Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: shermanjr on July 12, 2011, 08:28:09 PM
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where has pilot who when it 2v1 3v1 will stay outa fight or wont ho ya or when ur out of ammo and runnin on fumes will let ya go land. i dont claim to be a very good pilot but when ur facing 3 against 1 and they all ho watever happend to wanting the thrill of a greta dogfight rather then just killen someoen who really mean no harm
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I tried to respect thing like that. Now I'm getting picked more and more. When I'm back I'm gonna be a timid runtard that everyone will hate. The only legit 1v1 u can get is at a side field in the DA.
And if gonna dogfight I'm gonna fly brews, spits, and 109f's
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everybody is too worried about seeing their names in lights. Game isn't about skill anymore it's about shutting down bases to take them and pick pick pick. Take 1/2 the guys ranked under 50 in here and fight them lol ain't much w/out their horde and their tempest.
<3
DMGOD
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where has pilot who when it 2v1 3v1 will stay outa fight or wont ho ya or when ur out of ammo and runnin on fumes will let ya go land. i dont claim to be a very good pilot but when ur facing 3 against 1 and they all ho watever happend to wanting the thrill of a greta dogfight rather then just killen someoen who really mean no harm
If you've only been here since last fall, you've seen little of that
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everybody is too worried about seeing their names in lights. Game isn't about skill anymore it's about shutting down bases to take them and pick pick pick. Take 1/2 the guys ranked under 50 in here and fight them lol ain't much w/out their horde and their tempest.
<3
DMGOD
This
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"honor is for cattle, and loveplay."
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where has pilot who when it 2v1 3v1 will stay outa fight or wont ho ya or when ur out of ammo and runnin on fumes will let ya go land. i dont claim to be a very good pilot but when ur facing 3 against 1 and they all ho watever happend to wanting the thrill of a greta dogfight rather then just killen someoen who really mean no harm
wat ever happended to pilots with honor?
They got tired of you not having any and started flying like you.
...This community is full of hypocrites.
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One of the biggest has just spoken.
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Life Lesson.
Expect to be killed when you run out of ammo trying to shoot someone else down.
Expect to be HO'd when you go head to head.
Expect to be killed when you are on fumes and want to leave a fight.
Expect that your expectations of people will not be shared by others.
Then, when you are let go, are waved off with a salute and well fought message, and generally left with warm wishes you will be surprised, but pleasantly.
Expect and Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. If you always expect they will do something other than you want them to do, you will never be disappointed or let down. Much easier thing to control ones own expectations than the countless numbers around you.
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Sorry, my post wasn't in reference to Wmaker. Posting from my phone and I can't insert quotes where needed.
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I went a deep solo bomber run the other night into the other two countries and bombed some towns and killed 3 guys.
On the way out, the 2 of 3 guys upped twice from more forward bases in fast planes like pony and 262
I killed them again twice
When I had entered back into friendly country I flew over a fight well below me. Must have been 50 pilots down their
Well these two guys were not satisfied. They upped a fourth time and chased me 6 sectors into friendly country, over flying many fights along the way to just to track me down and kill me
I was in a long descent when they caught up and killed one of the two for a fourth time
With no guns left and shot to crap the remaining pilot of this duo took me down
ZERO CLASS
MA has gone down hill in a big way
Oneway
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wat ever happended to pilots with honor?
They got tired of you not having any and started flying like you.
...This community is full of hypocrites.
:rofl o my word
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My point was that practically everyone does these things but then there are those that think they should be treated some how differently than the ones they do these things to.
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:rofl o my word
And you are a good example of such hypocrite. You whine when you die and say you were "ganged" or what not but you are more than happy to "gang" yourself.
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:rofl Honor in a game? Wmaker it is not wise to call out those who actually fight rather than those who run at first sight of an enemy of course not when you fly the brewster :neener: Try again. :D Also sorry Bruv this thread was asking for DBone approval :aok
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And you are a good example of such hypocrite. You whine when you die and say you were "ganged" or what not but you are more than happy to "gang" yourself.
What I want to know is if you were successful in quest for cleansing and calling out updogging hypocrites?
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I'm an old timer, I like to think us older players had a bit more "honor" or "class" or "sportsmanship" back in the earlier days of this game and AWIII. Some of us still hang on to that. To us the game was all about fighting. Ganging a guy 4 or 5 on 1 isn't fighting, it's just looking to grab an easy kill. Personally I still ask if a guy wants help in a 1 vs1, will dive in to help a lone friendly against 2 or 3 or more even tho we both are most likely going to die. I'll by-pass a 2 or 3 friendlies on 1 with out a second thought. I still avoid shooting on a head on merge even KNOWING that the other guys going to fire.
Some of us still play this game just for the thrill of the fight, not for score or our name in lights.
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I'm an old timer, I like to think us older players had a bit more "honor" or "class" or "sportsmanship" back in the earlier days of this game and AWIII. Some of us still hang on to that. To us the game was all about fighting. Ganging a guy 4 or 5 on 1 isn't fighting, it's just looking to grab an easy kill. Personally I still ask if a guy wants help in a 1 vs1, will dive in to help a lone friendly against 2 or 3 or more even tho we both are most likely going to die. I'll by-pass a 2 or 3 friendlies on 1 with out a second thought. I still avoid shooting on a head on merge even KNOWING that the other guys going to fire.
Some of us still play this game just for the thrill of the fight, not for score or our name in lights.
I am not saying this is you but When i find a vet that proclaims this is what he does a majority of the time they are complaining because they couldnt land. Now my question is if this is all about the fight to some of you guys then why in the world would you be worried about landing after beating the guy you just fought so hard to have a 1v1 with? Dont take this the wrong way :salute I never go into the MA looking for 1v1s but if they come my way you bet that i would engage with no prob
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I am not saying this is you but When i find a vet that proclaims this is what he does a majority of the time they are complaining because they couldnt land. Now my question is if this is all about the fight to some of you guys then why in the world would you be worried about landing after beating the guy you just fought so hard to have a 1v1 with? Dont take this the wrong way :salute I never go into the MA looking for 1v1s but if they come my way you bet that i would engage with no prob
Right over D Bones head and symptomatic of the problem
Its not the 'landing' part Bone...its the 'honor' part
:bhead
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For just one month, I really wish HTC would remove the "name in lights" function just to test it out, what is the harm in that??? I'd be willing to bet the game changes for the better. More people will take challenging aircraft instead of the easy-mode stuff.
Also, I'd like to see HTC change up their scoring formulas to throw off the rank dweebs, too.
Scoring, ranking, name in lights... do not kid youself, they ALL lend to the arcade style of playing.
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Right over D Bones head and symptomatic of the problem
Its not the 'landing' part Bone...its the 'honor' part
:bhead
Honor? But what is considered Honor in this game really?Honostly if this was about Honor you guys wouldnt have a prob flying into 10 guys and killing 5 out of 10 of them maybe push yourself to be better in multicon engagements instead of wanting everyone else to fly the way you want?
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Like this game I am adapting everyday to the tactics of the regular Horde Monkies. Like i said Gents not being rude Just wanting to see it from the other point of view
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Most folks haven't an effing clue about how to prevail in a fight, and are desperate to get ANY sort of kill, via ANY means........will always be so
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I'm good at flying brewsters
Arnt we all?
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Personally, if you check my score you'll see I very rarely land, but then again that goes along with the honor/class thing. Why wouldn't you let someone land? Wheres the fight in killing a guy with his flaps out and his gear down dropping like a rock to the runway? Maybe you need the kill to get layed later in the week, but personally if there isn't a fight, I wouldn't bother. Have I vulched, sure, but more often than not I like to see them get a bit of speed up so they have a chance. If 6 other guys are diving the runway, well they don't often get that far.
It's all in how YOU want to play the game. I preach my way to any one who will read it. You on the other hand may be looking to get a longer list of kills each month, or more of certain names on that list. What ever, as long as we are having fun. Like it was said above, don't expect it, and you can be pleasantly surprised when you get it.
In this game I'm the same as I am in real life, no "persona" here. When I play golf and shoot a 95, my scorecard doesn't say 72. I don't have to be the top scorer and prove anything to any body. I'm here to have some good battles, and when I run into a like minded individual we do. Some NEED that satisfaction of a good score, or their name in lights. I love to be able to limp home in my beat up bird and NOT have to worry about some clown picking me as I belly in, but thats the way it is these days.... got to have that one more kill to look good to the peanut gallery!
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Personally, if you check my score you'll see I very rarely land, but then again that goes along with the honor/class thing. Why wouldn't you let someone land? Wheres the fight in killing a guy with his flaps out and his gear down dropping like a rock to the runway? Maybe you need the kill to get layed later in the week, but personally if there isn't a fight, I wouldn't bother. Have I vulched, sure, but more often than not I like to see them get a bit of speed up so they have a chance. If 6 other guys are diving the runway, well they don't often get that far.
It's all in how YOU want to play the game. I preach my way to any one who will read it. You on the other hand may be looking to get a longer list of kills each month, or more of certain names on that list. What ever, as long as we are having fun. Like it was said above, don't expect it, and you can be pleasantly surprised when you get it.
In this game I'm the same as I am in real life, no "persona" here. When I play golf and shoot a 95, my scorecard doesn't say 72. I don't have to be the top scorer and prove anything to any body. I'm here to have some good battles, and when I run into a like minded individual we do. Some NEED that satisfaction of a good score, or their name in lights. I love to be able to limp home in my beat up bird and NOT have to worry about some clown picking me as I belly in, but thats the way it is these days.... got to have that one more kill to look good to the peanut gallery!
sad but most are not like you...and some absolutely have no Honor in life..... how will they ever understand it in a game......
to the OP there is HONOR in this game...it just gets buried by all the "mine mine mine..." attitude.
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Bottom line is the only one I can control is me. Accepting that fact and playing the game in a way that I believe is respectful of other players is all I can do.
That and not getting worked up because someone doesn't play it my way :)
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how can somebody know if another is out of ammo? and if somebody I see that just picked 3 of my friends then called winchester, should I let him land? our that set of buffs that is just landing, they killed the hangars at my base, should I let then land?
hell no, you up expect to get killed. you want to have honor then let that dweeb with no skill kill you instead of killing him again for the fourth time in a row. that would bed the honorable thing to do. been here for five years and been listening to this whatever happened to honor crap.
I don't play for honor, since they'd is no such thing in a cartoon game. I play for the fun.
semp
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:rofl Honor in a game? Wmaker it is not wise to call out those who actually fight rather than those who run at first sight of an enemy of course not when you fly the brewster :neener: Try again. :D Also sorry Bruv this thread was asking for DBone approval :aok
I don't fight? Ok. Glad we got that sorted out.
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Bottom line is the only one I can control is me. Accepting that fact and playing the game in a way that I believe is respectful of other players is all I can do.
That and not getting worked up because someone doesn't play it my way :)
Yep.
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I don't fight? Ok. Glad we got that sorted out.
you still haven't answered my question...
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Heard we might be getting the "King" Tiger Tank!!! :bolt:
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you still haven't answered my question...
Not worth answering to...bit like your quest at finding something wrong from a flight model without basic understanding of aerodynamics.
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The bigger picture governs; this thing has nothing to do with this game.
It is symptomatic of a cultural shift or evolution
Anyone who has been doing laps on this rolling rock for more than 30 years has seen it.
The culture within the game only reflects the culture we have created and live in today as a society
Nothing is going to reverse it, here or outside.
Sad but true and inevitable
Oneway
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When I first log in, I try and look for the 1v1s or 1v2s but time after time it turns into one bandit that dives on you while 4 others stay high and wait for the right opportunity. After a couple fights like this, I try and work the fringes of the fight until that also fails. After this I give what courtesy I can while not giving out free kills. It is made doubly worse by entire squads winging up in the MA, imho, the MA is not the place for a squad of 12+ guys to wing up and work individual cons to death.
Nothing will change the above behavior unless HTC changes gameplay in some fashion (zone ENY, disabling scoring, decreasing point awarded for too many cons on a single fighter, etc). Either accept it or quit and move on, nothing is going to change.
Hitech grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to put up with the bullcrap in the MA;
and the ability to shoot down one horde monkey at a time, without end.
Amen.
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Not worth answering to...bit like your quest at finding something wrong from a flight model without basic understanding of aerodynamics.
Ahh, despite your superiority complex, we have something in common then, ch1tty jokes!
You wear out your stuffed Brewster that you take to bed every night?
.. and I don't want to know why you made a hole on the underside of it :bolt:
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imho, the MA is not the place for a squad of 12+ guys to wing up and work individual cons to death.
:huh It's the arena with the largest numbers... Where else are squads supposed to practice on multi v multi engagements? Scenarios, and only scenarios? I disagree.
I can't get over the ridiculous amount of whining some people do over logging into a free for all arena and finding... a free for all. IMO what makes the Main Arena fun is the fact that it's unpredictable, and the only thing stopping people from beating you is what they can do, and what they can't. Numbers on all sides ebb and flow, sometimes you've got the local air superiority, sometimes the other side does. How do you expect people to only try to shoot you down in ways you find acceptable in that kind of chaos?
How is it reasonable to dive into a crowd of 5 enemy planes and expect only the one you're trying to shoot at to engage you? Please, someone explain this in concrete terms to me.
Wiley.
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well i have been playing for last 3 years and noticed less and less honor here everyone just wants their 2 sec of glory when they land
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well i have been playing for last 3 years and noticed less and less honor here everyone just wants their 2 sec of glory when they land
Sorry sir. Dweebs/more dweebs rule the skies.
Youre not alone, i hear you.
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I've been flying online flight combat simulator's since Air Warrior in 1996, and I've not noticed that pilots today fly any less honorably today than they did 15 years. On the other hand, I've noticed that a small minority of the community has become substantially more outspoken, critical and insulting to their fellow gamers.
These insults are really the only dishonorable behavior I've noticed, but in fairness it was already there (to a much lesser degree) in 1996. The big difference today vs. then is that the rest of the community has grown weary of chastising these outspoken whiner's, which in my opinion has emboldened them. In my experience, treating others with respect is a prerequisite for being honorable. The day you log on to the forums, or sign into the game, and use that time to degrade or insult your fellow gamer is a day that you have chosen to squander your honor. In any contest I've ever been in, there have only been 2 means to measure my opponents honor. That being whether they follow the rules, and display good sportsmanship.
In my opinion, criticizing or insulting an opponent is poor sportsmanship, and detracts from the fun that all hope to find from Aces High.
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Take off your rose colored glasses, stomp them into shards, and then jam those shards in someone's face. The AH community has about as much honor, as it has proper spelling and punctuation.
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Take off your rose colored glasses, and stomp them into shards. Then proceed to jam those shards in someone's face. The AH community has about as much honor as it has proper spelling and punctuation.
Fixed I think
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If anything, that's worse. I threw an extra "and" in there, so the folks who have to read out loud wouldn't be confused.
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still there, we had some great sorties and fights with even numbers, ppl asked on a flyby if someone is in trouble, numbers was even so we denied.
Got great fun the last days, nothing to discuss, it all about what you do about it
Salute
dhyran
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Bottom line is the only one I can control is me. Accepting that fact and playing the game in a way that I believe is respectful of other players is all I can do.
That and not getting worked up because someone doesn't play it my way :)
Guppy is my puppet............
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I chased a bomber that hit my strats i came up killed a bomber and killed the second one, I then said Ima let that last one live bud, I hate it when I cant land my damage, haha he landed 15k and I didnt even make it back do to running outa fuel Lol oh well at least he was able to land
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I wonder if the word honour is appropriate, and yet I think I know exactly what you mean.
I agree with what Oneway said that it is symptomatic of the results-centred culture which tends to prevail. In other words the way you arrived at the result is nowadays meaningless.
In Aces High this announces as people attacking damaged aircraft, three and upwards fighters simultaneaously attacking one enemy, people running to ack to solve their ACM problems and then coming out for the 'kill' when the opponent has turned away or is already engaged, and so on.
I think Guppy's post is very wise. If you really believe that 'honour', as you put it, is important, then act according to your beliefs but do not expect others to reciprocate as this path only leads to frustration.
Perhaps it is a difficult but worhy endeavour, to value your reputation more than your own score or ego?
