HTC, for 1.07, can you please, PLEASE remove the inflight Radar?

[Mr. T]

 

Originally posted by hblair:
SW, those reasons would be __________.

[This message has been edited by hblair (edited 05-04-2001).]

#1) Number of fields. We don't know which fields contain activity if we don't have at the very least bar radar.

#2) Some people don't want to fly for 2 hours looking for a fight.

#3) Some people don't want to take off, go to a field and find it vacant then go back to base land and try a different field. Then repeat the process.

#4) Most people will not tell you what is going at a field, despite 14 guys being there... You think this will be different with 30 guys in the tower looking at radar?

#5) In flight bar radar represents ground controllers directing you to a fight.

#6) Radar was around in 1940 (Battle of Britain) and ground controllers were used to direct interceptors to an inbound raid. This is different from in flight bar radar, HOW?

#7) If I log in, and see enemies and friendlies somewhere on the map, I can go there and find a fight. However, when I'm in the air (in flight radar removed) and the fight ends... what are the chances of me getting a reply from someone in the tower that the fight has ended or moved or it's completely enemy?

#8) This game is about air combat, not about simulating WWII to the utmost realism (who got the F4U-1C 'perked' again?) and in flight radar provides means for each end user to be his own ground controller and pilot.

#9) I'm having fun with the current system, you need it changed because you believe it ruins your chances at jumping someone (you complained about getting the F4U-1C perked because it's quad hispanos ruined your fun... or maybe it was numbers... or maybe it was the flight model... I don't even remember anymore)... the MA in no way represents WWII... scenarios, check6 events and snapshots do that.

#10) I go into the MA expecting to be able to find action on my own terms and on my own ability. You want this taken away from me and the rest of the crowd because you believe it ruins YOUR chances of jumping someone or gang raping them.

#11) WB has the radar setup you want... if you like it so much, there *IS* another game that provides you with the radar setup you are looking for.

#12) Dot radar is like a WWII ground controller directing you to the enemy. "12 miles, vector 090, xxx bogies"

#13) Watch the history channel, you'll get the idea.
-SW


[This message has been edited by Mr. T (edited 05-04-2001).]

[Lizard3]

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
problem is a lot of the time they aren't online. Now that proves to be a bit of dilemma.

Unless you think I should call them at home, or at work while they are doing something important to them in their life and say "Hey dude, could you log in and look at the map on the tower... I can't find anything cuz no one else will reply to me."

Knights, Rooks, Bishops... all the same. I can ask all I want but until I flood the channel with the same question repeatedly I don't get an answer.

-SW

The delemma revolves around the fact that AK-SW need people to order around and tell what to do. He's a power tripin mongoloid. You can tell when his squads not online as he yells instructions at anyone and everyone and I suspect gets himself squelched by his own countrymen on a regular basis. Arabian Knights Sea Wolfe, the reason you get no answers is cause NO ONE IS LISTENING TO YOU!
Ya weenus.

[Dangerous Game]

You wouldn't dare! think of all those Law suits if that 747 collided with that Me109 wile landing at LAX Oh boy!

 Seriously I don't care ether way but I am a fan of realism,So if I was to take sides Id have to side with the what was it? (Gang banging vultures)who would dare to shoot down that lone  >WWII< spit pilot who was auto climbing 100mi behind enemy lines wile eating the once frozen pizza he just took out of his 1940's microwave oven! hehe
 

------------------
DG 483rd Tactical Fighter/Bomber wing

[Mr. T]

 

Originally posted by Lizard3:
The delemma revolves around the fact that AK-SW need people to order around and tell what to do. He's a power tripin mongoloid. You can tell when his squads not online as he yells instructions at anyone and everyone and I suspect gets himself squelched by his own countrymen on a regular basis. Arabian Knights Sea Wolfe, the reason you get no answers is cause NO ONE IS LISTENING TO YOU!
Ya weenus.

I never tell anyone what to do. I let them know what fields are in danger of capturing and tell them "well 27 is done for.."

But wait, you are so illiterate that must translate into ordering around right?

Sorry dickweed, I don't tell anyone what to do. I ask for information and don't recieve a response.

Do you eat with the same orifice you speak with? Sure sounds like it.
-SW

[Sundog]

I liked the DAR back in the beta. I would love it if the Dar was only viewbable in the tower, or....

If they limited the Dot Dar range to 5 grids out from the HQ. Then have Sector Dar for 3 grids beyond that. No Dar for everything else.

