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Author Topic: In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year  (Read 2350 times)

Offline NUKE

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« on: January 05, 2003, 05:59:32 AM »
Beet1e wrote

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year


So I ask, why does Beet1e feel there was a need to ban most guns after 1996?
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Offline moggie

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2003, 06:07:59 AM »
So I ask, why does Beet1e feel there was a need to ban most guns after 1996?

It wasn't Beet1e's descision, it was a choice made by a *democratically elected* government. why should you care anyway? Get over it.
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Offline NUKE

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2003, 06:11:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by moggie
So I ask, why does Beet1e feel there was a need to ban most guns after 1996?

It wasn't Beet1e's descision, it was a choice made by a *democratically elected* government. why should you care anyway? Get over it.


I didn't say it was Beet1e's descision, I asked why he feels there is a need for a gun ban.

And I will "get over it" as soon as Beet1e "gets over" his American fetish.
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Offline moggie

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2003, 06:16:16 AM »
Ok, but what Beet1e thinks is largely irrelevant as to the reality of the ban; you'll find that rightly or wrongly most Britons support it.
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Offline NUKE

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2003, 06:22:55 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by moggie
Ok, but what Beet1e thinks is largely irrelevant as to the reality of the ban; you'll find that rightly or wrongly most Britons support it.


You are correct is in that what Beet1e thinks is irrelevant.

I was looking at the BBC talking point yesterday regarding the gun ban....... seems most Brits that posted didn't support the ban.


Be interesting to have an official poll of Brits regarding the issue.
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Offline Dowding

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2003, 06:35:34 AM »
Quote
Be interesting to have an official poll of Brits regarding the issue.


And how 'official' would that be? I think you'd maybe have only 4 replies, and one of those would be beetle himself.

Let's see. That would be 4 out of 60 million. Hardly representative, statistically.

You overestimate the importance of gun control to most Britons.
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Offline NUKE

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2003, 06:44:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dowding
And how 'official' would that be? I think you'd maybe have only 4 replies, and one of those would be beetle himself.

Let's see. That would be 4 out of 60 million. Hardly representative, statistically.

You overestimate the importance of gun control to most Britons.


Dowding, I didn't estimate at all, so how could I overestimate?

I said it would be interesting.

was looking at BBC posts on issue, seems it is important enough to have BBC ask the question..... with more than 4 replies even.
Most Brits that replied seem to think gun laws are not the answer BTW

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/2624539.stm
« Last Edit: January 05, 2003, 06:48:22 AM by NUKE »
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Offline Ping

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2003, 07:27:14 AM »
What are the statistics for murders using sand filled garden hoses tho :D
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Offline Angus

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2003, 09:37:16 AM »
You are talking about the banning of handguns I presume?
Handguns are and have always been prohibited in my country (Iceland), while other weapons for hunting are allowed. (For that you need a clean criminal record, 2 guarantors, a course etc.).
The reason, I belive, is that handguns have no practical application (for hunting), while also being an easiy conceilable weapon. And its forbidden to shoot humans anyway.
As a result, the criminal world here is much less armed than in many other countries, and murders are rare, I belive we had only 1 last year. (drugged up burgler with an axe)
I can only recall 1 shootout between the police and a gunman in my life, - he was drunk and carrying a shotgun. BTW, the police is not armed,  - the gunman was cornered off and captured without injury by a special team (armed)
I must say, that I understand quite well what the Britons are trying to do, and keeping things this way certainly seems to work well up here.
Just thinking of the accessibility of any geek to heavy weapons in the USA runs shivers through my spine.
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline lazs2

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2003, 09:46:45 AM »
As your immigration and drug problems increase you will indeed see a rise in concern over gun bans for the law abiding..

People are people... here, when it is a case of a "nut" going on a suicidal shooting spree.... there is a huge outcry for "gun control", "help us nanny... save us from ouselves...."

When there is a riot or a stalker or a rash of armed robberies you see the gun stores selling out all their handguns...  "mind your own buisseness nanny..  you can't defend us..."

Best of both worlds is to increase penalties for gun crime while at the same time liberalizing gun ownership and concealed carry laws.
lazs
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Offline Angus

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2003, 11:08:44 AM »
Americans: you miss a point:
Guns are not prohibited in Britain, neither are they up here in Iceland.
I have 3.
However, I can't just walk into a shop and buy myself a .45 or whatever. And I can't Hide my arms, - my clothes are not baggy enough to conceil a rifle.
Since we have no handguns, we also have no conceil laws.
Another point:
In the U.S. more people get shot (mostly with small handguns) every year, than in any other western country.
Does that not indicate that there is something wrong? And how would that be countered? By INCREASING the arsenal?
Duhhhh.
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline Toad

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2003, 11:14:53 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Angus
Americans: you miss a point:

Guns are not prohibited in Britain, neither are they up here in Iceland....

...Since we have no handguns, we also have no conceil laws.



:D
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Offline lazs2

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2003, 11:23:02 AM »
angus... what are the restrictions on firearms... You say you can't have the useful and fun ones like handguns... what about semi auto rifles and shotguns? how bout pump shotguns?   Can you keep them in your home and can you do your own reloading at home?   What restrictions on ammo?   What restrictions on purchase of firearms?   We have welll stocked gun stores in every town...   Can you shoot on your own land outside city limits?   You can shoot an intruder tho right?  

In the U.S. it has been proven over and over that the more guns.... the less crime.   An armed society is a polite society.   When I was in limeyland the people seemed trustworthy enough but perhaps you have some special knowledge as to why they can't be trusted with firearms?   I guess a clue would be all the signs I seen to "watch your bags" "watch for pickpockets"   must be a country with very low morals I guess?   Still... the ones I met seemed fine.
lazs
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Offline Thrawn

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2003, 12:10:07 PM »
Cripes, I'm getting sick of this topic.  Let the American kill each other, for crying out loud.
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Offline Angus

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In Britain we've never had more than 100 gun murders in any year
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2003, 12:21:57 PM »
We can own rifles with the standard Mauser lock and with a magazine up to 5 bullets.
Pumps, yes, and semi-auto shotguns capable of 4 cartridges, yes.
Rifles varying from .22 all the way to 30-06.
You can reload your own casings, yes.
You can have a gun in the house, and you can shoot on your own land outside populated boundaries.
Usefulness of handguns, I fail to see.
You can NOT shoot an intruder, - that will just bring you to jail, unless the cirkumstances are extremely in your favour.
NB, most intruders are drunk and missing the right door, or looking for a party.
Burglars are rare, and almost never armed, and thereoff never with handguns.
People where I live, in the countryside usually never lock their houses, nor do they take the keys out of their cars!
(I take mine out on friday nights when there is a dance nearby)
I cannot see how more guns would improve such a status, and the US crime rate would certainly not support such a theory!
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It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)
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