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Honor? :lol Do you really expect that out of 3 or 4 hundred people all thrown in one room together to ALL display your code of conduct? You got little Tommy that'd sell his sister for a kill, JoeMo smoking dope and old Earl doing shots of Jack on climbout just looking to piss the next guy off cause he can't make this months house payment.
You got a scoring system and community that holds the #1 guys on a pedistal (spell check please). Honor from all ain't happening my man. Good luck on your search for the Holy Grail.
Oh, and a BBS that just stirs the pot. :aok
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I can't get over the ridiculous amount of whining some people do over logging into a free for all arena and finding... a free for all.
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You got little Tommy that'd sell his sister for a kill...
I think I met him! :rofl
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Wait. You mean it's scored by how many kills I get?
You mean I've been playing for the last 10 yrs thinking that
I get points when others kill me, not me kill them?
:cheers: Oz
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I think I met him! :rofl
Little Tommy, gawd I hate that kid. :devil
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everybody is too worried about seeing their names in lights. Game isn't about skill anymore it's about shutting down bases to take them and pick pick pick. Take 1/2 the guys ranked under 50 in here and fight them lol ain't much w/out their horde and their tempest.
<3
DMGOD
pick pick pick.........calling the kettle black are we :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
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Here's for respect:
If you see an enemy fighting 2-3 of your allies. Respect your enemy but more importantly, respect your allies, by finding someone else to shoot at. Nothing weaker than being the 5th or 6th hero in on a fight.
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Here's for respect:
If you see an enemy fighting 2-3 of your allies. Respect your enemy but more importantly, respect your allies, by finding someone else to shoot at. Nothing weaker than being the 5th or 6th hero in on a fight.
tunnel vision! Same effect that when a guy realizes you are flying a perk plane, and will run you down no matter what's around.
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Its all this simple:
3 of you vs 1 -- lame
2v1 -- not fun
1v1 -- fun
1v2 -- demanding, but can be the best fun
1v3 -- not fun
Yet there are plenty of gangers everywhere. What can you do?
- be a stupid (dead) pilot, then beyotch on 200 (like me)
- force yourself to be a hearthless dweeb in the MAs and rule the skies, but be a knight when youre in an 1v1
- became a gangster, sink deeper and deeper, get a K/D of 15+
Its all on you : )
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Replace "honor" with "sportsmanship" and the issue gets a little clearer.
+1 on on:
Here's for respect:
If you see an enemy fighting 2-3 of your allies. Respect your enemy but more importantly, respect your allies, by finding someone else to shoot at. Nothing weaker than being the 5th or 6th hero in on a fight.
Life Lesson.
Expect to be killed when you run out of ammo trying to shoot someone else down.
Expect to be HO'd when you go head to head.
Expect to be killed when you are on fumes and want to leave a fight.
Expect that your expectations of people will not be shared by others.
Then, when you are let go, are waved off with a salute and well fought message, and generally left with warm wishes you will be surprised, but pleasantly.
Expect and Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. If you always expect they will do something other than you want them to do, you will never be disappointed or let down. Much easier thing to control ones own expectations than the countless numbers around you.
Also you gotta consider the guy who just came in and picked you was himself getting picked all night and decided he had enough of it. Or you were fighting too close to his base or whatever. I'll pick in certain situations myself but I usually apologize, even if I don't know the poor bastid.
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lol
"Indignation" posts on a forum for an internet GAME are hilarious.
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Its all this simple:
3 of you vs 1 -- lame
2v1 -- not fun
1v1 -- fun
1v2 -- demanding, but can be the best fun
1v3 -- not fun
Yet there are plenty of gangers everywhere. What can you do?
- be a stupid (dead) pilot, then beyotch on 200 (like me)
- force yourself to be a hearthless dweeb in the MAs and rule the skies, but be a knight when youre in an 1v1
- became a gangster, sink deeper and deeper, get a K/D of 15+
Its all on you : )
You're forgetting a whole slew of possibilities that crop up in the MA though...
2v2- fun
3v3- quite fun
10v10- now we're talking
Then you've got all the possible permutations 2v3, 2v4, 5v8, 3v6... 6v3 with 4 reinforcements on the horizon.... Actually, that's a pretty good example. What is the honorable thing to do if you're one of the 6 in a 6v3, and there's 4 red dots heading in to help their buddies? Do you sit back and let 3 of your buddies engage the 3, and let yourselves get outnumbered? Or do you help kill as many of the 3 quickly as you can so you're prepared for the incoming wave?
All of these make for chaos, unpredictability, and fun. The ebb and flow of a furball is vastly more fun to me than 1v1 cold merge dueling all night. If you want 2 player gameplay, why are you logging into a server that has 400-odd people in it?
Wiley.
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Its all this simple:
3 of you vs 1 -- lame
2v1 -- not fun
1v1 -- fun
1v2 -- demanding, but can be the best fun
1v3 -- not fun
Yet there are plenty of gangers everywhere. What can you do?
- be a stupid (dead) pilot, then beyotch on 200 (like me)
- force yourself to be a hearthless dweeb in the MAs and rule the skies, but be a knight when youre in an 1v1
- became a gangster, sink deeper and deeper, get a K/D of 15+
Its all on you : )
The better question is to look at it from the side of the ganger,...
how do you like them assists!? does it make you feel accomplished? wtg, you landed 10 assists an no kills!
quite frankly, when ganging, it gets boring very fast as there is not a challenge thus no risk (no excitement) and no sense of 'accomplishment' as neither risk or the awarded kill was given.
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If you see an enemy fighting 2-3 of your allies. Respect your enemy but more importantly, respect your allies, by finding someone else to shoot at. Nothing weaker than being the 5th or 6th hero in on a fight.
+1
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Bottom line is the only one I can control is me. Accepting that fact and playing the game in a way that I believe is respectful of other players is all I can do.
That and not getting worked up because someone doesn't play it my way :)
+2
:aok
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Here's for respect:
If you see an enemy fighting 2-3 of your allies. Respect your enemy but more importantly, respect your allies, by finding someone else to shoot at. Nothing weaker than being the 5th or 6th hero in on a fight.
that is true grizz, except sometimes I'll be the 4th or 20th guy when I realize that single con doesnt just roll over and die and I dont really want somebody on my six close to me trying to take down as many as he can before he dies. i have gotten shot down by that single cons with 4 on his six who refused to die. so now if I am gonna be nearby and that con is still up, i will come down and pick him.
seen you fly and you really dont horde or pile up as much as we do, but we are all trying to learn.
semp
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How does a guy with 4 or more friendly planes on him manage to get on your 6?If he has enough speed and alt to come after you, then he wasn't engaged with those friendlies......
What is dweebish is one con on the deck with a friendly fighting it out, and three or more (or even one more if he doesn't ask first) countrymen diving in from above to gang the lone con. If the friendly is asking for help it's one thing, but more often than not it's just a race by all the green icons to see who can get the kill first, even if they are ruining someone else's fight.
I'll dive in on cons below with a friendly in a fight, but only if I'm coming to a call for help or if I ask the guy if he needs help first and he says yes.
What's the worst is a con running from a frienly, and that friendly is being chased by another con..... and all the other green icons dive in to try and kill the con that's being chased, not the con trying to clear the chaser!
But any rate, it's the MA. What the BBS filter likes to call "toejam" is gonna happen. Getting upset about it is stupid... it's best just to laugh, get a new plane, and have fun. You can set rules for yourself, but if you expect others to adhere to your set of standards you're just setting yourself up for frustration.
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There is one, and only one thing you have control of while you are playing. Yourself. Do what you know is right, be quiet and humble about your own actions, participate in the fight when it is appropriate to do so and consider every player to be your friend. When called out by others, apologize that your actions upset him, be generous in your assement of the situation. Should something upset you, get up, walk away for a bit.
As an example, (not to bang my own drum), just recently I was thumped a bit on vox by someone with a reputation for doing so, after I shot down 2 of his buffs and flew away to let the last one fly home. I threw him a salute, apologized that I had upset him, then gently reminded him that I had always been respectful to him and his squad. Result: situation diffused completely, and a short conversation thereafter forging maybe another friendship.
Control yourseves gentelmen, :salute
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Looks like a consensus is forming.
:salute
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Blah blah blah... It WOULD be nice if there was more honor and integrity in this game, but remember, the age range is whatever. Anyone can fly, and looks like some squads let anyone in. Gang, horde, odds, ho's.., most people can't fly alone, and being that they pay to play, and HT can't really adjust anything, it is what it is. And as much as everyone preaches how to fly 'correctly', it's rarely seen in game. Even pilots that normally don't ho, myself included, slip one in now and then. There's a few that abide by the 'rules', but 500+ that don't, so......GOOD LUCK !! :x
BA
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Eight years ago and even far further back a landing aircraft, full plaps, gear down, damage/smoking or not was off limits.
Now, getting vulched on landing is a daily occurance.
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Wake up people....
Stop feeling sorry for yourselves....
It's a game.....
AND...
It's a competitive, do anything to claim a scalp kind of game. You people that talk about all these crazy things need to realize that is only here in the DA when it is set up that way, or perhaps SEA as well. All other times, all other places, it is a lock, stock and barrel throw down, no holds barred, MINE MINE MINE type of environment.
So when you're done crying in your handkerchief, come back, and get better at being that much faster. Or... [ InsertAvAplug ] Goto the AvA and get yourself a 1v1. [ /InsertAvAplug ]
It's all very sad really. :(
:cheers:
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Wake up people....
Stop feeling sorry for yourselves....
It's a game.....
AND...
It's a competitive, do anything to claim a scalp kind of game. You people that talk about all these crazy things need to realize that is only here in the DA when it is set up that way, or perhaps SEA as well. All other times, all other places, it is a lock, stock and barrel throw down, no holds barred, MINE MINE MINE type of environment.
So when you're done crying in your handkerchief, come back, and get better at being that much faster. Or... [ InsertAvAplug ] Goto the AvA and get yourself a 1v1. [ /InsertAvAplug ]
It's all very sad really. :(
:cheers:
The bolded section is what the game has BECOME, due to people who either don't give a crap, or have given up on players/society. Too many people/players are ok with going through life as an dork and so this is what you run into more and more often these days.
As far as the competition, about the only competition I see is to get your name in lights any way you can (HOin, vulchin, ganging), win the map any way you can (hordes, endless NOE hordes), or stay at the top of the scoreboard any way you can ( killing squadies, or shade accounts, bombing town centers, or using your squad mates as "chum" to pick easy kills).
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The only thing thay has changed in my opinion since 06 is the graphics :O game play has alway's been this way in MA.. DA is what has changed :bolt:
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The bolded section is what the game has BECOME, due to people who either don't give a crap, or have given up on players/society. Too many people/players are ok with going through life as an dork and so this is what you run into more and more often these days.
As far as the competition, about the only competition I see is to get your name in lights any way you can (HOin, vulchin, ganging), win the map any way you can (hordes, endless NOE hordes), or stay at the top of the scoreboard any way you can ( killing squadies, or shade accounts, bombing town centers, or using your squad mates as "chum" to pick easy kills).
So what you're saying is, you don't want a maximum effort from your opponents? You want people to fight against, but you don't want them to take 'unfair' advantages (whatever your definition of those may be)?
Where's the fun in that? Why demand your opponents limit themselves? What's the difference between getting fussy because you got ganged, and getting fussy because your opponent turns both left and right when they fly? Both are arbitrary limitations. Maybe I should start whining on the boards about the people who turn right when they're fighting against me. It has about the same amount of meaning as whining about the other side not playing fairsies.
Wiley.
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where has pilot who when it 2v1 3v1 will stay outa fight or wont ho ya or when ur out of ammo and runnin on fumes will let ya go land. i dont claim to be a very good pilot but when ur facing 3 against 1 and they all ho watever happend to wanting the thrill of a greta dogfight rather then just killen someoen who really mean no harm
Thats what happens when you have score and two types of players simmers and gamers
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WOW what a stupid pile of drivel! Sure lets say you can carry your ball to the green in golf and count it as one stroke. OH I know lets say when the linebacker runs down the sideline and a player off the field trips him he still down because his knee hit the ground.
Ya I can make wild and ridiculous statements as well. The point being is if two of your squadies are working a single con and nobody else is around your a dork if you dive in to help. While it may be fun to you ..... "LOL!!!! we sure showed him!" :rolleyes: It most likely wasn't fun for the other guy when the 3rd guy dove in. Holding off in that situation makes it fun for the single con as well as the 2 fighting him. In the end even if the single dies he would be more likely to come back and try again knowing the extra guy will stay out.
How is a horde fun? 50 guys rolling a base in 3 minutes is a waste. Sure you can up a cannon bird and HO a bunch of them as they come in and drop bomb hither and yon hoping to hit EVERYTHING, but there is no fight in it, just kills on a scoreboard. From the horde side, the last 15 guys into the base have nothing left to drop on, nor vulch (FHs are down), and those few that did get up where ganged to death already. Wheres the fun for them?
A leader with a little "sportsmanship" might split his force creating 2 fights, giving those last 15 guys a target or two to hit, as well as the defenders a little more of a chance to fight and maybe have fun. They are still working together, still taking bases, still having fun a long with a bunch of other who other wise would have just turned away from "another horde mission"
Its a game, it's suppose to be fun. Playing a game with a little class, honor, sportsmanship to me, makes it more fun, kinda how life is.
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I am currently taking donations so I can fly the way YOU want me to :aok. Just PM me with verification that you paid my sub this month, and how you want me to fly for said month. :aok :salute :salute
NOT
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that is true grizz, except sometimes I'll be the 4th or 20th guy when I realize that single con doesnt just roll over and die and I dont really want somebody on my six close to me trying to take down as many as he can before he dies. i have gotten shot down by that single cons with 4 on his six who refused to die. so now if I am gonna be nearby and that con is still up, i will come down and pick him.
seen you fly and you really dont horde or pile up as much as we do, but we are all trying to learn.
semp
That's true, but I'm talking more like, you are flying and you see a guy getting ganged 2-3k below you. I always fly by, whereas most players will dive in being 5th or 6th guy trying to steal the kill. What makes it even worse is when 2-3 of them whine on range about getting an assist.
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That's true, but I'm talking more like, you are flying and you see a guy getting ganged 2-3k below you. I always fly by, whereas most players will dive in being 5th or 6th guy trying to steal the kill. What makes it even worse is when 2-3 of them whine on range about getting an assist.
If I may add to this. I like circling around them for a bit watching for that 1 or 2 or 3 guys maybe coming into the fight. Maybe I can keep them occupied while the fight plays out below me. At least you give your buddies a "5 more inbound gents, better finish it up and egress" heads up. If my friendlies are killed in the fight I've stayed out of, will I dive on in and kill that enemy ?. You bet. Then I'm a picker of course. BTW gotta big kick last night when killing a fighter attacking a friendly buff when he called out that he thought I was a picker because of it.
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I am currently taking donations so I can fly the way YOU want me to :aok. Just PM me with verification that you paid my sub this month, and how you want me to fly for said month. :aok :salute :salute
NOT
Hey you can play anyway you want, nobody is telling you how to play. Some may be throwing out a few suggestions, but nobody is telling you how to play. It's pretty simple, some people like to play like Aholes, others like to play using sportsmanship. It's up to YOU to decide which type you are :devil
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I am currently taking donations so I can fly the way YOU want me to :aok. Just PM me with verification that you paid my sub this month, and how you want me to fly for said month. :aok :salute :salute
NOT
By this reasoning you shouldn't criticize others for not doing their part to Win Zee War!!
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Let's recap....
For Honor 2
For Kills 5
For not being 4 friendly in line 3
For finding another con 3
Hey look at this belly buttoin lint 1
:D Continue
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WOW what a stupid pile of drivel!
I agree, but I'll try to read your post anyways.
Sure lets say you can carry your ball to the green in golf and count it as one stroke. OH I know lets say when the linebacker runs down the sideline and a player off the field trips him he still down because his knee hit the ground.
Right, because breaking the rules of the game is exactly the same as doing what's allowed within the rules of the game. Hint- The only enforcable rules in AH are done through code. In other words, what you can do in the game, and what you can't.
