Will you defend palestinians...

[Thrawn]

Originally posted by Toad
N'Sync? N'Synch? Yah, well I'll apologize for N'Synch right after somebody apologizes for Celine Dion!  

Hey, we paid full reparations for Dion, in the Shania Twain Treaty of 1995!!

[straffo]

I'm perhaps ignorant but when there was a state of war between USA and France ? (*)

Truly I'm candid and I don't know

(*) a real state of war not a chicken game

[Toad]

I don't think you ever DID abide by the protocols of the Saccharine Sweetness Songwriting Treaty of the '70's that ended the Anne Murray cross-border war, now did ya?

I think you'll admit to it, as I know you are a student of history.

[Toad]

I hear ya. There's no GOOD side to support here. I would like to see the US government get tough with Israel though. Maybe just immediately cut all aid; somehow I think THAT would get Sharon's attention.

The Arab offer was a good one... if they'd abide by it. I can see where Israel doesn't have much faith in the promises of the Arab League.

... and the '67 border idea can't be challenged. Israel shouldn't have that land by conquest despite their claim that it aids in their territorial security.

Pollyanna solution? Israel pulls back behind the '67 borders. Arab League actually does recognize Israel and treats and trades with her just like "any other country". >

Palestine gets its own state and the state actually pays more attention to aiding its own citizens health, education and welfare than trying to "get back at Israel".

UN installs Peacekeeping force between Arabs and Israel using the meanest "pit bull" Peacekeepers they can find and gives them authorization to immediately engage with deadly force on ANYONE breaking the peace.

Told ya it was Pollyanna. Probably wouldn't work. Some moron would find a way to continue the slaughter.

[easymo]

I recognize that the Arabs might just be buying time, and space with the offer. But, tactically the Israelis wouldn't lose that much. And what the would stand to gain politically, if the Arabs defaulted, is far more valuable than there position is now.

[~Caligula~]

The problem is,the 1967 borders of Israel are not defendable.
The border would be some 7 miles away from israel`s only international airport,from the golan syrians could shell major cities and Jerusalem would be off limit for jews once again.

It would be like the US pulling out of Europe during the cold war.
Yes,Israel would win and beat the arabs once again,but at what prize.

No scuicide attack today (they caught and killed one wannabe martyr) and support from US is still strong.So it seems like it`s working.I hope I`m not saying it too soon.

[Thrawn]

Originally posted by ~Caligula~
No scuicide attack today (they caught and killed one wannabe martyr) and support from US is still strong.So it seems like it`s working.I hope I`m not saying it too soon.

Yeah the killing of many civilians by the IDF is coming along quite nicely.

[~Caligula~]

When civilians pick up guns,they`re not civilians anymore.
BTW if the IDF was about to go and kill all palestinians,they would have done it by now.
They go to arrest people suspected of terrorist activity,and they fight the ones that resist.If You`re not a terrorist why would You resist?

[Toad]

Originally posted by ~Caligula~
The problem is,the 1967 borders of Israel are not defendable.
 

The problem is that taking land by conquest isn't permitted.  

I understand the concern but the excuse won't wash.

Israel got what it got in '48 from the UN. There was no "and any other territory you think you need to defend yourself and can conquer and hold from your neighbors" clause in the deal.

What Israel (IMO) needs to do right now is:

• Pull back to the original borders. receiving in exchange a committment from the UN to supply UN troops to defend Israel if Israel is attacked again by military forces.
• Agree to the Palestinian statehood
• Totally seal its border with the new Palestinian state.  

Don't worry, I know it won't happen.

But if it did and the Palestinians kept up the terror attacks, where would the world turn its anger? Right now, the world is totally PISSED at Israel; wouldn't it be better if they were totally pissed at the Palestinians?

Either way, Israelis are dying. The way it is right now, most of the world is placing the blame on Israel.

[Thrawn]

Originally posted by ~Caligula~
When civilians pick up guns,they`re not civilians anymore.
BTW if the IDF was about to go and kill all palestinians,they would have done it by now.
They go to arrest people suspected of terrorist activity,and they fight the ones that resist.If You`re not a terrorist why would You resist?

I said civilians, I ment civilians.  Because they are being arrested by military personal from a foreign government.  Civilian palistinians are already ghettoized and are now have a curfew.  They are being rousted from their homes and arrested.  Do you think that the israelies have enough prison space for the 700 people they've arrested already?  The might have to concentrate them in camps.

Isrealis killing civilians is not right, the Palistians kill of Isreali civilians is not right.  Anyone that is says otherwise is just wrong in my books.

[fdiron]

The Jews have had it pretty bad for about 2000 years now.  I dont see how anyone could support Palestine especially since it is sending wave after wave of suicide bombers into Israel.  I dont know how much longer Israel is gonna sit back and keep letting Palestine attack it.

Here is a quote from General Hawley

) ") "Violence only leads to more violence." This one is so stupid you
usually have to be the president of an Ivy League university to say it.  Here's the truth, which you know in your heads and hearts already:
Ineffective, unfocused violence leads to more violence. Limp, panicky, half-measures lead to more violence. However, complete,
fully-thought-through, professional, well- executed violence never leads to more violence because, you see, afterwards, the other guys are all dead.  That's right, dead. Not "on trial," not "reeducated," not "nurtured back into the bosom of love." Dead. D-E-Well, you get the
idea.

[Toad]

I found it here.. entire piece is pretty funny acutally:

You Say You Want a Resolution

[Steven]

<<>>  -Caligula

You don't even need to pick up a gun to support the economy and war-making machinery.  Even armies need food and that calls for farmers.  I'm not sure in today's world that there are "civilians" anymore.

[~Caligula~]

I just saw on CCN curfew lifted for 2.5 hours to let civilians get food from the market.They sure looked upset,but noone was bugging them.Than I saw UN trucks unloading medical supplies.
So israelis do make sure the innocents suffer as little as possible,but it`s war after all,and in war people suffer.
Colleteral damage seems to be lower than in any other war I`ve known of (at least in the west bank,palestinians aim for civilians in their brave martyr attacks).

Israel is in deep toejam,and they do everything possible not to sink even deeper.I`m sure there are many israelis that would like to see all palestinians rounded up and moved down,it ain`t gonna happen.I`m yet to see reports of israeli mobs going around linching arabs,but I see this:

[Thrawn]

Oh how magnanimous of the Isrealis.  If a foreign government came an ghettoize the you and, then invaded your country, shot innocent neighbours of yours and imposed a curfew on you.  Would you be sitting there thinking how wonderful they were when they you out of your house for 2 and 1/2 hours.

Caligula, I fear your biases have blinded you.