dinosaurs walked the earth...

And no humen were witnessing that.

[FLS]

I think ya'll are missing a big point here.  Isn't climate change a symptom of a larger problem?

7 billion living on a planet meant for 200M - 1 Billion.

What could go wrong?

...

When Ehrlich was pushing that nonsense there were fewer people than there are today. However there is less poverty today than there was then. There has been an unending litany of disasters that never come to pass for as long as I can remember.

[FLS]

In the 70s everyone was talking about the cooling.

NASA says the upper atmosphere is cooling now.

[Mister Fork]

NASA says the upper atmosphere is cooling now.

..from the Russian volcano erruption this summer....

[BoilerDown]

Climate change is really happening and its been brought on by mankind.  The only real remaining question is how much to spend combating it.

https://xkcd.com/1732

Bring on the electric vehicles (despite the gloom-sayers on these very forums, there's still no evidence that the electrical grid will collapse from widespread EV use, even in countries like Norway where the vast majority of vehicles sold are EVs), solar panels, alternative energy sources, and yes, the latest generation of nuclear power.  Carbon tax until its financially infeasible to emit large quantities of carbon.

Screw vegetarian diets though, mankind evolved to eat meat.  We either survive with the CO2 emissions of cow farts or we perish with them, there is no without them.

The government should finance more research into advanced electric transportation, including trains and aircraft.  Obviously nothing is going to get accomplished (failing article II section 4) by the government until January 2021, but after then, I expect things to move fairly quickly.

And before some idiot criticizes electric vehicles for just shifting the carbon source, A) large generators are more efficient than small ones, so 1000 cars running on electricity powered by one big gasoline generator will always be more efficient than 1000 cars running on 1000 small gasoline engines... blame the laws of thermodynamics if this hurts your world view, and B) electricity can more easily get cleaner quicker.... take a dirty plant offline and put a cleaner or even zero emission plant in its place, and BAM, all those EVs just got cleaner.

[FLS]

..from the Russian volcano erruption this summer....

NASA is referring to the thermosphere.  NASA didn't mention volcanoes, just solar output. Volcanic eruptions don't cross the stratosphere.

Climate change is really happening and its been brought on by mankind. ....

Electric vehicles don't do anything to help the environment. They aren't even neutral. And have fun when the electricity is off. The US leads the world in carbon reduction but as long as China and India have other priorities they aren't going to play along.

The real problem with electric is the batteries and R&D has been ongoing. A government graft program won't speed it up.

The good news is that CO2 is a fake problem.

[FLS]

This was written in 1920, shortly before the world ended. And here we are, debating fire and ice again. 

Fire and Ice by Robert Frost

Some say the world will end in fire,
Some say in ice.
From what I’ve tasted of desire
I hold with those who favor fire.
But if it had to perish twice,
I think I know enough of hate
To say that for destruction ice
Is also great
And would suffice.

[perdue3]

I do actually it's real. It's bad. Maybe you notice little since your country is so huge. But we are f"ed.

That you are. The Netherlands will go first. At least most governments around the world work toward limiting it. Our country could be at the forefront and maybe will be soon. It makes me proud to see what countries like Denmark, Sweden, and France have done.