The point being is if two of your squadies are working a single con and nobody else is around your a dork if you dive in to help.
Right. In a vacuum, that's a perfectly valid statement. However, in a situation like that possibly, perhaps, because people are doing different things in the arena, maybe there's a goon or bomber formation or strike package 2 minutes out that needs to go through the airspace the singleton is occupying. I know it's far-fetched, but it does happen.
*snip anti-horde screed* I don't get upping with a bunch of green toward an undefended base either, that's not my cup of tea.
Its a game, it's suppose to be fun. Playing a game with a little class, honor, sportsmanship to me, makes it more fun, kinda how life is.
It is supposed to be fun. Why is it you guys who are looking for 'fights' (meaning duels) leave the dueling arena? If you're looking for 1v1 controlled contests, why are you in a free for all arena and expecting it to bend to your will? The best part is, you're bleating on and on about how 'classy' and 'unselfish' you are, while demanding people stop what they're doing and conform to your narrow view of how the game should be played.
Wiley.
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I fly with my honour intact, but if your a Brewster my honour goes out the window as soon as I see it.
Red mist, HOing and acute amnesia all present during the time there's a Brewster in the air.
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It's still good to fly with Honor in this game, it shows the quality of Person to me. i'll still fly into a headon 1v1 cold trigger, sure in the back of my head im thinking here comes the HO but if that happens i can get out of the way no problem usually, but it's when both pilots hit that headon merge with the same honor mindset and you pass inches from each other with cold triggers, that's when i know i'm going to have that adernalin filled, fun and memorable fight and when i find those fights it's always the pilots i've known and fought with for years, win or lose that doesnt matter it's that fun that seems to be harder to find lately for me.
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This is an interesting thread . What if everybody were extremely honorable - no shooting you on the re-arm pad, no shooting on HOs, no ganging, etc.? It would be surreal. Part of the fun of the game is the brutality of it. It creates feelings of anger and a lust for vengeance that would be dangerous in real life.
Personally, I often fly alone into clouds of enemy fighters. I up from capped bases and I never shoot on the HO. I once flew wingtip to wingtip for about twenty minutes with an enemy fighter with an AFK pilot. When he returned he panicked like you wouldn't believe. Great fun. So, am I honorable, or merely a lemming? Honor is within and its very difficult to be consistently honorable in this game. Better to be honorable in real life and a lemming in this one.
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When I run outa fingers to count how many are ganging me, honorabley fighting is the last thought to cross my mind.
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Oh the many reasons I don't fly in the MA's anymore :lol. Me personally, if you removed the MA's, only leaving FSO's, Scenarios, and other special events. I'd still subscribe. Leave me only the MA's, I'd be gone in two weeks at this point. :salute to those that put on the special events, you guys keep a lot of us vets around that would otherwise be long gone :aok
:salute
BigRat
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I agree, but I'll try to read your post anyways.
Right, because breaking the rules of the game is exactly the same as doing what's allowed within the rules of the game. Hint- The only enforcable rules in AH are done through code. In other words, what you can do in the game, and what you can't.
Right. In a vacuum, that's a perfectly valid statement. However, in a situation like that possibly, perhaps, because people are doing different things in the arena, maybe there's a goon or bomber formation or strike package 2 minutes out that needs to go through the airspace the singleton is occupying. I know it's far-fetched, but it does happen.
*snip anti-horde screed* I don't get upping with a bunch of green toward an undefended base either, that's not my cup of tea.
It is supposed to be fun. Why is it you guys who are looking for 'fights' (meaning duels) leave the dueling arena? If you're looking for 1v1 controlled contests, why are you in a free for all arena and expecting it to bend to your will? The best part is, you're bleating on and on about how 'classy' and 'unselfish' you are, while demanding people stop what they're doing and conform to your narrow view of how the game should be played.
Wiley.
The only point I'm trying to make here is at some point you cross over into "over kill" thats where honor and sportsmanship comes in. In the above mentioned scenario you think two guys on one isn't enough to save a goon in the area? Having 50 guys take a base is over kill, having 30 guy do it NOE is even worst! The point being that at some point an honorable player will step back and look for another fight, where an "Ahole" continues to push the stupidity over the line.
While I do go to the DA and fight squadies, and sometimes even run around furball lake, I prefer the MAs the "war action" believe it or not. Some believe I can't stand the "win the warz" crowd, but nothing could be farther from the truth. Had we more skilled, honorable, sportsman type players I think you'd see far more battles in the war than you would see "stealing base" type things that you see now.
I don't want people to play my way, I'd just like to see people to play the game and not game the game.
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This is a good thread. A similar one in nature to this came up, regarding two-weekers and how to retain them. One point was the 'alt f4' joke on new pilots. It strikes that i've seen less of this. If there is to be honor it starts by example leading to expectation.
Boo
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I try fly with some honor. Have I done all the the bad stuff (gang,vutch,pick,etc....). I have but not much anymore.... Not here for the kill I'm here for the fight. But I fly my way which fun for me. Other fly thier way which fun for them.
<S> BushLT
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Let's recap....
For Honor 2
For Kills 5
For not being 4 friendly in line 3
For finding another con 3
Hey look at this belly buttoin lint 1
:D Continue
(http://images-mediawiki-sites.thefullwiki.org/03/4/0/1/1318915241495074.jpg)Please update your tally Shuffler. :rofl
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(http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2009/3/12/128813690922273521.jpg)
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Funny how a lot wanting honor in here, I have in turn never seen fight honorably. Funny. People are only aware of what the red guys are doing, and are in la la land when it comes to their own actions. The self righteous folks in this game crack me up. I think game play has deteriorated in the nearly 5 years I've had various accounts here, but not a huge amount. I've seen large squads form that weren't around when I started, which certainly effects game play in the MA, but I think people are just finally getting tired of things. If you go back in time, you'd find things are not all that different. I've been playing multi player flight sims since' 99. Other than evolving from a bright eyed, innocent newb that didn't know any different, nothing has changed.
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Sorry, can't edit from my phone. Not much has changed* rather.
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My point was that practically everyone does these things but then there are those that think they should be treated some how differently than the ones they do these things to.
No. Your statement was entirely accurate though not necessarily to the OP whom I dont know when you said this.
wat ever happended to pilots with honor?
They got tired of you not having any and started flying like you.
When you try to fly with honor and everyone else is doing these things. It gets old enough to say "screw it" and go for some paybacks.
As per our argument the other night I've long said both in the MA and on the boards the circumstances in which I will HO. Thats not at all being hypocritical. Well over 90% of fights I enter or am in will I take a HO shot even once the fight is joined and I am out numbered so long as Im not being HOed. But if 3 guys are on me and 2 of em are HOing there isnt much other choice then to start HOing back.
Or if your already in a fight with 4-5 people ganging you. And someone who wasnt originally involved int he fight suddenly decided to come in at you for the easy pick head on. You dont have many other options. If you have the shot you take the HO or end up with 5 or 6 on you then 4 or 5
When the last 4 times in the last 1/2 hour you flew against a Pony and you've either been Hoed or the pony driver has tried to HO you And thats pretty much the only shot the pony was even trying to make. Well then you are going to start HOing ponies.
when against a 262. Unless its against a really poor pilot who Pzes away his E. Often the HO shot is the only one you have if said 262 has advantage and is zooming you. And often if the 262 is pretty fast.You start off taking the HO shot in an attempt for the deflection or snapshot. Because if you dont start taking that shot in the Ho position. there is a good chance the 262 will be past you before you can ever pull the trigger.
In our fight the other night. If you look at your film. you will see that only 2 of those passes tops were true HO shots. The rest I was turning for the deflection shot. In fact the one ping on your wight outer wingtip I made was on a deflection shot.
Now Im not denying that I took a couple HO shots. Those were the only shots you were giving me. For most of that fight you had the advantage. I was taking the shots that were available. The one time I did have advantage. Your feild ack became too much an issue to press.
None of this is being hypocritical. As a general rule. I dont initiate the HO's and generally I only do so in certain circumstances. The most common of which is retaliation. You would find alot more people who would say I fought them cleanly more often then those who would say I always HO. If I have. There is usually a reason for it including your statement of "They got tired of you not having any and started flying like you."
As I said. 90+% of the time I wont take the HO shot unless Im Hoed first and even then not always. And that number would go up dramatically if its a 1V1 regardless of advantage.
But those are the HOes I hate the most. the ones where its a roughly evenly matched fight in both plane and Alt/E Or those such as a guy in a KI I called out a week or two ago where the other person had both alt and E and the ONLY shots he was taking were HOes. Not one time in that fight did I respond in kind. When that happens.Then yea I'll call them out on it every single time. Just as I did then. In that instance he hit my oil on the first pass and a few passes later took out my engine. Being far from home, I bailed. My next flight I went to the same area and spotted 2 KIs. Not knowing who was who. Damn right I HOed em both. didnt outright kill them because I only got their oil and they dove back to their field and hid in the safety of their ack.
That wasnt being hypocritical. That was getting some payback. And at least one of the two suffered for the sins of another. but since we cant identify whom is whom. It is what it is.
But you know what they say about payback.
Still. my ratio of HO vs non HO fights by FAR is in favor of non HO when compared to alot of players. I'd take my ratio over most others when it comes to being non hypocritical.
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The only point I'm trying to make here is at some point you cross over into "over kill" thats where honor and sportsmanship comes in. In the above mentioned scenario you think two guys on one isn't enough to save a goon in the area?
If they've been dancing with the singleton long enough for me to notice, probably not. For whatever reason, they're having trouble putting him down.
Having 50 guys take a base is over kill, having 30 guy do it NOE is even worst! The point being that at some point an honorable player will step back and look for another fight, where an "Ahole" continues to push the stupidity over the line.
What I've generally noticed though, is if you bring just enough people to take the base, more often than not there's suddenly 30 defenders upping. To me the game is at its best with groups of 20 or so on each side clashing.
The point I'm making is, the thing that makes the MA great is the ebb and flow of combat. A relatively even fight generally swings one way or the other for a few minutes at a time, and then the uncertainty comes in about if and how reinforcements are going to come in on either side. You get moments of local superiority before the other side sends in more people, and sometimes your side is outnumbered for a while while reinforcements come back. To me, those moments of local superiority are where the ganging is ok, and quite often it's where most of the " :cry I got ganged" on 200 comes from. It really irks me when someone dives into a crowd of enemy planes and then whines when they engage him.
I'm sorry, you came in with 10 of your buddies and you're the last one alive, there's 4 of us still flying, and more enemy are inbound? I'm all for the 4 of us putting you down asap so we can get ready for the next wave. If I'm headed toward a fight and there's a gang of friendlies chasing something that's faster than my plane toward me that is co-alt or higher, sorry, I'm going to take a whack at him if he's headed my way. To me, it's self defense as quite often the guy that's being harried will attack.
While I do go to the DA and fight squadies, and sometimes even run around furball lake, I prefer the MAs the "war action" believe it or not. Some believe I can't stand the "win the warz" crowd, but nothing could be farther from the truth. Had we more skilled, honorable, sportsman type players I think you'd see far more battles in the war than you would see "stealing base" type things that you see now.
I think that it has less to do with honor, and more to do with organization. Most people don't want to put in the effort to get organized and do more reasonably sized battles along the front, so you get hordes. It's kind of an unsolvable problem too, in that it's not reasonable to expect people to get organized and treat it like a job.
Wiley.
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Honor? :lol Do you really expect that out of 3 or 4 hundred people all thrown in one room together to ALL display your code of conduct? You got little Tommy that'd sell his sister for a kill, JoeMo smoking dope and old Earl doing shots of Jack on climbout just looking to piss the next guy off cause he can't make this months house payment.
You got a scoring system and community that holds the #1 guys on a pedistal (spell check please). Honor from all ain't happening my man. Good luck on your search for the Holy Grail.
Oh, and a BBS that just stirs the pot. :aok
I used to see something resembling Honor in pre gamestorm AW. I remember fights where One person would call out "Bingo ammo" or "Bingo fuel" Or being in a damaged plane trying to disengage and one player would actually give a <S> and let the other one go land. If it was a 1 V 1 fight. Rarely would anyone interefere. There were some players to the contrary. But they were the exception and not the norm.
There seemed to be and unwriten code of honor. An "esprit de corps". It was like that the first year or so I played. Then became less and less. Eventually the best time to find such honor among combatants was early in the mornings on Sat and Sun. and would last untill around Noon EST. That was back in the days when on a weekend I was known to play on stop for 15-20 hours straight. And once played non stop for 24 hours. (needless to say I didnt play at all the next day LOL) But eventually even that gradually vanished as newer players came in and for lack of a better term. Didnt share the same kind of respect or the camaraderie that was once common. And in fact would sneer outright at the mere suggestion with pretty much the same attitudes you see now.
Eventually it became just as you see it today. Not much has changed in the 10 years I've been here. Its completely flip flopped from where it was. Honor is more the exception rather then the norm. Everyone for the most part. Even the old timers just gave up. You still occasionally see it. And its a breath of fresh air when you come across it. But I cant say as I blame anyone for giving it up. Whats the point if your one of the only ones doing it.
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For just one month, I really wish HTC would remove the "name in lights" function just to test it out, what is the harm in that??? I'd be willing to bet the game changes for the better. More people will take challenging aircraft instead of the easy-mode stuff.
Also, I'd like to see HTC change up their scoring formulas to throw off the rank dweebs, too.
Scoring, ranking, name in lights... do not kid youself, they ALL lend to the arcade style of playing.
Naa. People typically want to get the most satisfaction while doing the least amount of work. They will still fly their EZ mode planes because it makes getting that kill count that they look at even better.
Now take away all semblence of light,scoring and record keeping of any type and then you might see people in other planes. But even then. Some folks will go for the easiest way. Because as a rule. Most people in general are lazy when they can get away with it.
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that is true grizz, except sometimes I'll be the 4th or 20th guy when I realize that single con doesnt just roll over and die and I dont really want somebody on my six close to me trying to take down as many as he can before he dies. i have gotten shot down by that single cons with 4 on his six who refused to die. so now if I am gonna be nearby and that con is still up, i will come down and pick him.
seen you fly and you really dont horde or pile up as much as we do, but we are all trying to learn.
semp
Grizz doesnt have to.
With his uncanny gunnery skills he IS the horde. LOL
Try telling me that no matter what side your on as soon as you know Grizz is in the area on the opposing team it doesnt get everyones attention as being a major threat. LOL
I dont care if 20 people from my base are chasing him. If I know Grizz is around. I want to know exactly where he is at at all times. I've even chased him around with no intention or thought of even trying to get him just to keep him in front of me rather then risk him ending up behind me.
That being said. Grizz is one of the most clean fighters I see in game
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Oh the many reasons I don't fly in the MA's anymore :lol. Me personally, if you removed the MA's, only leaving FSO's, Scenarios, and other special events. I'd still subscribe. Leave me only the MA's, I'd be gone in two weeks at this point. :salute to those that put on the special events, you guys keep a lot of us vets around that would otherwise be long gone :aok
:salute
BigRat
Let's not forget about noobs that would be long gone if not for those very same special event. That's where this game truly shine. Not in the MA cluster f... Every time I fly in there I feel like that girl in the movie i'm loo....eerrr....NVM :devil
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I find it funny that Wwaker would have the ____ to even make a comment on a thread that involved the word Honor in it. I did have some shread of respect for him until he pm'd me after I killed him in his brewster. Yet it seems that is all you see him fly....literally. It seems that if he keeps up with the Pm's he will have to join the ranks of such as VDallas.
I give respect where it is earned and Wmaker has blown it time after time.
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That's true, but I'm talking more like, you are flying and you see a guy getting ganged 2-3k below you. I always fly by, whereas most players will dive in being 5th or 6th guy trying to steal the kill. What makes it even worse is when 2-3 of them whine on range about getting an assist.
Yep. Asking if someone needs help takes but a click of the mic button too. I ask folks to stay out of the fight I'm in, even if the guy is getting the edge. I kinda figure at that point he's earned the kill.
Nothing more frustrating then being in a good fight and have someone blow through and ruin some other guy's effort, even if it's me that got picked. I often check on 200 to make sure it was the guy who was actually fighting that got the kill on me. I figure they deserve the credit for it and the <S> for the good fight.
