Buffing: hard work to be undone in minutes

[Keez]

Originally posted by Pongo:
Sorry you didnt enjoy your mission because a goon pilot was on the ball. He didnt like being in the dark to give you your fun I guess.
I would think the strat systems big reason for existance was to get bombers and fighters contesting the same airspace..
Sounds like that happend.
What was the problem again?

I dont blame the goonpilot for bringing supplies to his bombed city. If I was him, I would have done the same thing. It is the system which allows this, that forms a problem for me.

And I dont get the last part... sounds like what happened? fighters came up to us? Yes that happened, was fun, I must admit, but killing fighters is a meassure, not a goal in itself.

[Revvin]

I'm holding off judgement to see what 1.09 brings, in the last interview I read Hitech said 1.09 would have alot of bomber fixes in it. Unless things change I'll be changing my squad role to an attack/fighter role because bombing really is pointless right now. BTW ignore lazs he gets his historical reference from a comic book  

[Apache]

Keez I have a question.

Which in the more difficult to accomplish? Bomb a city or resupply said city?

[straffo]

Originally posted by Apache:
Keez I have a question.

Which in the more difficult to accomplish? Bomb a city or resupply said city?

it depend of the position of the frontline ... if it's bombing deep into nme territory (aka strategic bombing) the gooner is milk running ...

[popeye]

Well, I hope both bombers AND resupply will be looked at for 1.09.

[Kieran]

Since we are talking milkrunning... how many perk points does a goon get for making that drop?  

Fighters and bombers contesting the same airspace can also be interpreted to mean cooperative operations between fighters and bombers on the same side. Fighter sweep, bomber stream with escort, next wave in to keep the pressure on. If you get enough guys on one side to do that, you get the base. If not, the defending side can rebuild if they take the time and effort to do so.

One thing I never liked before was the ability of two (2) 33K Lancasters to shut down production for hours on end. This seems a better solution to me, where it is much harder to stop the resources of a country from flowing. IMHO it should be very hard to kill a city (short of an A-bomb or Dresden-type fire attack). Likewise, taking an airbase should not be the 10-minute walkover it was before where all you really needed was 5-6 vultching ack (and fighters) and a goon or M3 to sneak in.

What seems odd to me is that you state you had nail-biting fun going in and out of the target area. You successfully dropped your load on target and then successfully egressed. You killed 10 fighters in the process. You gained many points. The only thing that did not occur is you didn't kill the city for two hours (because of the enemy that took the time to send in supplies). How could this be so bad? What am I missing here?  

[Grimm]

Originally posted by Keez:
We fought a nail-biting battle to get to our target, but we downed five fighters, of which one was a 262, without losing one bomber. We dropped our bombs succesfully and turned around to fight a nail-biting battle to get back home.

I say congradulations!  Sounds like a darn good flight!  Sorry the way the system works took the fun away for you.  Still, you should be feeling good for making the run and returning as you set out to do.  

I dont really have an opinion on the balance in the whole strat system yet, Im still figuring strat out.  (as to how to be most effective)

My point is, Just be happy with what you accomplished. I think you did very well.

[Stiletto]

The way it looks to me is that bombers have very limited tactical value in AH - close to zero on their own. I like flying them, but if the buff mission isn't part of an overall strategy to take territory, there's not much point in taking them up.

As for strats: It would hasten the end of a war if they remained down a lot longer - assuming the prevailing country at the time took advantage of it. At the same time, it would grant the losing side some breathing room, if a daring deep strike managed to get in to destroy one of the enemy's important strats. For example, it would be kinda cool if there were dams in AH...

Stiletto  

[Grimm]

Originally posted by lazs1:
flying the things is no fun unless you can spoil the fun of a lot of other guys?

lazs

Hey, Isnt this the point of flying period.  Be it a Buff or a Fighter or even a GV or CV.

Shoot them down and ruin their fun.  

Isnt a good mission when you Tick-off the enemy??  