And it would be cool if they would Shorten the TAG visual distance to that used in the EVENTS as well.
But that's only what I would like. I would prefer tagless all together (That was fun when we did that in the SEA room   ).

------------------
Sundog
VMF-111 Devildogs
MAG-33

'Criticism is easier than craftmanship.'

[Otto]

The infight Radar in AH is without a doubt the worst feature of this great sim.

------------------
CO - 111th Fighter Group

[hblair]

What'd ya do, pull every semi-almost reason outa the air that you could dream up?

Well, here goes...

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
 #1) Number of fields. We don't know which fields contain activity if we don't have at the very least bar radar.

You do know that # of fields is completely adjustable in the terrain editor?
Who said no radar? tell me. It wasn't me. I said no ***>>>in-flight<<<*** radar. There is a difference between "no radar" and "no in-flight radar"

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#2) Some people don't want to fly for 2 hours looking for a fight.

Ya reckon? Now why would they do that without in-flight radar? I don't recall flying around two hours in warbirds looking for a fight. Be more specific. How would no in-flight radar lead to this??

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#3) Some people don't want to take off, go to a field and find it vacant then go back to base land and try a different field. Then repeat the process.

Ya know what? I gotta agree with ya, but let me add to it. I bet MOST (not some) people wouldn't really dig that. And again, no in-flight radar relates to this in what way? How long does it take you to fly between airfields on the front? 10 minutes tops? Do you really think the fight's gonna just evaporate in that time? Makes good scary P.R. though

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#4) Most people will not tell you what is going at a field, despite 14 guys being there... You think this will be different with 30 guys in the tower looking at radar?

They will. They did (and do) it over in warbirds. Why wouldn't they here? 30 guys in the tower huh? Is that supposed to be funny? I hope so.

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#5) In flight bar radar represents ground controllers directing you to a fight.

And a countryman or squaddie (you know, an honest to God real person) on radio or roger wilco does not represent this?   I would tend think it would more accurately represents this. You're arguing that real time *in the cockpit* radar better represents the real life BOB radar than a person vectoring you to the fight over the radio?

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#6) Radar was around in 1940 (Battle of Britain) and ground controllers were used to direct interceptors to an inbound raid. This is different from in flight bar radar, HOW?

refer to #5


 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#7) If I log in, and see enemies and friendlies somewhere on the map, I can go there and find a fight. However, when I'm in the air (in flight radar removed) and the fight ends... what are the chances of me getting a reply from someone in the tower that the fight has ended or moved or it's completely enemy?

I would say your chances would be good. Why wouldn't they be? remember, this works in that other simm. This feature, belive it or not, brings the countrymen a little closer together because they actually depend on each other a little. Comeradery. <sp?>

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#8) This game is about air combat, not about simulating WWII to the utmost realism (who got the F4U-1C 'perked' again?) and in flight radar provides means for each end user to be his own ground controller and pilot.

Okay, in #5 and #6 you argue that the current radar accurately represents Battle of Brittain era radar. Now you're saying the game is "not about simulating WWII to the utmost realism".

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#9) I'm having fun with the current system, you need it changed because you believe it ruins your chances at jumping someone (you complained about getting the F4U-1C perked because it's quad hispanos ruined your fun... or maybe it was numbers... or maybe it was the flight model... I don't even remember anymore)... the MA in no way represents WWII... scenarios, check6 events and snapshots do that.

This is your best attempt so far. Yes, I personally feel that the "bounce" was the most used way to kill planes in WWII. You just didn't usually see guys coming from so far away. I also felt that the C-hawg had too strong a gun package to be mixed in with the main arena. Thats my opinion. And judging from what you posted in #9 here, you like the current status. You are entitled to your opinion, as i am entitled to mine.

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#10) I go into the MA expecting to be able to find action on my own terms and on my own ability. You want this taken away from me and the rest of the crowd because you believe it ruins YOUR chances of jumping someone or gang raping them

Look here hoss, you point out exactly where I said that kind of stuff. Where's the thread? ? ?   Much more fun to pull it out of the air isn't it?

Try (real hard) to come up with some objective reasoning here.

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#11) WB has the radar setup you want... if you like it so much, there *IS* another game that provides you with the radar setup you are looking for.

I like this simm better. I'm just kicking around thoughts here. But if I ever do decide to leave. It won't be some goofy exit over some lame reason. I'd probably say bye to my squaddies and be gone. Like I said, I'm enjoying it here though, is it ok with you if I stay?  