Always cracks me up to have the picker throw the <S> out after the pick too. I don't care that you picked me, but I'm not really impressed either. At least give credit to the guy who worked the fight to the point I was that much of an easier target :)
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I was in Rookland the other night at about 10k in a Tiffie when I overheard another Rook as if the Rook down on the deck wanted assistance to which the Rook in a two red vs one Rook replied "By all means, jump in, jump in!"
Some people do ask.
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Bottom line is the only one I can control is me. Accepting that fact and playing the game in a way that I believe is respectful of other players is all I can do.
That and not getting worked up because someone doesn't play it my way :)
I need not read any farther in this thread than this!!!! You say it simple yet effective Dan...... :salute
I'm not in it for the name in lights, not in it for the rank, not in it for the chest thumping. I'm just looking for some fun, and an honest fight. Almost impossible to find that in any arena, yet on that rare occasion you do, it has it's personal rewards....Win or lose. Plus, just hanging out on range and squad channel, that's just a bit of icing on the cake
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I find it funny that Wwaker would have the ____ to even make a comment on a thread that involved the word Honor in it. I did have some shread of respect for him until he pm'd me after I killed him in his brewster. Yet it seems that is all you see him fly....literally. It seems that if he keeps up with the Pm's he will have to join the ranks of such as VDallas.
I give respect where it is earned and Wmaker has blown it time after time.
Don't remember anything of the sort. You better have a film/screenshot to back this one up.
For the record, you've blown yours by being a mouth in the Ch200.
And flat out lies like the above one certainly won't raise it any.
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Don't remember anything of the sort. You better have a film/screenshot to back this one up.
For the record, you've blown yours by being a mouth in the Ch200.
And flat out lies like the above one certainly won't raise it any.
I think WMaker, it's just in your nature to cause trouble. First the Brewster, now this! :)
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I think WMaker, it's just in your nature to cause trouble. First the Brewster, now this! :)
or he is permanently angry... the jury is still deliberating though
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or he is permanently angry... the jury is still deliberating though
I've never had a problem with WMaker, and he seems to contribute a fair amount to the game. Guess I must have missed something as I've not seem him as the bad guy.
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or he is permanently angry... the jury is still deliberating though
I live by the 30/70% rule when it comes to the population of this planet. Saves from a lot of dissapointments. On this BBS, I think I should adjust the %...closer to 50/50%.
Pessimist is an educated (for the matter at hand at any given time) optimist.
I think WMaker, it's just in your nature to cause trouble. First the Brewster, now this! :)
<S> Guppy! ;)
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he pm'd me after I killed him in his brewster.
I just got done looking late war tours' kill stats one year back from this tour. The thing is, that during that year, Iraqvet doesn't have a single kill on me while I was flying Brewster.
I will look further back if need be.
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:rolleyes:
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Thats what happens when you have score and two types of players simmers and gamers
that's it man
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:rolleyes:
As for PM(S)s..
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f147/Wmaker/kiloilo.jpg)
...I do take a lot of screenshots.
EDIT: (kilo2=Sukov for those who don't know.)
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WMaker, you still flying that ugly arse brewski! I never told you this before but it makes your butt look really fat. :neener: :joystick:
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WMaker, you still flying that ugly arse brewski! I never told you this before but it makes your butt look really fat. :neener: :joystick:
I'm my current state, I consider that to be a good thing. :)
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As for PM(S)s..
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f147/Wmaker/kiloilo.jpg)
...I do take a lot of screenshots.
EDIT: (kilo2=Sukov for those who don't know.)
And? Nice job.You got me so good.
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And? Nice job.You got me so good.
Not at all, happens to half of the population of this globe! Don't worry about it! They have tampoons for it nowadays. :)
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Not at all, happens to half of the population of this globe! Don't worry about it! They have tampoons for it nowadays. :)
Clever! Look out for this guy he is on a roll.
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I'm my current state, I consider that to be a good thing. :)
I always did enjoy a good dogfight with you. :salute even if ya did kill me all the time :furious
Give it hell for Finland!
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Pilots interested flying honorably should seriously look at flying in the Coral Sea Scenario
MA nonsense doesn't exist
Sign up for Zulu Team, we need their numbers up
Its a 4 frame event but all we ask is you stick your toe in the water and fly Frame 1; then we got you hooked
:aok
http://ahevents.org/images/stories/scenarios_images/201103_CORALSEA/rules_files/CSBANNER.png[/img]](http://ahevents.org/images/stories/scenarios_images/201103_CORALSEA/rules_files/CSBANNER.png) (http://[img)
Event Details (http://ahevents.org/images/stories/scenarios_images/201103_CORALSEA/rules.html)
Register Here (http://www.ahevents.org/scenario-registration.html)
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Seeing as how this thread would probably end up being locked, a highjack is in order, :D
I have a question and comment for Oneway. 1st my comment. Special events was the first remedy that came to my mind when this thread popped up. But my opinion has always been that most, including myself have found the events are too far and few between even though they are a alot of fun.
My question is, have you guys ever thought about or tried to run these things continuely? Would something like that even be possible.... or worth the time and effort in your opinion?
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Basically, imho, a game is one of the few places these days where you can afford to have honor. So if you can't even find time to do that in a game...
On the other hand, it is a game, so everyone's entitled to enjoy it how they see fit.
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This thread should have been locked before it got started. You all talk about honor, skill, respect....helllllllllloooooo o....it's a game folks. You don't really die, you can get a new a/c or gv anytime you want. Next thing you'll be saying is player A is my hero.....errrrrrr wait we have one of them running around already :bhead. With all the crap going on in the world today I think we should not really worry about little things like "he ho'ed me" or "you bombed my tank", come on people grow up a bit :salute
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This thread should have been locked before it got started. You all talk about honor, skill, respect....helllllllllloooooo o....it's a game folks. You don't really die, you can get a new a/c or gv anytime you want. Next thing you'll be saying is player A is my hero.....errrrrrr wait we have one of them running around already :bhead. With all the crap going on in the world today I think we should not really worry about little things like "he ho'ed me" or "you bombed my tank", come on people grow up a bit :salute
Hah! Well in that case I'll be sure to steal your kills every time I'm flying with you, and mercilessly gang you everytime I'm flying against you. It'll be very fun for me and apparently you will be indifferent to it so why not? :aok
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As for PM(S)s..
(http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f147/Wmaker/kiloilo.jpg)
...I do take a lot of screenshots.
EDIT: (kilo2=Sukov for those who don't know.)
You gotta pad your fighter score somehow...
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It was like 3AM EST and I couldn't sleep. Decided to play for a couple hours and found a squaddie who happened to be
FWI. We were on our way to defend a base when we spotted this B17 formation at 28k approx. We were flying Spit 16s
with rockets. We decided to test rockets on the B17s who were doing their milkrun. We both got shot down. We complimented
you and I saluted you. I got no response and my squaddie tells me you gave him "attitude" after he PMed you.
I see no class act there buddy. You got what you deserved, a Oneway ticket to the tower.
Next time be humble or be dead. After all it is only an Internet GAME.
And by the way I was the TA152 who shot down your first drone. You took my radiator but I landed. That made my
night and I slept like a baby. The other two green guys happened to be there. We gave no advance warning.
<UNSALUTE 1WAY> :neener: :neener: :neener:
I went a deep solo bomber run the other night into the other two countries and bombed some towns and killed 3 guys.
On the way out, the 2 of 3 guys upped twice from more forward bases in fast planes like pony and 262
I killed them again twice
When I had entered back into friendly country I flew over a fight well below me. Must have been 50 pilots down their
Well these two guys were not satisfied. They upped a fourth time and chased me 6 sectors into friendly country, over flying many fights along the way to just to track me down and kill me
I was in a long descent when they caught up and killed one of the two for a fourth time
With no guns left and shot to crap the remaining pilot of this duo took me down
ZERO CLASS
MA has gone down hill in a big way
Oneway
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For when the One Great Scorer comes
To write against your name,
He marks-not that you won or lost-
But how you played the game
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Whenever i try to show respect to a fellow pilot, or "Honor", it usually back fires on me.
-Was in a DF with a 190A-5. shot his wing in half. was a good fight so i disengaged my ACM's, was going to escort him back to his base(Mainly because i wanted to see if he could land with half a wing.)
Pulled up next to him, wiggled my wings to give him the <S> trying to show him that i was disengaging. and what does he do? pulls hard right into me, killing us both.
-Was buff hunting, ran into a Set of Lancs doing the usual sortie 1 on town squares ordeal. took out 2 of his bombers, but my plane got pretty beat up in the process. I pm'ed him informing him that i would not shoot down his last buff, and allow him to land if he jettisoned his remaining payload and left Bish airspace. he responded with a flurry of rage-filled words at me that involved cheater/hacker and a certain racial term. so i said to hell with it and shot him down.
-Was in EW, had upped a p40E, ran into another P40E .as soon as i got within icon range of him he ran straight back to his base. i asked him over all-channel why he was running. He responded that he was out of ammo, but there was another rook upping from his field if i was looking for a fight. I was closing on him fast so he asked me if i wouldnt fire on him since he didnt have guns left to defend himself. i agreed. and flew formation with him. when We got to his base, it turned out to be another P40E that had upped. so i broke off the formation with maddog to engage the p40E. Less than 3 turns i was on the P40E's 6 getting ready to shoot him down, then in comes the other p40 on my 6 guns a blazing. I ended up pulling a hard vertical, causing him to auger, then shot the other p40E down. i asked him what that was all about, and he responded "oh well i had a few rounds left".
I tried to have the "Honor" many have spoken of in the Main Arenas, i really have. But ive had too many instances like the ones stated where having Honor has come back to bite me in the backside.
So now i usually take any shot i can get, and spare no one.
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So because you ran into a few aholes you going to be one too. Good deal!
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So because you ran into a few aholes you going to be one too. Good deal!
alot more than a few. I.d count you among them ;)
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So because you ran into a few aholes you going to be one too. Good deal!
alot more than a few. I.d count you among them ;)
Puns intended?
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Actually Tyrannis, Fugi might be a few things, but Ahole isn't on that list.
Wurzel (tries to fly, sometimes with honor even)
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it comes down to the fact if someone has Honor in life they will carry that over to this game.
if they don't they wont.
most people today do not have any Honor, or understand the concept of Honor.
Honor is a dying way of life, this world does not encourage, Honor just the opposite, so I am not surprised that 90% of the MA are clueless to it.
those that are saying "gee guys its just a silly game........"
just prove my point, they have no concept of Honor, for Honor is in ALL aspects of life, and should most certainly show up in a game of competition.
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Well said, Ink. :aok
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Agreed, well said Ink
Thanks wurzel....... I think :)
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HONOUR!!!!! :bhead
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HONOUR!!!!! :bhead
Well said, Ink. :aok
Agreed, well said Ink
Thanks wurzel....... I think :)
Ty guys <S>
HONOUR!!!!! :bhead
no its "Honor"
hon?or
[on-er] Show IPA
?noun
1.
honesty, fairness, or integrity in one's beliefs and actions: a man of honor.
2.
a source of credit or distinction: to be an honor to one's family.
3.
high respect, as for worth, merit, or rank: to be held in honor.
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It "honour" in her majesty's dictionary. Silly Brits.
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It "honour" in her majesty's dictionary. Silly Brits.
here here :rock
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Oxford dictionary has both spellings.
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The issue that the OP is talking about is not an honor issue, rather it is an issue of inexperience or low skill level and simply nothing more.
Honor encompasses things like honesty, integrity, loyalty, bravery, selflessness, respect, etc. and I could go on ad nauseum. So how does this apply here? :headscratch: Only thing I can think that might apply is respect for others game play. The only exception is squaddies kills! Always OK to take those! :aok
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The issue that the OP is talking about is not an honor issue, rather it is an issue of inexperience or low skill level and simply nothing more.
Honor encompasses things like honesty, integrity, loyalty, bravery, selflessness, respect, etc. and I could go on ad nauseum. So how does this apply here? :headscratch: Only thing I can think that might apply is respect for others game play. The only exception is squaddies kills! Always OK to take those! :aok
you answered your own question..... :aok
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you answered your own question..... :aok
I really should listen to those little voices in my head... :rofl
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Always cracks me up to have the picker throw the <S> out after the pick too. I don't care that you picked me, but I'm not really impressed either. At least give credit to the guy who worked the fight to the point I was that much of an easier target :)
I always laugh at that too.
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alot more than a few. I.d count you among them ;)
Watch your mouth child Joe has more respect and honor than you will ever think of having
You have crossed the line here
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Always cracks me up to have the picker throw the <S> out after the pick too. I don't care that you picked me, but I'm not really impressed either. At least give credit to the guy who worked the fight to the point I was that much of an easier target :)
those are good for a laugh, the better ones are when 3 pick or gang you and they ALL salute you. after one of those i just laugh in amazement of their ubber skillz
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Agreed, well said Ink
Thanks wurzel....... I think :)
He he he, I said might...... :D (Personally I think your a good guy Fugi)
Wurz
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we busted an small attack into one of our bases a couple of nights ago, we headed to their base and proceeded to kill 3 or 4 guys that upped several times. they were new guys according to their score. couple of kills lots of flights. at the end I felt bad since they hadnt kill any of us, so i faked a pick pulled in front of him and decided to let him shoot me down. I had announced that on the local Chanel, 2 guys got on his six but pulled away when I asked them to let him shoot me down. he tried but his aim wasnt so good, he was missing at 400, then to my amazement a long time player decided to just come in and shoot him down, even as I asked him to stay out. I went and landed disgusted. was that honor, or a reflection of his character? probably not. it's just a game where we pretend to be badasses :joystick:.
semp
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And you are a good example of such hypocrite. You whine when you die and say you were "ganged" or what not but you are more than happy to "gang" yourself.
Maker, Your points are entirely valid. I'd question, but do not know, your stance or expectation. After all, is this not a realistic game in that it sets up a "race for the bottom", much like war itself.?
Now picture an attractive 18 year old girl in an isolated room with a bunch of young gang members or a boss who leaves his jewelry-store employee with a request that he inventory some pile of new stock (not sure what all's in there). These are all similar situations, i.e., ideal situations for a "race to the bottom". I like the idea of this type of moral hazard so well I think somebody should devleop a TV series on the theme.
The AH analog: "here's an LA-7... it's really good for HO'ing and running but don't ho and run with it..."
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Hah! Well in that case I'll be sure to steal your kills every time I'm flying with you, and mercilessly gang you everytime I'm flying against you. It'll be very fun for me and apparently you will be indifferent to it so why not? :aok
There you go, Grizz. Let the race for the bottom continue!!!
I wish there was a way that squad buddies could hold an opponent down so that I, or other squad buddies, could repeatedly bust him up. That'd be so kewl.
I'm kidding, of course, but I find this thread absolutely hilarious - and your response tickled me. BTW, Hawker, you might want to avoid the dude. He's pretty handy with that tater, as I've found a couple of times now.
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it comes down to the fact if someone has Honor in life they will carry that over to this game.
if they don't they wont.
most people today do not have any Honor, or understand the concept of Honor.
Honor is a dying way of life, this world does not encourage, Honor just the opposite, so I am not surprised that 90% of the MA are clueless to it.
those that are saying "gee guys its just a silly game........"
just prove my point, they have no concept of Honor, for Honor is in ALL aspects of life, and should most certainly show up in a game of competition.
It is a silly game INK :) That being said, how you approach anything is a reflection on you as a person. So I'd hope that folks would get what you are saying.
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Lighten up, folks. Fly how you want, but don't expect others to fly how you fly. That's just an exercise in frustration that leads to forum posts like this one.
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DejaVu, all over again. :lol It's almost as if someone lifted pages from AW from the 90s and posted them here. :old: Like Dead Man said: "lighten up".
btw, I love this lil emote: :airplane: kewl!
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Next time I see this Corky character... I'm gunna change sides and ho'em.
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It is a silly game INK :) That being said, how you approach anything is a reflection on you as a person. So I'd hope that folks would get what you are saying.
