"N. Korea claims nuke"

[weazel]

When they invaded.  

The Russians did have a non-aggression pact with the Japanese throughout the war.

[Sikboy]

Originally posted by weazel
 Yep, and they broke that treaty

When they invaded.

Filthy Stinking Reds! I knew they weren't to be trusted!

-Sik

[Hangtime]

Look.. I'll be the first to admit that US intentions are not always honorable..  but when is Boroda gonna admit that Soviet intentions were NEVER honorable?

Does anybody here see the USSR's occupation and subsequent bloody handed stranglehold of the nations of eastern Europe for 50 years as materialy different from our treatment of western Europe, Germany and Japan during the same period???

Boroda, yah commie pinko pinhead, I dunno where in hell you think the resta the world gets it's history lessons from, but lemme assure yah, yer treasured socialist empire was a freakin dark and evil boil on the bellybutton of enlightend progress fer 50 damn years. And it's apparent you'd just love to see that evil pack of dickwads make a comeback.

In some respects it's a shame yer precious 'victory' in the october crisis of 1962 did not result in the following:

US attacks installations in Cuba, gives assembled invasion force the green light for beacheads in NE Cuba.

Russians release nukes, both stategic and tactical. Invasion force immolated. Miami, Charleston, Newport News and Washington D.C. destroyed.

US counterstrikes with its 30-1 superiority in nuclear warheads and delivery systems.

After 3 weeks of unrestricted war, 1/3 of the globe is uninhabitable, but there are no commies left anywhere. And, while the US has suffered grevious harm, it still exists and will recover, whereas there is no soviet union... no soviets..  no russians... no red chinese... nowhere.

And no damn boroda.

[mietla]

Originally posted by Boroda
Mietla, funny, but we didn't have to chain the glasses to the soda machines

chain? who can afford a chain in communism? it's a piece of rusty wire.

[easymo]

Cause you look just like a commie and you might just be a member maaaby.   Get out of Denver baby. Get out of Denver.

[Boroda]

Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
LOL!

Too bad Nikita Khrushchev wasn't quite so successful in painting it as such to his fellow high-ranking party members, eh?

-- Todd/Leviathn

His fellow party bosses knew all the situation. The problem was a word that Soviet side had to give to Robert Kennedy, to keep the details of the "bargain" in secret.

[Naso]

Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
As for your government question... the US never forcefully imposed it's will or it's policies on any nation, liberated, occupied, or otherwise.

Nor did we keep our hands in their business for 30+ years...

-SW

Well, when I was a child, and the Wall was up and working, they told me that US was our big and nice brother, that helped us to repair the damage of the war (that the US bombers made, btw).

Then I grow up, I dig a little more, the Wall fall, and more info comes...

And I discover that, and the end of the war, Italy had the more powerful in number Communist party in the western Europe.

In june 1946, we had the first vote to the govern system, and we chose the democratic republic, throwing away the king, some time later, we had the first election of the new brand democracy.

There was a founded fear that the communist party cut win, twisting Italy toward the Commie area.

This possibility had 2 big enemies:

The church, fearing an atheist state (at those times, and now, Italy it's still a one religion state).

The USA (you know, Italy have a nice strategic position in Mediterranean).

What started then is amaizing.

The priest take part of the politic, even refusing to celebrate baptism and weddings for Commies, and saying (that's true!) that the communists ate their children.

The USA refused to let the Italy enter in the Marshall plan, until the elections were made, and started secretly refunding the Democrazia Cristiana party with a LOT of money (they were even simply buying the votes).

The Democrazia Cristiana wins the election, and has been in the government (in an amaizing way that we can discuss in other place) until the 90s.

A former Head of the CIA admitted some day ago that Italy was the first experiment of "govern hidden guidance" made by the States.

In conclution,

Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
As for your government question... the US never forcefully imposed it's will or it's policies on any nation, liberated, occupied, or otherwise.

Nor did we keep our hands in their business for 30+ years...

-SW

was'nt by force, but...

I think both the parts of this discussion are victims of the respective propaganda, it's time you grow up, and understand that the "total evil" and "total good" does'nt exist in this poor world, and any state here have a lot of think to be ashamed.

Oh, I am sure that hase been good for us (Italy) to be on the western side, at least I can have a car now

The price has been high, but cut have been worse.

[Kieran]

Naso-

I think if you read back on the thread the preponderance of US posters admit the US is far from clean. There is one particular person of Russian persuasion that will not admit one iota of wrongdoing on the part of his native country. That has generated the bulk of the discussion.

[AKS\/\/ulfe]

I'm so sorry you had to go through all that Naso...

Propoganda or not, atleast you didn't have to live under the iron curtain.. which would of been far worse for your country than the US supporting one party in your country...

That's a far cry from what Russia did to all of the surrounding areas it invaded and occupied.
-SW

[Naso]

Yep, I know, Kieran, but I was answering mister swulf, and his declaration.

Boroda for sure exagerate in defending his country, but I am sure it is a reaction to the fanatical hate that it's spreading from a lot of people here, not enough cynic/growth/disillused/smart to understand that the truth is'nt in the words of a government, or of an organization, but somewere else.

The truth it's almost always somewere in the middle.

It's not a surprise that the "middle (ugly ) american" has been prepared to fight the "dead-fight" with the worst enemy US had (politically, militarly, but most important, economically), and the hate it's necessary to "motivate" the soldiers to fight to the end, and the people to accept the losses.

But now the world has changed (well, almost ) and we can start to look the story with more cold head.

BTW, back to the topic

IRAQ, next NK, and then?

Who will be next?

France?
Canada?



You need soooo much an enemy!!!

Your nation cannot survive without an enemy.

[AKS\/\/ulfe]

Originally posted by Naso
You need soooo much an enemy!!!

Your nation cannot survive without an enemy.

Well, if the UN were effective...........

-SW

[Naso]

Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
I'm so sorry you had to go through all that Naso...

Propoganda or not, atleast you didn't have to live under the iron curtain.. which would of been far worse for your country than the US supporting one party in your country...

That's a far cry from what Russia did to all of the surrounding areas it invaded and occupied.
-SW

Reread the end of my post, I already said that I feel fine to have born in a western country, and that cut have been worse.

And there's a lot more to say about the US foreign politic, here and in other states (South america for example), but this become too much off-topic.

The big problem I see in this board (and one of the main reasons that I had a loong breack for posting here), is that a lot of people talk with the others transferring the charateristics of the Nation in wich they born, to the person they are talking with, loosing the sight that there is a person in front of them, with the same problems and wills.

The same attitude that scare me so much when you cheerlead the bombing of the IRAQ cities like there will be only mr Saddam there, and not some poor people that is already starving, under adictature, and an huge propaganda, and have a lot bigger problems than what plane need to be perked of what cheat the other virtual pilot made yesterday in Main.

We are talking of human beings here, if we lose this contact with reality, we will become comparable to Mr. Osama and his friends.

[Naso]

Originally posted by AKS\/\/ulfe
Well, if the UN were effective...........

-SW

The UN will become effective the moment that stop to be a USA puppet.

[AKS\/\/ulfe]

I understand Naso.... but if the world ain't gonna fix the problems (and Saddam *IS* a big problem, so is N. Korea if they start taunting S. Korea with their nukes), then someone had better.. or else tommorrow, there won't be any reality.
-SW

[AKS\/\/ulfe]

Yeah right Naso.. if they were our puppet, then we would of been inside Iraq months ago hunting down Saddam.

Who keeps getting the run around, and then saying "well, maybe a new resolution and we can get in there next year".... that's right, the UN...

If they were our puppets, Saddam would be very dead a year ago.
-SW