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#12) Dot radar is like a WWII ground controller directing you to the enemy. "12 miles, vector 090, xxx bogies"

Back on realism huh, and a real guy giving you vectors with his real voice (or type) just aint the same huh?  

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
#13) Watch the history channel, you'll get the idea.

Thats where I got the idea.


Like I said, I'm not slamming the game, HT, Pyro, nothing like that. I think most people around here know me better than that. I'm just saying that I know it would be a more enjoyable simm for me, and many more, if the radar wasn't spoon fed to us.

I'm sure HTC have what they feel are very good reasons for this, it's their game, business, & livelihood. And if HT or pyro says that it aint changing, I won't be bitter about it. I'll probably just clam up and adapt.

The reason I refer to WB's so much is that it is the game i used to fly (that HT and pyro were responsible for) that had tower only radar, and it worked!

For every 1 person who flew WB's and didn't like their in-tower radar, I bet I can find 5 that liked it.

[Lizard3]

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
I never tell anyone what to do. I let them know what fields are in danger of capturing and tell them "well 27 is done for.."

That is an absolute complete baldface lie. Now I have you pegged. Thank you for clearing that up. You have never once uttered (typed) "well 27 is done for..." while flying for the same country as me. You constantly YELL(caps) at everyone ALL the time. When ya left Rooks a couple months ago, I silently cheered. Now your back and your worse if any different. Please auto squelch for us and our enjoyment of the game.

[Mr. T]

 

Originally posted by Lizard3:
That is an absolute complete baldface lie. Now I have you pegged. Thank you for clearing that up. You have never once uttered (typed) "well 27 is done for..." while flying for the same country as me. You constantly YELL(caps) at everyone ALL the time. When ya left Rooks a couple months ago, I silently cheered. Now your back and your worse if any different. Please auto squelch for us and our enjoyment of the game.

You either have me mistaken for someone else or you are on some really nifty drugs that allow reality to be distorted to however you like. Either way, you are full of toejam up to your neck.. any further and you might drown in it.

I haven't said or told anyone to do anything in the past 5 days I've been a rook. Last night I said "Look at 11,11" then "look at 10,11" and said "Looks like a slowly moving HQ raid" someone confirmed it and that was that.

Now again, who have I told what to do? Do you have any proof (screenshots... film)... cuz if you don't then you mine as well go back to keeping your thumb in your ass. You do that much better than trying to falsly accuse me of doing something I'm not doing.

Your breath smells like toejam, you really should stop talking out of your ass.
-SW

[Mr. T]

So again hblair, you want me to rely on my squad mates (who are usually not online when I am) or you want me to rely on "country mates" like this inept lizard3 character who wouldn't know his bellybutton from a hole in the ground with a sign saying "Your ass" affixed to it?

No thanks, I like the fact that I don't have to ask people where I should go when I'm in the air.

I said all along, bar radar in flight is fine... but whatever. You are just trying to make it more difficult.

How many maps or terrains have been included in the MA built by end users and reduced the number of fields? NONE! So you constantly bringing up "it can't be fixed via the terrain editor" is just as rediculous a statement as this inept fool lizard3 thinking I bark out orders and type in caps all of the time.

But if I ever do decide to leave. It won't be some goofy exit over some lame reason. I'd probably say bye to my squaddies and be gone.

As for that statement..    

How many people have quit over dumber reasons and come back? You don't jump on them for it, so kiss my ass. I atleast apologized, you wanna keep bringing it up? Fine, I'll just lump you, lazs and this lizard3 idiot into the same basket. I'll call you the Ambiguously handsomehunk Trio.
-SW

[hblair]

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
So again hblair, you want me to rely on my squad mates (who are usually not online when I am) or you want me to rely on "country mates" like this inept lizard3 character who wouldn't know his bellybutton from a hole in the ground with a sign saying "Your ass" affixed to it?

I don't want you to do anything really. But most people would check the radar when they roll, and maybe get updates from the tower if they needed them.

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
No thanks, I like the fact that I don't have to ask people where I should go when I'm in the air

[/b]

I'm sure you do.  

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
I said all along, bar radar in flight is fine... but whatever. You are just trying to make it more difficult.

There you go again. Putting words in other peoples mouths and thoughts in their heads. You're not my wife are you?   Doesn't that get boring?