I get what he's saying and the Race to the Bottom is all about moral hazard and adverse selection - honorable people will be so infuriated that they too will join the race. Consider any kind of irregular or asymmetric warfare or game, for that matter. Adverse selection eventually takes over or one side loses.
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I get what he's saying and the Race to the Bottom is all about moral hazard and adverse selection - honorable people will be so infuriated that they too will join the race. Consider any kind of irregular or asymmetric warfare or game, for that matter. Adverse selection eventually takes over or one side loses.
Hmm... not something I've heard of before, but I can follow the logic.
So essentially, competitive online games turn people into Aholes by their very nature? A 'dweeb engine' if you will?
It seems inline with my observations.
Wiley.
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Don't remember anything of the sort. You better have a film/screenshot to back this one up.
For the record, you've blown yours by being a mouth in the Ch200.
And flat out lies like the above one certainly won't raise it any.
Yes Wmaker I'm sure you don't remember but I do.
I dont have to lie....the truth has no agenda.
As I recall it was YOU that opened up on 200ch...not me after I killed your Brew. All I did was salute you as a sign of respect.
And yes if need be I will start start recording so your fellins wont get hurt.
I would not have said anyting at all about this if you had not made such fit on 200ch after I downed you.
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DejaVu, all over again. :lol It's almost as if someone lifted pages from AW from the 90s and posted them here. :old: Like Dead Man said: "lighten up".
btw, I love this lil emote: :airplane: kewl!
Wait! So your telling us this as been going almost as long as these flight sims games have been around :O ! That's BS south! It all started last week :noid. (mmmmmm. I smell sarcasm here :rofl)
To quote that guy from fallout(dont recall his name right now) : War. War never change.
This is as close as I ever wanna be to war. But I think it's a fair representation. If you let your guard down 1 second, your dead. You put your nose (figuratively speaking) where you shouldn't, your dead. that's it. That's all.
There is 2 rules I live by in this game
1-stay out of the other guy gunsight (IE : If I get shot down it's MY fault. The other guy just accomplished what he set out to do)
2-get my gunsight on the bad guy
#1 I'm getting the hang of it slowly. #2 I have a hard time doing... I'm still a bit green.
That's how I fly. Do whatever you want. The day I learn to stay out of your sights, it wont matter whatever shot you try to take. I wont be there :devil
See ya in the skys gents. :salute
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Yes Wmaker I'm sure you don't remember but I do.
I dont have to lie....the truth has no agenda.
As I recall it was YOU that opened up on 200ch...not me after I killed your Brew. All I did was salute you as a sign of respect.
And yes if need be I will start start recording so your fellins wont get hurt.
I would not have said anyting at all about this if you had not made such fit on 200ch after I downed you.
As I said before, I already proved you are lying as the HTC kill stats don't lie. There isn't a a kill of me flying a Brewster done by you found from the kill stats. Now you talk about Ch200 before it was a PM, now which is it?
I repeat, this kill you claim to have done can't be found from the kill stats. That basically proves that nothing you are claiming here happened and no wonder I don't remember such incident. Hard to remember something that hasn't happened.
In life in general, if you are gonna start accusing someone of something you better be darn sure you can back it up. Otherwise, you'll look like an insulting liar...well, which you are.
You are nothing but a liar.
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:rolleyes:
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Yes Wmaker I'm sure you don't remember but I do.
I dont have to lie....the truth has no agenda.
As I recall it was YOU that opened up on 200ch...not me after I killed your Brew. All I did was salute you as a sign of respect.
And yes if need be I will start start recording so your fellins wont get hurt.
I would not have said anyting at all about this if you had not made such fit on 200ch after I downed you.
There is another Widowmaker that plays, maybe you're complaining about the wrong one.
ack-ack
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:rolleyes:
So, me defending myself against false accusations makes you "roll your eyes"?
I'm well aware you don't like me and yes due to your retarted conduct I woudln't pee on you if you were on fire...I'd rather grab popcorn and watch the show. The aftermath would leave a higher quality genepool for sure.
...but all of the above is really beside the point. As, no matter how low of an opinion I have about someone I still consider it to be a virtue to remain objective in this type of situations. I think it shows high moral ground when one puts aside ones personal agenda/feelings and looks the issue objectively. I wouldn't blindly defend a friend of mine if he acts like a moron and gets what's coming to him nor would I blindly cheer when someone who I don't like so much would get falsely accused. Justice, rectitude, fairness and equity I believe are the words I'm looking for here. As you don't seem to be showing any of that you truly are in the oxygen waster category.
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Hmm... not something I've heard of before, but I can follow the logic.
So essentially, competitive online games turn people into Aholes by their very nature? A 'dweeb engine' if you will?
It seems inline with my observations.
Wiley.
I don't think it's the game bringing it out in people, I think it's the society we live in that nurtures it. More and more people spend their lives interacting with other through a computer instead of face to face. Whiles this gives us a broader reach and sampling of people, it also gives everyone anonymity. People do, say, and act however they want and nobody can correct them. Aholes abound! There are no consequences on the internet. More and more kids have a problem interacting with others face to face these days. They don't understand why their little "online personas" get them in trouble when dealing with real people.
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So, me defending myself against false accusations makes you "roll your eyes"?
I'm well aware you don't like me and yes due to your retarted conduct I woudln't pee on you if you were on fire...I'd rather grab popcorn and watch the show. The aftermath would leave a higher quality genepool for sure.
...but all of the above is really beside the point. As, no matter how low of an opinion I have about someone I still consider it to be a virtue to remain objective in this type of situations. I think it shows high moral ground when one puts aside ones personal agenda/feelings and looks the issue objectively. I wouldn't blindly defend a friend of mine if he acts like a moron and gets what's coming to him nor would I blindly cheer when someone who I don't like so much would get falsely accused. Justice, rectitude, fairness and equity I believe are the words I'm looking for here. As you don't seem to be showing any of that you truly are in the oxygen waster category.
Ha! You really think your opinion means anything to me? You are an arrogant appendage who really needs to learn some humility. You should also realize going around calling others idiots only makes you look like a tard.
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I don't think it's the game bringing it out in people, I think it's the society we live in that nurtures it. More and more people spend their lives interacting with other through a computer instead of face to face. Whiles this gives us a broader reach and sampling of people, it also gives everyone anonymity. People do, say, and act however they want and nobody can correct them. Aholes abound! There are no consequences on the internet. More and more kids have a problem interacting with others face to face these days. They don't understand why their little "online personas" get them in trouble when dealing with real people.
I actually like this point, Fugi. Other analogs are thick on the ground. For example, consider the explosion in the popularity of porn once it changed to an anonymous distribution channel, or, for an older phenomenon, consider how even the "nicest" people can be total bungholes when you put them inside a motor vehicle. I livr in a nice residential neighbothood with a 25 mph speed limit. Generally, people obey it - yet, unerringly, there appears to be a cadre of women who tend to go about 50 through here at around 5 or 6pm. Anecdotal? Absolutely - but who hasn't seen an otherwise decent person morph into King Turd once they can do so with impunity?
Otherwise, I'd correct you - for this is a particular case of your general point. Yes to both, - the broader phenomenon and the game are bunghole makers - but responsibility for this STILL must be awarded the a-hole in question. Otherwise, we only issue accelerators in the race to the bottom.
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I don't think it's the game bringing it out in people, I think it's the society we live in that nurtures it. More and more people spend their lives interacting with other through a computer instead of face to face. Whiles this gives us a broader reach and sampling of people, it also gives everyone anonymity. People do, say, and act however they want and nobody can correct them. Aholes abound! There are no consequences on the internet. More and more kids have a problem interacting with others face to face these days. They don't understand why their little "online personas" get them in trouble when dealing with real people.
(http://www.unc.edu/depts/jomc/academics/dri/idog.jpg)
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I don't think it's the game bringing it out in people, I think it's the society we live in that nurtures it. More and more people spend their lives interacting with other through a computer instead of face to face. Whiles this gives us a broader reach and sampling of people, it also gives everyone anonymity. People do, say, and act however they want and nobody can correct them. Aholes abound! There are no consequences on the internet. More and more kids have a problem interacting with others face to face these days. They don't understand why their little "online personas" get them in trouble when dealing with real people.
Oh, I'm well versed in John Gabriel's Greater Internet Effwad Theorem... Anonymity + Audience = Effwad^2. But what you said before is something I hadn't considered before, about it wearing people down that would normally act classier than they do if they're surrounded by a constant stream of jackwagons. I'm not saying it would happen to everyone that's exposed to it, but I can definitely see it wearing some people down.
Wiley.
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Absolutely - but who hasn't seen an otherwise decent person morph into King Turd once they can do so with impunity?
I don't think anybody hasn't. I live in a small town of about 40k ppls. And I can assure you there are king turds lurking everywhere
the broader phenomenon and the game are bunghole makers - but responsibility for this STILL must be awarded the a-hole in question. Otherwise, we only issue accelerators in the race to the bottom.
I agree that the responsibility is on the aforementioned a-holes. Acting otherwise might require quite a bit of self control and reasonable thought. Both of which a fair share (and personally I think : the vast majority) of the world population are clearly ill-equipped to deal with, mainly through lack of education.Not because they are dumb.
One point I wish to disagree on though : I don't see more people acting selfish and dumb than before. The problem is we have no real empirical data to support these claims. All we have is the human perception of his environment, and this have been proven, countless times, to be wrong. This is all associated with the phenomenon of nostalgia and how the human long term memory works. In the psyche of a person, the long term memory will tend to retain mostly the good memory, in such a way we get to a point where we regrets those past times. All the bad memory of people being disrespectful and all the little problems of your life at the time fade to leave you with the feeling that "these were the good ol' times". I'll give you a very concrete example of this : I work at a car dealership (if you know of a better place to meet a-holes, tell me. I do not). Sometimes some old guy will come to me and talk about the cars they owned in their life. If the guys are old enough it often go back to the 60's and 70's. They tell me of how THESE were good, RELIABLE cars. Not like the junk they sell today. That's the perception they got. I often ask them how often they had to bring these cars in for tune-up, maintenance, bodywork, engine work, ect... they look at me with big eyes. The fact being that while they had great styling in those days, the cars nowadays are WAY more reliable than they've ever been. I've heard stories from one of our old tech that's been in the business for 35 years now. Bodywork to fix rust HOLES every 2 years on these oldies(I live in Quebec, very hard condition for cars). Muffler every years, complete tune up every 6 months. Now to start them in the winter, choke, 2 press of the pedals to spray some fuel in the carburetor and pray it'll start cause it's minus 20 Celsius outside. Great cars...yeah right...pieces of junk that you were lucky if all went well they were (and pu-lease(sic), don't get me started on volks) Yet all they remember is the fun they had on their road trips. It's in the human nature. All this to say. Don't be so quick to judge and tell us how the people now are such jerks. The bad phenomenons always seems at a peak for people living in those times. You also have to factor in that you now have access to a broad pool of genetically inferior group thanks to the net. which you probably didn't have 30 years ago (even if you did, back then you probably were communicating with well educated people who knew how the f... these old 'puter worked). And also factor in the fact you grew older over the years. Yes. The teens always looked kinda bizarre to their parent's generation(let's talk about the hippie and how they were perceived in the 60 by the people 40-50-60 years old...).
If you read all the way through, congratulations. I just want to finish with this : I, in no way, affirm being the sole holder of the truth. I think I presented a rather solid argumentation, that is well debatable and refutable, and not a bunch of conjecture put together. Now I ask you. What do you think?
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Make it stop! :bhead
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I don't think anybody hasn't. I live in a small town of about 40k ppls. And I can assure you there are king turds lurking everywhere
I agree that the responsibility is on the aforementioned a-holes. Acting otherwise might require quite a bit of self control and reasonable thought. Both of which a fair share (and personally I think : the vast majority) of the world population are clearly ill-equipped to deal with, mainly through lack of education.Not because they are dumb.
One point I wish to disagree on though : I don't see more people acting selfish and dumb than before.
I did get through that puppet -and I first have to commend you on an excellent example that IS suported by empirical data. At Ford with Product Development, we're well aware of the relative quality/maintainability/reliability of old versus new. Whether the phenom you indicate is responsible for this gilding of the past is a broader point about which I make no conclusion - but if we had data on the cohort that remembers such old junk as somehow better, we'd have a pretty solid case. In any case, I wouldn't disagree anyhow. My point is limited to the impact of moral hazard on the behavior of most. Put any cohort in two situations - the first in which they're rigorously monitored, the second in which they're presented with moral hazard - and undoubtedly, you'll have a few more transgressors in the second . I'd be very cautious about extrapolating that concept to indicate some broader societal decline trend.
I think from this idea, you could say (I know it's a tired idea) that there are 2 types of people (it's really an analog continuum, not a binary set):
1. people who will act like King Turd or Sir Galahad whether monitored or not (internal compass, good or bad)
2. slippery base-terts who shape-shift depending on their environment (no internal compass)
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Well you'll get no thesis about cartoon chivalrous culture from me. For me phases of the game as follows. 1st yr. Noob- Crazy, Pobably HOing, anything I could get guns on, including gvs. 2nd yr. dweeb Crazy, believing everyone should fly my way, and displeased when shot avoiding a HO. Current Enlightened dweeb Crazy. See's noob Crazy coming a mile away, and waits for dweeb Crazy, to pick him honorably. :D Have fun kids.
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this is what happened
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/8635624/Pastafarian-wins-religious-freedom-right-to-wear-pasta-strainer-for-driving-licence.html
hmmmm does this breach a rule ???? hmmmm...I spose i'll find out soon enough
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Ha! You really think your opinion means anything to me? You are an arrogant appendage who really needs to learn some humility. You should also realize going around calling others idiots only makes you look like a tard.
So why respond? Why not set the example by taking the higher road?
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I did get through that puppet -and I first have to commend you on an excellent example that IS suported by empirical data. At Ford with Product Development, we're well aware of the relative quality/maintainability/reliability of old versus new. Whether the phenom you indicate is responsible for this gilding of the past is a broader point about which I make no conclusion - but if we had data on the cohort that remembers such old junk as somehow better, we'd have a pretty solid case. In any case, I wouldn't disagree anyhow. My point is limited to the impact of moral hazard on the behavior of most. Put any cohort in two situations - the first in which they're rigorously monitored, the second in which they're presented with moral hazard - and undoubtedly, you'll have a few more transgressors in the second . I'd be very cautious about extrapolating that concept to indicate some broader societal decline trend.
I think from this idea, you could say (I know it's a tired idea) that there are 2 types of people (it's really an analog continuum, not a binary set):
1. people who will act like King Turd or Sir Galahad whether monitored or not (internal compass, good or bad)
2. slippery base-terts who shape-shift depending on their environment (no internal compass)
I get your point. It is true that the internet knows no laws. As such, we get a decent idea of what some will do when given free roam and without the fear of ever be faced with the consequences of what they do or say. I think you pretty much nailed the types of persona we encounter in our everyday life. It's very sad though to see perfectly decent person act like a fool because "everybody does it". I am better than that. If they are, is themselves to decide. As Ink (I think) said, how you approach the game is very revealing of how you approach your everyday life.
The one thing I find most laughable and disconcerting at the same time is people getting so angry about being killed in a game they feel the need to blast away at everyone. That's something I had not encountered ever before online, me being a solo gamer and not participating in BBs. That's exactly the same type of people that think with their emotions instead of their brains. The same type that got through life so far by crying at their mother so she buy them the last gi joe. The very same type that loads his 10000$ credit card even though he works at subway and wonder why they threaten to re-possess their dropped honda civic with a japanese engine and gets angry at them because of the problems they brought upon themselves. The very same type that makes everyone else responsible for his demise except himself. And, sadly, the same kind of person that think school is for looser. It shows...
I agree that the responsibility is on the aforementioned a-holes. Acting otherwise might require quite a bit of self control and reasonable thought. Both of which a fair share (and personally I think : the vast majority) of the world population are clearly ill-equipped to deal with.
Trolls are way more numerous than articulated people on earth. Maybe Sauron is behind it all :noid
"One ring to bring them all
and in the tardness bind them" :devil
:cheers:
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this is what happened
hmmmm does this breach a rule ???? hmmmm...I spose i'll find out soon enough
I think it would be a rule breach if Pastafarianism were a real religion and if you were mocking it. I'd not worry, since the only people dumb enough to think the former true appear to be located somewhere in the government of the Osterreich. I'm waiting for someone to file for a (non-civil union) marriage license with their cat. After all, why not - I mean, besides the embarassing claw marks?
