A few questions for Americans

[blitz]

Originally posted by Fatty
Nice list of quotes you copied all together there, but is there an answer to the question?

Read again, it's all in it


Regards Blitz




America was threatened by Iraq in no way, it was just plain ridiculous

[NUKE]

Who cares about France? Are they more important than say, Mexico or any other 3rd world nation?

[blitz]

Originally posted by NUKE
Who cares about France? Are they more important than say, Mexico or any other 3rd world nation?

Mexico is devot, France dared to get cheeky against the masters of the universe, That's the difference.

Get 'em!



Regards Blitz




America was threatened by Iraq in no way, it was just plain ridiculous

[NUKE]

Originally posted by blitz
Mexico is devot, France dared to get cheeky against the masters of the universe, That's the difference.

Get 'em!



Regards Blitz




America was threatened by Iraq in no way, it was just plain ridiculous

At least you understand who your master is

[blitz]

Originally posted by NUKE
At least you understand who your master is

Sure, i do: GOD



Regards Blitz




America was threatened by Iraq in no way, it was just plain ridiculous

[Fatty]

Blitz, your opinions of leaders' motives is not an answer.  I am merely asking for a single example of the US using bully diplomacy even remotely approaching that of the french.

Did we threaten to withdraw defense of Turkey when they refused to help us?  The axis of oil did when it appeared they were going to help us.

Can you name a single action we have taken or stated we were going to take against France, Germany or Russia?  Something approaching France's attempted intimidation of eastern Europe?

You have a list of what you believe the US might do.  For each of those there is an example of your Axis of Saddam actually taking that action.

[Saurdaukar]

Started to consider a reply to Blitz and Dolf, but then realized it wouldnt accomplish anything.

Heres to stupidity.  

[ra]

1. Why France is facing US sanction for not joining the coalition of the "Willing"?

Many countries did not join the coalition, but France aggressively tried to interfere with the US operations both diplomatically (UN) and tactically (Turkey).  

France's games in the UN made the US threat of force less effective, because Hussein could continue to hope that the war would be politically impossible for the US.   And by encouraging Turkey to deny the US from staging on Turkish soil, the US had a tougher military task.

That said, I'm not aware of any formal US sanctions against France at this time.

ra

[Arlo]

Blitz does the Everly Brothers

Bye bye free world.
Bye bye, happiness.
Hello, loneliness.
I think I'm a-gonna cry-y.

Bye bye, free world.
Bye bye, in my dress.
Hello, emptiness.
I feel like I could di-ie.
Bye bye, free world, goodby-ye.

There goes my bowels
What a smell - pee-ewww.
I hope you're happy.
I sure am blue.
UN gave lip service
'Til Coalition stepped in.
Goodbye to "free" world
That might have been.

Bye bye, free world.
Bye bye, happiness.
Hello, loneliness.
I think I'm a-gonna cry-y.

Bye bye, free world.
Bye bye, I'm verklempt.
Hello, emptiness.
I feel like I could di-ie.
Bye bye, free world, goodby-ye.

I'm not through complainin'.
though it's all in vain.
I'm not through a whinin'
yes I'll still complain
And here's the reason
That I'm verbose:
ain't got a real life
US bashin' is the most.

Bye bye, free world.
Bye bye, happiness.
Hello, loneliness.
I think I'm a-gonna cry-y.

Bye bye, free world.
Bye bye, pope can bless.
Hello, emptiness.
I feel like I could di-ie.
Bye bye, free world, goodby-ye.
Bye bye, free world, goodby-ye.
Bye bye, free world, goodby-ye.




Now is the time on Sprockets when we dance![/size]

[Imp]

Originally posted by NUKE
1. France didn't just dissagree with the coalition, they activley campained to undermine it, which is their right to do . America also has a right to choose who it does business with. What's your point exactly?

2. What is America forcing France to do?

3. Because it was France that was sending diplomats to other countries trying to get them to undermine the coalition.

1. I never said you didnt have the right not to buy from france, I said you have no right to put sanctions on them for not deciding to go your way. Because they have the right to make theyre own decisions just like you do. Its call freedom.