So if Bombers Ruin some fighter guys fun, well that happens.  Same with the Fighters, if they can shoot down the bombers and ruin their fun, well it happens also.

I think its called, Spread the Hate!  

[Apache]

I don't see that there is a problem. Straffo said that it was a milk run for a goon to resupply if it was deep into enemy territory. Well yeah. Looking at it from the enemies side, it's protected, it's ours. What are we supposed to do, sit & watch?

If on the other hand, it's a front line bomber raid, which is more difficult now? Flying in a bomber formation with escort or flying an unarmed c47 with enemy fighter aircraft in the area?

Balance & counter balance.

[fats]

--- Keez: ---
how would you like it if that plane respawned right back in front of ya, at 20K?
--- end ---

I am assuming your '20K' means 'higher than you are'. Then that's same as saying the intercepting fighter you just nuked with uber-lazers would spawn at position of attack to you every time. The enemy doesn't gain a position to affect you _directly_ if they resuply the targets, like your '20K' comment suggests if it was what I took it as, so resply and enemy upping at '20K' are not comparable.
Next time you up, leave fighters at the attacked target to vulch goons. Oh and advise them not to ininin all at once for one low target which can't harm the attacking fighter anyway. Leave high cap for incoming enemy fighters. I bet P-51 with DTs can down a goon with out dropping the DTs to allow for long loiter time.

Your bombers on the way back home are at 30K+ and so light that they will outperform most fighters up there -  you won't need an escort while RTB. Oh or perhaps arrange for a new escort to get you home, I know it must be totally brand new idea...

// fats

[Keez]

Originally posted by Grimm:


My point is, Just be happy with what you accomplished. I think you did very well.

Oh we are all very happy about that flight, it was one for the squadron record  

Dont get me wrong, even if a city would pop right up after we bombed it, we would still go. Because our first and foremost objective is have fun together doing what we like to do: flying a formation of B17's deep into enemy land, fencing off fighters and then making it back. The seconday objective is always the actual destruction of the target.

But people who really like to play soccer also get ticked off when every goal they score doesn't count "just because that's the new system". Altough in the end the real soccerfans will ofcourse keep on playing, points or not, just like we will keep on buffing. Thanks for the compliment btw  

[AKDejaVu]

What altitude were you at.. and what type of bombers?

AKDejaVu

[lazs1]

Ok... I'll simplify.. You have plenty of strat to work with.   If you flew in a realistic manner with escort and such... You would "accomplish" something.   What?  You can't get escort?   You mean, the more complex the strat get's the less people wnat to participate?   Yeah, I agree.

I also think that you are confussing "hard work" with "skill".   I don't believe that "hard work" should be rewarded unless it involves skill and then... only in a balanced manner.   The "skill" required to kill dar or ruin fights is so low now that it should only be worth about 20 seconds of closure per hour of "hard work" at this point.   Most bomb runs are either skilless suicide runs and/or milkruns.  No one is fooled thaspends any time in the arena.

you say we/I don't have "what it takes" to kill fluffs.... Maybe, That doesn't seem to ring true tho in light of the stats, but...  more importantly.... who would want to?   To kill gamey, silly fluffs that are an embarassment to a flight simulation is simply..... not fun and, if it's not fun... What's the point?  How do I know I am really bored?   when I kill a fluff.
lazs

[straffo]

Originally posted by Apache:
I don't see that there is a problem. Straffo said that it was a milk run for a goon to resupply if it was deep into enemy territory. Well yeah. Looking at it from the enemies side, it's protected, it's ours. What are we supposed to do, sit & watch?

If on the other hand, it's a front line bomber raid, which is more difficult now? Flying in a bomber formation with escort or flying an unarmed c47 with enemy fighter aircraft in the area?

Balance & counter balance.

To make my point clear I never said that I'm against milk running and I'm just too lazy to developpe my reasonement further  

The bad think IMO is that it ruin the strat part of the game ...