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As I said before, I already proved you are lying as the HTC kill stats don't lie. There isn't a a kill of me flying a Brewster done by you found from the kill stats. Now you talk about Ch200 before it was a PM, now which is it?
I repeat, this kill you claim to have done can't be found from the kill stats. That basically proves that nothing you are claiming here happened and no wonder I don't remember such incident. Hard to remember something that hasn't happened.
In life in general, if you are gonna start accusing someone of something you better be darn sure you can back it up. Otherwise, you'll look like an insulting liar...well, which you are.
You are nothing but a liar.
And I will say it once again mouth as soon as I shot you down.....you crashed I got a pm from you like a big baby.
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Caller: Hey Ditka, I saw you on the sidelines last week, crying like the baby you are
Ditka: I live at XXX YYY Lane! You mee t me there and we'll see who the gutless wonder is!
Host: Next Caller, you're on the air...
Caller 2: Hey Ditka, do you need osme Cruex? I saw you on the sidelines last week. I was tempted to hand you a wire brush and tell you to have yourself a field day!
Ditka: I'm ZZZ years old and I'll take you on any day you punk! Meet me here at the studio if you've got the guts!
Host: Next Caller, you're on the air...
Caller 3: Don't worry, Mike, you'll always be my baby.
Ditka: Mom, I told you...
Now, where's that lock?
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Some of you need your heads examined or a good, prune enema.
You're truly "dented" in the head if you think online, intardnet
game "behavior" is any kind of a real-life reflection of someone's
character.
It'd be like claiming I'm a psycho behind the wheel of a real car
because I get a laugh from smashing Matchbox toy cars together.
Get real. Get help too.
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You're truly "dented" in the head if you think online, intardnet
game "behavior" is any kind of a real-life reflection of someone's
character.
It'd be like claiming I'm a psycho behind the wheel of a real car
because I get a laugh from smashing Matchbox toy cars together.
Get real. Get help too.
I believe the last time it came up, the conclusion was reached that if you HO, you're probably a drug addled thief who cannot be trusted in any aspect of business and are destined to ultimately spend life behind bars.
I don't think you can draw any conclusions about RL behavior from the game, but I do find it interesting how some peoples' in-game or online behavior changes over time.
Wiley.
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I'm honestly torn on this matter. On the one hand, yes, it sounds a bit grandiose to expect a bunch of character projection as a feature of the game, yet, at the same time, I know when I play a USTA (recorded to a database) match, I feel I always get a good sense of the opponent's character.
I'd say that if the opponent is a serious blowhole, it's probably going to show here or there. For the vast bulk of players, though, probably not... The most notable will be the exceptions. I mean, consider the case where the opponents gets on 200 for a taunt or complaint. I'd never do such a thing and can only look at those who do as somehow miswired. What doe sit say about them? It's hard to say in any given case - after all, they might be 13 years old (different standard).
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It depends what you're talking about too though. How you communicate with and treat other people in game and on the forums I think is often closely related to RL behavior. Whiner in game, probably whiner IRL. Internet Tough Guy in game, more often than not, dolt IRL.
As far as how people play the game, I don't think it's as much of a correlation. Everybody in the MAs is playing according to their own set of (or lack of) rules. Just because someone isn't playing by your self imposed limitations doesn't mean they're a meth head thief, it just means they're playing by a different rule set in game than you are.
To me, there's a world of difference between a guy that is third man in when 2 friendlies are having trouble with a singleton and kills him and a guy that is third man in when 2 friendlies are having trouble with a singleton and kills him, and then proceeds to get on 200 and thump his chest about his mad skills.
On the other side of that, there's also a world of difference between a guy that gets himself into a position where 3 enemies have access to him and gets killed, and the guy who gets killed in that scenario and then proceeds to go on a half hour long screed on 200 about his attackers' questionable parentage, lack of skill, etc etc.
Wiley.
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I've met 20-25 people from the game and all of them have been the type of people they acted like in the game. No different in real life than they were in the game. Not all of them were "my kind of people", but I was happy to meet them all.
I'm sure some put on a "persona" when they play, but is bet it would be very few. So for me, what I see here is what is expect to see if I met ya'll in real life. Those that act like Aholes in the game I would expect to act like Aholes face to.face.
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Those that act like Aholes in the game I would expect to act like Aholes face to.face.
Wouldn't that really be more like "ace to face"?
Be careful when you're in such an encounter. After all, there's nothing worse than a spitting ace.
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I've met 20-25 people from the game and all of them have been the type of people they acted like in the game. No different in real life than they were in the game. Not all of them were "my kind of people", but I was happy to meet them all.
I'm sure some put on a "persona" when they play, but is bet it would be very few. So for me, what I see here is what is expect to see if I met ya'll in real life. Those that act like Aholes in the game I would expect to act like Aholes face to.face.
Same here. I'm looking at you DMgod...:)
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I've met 20-25 people from the game and all of them have been the type of people they acted like in the game. No different in real life than they were in the game. Not all of them were "my kind of people", but I was happy to meet them all.
I'm sure some put on a "persona" when they play, but is bet it would be very few. So for me, what I see here is what is expect to see if I met ya'll in real life. Those that act like Aholes in the game I would expect to act like Aholes face to.face.
funny all the guys I have met or spoken to in the phone were cool as hell. the definition of aholes is pretty much subjective.
do you really think if I ever meet silat that she will be wearing red high heels with a mini dress? well, he probably will, but you get the point. if you meet people and you already have an opinion of how they act, then that's how you will see them act, even as others see it in a different light.
I imagine you being one of them guys who sits in the back and judges everybody as if you were better than anybody. that's how I see you based on what you write here on the bb, but that's not really how you really are is it?
semp
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Some of you need your heads examined or a good, prune enema.
You're truly "dented" in the head if you think online, intardnet
game "behavior" is any kind of a real-life reflection of someone's
character.
It'd be like claiming I'm a psycho behind the wheel of a real car
because I get a laugh from smashing Matchbox toy cars together.
Get real. Get help too.
Since anything that you do is a part of your character..... how do you come to that conclusion.
If you want to be some internet bad boy then that in itself is part of your character.
Character is built as you go along. it is not something you choose to turn on and off at will. You can think what you will of yourself, in the end it is how you really are at any point or time of the day that is your true character.
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And I will say it once again mouth as soon as I shot you down.....you crashed I got a pm from you like a big baby.
Nothing what you say ever happened, you are nothing but a liar. Kill stats are there to prove it. You're are probably a compulsive liar, so I leave you be. I think there's a medication for it too.
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lol at this thread.
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(http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/6729/lockod.jpg)
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Honor? :lol Do you really expect that out of 3 or 4 hundred people all thrown in one room together to ALL display your code of conduct? You got little Tommy that'd sell his sister for a kill, JoeMo smoking dope and old Earl doing shots of Jack on climbout just looking to piss the next guy off cause he can't make this months house payment.
You got a scoring system and community that holds the #1 guys on a pedistal (spell check please). Honor from all ain't happening my man. Good luck on your search for the Holy Grail.
Oh, and a BBS that just stirs the pot. :aok
+1. I love it that no one wants to compare brainpans or paychecks because those are real things..not that either is more important than family etc but they are certainly more important than a game.....lol. Uptown has given the reality of our situation...with zero ambiguity.
V/r
Changeup
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Next time I see this Corky character... I'm gunna change sides and ho'em.
Shuffler no point in changing sides as Corky will most likely auger at takeoff.
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Sorry...one correction. The forums don't always stir the pot...there are some people on these forums that are actually the funniest shiesters I have ever read and I've read some funny stuff. There are some truly amazingly intelligent people posting in here from time to time... :aok
Sorry....continue on with the argument ad hominem
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Changeup,
go take your rational logic & reason out of this thread, this thread is all about cartoon egos, an angry fin, and some people's selective memory.
This is thread is the battle between the retirement home & the mental hospital...
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Did I miss something? :headscratch:
JUGgler
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Did I miss something? :headscratch:
JUGgler
Nice sig.. :rofl
Quick summary..
Someone claimed about a lack of honor, someone else said they were on a crusade against hypocrites who proclaimed honor (his new handle should be Don Quixote), some funny jokes in between & some old guys talking about the old 'better' days of online air combat
It will start to get good when scuzzy starts handing out jello salads laced with Prozac.
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Nice sig.. :rofl
Quick summary..
Someone claimed about a lack of honor, someone else said they were on a crusade against hypocrites who proclaimed honor (his new handle should be Don Quixote), some funny jokes in between & some old guys talking about the old 'better' days of online air combat
It will start to get good when scuzzy starts handing out jello salads laced with Prozac.
Mmmmmmmmm, jello
JUGgler
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Changeup,
go take your rational logic & reason out of this thread, this thread is all about cartoon egos, an angry fin, and some people's selective memory.
This is thread is the battle between the retirement home & the mental hospital...
I know. I was trying to confuse them but you saw right through it and now they're on to me...thanks.
The FIN is angry because he read JUGgler's very witty and perfectly accurate signature. I will now change my sig...
Changeup
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It will start to get good when scuzzy starts handing out jello salads laced with Prozac.
I thought the unblinking wood shampoo laced with moloko drencrom was more his style... but I still like the visual.
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I've found that arguing with Wmaker is like a rocking chair. Gives you something to do but won't get you anywhere. Guess I should expect as much from someone whom only fly's the circus plane Brewster. Guess I will have to start recording the PM's that he supposedly doesn't send me. Gonna start callin him "VDallas". :rofl
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I've found that arguing with Wmaker is like a rocking chair. Gives you something to do but won't get you anywhere. Guess I should expect as much from someone whom only fly's the circus plane Brewster. Guess I will have to start recording the PM's that he supposedly doesn't send me. Gonna start callin him "VDallas". :rofl
No , No , he'll also come kill you in an il2 while youre having a gv fight. :D
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Some of you need your heads examined or a good, prune enema.
You're truly "dented" in the head if you think online, intardnet
game "behavior" is any kind of a real-life reflection of someone's
character.
It'd be like claiming I'm a psycho behind the wheel of a real car
because I get a laugh from smashing Matchbox toy cars together.
Get real. Get help too.
Come on Westy, you know better then that! Regardless of the 'persona' the person's character will show through eventually. You and I have seen way too many examples of this over the years and you know it :)
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So for me, what I see here is what is expect to see if I met ya'll in real life.
Well, when I met Silat he wasn't wearing a dress, he didn't ask either of my daughters out on a date (or my son for that matter) and he wasn't driving a panel truck with "pet my puppies" painted on the side. So bang goes that theory.
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Well, when I met Silat he wasn't wearing a dress, he didn't ask either of my daughters out on a date (or my son for that matter) and he wasn't driving a panel truck with "pet my puppies" painted on the side. So bang goes that theory.
No it's also NOT what I'd expect from Silat. It' doesn't take "genius" type brain power to figure out what is joking around and what is more likely real. If you couldn't figure that out BEFORE you met him you need help.
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lol at this thread.
+2
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It' doesn't take "genius" type brain power to figure out what is joking around and what is more likely real.
Are you sure?
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Well, when I met Silat he wasn't wearing a dress, he didn't ask either of my daughters out on a date (or my son for that matter) and he wasn't driving a panel truck with "pet my puppies" painted on the side. So bang goes that theory.
I do have honoUr you know.
I am waiting till they are old enough:)
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frankly, I will do my best neve to ho and if I get shot down - no biggie - I just go up in another field and try to come back with more alt or more friends or whatever. . .
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Speaking of honor, I have to admit being a little dismissive of this whole "whining on 200" thing. That was until last night.
Since taking off the gondies, I'm having at least a brief undefeated streak. It's probably not coincidental. I mean, consider running up, twice last night, against some clown in a KI-84 who appeared to think he could rope a 109 (doable if It were saddled with gondos, certainly) - even after a chase at which, as established by the unchanging distance between the two, the 109 was at the same inital velocity before the climb. I call that foolishness and used my single 20/twin 50's to relieve the clown of his tail as he hopefull waited for me to stall. Still, he'd put up a good fight prior to running. We'd had several fairly involved cycles of maneuvering and jockeying, mostly in the vertical - and at least one reversal in which he'd sort of managed to flat-scissor me at the top of a loop. I was left doing a diving sort of dutch roll to get away. As a result of the fact that we'd locked horns pretty well for some time before the climactic scene in which I blew his ace off, I fired him a salute. Of course, he didn't respond so, when I again shot him down a little later, I didn't bother. As you wish - die without ceremony.
Not five minutes later, I engaged a Spit8 who happened to attack from an alt advantage over some guy named Thrash. The latter and I were separated by 2-3k. Since the Spitty had the advantage, I jumped in without all that much speed (near 250 and climbing, close enough to the g-14's E-M sweet spot I figured it worth a shot). I got the Spitty off Thrash and from there Thrash and I sort of traded being dogged by this nuisance until he foolishly squandered his E and I blew him out of his cockpit as I got a vertical angle on him. He fired off a salute. I responded with, "and you, XXX". I think just about anyone would interpret that as a return salute, right? No. The clown starts moaning on 200 about how we ganged him and that I should return the salute since it took two of us to kill him. I love the complaint because it manages to be both juvenile and grandiose all at that same time, a kind of study in the chiaroscuro, if that makes sense... I fired off a message to placate the forty whiner (first negative experience with anyone from that otherwise worthy squad) and went on about my business. My opinion: The guy should try flying a challenging ride well before first picking an easy-mode-ride losing fight with 2 opponents and then whining about getting ganged - and a course in reading comp might help as well since I really don't see why the first response was somehow insufficient.
At the end of the match, it's best to shake hands and walk away a winner or a loser - never as an actor or poseur engaged in theatrics.
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I think I'll hunt Gdzilla.
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I think I'll hunt Gdzilla.
I'll tell him I sent you.
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I'll tell him I sent you.
OK, let me be clear, I'm gunna hunt you. First I gotta figure out what your in-game name is, then I'll hunt you. First I gotta find out what side your are on, then I'll hunt you. First I gotta find out what your flying, then I'll hunt you. First I gotta figure out where you are flying, then I'll hunt you.
There are 3 kinds of people in the world, those that can do math, and those that can't.
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OK, let me be clear, I'm gunna hunt you. First I gotta figure out what your in-game name is, then I'll hunt you. First I gotta find out what side your are on, then I'll hunt you. First I gotta find out what your flying, then I'll hunt you. First I gotta figure out where you are flying, then I'll hunt you.
There are 3 kinds of people in the world, those that can do math, and those that can't.
Okay. I probably won't give the the same fight but I'll try. Sometimes I get lucky against a-listers - except that furschlugginer SHAWK, and despite several attempts.
The only thing I'll promise you is that I won't 200-whine like a baby with a diaperfull - and that's whether you kill me or not.
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I think you may misunderstand. I am going to hunt you down. Who is this "A" lister you speak of ? It sure as h e double hockeysticks aint I.
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I think you may misunderstand. I am going to hunt you down. Who is this "A" lister you speak of ? It sure as h e double hockeysticks aint I.
I thought you were the highly-ranked Zoney..? If not, so much the better. I'm always dragging something.
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I thought you were the highly-ranked Zoney..? If not, so much the better. I'm always dragging something.
Zoney and Godzilla just made the Sports hero list...
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I'm an old timer, I like to think us older players had a bit more "honor" or "class" or "sportsmanship" back in the earlier days of this game and AWIII. Some of us still hang on to that. To us the game was all about fighting. Ganging a guy 4 or 5 on 1 isn't fighting, it's just looking to grab an easy kill. Personally I still ask if a guy wants help in a 1 vs1, will dive in to help a lone friendly against 2 or 3 or more even tho we both are most likely going to die. I'll by-pass a 2 or 3 friendlies on 1 with out a second thought. I still avoid shooting on a head on merge even KNOWING that the other guys going to fire.
Some of us still play this game just for the thrill of the fight, not for score or our name in lights.