 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
How many maps or terrains have been included in the MA built by end users and reduced the number of fields? NONE! So you constantly bringing up "it can't be fixed via the terrain editor" is just as rediculous a statement as this inept fool lizard3 thinking I bark out orders and type in caps all of the time.

There are a couple terrains being tested right now by the CM group. You'll see 'em soon. You can tell me how ridiculous a statement that was then.  


 

Originally posted by Mr. T:
How many people have quit over dumber reasons and come back? You don't jump on them for it, so kiss my ass. I atleast apologized, you wanna keep bringing it up? Fine, I'll just lump you, lazs and this lizard3 idiot into the same basket. I'll call you the Ambiguously handsomehunk Trio.
-SW

I brought that up the other day, as a joke. This statement here wasn't even directed to you personally, but to all dorky quitters who post begrudgingly <sp?> about it. I actually wasn't thinking about your episode when I typed that out.

I'll give you some unsolicited advice, your posts can be on the combative side, and that ticks people off. You might not care, but if you ever meet some of these guys face to face at the con or wherever, you *might* be eating crow. You told liz this...

Your breath smells like toejam, you really should stop talking out of your ass.

Thats a little on the tasteless side, at best, isn't it? Lizard3 lives about 50 miles south of me, we met for lunch one day, and I'll tell you, he aint no small guy. I doubt very seriously you would tell him that to his face, unless you were ready to do some floor mopping, and he would have too much respect for you (you know, respect?) to say it you. Why can't we just disagree about stuff without becoming insulting?

Why is that so hard?

Well, I think I know why, cause when it's done on your 'puter, the word *consequences* doesn't come into play.  

Anyways, you still haven't given me a decent reason yet.  




[This message has been edited by hblair (edited 05-05-2001).]

[rosco-]

  Soooooo
 
  Back on topic.

  Yes scrap the  inflight radar. In DOA we had dar in tower only and it worked great. IMO made things a whole lot more interesting and I would love to see it done here. At times with under 50 of us in the arena we had no problems finding a fight so ill just dismiss that argument.

 Inflight radar is just a crutch for the SA impaired "yea that includes me"

[lazs]

blair... hooli drove the healey and still has his drivers licence good SA.

People got "bounced" in WWII because of the mind numbing boredom not because they couldn't see the enemy.  we don't want to duplicate that.

Now... lets just cut to the chase and use the one rule that is written in stone and is never wrong in any flight sim I have seen so far....

If the LW and/or buff guys want it... It is a very bad idea and bound to screw up the game for everyone else.  

Think about it... Do any of you want the game to be as boring for you as it is for a LW or buff guy?   Forget the fact that WB has a totally different field and field capture setup.. The RULE is what works here.

Still.... fix the fighter availability at the fields and it will change the nature of fights in the arena.   More concentrations and more evenly divided concentrations of fighters.  More action and a faster paced game.  you probly wouldn't need in flight radar then.
lazs

[Mr. T]

 

Originally posted by hblair:
Thats a little on the tasteless side, at best, isn't it? Lizard3 lives about 50 miles south of me, we met for lunch one day, and I'll tell you, he aint no small guy. I doubt very seriously you would tell him that to his face, unless you were ready to do some floor mopping, and he would have too much respect for you (you know, respect?) to say it you. Why can't we just disagree about stuff without becoming insulting?

The delemma revolves around the fact that AK-SW need people to order around and tell what to do. He's a power tripin mongoloid. You can tell when his squads not online as he yells instructions at anyone and everyone and I suspect gets himself squelched by his own countrymen on a regular basis. Arabian Knights Sea Wolfe, the reason you get no answers is cause NO ONE IS LISTENING TO YOU!
Ya weenus.


I don't suppose THIS could be the reason?

Trust me, he said that to me face to face and I'd knock his mouth off his face.
If you think I'm some computer dork that plays keyboard bully, you are sadly mistaken.

But your free to think whatever you want, I spar every weekend with my friends.. gloves or no gloves and have had my nose broken 4 seperate times, I'm not afraid to tell someone to diddly off when they have it coming.
-SW

[Mr. T]

 

Originally posted by hblair:
Anyways, you still haven't given me a decent reason yet.    

and vice versa, I haven't read a single decent reason to remove/change it.. Most of these consist of "it's a crutch".. interesting, but I have no time in a fight to check out the map for incoming fighters... I'm usually focusing on shooting them down.
-SW