2. They are telling the french that if they go against them, they will face consequences. So go with us or your our ennemy.
Thats what I call bullying.

3. France used there ressources to try to gain country to there cause just like the US did. By your logic the US tried to undermined France's effort for peace.


You guys put way to much emotions in this, this isnt personal. The French didnt agree with you, that happens. They have that right.

I dont believe the french did it because they hate you, thats an oversimplification. The thruth is you dont know the real reasons.
Because youre not in there heads.

Were the french wrong, I dont know.

Were the US right, I dont know.

Did the french have some selfish reason to oppose the US, maybe.

Did the US have some selfish reasons to go to war, maybe.


I dont know, and I dont claim to know. I see alot of people jumping to conclusions without knowing all the facts. It sounds like a witch hunt. That makes guys who post it seem narrow minded is all im saying.


Im not accusing anyone. Im just saying this as a neutral observer.

I dont believe in pure evil or good, its all in Shades of Grey.

[Tumor]

The French had/has the right to disagree with the United States.

The United States has the right to plant sanctions on France.

We are not living under the umbrella of a world government, and the U.S. does not have to answer to the U.N., or France.. and vice versa.

So what's the problem?  If France doesn't want to be friends, or even freindly... fine.  France shouldn't expect preferencial treatment.  If France chooses to actively undermine the U.S., then France should obviously expect to recieve the same in return.  Thats not bullying, it's reality.  Simple really.  

Fool me once.. shame on you.  Fool me twice... shame on me.

[Fatty]

Back up for a second, Colin Powell's remarks were in reponse to Chirac's genuinly insulting (and intended to be threatening, but ended up only being laughable) comments to eastern Europe.  She's a big girl, she can handle the consequences of her actions.

There are no sanctions and there will be no sanctions, but there are diplomatic consequences for Chirac's behavior over the last year.

[blitz]

Originally posted by Fatty
Blitz, your opinions of leaders' motives is not an answer.  I am merely asking for a single example of the US using bully diplomacy even remotely approaching that of the french.

Did we threaten to withdraw defense of Turkey when they refused to help us?  The axis of oil did when it appeared they were going to help us.

Can you name a single action we have taken or stated we were going to take against France, Germany or Russia?  Something approaching France's attempted intimidation of eastern Europe?

You have a list of what you believe the US might do.  For each of those there is an example of your Axis of Saddam actually taking that action.

Bush and his famous "Black Gold Team" tried to blackmail countries which dares to withstand their evil will to invade a sovereign country on several occasions.

ex. "We can take our forces out of Germany."

       "We can give gouvernment orders to other countries."

       I call this economical blackmailing.


ex. "Germany and France are the same level as Lybia"

       "It's only old Europe talkin here"

        I call this political blackmailing.


Regards Blitz




America was threatened by Iraq in no way, it was just plain ridiculous

[Habu]

Maybe it is because Germany did not give Iraq secret briefings on what the US was thinking. I think France has made its bed. Now it is time for France to lay in it.


 Separately, The Sunday Times reported that its own journalists had found documents in the Iraqi foreign ministry that indicate that France gave Saddam Hussein's regime regular reports on its dealings with American officials.


The newspaper said the documents reveal that Paris shared with Baghdad the contents of private transatlantic meetings and diplomatic traffic from Washington.


One document, dated Sept. 25, 2001, from Iraqi foreign minister Naji Sabri to Saddam's palace, was based on a briefing from the French ambassador in Baghdad and covered talks between presidents Jacques Chirac and George W. Bush.

[Fatty]

So do you want a military presence in Germany, or not?

That Black Gold Team you seek I would believe is TotalFinaElf.  Their contract with Iraq was more than the infamous Haliburton has ever seen in its lifetime, and far more than all US contracts in postwar Iraq will be combined, but required Saddam to stay in power to cash in on.

Please tell me who said "We can give gouvernment orders to other countries.", because that sounds remarkably like something you would make up, not an actual quote.

Again Blitz, I don't expect you to understand this because it has been explained to you many times before, but your opinion on motives behind actions are not the same as actions.  I ask for examples and you put your same opinions up again but put quotes around them.