It is very rare anymore...... Was in a great turn fight in MW last week. Fm2 vs my F4U. Both of us full flaps, ready to stall and tip it over any second. We went on for at least a minute or so. Even after repeated calls "do not engage please" some one still had to come swoop in and kill the FM2. I apoligized to the FM2 driver and just shook my head.
It was a rare time that my heart was racing and I was talking myself through ther fight, waiting to see which of us would make that fatal error. Then it was snatched away in a second by a (what I call a highlighter") ("so and so landed a bizzillon kills") type.
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I've found that arguing with Wmaker is like a rocking chair. Gives you something to do but won't get you anywhere. Guess I should expect as much from someone whom only fly's the circus plane Brewster. Guess I will have to start recording the PM's that he supposedly doesn't send me. Gonna start callin him "VDallas". :rofl
You really can't grasp the fact that you haven't gotten a kill of me while I've been flying Brewster? If you would have it would be found from the kill stats. There's no to ways about it. You got caught on a lie.
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You really can't grasp the fact that you haven't gotten a kill of me while I've been flying Brewster? If you would have it would be found from the kill stats. There's no to ways about it. You got caught on a lie.
My rational and skeptical nature says to side with the evidence. You're asserting a negative but IF events occurred as he says they did, he ought to be able to produce. Until then, I can only file his claim under "Sasquatch" - i.e., there is no conclusive supporting evidence for his claim. Hitchens would say it better: That which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
BTW, WMaker, I know you killed me once from your Brewie. I was but a noob all of a couple years ago and foolishly attempted to engage in a turnfight from my G-14. I would never do such a thing against a Brewie today but there you are. However, more recently I was trying to get a little Ki-84 seat time and got roughed up badly by someone in a P40E, That was embarassing but, hey, I don't fly that thing much. That wasn't you, was it? One thing I note about the Ki - you can't use the rudder like you would in a 109 without having the slipstream summarily remove it... such a lightweight and frail little critter.
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Zoney and Godzilla just made the Sports hero list...
Changeup, I reckon this is the equivalent of calling someone who's all thumbs "Champ". No matter. The final megalomaniacal triumph is ensured. Life's tough in the midranks.
Back to my point, why would I care if this guy hunts me? Hell, the game slaps a red icon on me and paints me a target anyway. That's what I come for. He's just telling me I'll get my money's worth -which, I'm happy to say, is something of which I'm already confident (otherwise I'da cancelled). Now, if he were a highly ranked pilot, it'd be the equivalent of him saying "I'm going to train you". I'm honestly disappointed to have no such luck here. On the upside, the games continue.
Further, that's part of why I'm so baffled at some of the behavior of which we speak in this thread. Geez, you sign up for a game in which some huge number (on the order of thousands - I actually think more like hundreds of thousands, if I recollect the thread we had about the persistent battlefield correctly) of kills occur monthly only to get upset that, GD it, I just got killed... I'd call that a foul brew of cognitive dissonance and hubris - the former because any such attitude is blindingly ignorant of the unconditional odds, the latter because clearly only a few can be at the top.
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You really can't grasp the fact that you haven't gotten a kill of me while I've been flying Brewster? If you would have it would be found from the kill stats. There's no to ways about it. You got caught on a lie.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/diedin.php?playername=Wmaker&selectTour=LWTour114&pindex=101
114 was the last time he shot your Brewster down. He was in a ponyB.
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http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/diedin.php?playername=Wmaker&selectTour=LWTour114&pindex=101
114 was the last time he shot your Brewster down. He was in a ponyB.
Clear and compelling evidence... it speaks for itself.
BTW, Dolby, I can't find the functionality on the new page unde Pilot Score. How do you get to it? I tried backing out of the url you give and ended up with a screwy split screen or, backing up further, th eold page.
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http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/diedin.php?playername=Wmaker&selectTour=LWTour114&pindex=101
114 was the last time he shot your Brewster down. He was in a ponyB.
Thank you Dolby!
So that was the first tour Brewster was released IIRC, July 2009. :lol I checked all tours about 1,5 years back.
At first the guy says I send him a PM, see absolutely no reason to do so. Then, he says "I opened up on Ch200". Nothing is being said what I actually said, just references to vDallas.
Right.
Clear and compelling evidence... it speaks for itself.
...that he has shot me down once in a pony two years ago and that's it. Doesn't change the fact that the burden of proof is always with the accuser.
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...that he has shot me down once in a pony two years ago and that's it.
That's right. I see no evidence supporting any ch200 assertion - however, it does contradict any claims that he never shot you down, albeit Pony on Brew.
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That's right. I see no evidence supporting any ch200 assertion - however, it does contradict any claims that he never shot you down, albeit Pony on Brew.
Correct. I was wrong in claiming never after looking back 1,5 years. Just thought that the claim had something to do with something recent.
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Well, I think that' s probably honest. I doubt I could remember if any given individual killed me two years ago. As for the ch200 charge, it was asserted without evidence.
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Wmaker I just remember you mouthing off after I shot you down and I know you did.....because I dont forget stuff like that don't matter it be 6 yrs ago or 10. I tend to hold grudge for childish stuff like that when it is not needed or called for on 200ch or PM. That being said you need to remeber it is a game after all and stop being offended so much when people get the better of you and shoot you down. After all it is a game and we are all on here to have a good time............ not get mad and have temper tantrums. :salute
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You really can't grasp the fact that you haven't gotten a kill of me while I've been flying Brewster? If you would have it would be found from the kill stats. There's no to ways about it. You got caught on a lie.
[/b]
...that he has shot me down once in a pony two years ago.
So who got caught in a "lie" here?
just wondering. :noid
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Negative I just remember you mouthing off after I shot you down.....because I dont forget stuff like that. Don't matter it be 6 yrs ago or 10. I tend to hold grudge for childish stuff like that when it is not needed or called for on 200ch or PM.
Ahem, it's a tad funny you come up with this now that somebody dug the stats out for you. :D LOL, you should so honest. :rofl
Burden of proof is with the accuser. And now proof has been forth coming
That being said you need to remeber it is a game afterall and stop being offended so much when people get the better of you and shoot you down. After all it is a game and we are all on here to have a good time............ not get mad and have temper tantrums. :airplane:
Considering in what light your name comes up on Ch200 on daily bases, I think you have zero room to talk.
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So who got caught in a "lie" here?
Good you wrote it with quotation marks. As I said before, I at first looked one year back, then half a year more. Didn't seem like there was much point to look any further.
Priceless, that is all I can say.
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Fun thread.
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Fun thread.
Excruciating.. More please.
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Wmaker,
You're silly for dealing with this openly. Vet, you're silly for even bringing it up. This thread is silly....if Wmaker wants to fly easy mode all the time it's his money. If Vet wants to get down on the deck with a OM'd Brewster in anything other than a Zeke or Brewster and expect a win everytime, it's his money....silly, silly, silly.
"to continue to defend one's self against silliness is to admit your doing something wrong...." - Changeup
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and counseling the silly is... what, again? It's kind of like painting hot tar. Eventually, you're wearing it.
Me, I just like stirring it. I like silly entertainment.
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Being entertained by silliness is representative of a specific level of IQ. Just saying....that being said, I can understand now why counseling against it would cause an issue for ya! ;) :neener:
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I'll get you after apple juice and cookies...
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Wmaker,
You're silly for dealing with this openly. Vet, you're silly for even bringing it up. This thread is silly....if Wmaker wants to fly easy mode all the time it's his money. If Vet wants to get down on the deck with a OM'd Brewster in anything other than a Zeke or Brewster and expect a win everytime, it's his money....silly, silly, silly.
"to continue to defend one's self against silliness is to admit your doing something wrong...." - Changeup
Yes, I'm sure you wouldn't do anything if you were accused without a reason.
You're a child molester right? Well, of course you are not but how would it sound if one would accuse you of being one publically? You wouldn't clear your name publicly?
Obviously we are talking something really laughable here compared to the above...a silly video game but the basic principal is the same. I've been a member of this board for a long time and no, I generally don't like to get wrongly accused as most people don't, not in real life nor here. It wasn't me who started spreading lies publicly. No matter how silly or meaningless the "accusation" is, I'm gonna tell my side of the story just because of that basic principle.
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I'll get you after apple juice and cookies...
You do that sir and rest assured I will be throbbing with anticipation!!! Enjoy the cookies
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And now proof has been forth coming
The above should have of course read: And no proof has been forth coming.
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Yes, I'm sure you wouldn't do anything if you were accused without a reason.
You're a child molester right? Well, of course you are not but how would it sound if one would accuse you of being one publically? You wouldn't clear your name publicly?
Obviously we are talking something really laughable here compared to the above...a silly video game but the basic principal is the same. I've been a member of this board for a long time and no, I generally don't like to get wrongly accused as most people don't, not in real life nor here. It wasn't me who started spreading lies publicly. No matter how silly or meaningless the "accusation" is, I'm gonna tell my side of the story just because of that basic principle.
My point sir, which you missed because you were defending your defense, is that no one that knows you cares at all. I don't know you and I don't care...however, Shakespeare was right, " the lady doth protest too much"
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My point sir, which you missed because you were defending your defense, is that no one that knows you cares at all. I don't know you and I don't care...however, Shakespeare was right, " the lady doth protest too much"
I'd echo this, in all seriousness. Changeup's counsel is solid here - and he's a good sort even if he taunts a bit (part of the entertainment). Maker, you don't impress me as the type to live carelessly or to whine. I've seen too much of your fastidious attention to detail to think you're the type. Even if you had, well, what did the bard say about small transgressions and how we treat them? It just isn't blood feud material.
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what did the bard say about small transgressions and how we treat them? It just isn't blood feud material.
You'd think that wouldn't you? But that's not how this world works. Pretty apparent from this thread. World has good guys like you but their voices are usually overshadowed by class A morons.
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You'd think that wouldn't you? But that's not how this world works. Pretty apparent from this thread. World has good guys like you but their voices are usually overshadowed by class A morons.
Wmaker,
The class A morons are not hard to spot....the good folks leave them to their own devices which usually ends in their own demise. Murphy's Law
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Wmaker,
You're silly for dealing with this openly. Vet, you're silly for even bringing it up. This thread is silly....if Wmaker wants to fly easy mode all the time it's his money. If Vet wants to get down on the deck with a OM'd Brewster in anything other than a Zeke or Brewster and expect a win everytime, it's his money....silly, silly, silly.
"to continue to defend one's self against silliness is to admit your doing something wrong...." - Changeup
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g256/BloodyBandage/BigSillyGoose.jpg)
:rolleyes: for Wmaker
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:rofl :rofl
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Wmaker,
The class A morons are not hard to spot....the good folks leave them to their own devices which usually ends in their own demise. Murphy's Law
Case in point: I was tickled by this little story: http://www.wyff4.com/r/28592862/detail.html Though I was a bit perturbed at the thought of those 3000 that lost power. Still, definitely Darwin award material...
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Changeup,
go take your rational logic & reason out of this thread, this thread is all about cartoon egos, an angry fin, and some people's selective memory.
This is thread is the battle between the retirement home & the mental hospital...
Grizz HOs.
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Grizz HOs.
Yes but he does it with style and pinache.
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They are stuck on the other team for 12 hours :P
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wow this got aloot mroe porst then i though it would haven been on to check it ina while
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Wow, this got a lot more posts than I though it would. I haven't been on to check it in a while.
Translation :D
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Good you wrote it with quotation marks. As I said before, I at first looked one year back, then half a year more. Didn't seem like there was much point to look any further.
Priceless, that is all I can say.
quote
Priceless Indeed Wmaker...only confirms what I had been saying. Yet listening to Wmaker blanket saying. I had "Never" shot him down and that I was a lie through and through. Someone needs to inform you that the world isn't flat and that stats go back more than a yr and a half. :salute
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So who got caught in a "lie" here?
just wondering. :noid
He is back peadaling now that he got caught in a lie. Was waiting for him to bury himself and he did. After he called me a liar for a week....
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Ahem, it's a tad funny you come up with this now that somebody dug the stats out for you. :D LOL, you should so honest. :rofl
Burden of proof is with the accuser. And now proof has been forth coming
Considering in what light your name comes up on Ch200 on daily bases, I think you have zero room to talk.
Ahem...indeed. "You" hung yourself on this one just as I knew you would. This thread being about Honor, and you calling a person a liar, over and over when you know its not true. And I didn't just come up with this now...lol. I knew just as I did from the beginning that I had shot you down.
Yes my name is on 200ch on a daily basis because I actually talk to people and make good friends...part of the game you should try it. Maybe then you wouldn't be so upset when you get killed. And honestly that was the root of the problem, and that's why I remembered your comment after I shot you down in such a light. But I suppose your going tell me I'm lying about that next now too. :headscratch:
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Wmaker,
You're silly for dealing with this openly. Vet, you're silly for even bringing it up. This thread is silly....if Wmaker wants to fly easy mode all the time it's his money. If Vet wants to get down on the deck with a OM'd Brewster in anything other than a Zeke or Brewster and expect a win everytime, it's his money....silly, silly, silly.
"to continue to defend one's self against silliness is to admit your doing something wrong...." - Changeup
No I was just trying to get him to be honest and not lie thats all I was trying to accomplish. This being a thread about Honor.. I tend to take it personally. :salute
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Yes, I'm sure you wouldn't do anything if you were accused without a reason.
I've been a member of this board for a long time and no, I generally don't like to get wrongly accused as most people don't, not in real life nor here. It wasn't me who started spreading lies publicly. No matter how silly or meaningless the "accusation" is, I'm gonna tell my side of the story just because of that basic principle.
It matters not if you have been on a board for 20 or 30yrs. A fact can be backed up with proof just as it was. Now that you have called me a liar.
You my friend have been proven to be the stated "Liar" just as I knew you would due to the facts that people looked up.
The truth has no aqenda.
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It matters not if you have been on a board for 20 or 30yrs. A fact can be backed up with proof just as it was. Now that you have called me a liar.
You my friend have been proven to be the stated "Liar" just as I knew you would due to the facts that people looked up.
The truth has no aqenda.
I haven't had a reason to say anything to you nor have I. You havent proved anything you've accused me of.
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I haven't had a reason to say anything to you nor have I. You haven't proved anything you've accused me of.
I don't have to "Prove" anyting. You called ME a "liar" when I stated that I had shot you down in your Brewster. Stated it had never ever happened and that I must be a liar...proclaimed that to the whole board. Then when someone pulls the stats....proves you wrong...... and I haven't proved anyting....give me a break.
This is Exactly why I decided to comment on your post in the first place this being a thread about Honor and you were making derogatory comments about the lack of Honor in others. Speaks volumes for itself.
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I don't have to "Prove" anyting.
If you accuse me of something then you need proof that I have done so.
You called ME a "liar" when I stated that I had shot you down in your Brewster.
No, I called you a liar based on your claim that I had PM'ed you. As for looking stats back for *only* 1,5 years...my bad I guess.
This is Exactly why I decided to comment on your post in the first place this being a thread about Honor and you were making derogatory comments about the lack of Honor in others. Speaks volumes for itself.
You missed my point. My point was that basically everyone who calls for honor and defines this "honor" somehow has at some point of their AH career broken their own rules or "code of honor" or whatever. Thus, the louder they call for this "honor" the bigger hypocrites they are.
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If you accuse me of something then you need proof that I have do so.
No, I called you a liar based on your claim that I had PM'ed you. As for looking stats back for *only* 1,5 years...my bad I guess.
You missed my point. My point was that basically everyone who calls for honor and defines this "honor" somehow has at some point of their AH career broke their own rules or "code of honor" or whatever. Thus, the louder they call for this "honor" the bigger hypocrites they are.
I know you will never admit it but you did make a nasty comment after I shot you down...I dont remember if it was Pm, or 200ch. But you did. And You DID call me a lair based on the fact that I had shot you down....need only look back in thread at your posts to see that.
The Irony in this and the reason it bothered me is the fact that that in reading your posts on a thread about "Honor" and you hammering people for thier lack of it. It was then that I remembered your comment when I had shot you down. It was then that I was compelled to post. After that you called me a "Liar"
I am by no means perfect in this journey of life I am living but I am also no hypocrite simply because I try to embrace such things like Honor. :salute
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Gentlemen I really think this discussion is not progressing, you are both entrenched in your positions. Either shake hands & walk away or otherwise just walk away :salute
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I believe everyone comes around eventually if you play long enough. Noobs will always ho, patience will earn you a couple picks. Sooner or later I think most want to fly "honorably"..then they die!! :banana:
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I believe everyone comes around eventually if you play long enough. Noobs will always ho, patience will earn you a couple picks. Sooner or later I think most want to fly "honorably"..then they die!! :banana:
and after a few deaths with no kills they resort to the HO again...and the cycle repeats itself.
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my idea of honor is letting a badly beaten or smoking, pw'd pilot try to rtb. many times i escort him home if theres no one around( IE a jeager escort). of course that means ive run out of ammo and its the least i could do. by the way, i don't tell him that heheheh.
i rarely HO, i prefer to get on someones six to kill them. anything less is pure gameyness, but thats just my opinion. i wont vulch cause its cheap and i dont care about my score. i dont jump into a fight unless i ask first or im called by my teammate.
i only salute a good fight. if you HO me and salute me, don't expect the same in return.
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my idea of honor is letting a badly beaten or smoking, pw'd pilot try to rtb. many times i escort him home if theres no one around( IE a jeager escort). of course that means ive run out of ammo and its the least i could do. by the way, i don't tell him that heheheh.
If they put up a good fight this is doable.
i only salute a good fight. if you HO me and salute me, don't expect the same in return.
Agreed
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if you HO me and salute me, don't expect the same in return.
You're kidding me, people do that? :lol
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Wmaker and Vet have to be sleeping together...the He lied, He lied routine is a rouse..
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Wmaker and Vet have to be sleeping together...the He lied, He lied routine is a rouse..
Hey now.....lol. The stats were looked up and proved Wmaker did in fact lie. Before that he spent a considerable amout of time calling me a liar for something we both knew all along. With too much pride to admit the kill and his actions afterwards it was easier to label me as a liar. But the truth always comes out...eventually :aok
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I'll gladly give anyone an "honorable flight" PM me and we could duke it out all day if ya want to :salute
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Hey now.....lol. The stats were looked up and proved Wmaker did in fact lie. Before that he spent a considerable amout of time calling me a liar for something we both knew all along. With too much pride to admit the kill and his actions afterwards it was easier to label me as a liar. But the truth always comes out...eventually :aok
I see you are too darn dim to let it lie. I have no problem admitting someone has killed me. Everybody can kill everybody in the MA, it happens. I die plenty. The point was that you started accusing me of a personal attack directed at you which haven't proven to this day. And for the tenth time, I tought giving a change of 1,5 years to surface was enough, my bad. And yes you lied, I have no reason to say a thing to a guy who kills me in the MA.
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I normally don't jump into 2-3 vs 1 (although it has happened) and I very rarely attacking people trying to land or obviously damaged planes whom are no threat (oil leak or missing half wing).
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Hey now.....lol. The stats were looked up and proved Wmaker did in fact lie. Before that he spent a considerable amout of time calling me a liar for something we both knew all along. With too much pride to admit the kill and his actions afterwards it was easier to label me as a liar. But the truth always comes out...eventually :aok
So you DO admit you're attracted to Wmaker?...I mean we can tell he is attracted to you. Rouse I say, lmao!! :rofl :aok I can stop this right now.
Wmaker...Vet, if you both keep arguing like this, we will have no choice but believe you both are in a relationship with each other. This is the only explanation for this silliness.
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So you DO admit you're attracted to Wmaker?...I mean we can tell he is attracted to you. Rouse I say, lmao!! :rofl :aok I can stop this right now.
Wmaker...Vet, if you both keep arguing like this, we will have no choice but believe you both are in a relationship with each other. This is the only explanation for this silliness.
Negative......lol. My wife does enough arguing as it is to last a lifetime. :rofl
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Negative......lol. My wife does enough arguing as it is to last a lifetime. :rofl
hehehe...(mine too)
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Someone is very interested in hounour past couple days.
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Thanks for reviving this very old thread :bhead :bhead
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Thanks for reviving this very old thread :bhead :bhead
It pertains to a topic that was brought up on 200 yesterday, so it's relevant and no sense in makeing a new topic but thanks for being that guy. :aok
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I'd rather be inner than honor.
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Is Honor or Honour more correct?
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Does it matter in a thread that starts with "wat"?
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I still want BadMoon to man up and tell me what country he is from irl.
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I'd rather be inner than honor.
Not being able to do both means you're retarded, lol
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I'm writing this because basically I think it's a funny story but also as a
thought about gang, ho, etc 100 vs 1 and other 'accidents'.
I was fighting vs 5 cons of the same squadron low into a valley many weeks ago.
I heared a voice ...
voice: "hey Lulù ck 6"
I thought: "ck 6?? They are all around my plane. Why not help directly?"
voice: " Sorry I can't fly into the valley ..."
I thought: "My luky day ..."
one down, second too, third, four, five - but i was very slow.
voice: "be carefull 262 high"
Well, You know, if your are so low and slow that you can get flowers on the ground,
which importance can have an high 262?"
So I said to my self: "It's over"
I watched on my six and I saw a p51 400 yrds on my six. End of the games.
I bailed and look at the friendly voice flying in the sky thinking "a 262 ... lol"
That's was very funny.
So let have fun in AH
:salute
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Is Honor or Honour more correct?
:old: Honour
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Not being able to do both means you're retarded, lol
or with a spinner..
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:old: Honour
as in: on our?
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"Honour" is only something *you* can uphold, relying on others for it means your just acting and have fallen fron genuineity.
There are plenty of other people out there who hoped for it, but have abandoned that hope out of sheer communal pressure. So if you hold on to it; at least when you meet someone like that, you will probably bring it out in them.
Peace out.
:airplane:
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if i see 2 on 1 i don't jump in.. if i see 1 on 1 i ask first.depend on the situation.
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wat ever happended to pilots with honor?
They got tired of you not having any and started flying like you.
^This.
And I'd like to add that people usually forget very soon the killer when they are killed in a non-honourable way...however....it's harder to forget honourable pilots....for exemple, when I was getting back home in my Hog and Hoagi run into me in hs Tempest.....he managed to place his nose at 200 yrds off my tail..... "Tempest, I'm the rook hog, no ammo here....."
He had just to pull the trigger for the easiest kill. He rolled, pulled nose up and let me get home....It was 5 months ago...ll never forget this name.....Hoagi.
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^This.
And I'd like to add that people usually forget very soon the killer when they are killed in a non-honourable way...however....it's harder to forget honourable pilots....for exemple, when I was getting back home in my Hog and Hoagi run into me in hs Tempest.....he managed to place his nose at 200 yrds off my tail..... "Tempest, I'm the rook hog, no ammo here....."
He had just to pull the trigger for the easiest kill. He rolled, pulled nose up and let me get home....It was 5 months ago...ll never forget this name.....Hoagi.
Hoagi did something good besides running. :banana: :salute :rock
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((Midway, we are suppossed to be talking here about honour, not flying style I guess.....))
In the MA sometimes I've seen 1 vs 1 fites and I've stayed out....in the meanwhile, always, I repeat, always, another enemy has entered in the scenario, and without doubting, has broken the 1 vs 1 and killed my friend. Then I stay up there thinking If I did it right staying out...... :frown:
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For me are honourable behaviours not killing a half winged plane trying to rtb (if he just showed up already like that.......), killing planes that are about to land, not shooting if the plane calls out "winchester"....etc
as you can see, for me, nothing to do with flying style.
(S)
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Hoagi did something good besides running. :banana: :salute :rock
Midway not honorable this is discraceful personal attack...
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Midway... HAHA Busted! :lol
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it is a sliding scale for sure.
I have a code I stick to with exceptions in certain situations - like anyone does.
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Midway not honorable this is discraceful personal attack...
Hoagi good at running and good decision to listen to 200 requesting clearance to land. :angel:
:headscratch: How is that dishonourable (unless you're biased against running or doing what enemy requested), I ask you?
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You are also good at ho'ing how is that dishonorable?
Answer this and you will answer your own question
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You are also good at ho'ing how is that dishonorable?
Good HOing is honourable. :aok Bad HOing (losing) not so much.
I enjoy someone HOing me well, because most people that try to HO me I can shoot down after their failed attempt. There is honour in learning HO avoidance and therefore there is honour in someone teaching me to improve said avoidance with a really good HO. :aok
:old: Honour may be in the eye of the beholder.
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Is that why you ho? To try to teach avoidence?
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Good HOing is honourable. :aok Bad HOing (losing) not so much.
I enjoy someone HOing me well, because most people that try to HO me I can shoot down after their failed attempt. There is honour in learning HO avoidance and therefore there is honour in someone teaching me to improve said avoidance with a really good HO. :aok
:old: Honour may be in the eye of the beholder.
no Honor is not in the "eye of the beholder"
no matter what anyone says....
I will quote a movie for it is the best description I have ever heard of what Honor is.
"Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong;"
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Is that why you ho? To try to teach avoidence?
That was certainly a big part of it. To teach it so I can learn it myself... by watching what others do... :headscratch: which I now have learned to a signficant extent... so Midway no longer HOs... :aok task accomplished.... knowledge gained. :D
Suspect 95% of the time, you try to HO me, you will be shot down shortly afterwards. :)
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no Honor is not in the "eye of the beholder"
no matter what anyone says....
I will quote a movie for it is the best description I have ever heard of what Honor is.
Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong;
There way be another word for this part, but I won't go there because I'm going to be nice. :)
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I will quote a movie for it is the best description I have ever heard of what Honor is.
"Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong;"
That's Kingdom of Heaven isn't it? I liked that movie.
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Midway talking about honor is like Madonna talking about virginity.
They can, just noone will belive them.
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That's Kingdom of Heaven isn't it? I liked that movie.
one of my favorites :aok
true story, obviously embellished somewhat, if I were to believe the DVD that came with the movie it said it was extremely close to reality.
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one of my favorites :aok
true story, obviously embellished somewhat, if I were to believe the DVD that came with the movie it said it was extremely close to reality.
Ya, that's a very interesting period of history. :aok
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Ya, that's a very interesting period of history. :aok
totally..
Pope tells them go kill the unbelievers and they will have a guaranteed spot in Heaven.... :rolleyes:
funny how all these people through out history call on the Bible for reasons of murder...yet Yeshua(jesus's real name) was all about forgiveness....
even crazier....a line in the bible Yahaveh speaking "They will kill you thinking they are doing my will..."
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I was told several times in the deep tank canyons in MA last night that I fought with honor, or was in honour..? :confused: :rolleyes: :uhoh :angel:
It sure was some intense and fun fights! Honor or not.. :rock :aok :salute
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honour
it was definitely honour :aok
:old:
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I was told several times in the deep tank canyons in MA last night that I fought with honor, or was in honour..? :confused: :rolleyes: :uhoh :angel:
It sure was some intense and fun fights! Honor or not.. :rock :aok :salute
:old: Very honourable indeed.
:salute :rock
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well this game is about being a idiot nowdays and we MUST ALWAYS find a way to insult one another. thats what i think is wrong with this community. why yall making with them negative waves?
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http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/honor
honor
[on-er] Example Sentences Origin
hon·or
[on-er] Show IPA
noun
1.
honesty, fairness, or integrity in one's beliefs and actions: a man of honor.
2.
a source of credit or distinction: to be an honor to one's family.
3.
high respect, as for worth, merit, or rank: to be held in honor.
4.
such respect manifested: a memorial in honor of the dead.
5.
high public esteem; fame; glory: He has earned his position of honor.
EXPAND
verb (used with object)
13.
to hold in honor or high respect; revere: to honor one's parents.
14.
to treat with honor.
15.
to confer honor or distinction upon: The university honored him with its leadership award.
16.
to worship (the Supreme Being).
17.
to show a courteous regard for: to honor an invitation.
sounds spot on to me :aok
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This is a flight simulator, not 'Knights of the Round Table.' Head-on attacks are, quite frankly, modeled ... and allowed. As is vulching, boom and zooming and flying a Spitfire ... and ... ahem ... shooting at another player who is, otherwise, very much engaged with others. 'Honor' is an artificial standard some players attempt to shame others with when, in fact, they are frustrated due to the perception that they are being treated unfairly. The perception is false. 'Honor' is a whine. 'Integrity', otoh, is how one decides to behave (on a consistant basis) and it is independent of how others do. To point at others for their lack of 'honor' is not a display of integrity. The decision to jump in to steal a kill from five other players piling up on a lone opponent ... or not ... is a personal one - and can be claimed integrity or not (in this game of pretend pilots). The decision to nail one's self to a cross and bemoan the community's 'sudden' lack of 'honor' is merely self-persecution (and, as said before, frustration) on display. Honestly, I'm embarrassed more for the protester than the practicioner.
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honour
it was definitely honour :aok
:old:
nah American's spell it as Honor and since we beat ya twice, I think you should use "are" spellilling. Victor's write the history books why not right the spellin books?
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it's called the English language :aok Therefore the way it is spoken and written by English people is evidently the correct way ;)
(I do actually understand the differences between American English and regular/Oxford English, and wish to make it clear that I am just joking, before this comment spawns a stupid argument and 'pesonal attacks' :angel: )
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Looking for honor in a video game is like looking for love in a brothel.
ack-ack
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it's called the English language :aok Therefore the way it is spoken and written by English people is evidently the correct way ;)
(I do actually understand the differences between American English and regular/Oxford English, and wish to make it clear that I am just joking, before this comment spawns a stupid argument and 'pesonal attacks' :angel: )
Thats an old way of thinking You speak the Queen's English while hait in the states we speak the President's American.
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Thats an old way of thinking You speak the Queen's English while hait in the states we speak the President's American.
I honestly don't know what language most Americans on this BBS think they're speaking, but it's no form of English I've encountered in my 10 years working in publishing :neener:
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He speaks in red-neckerson
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where has pilot who when it 2v1 3v1 will stay outa fight or wont ho ya or when ur out of ammo and runnin on fumes will let ya go land. i dont claim to be a very good pilot but when ur facing 3 against 1 and they all ho watever happend to wanting the thrill of a greta dogfight rather then just killen someoen who really mean no harm
This is a war game. A simulation of the air war. The idea is to kill the other side. Five against one will accomplish that quite nicely. You're looking for a jousting simulation. but maybe train simulator from Microsoft would work. Not sure.
infidelz.
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Honor is not something you can put away....
"because your playing a game" Chess is a game...... you play Honorable when you play chess don't you?
if you can put away Honor just because this is a game on the internet,Honor is not something you posses.
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The hypocrisy in this thread is very thick. I'm willing to bet that 100% of those that claim to play with honor very rarely do so in deed and only play lip service.
ack-ack
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This is a war game. A simulation of the air war. The idea is to kill the other side. Five against one will accomplish that quite nicely. You're looking for a jousting simulation. but maybe train simulator from Microsoft would work. Not sure.
infidelz.
Maybe honor is the wrong word. Possibly 'sportsmanship' would suffice. There is no 'war'. It is a 'game'.
That being said, you can only control how you play. Expecting it of someone else, is probably asking too much in the AH world. It does make me appreciate it when I see it though.
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I might add that, honour; despite all its good intents and hopes does actually quite the opposite of its purposes.
Heres a little story:
"In the beginning, there was fun! Then arose some honourable few who took themselves seriously: These persons were of an exceptional sort. They looked at everything in a very prim and timely manner.
These few were much looked up to by those around them, with multitudes wanting to be them. Many who aspired, never could achieve it and became bitter and full of hatred and jealousy.
This formed the complete opposite of the honour they had so originally sought. This new form infested their minds and they made secret oaths in dark corners that they would destroy these usurpers wherever they appeared, however the means.
Thus began the dweeb wars. It was a long and hard battle, both sides exchanged countless blows from isolated valleys, to far-flung hills to creeping lines of bomber formations. Slowly and surely; time passed, their voices dimmed, their ideas diminished they were banished to wander the world, endlessly reminiscing of grander times.
If you are lucky and the wind is blowing Westward over the white-tipped coasts, they say that you can see the remnants of these great battles blowing inland, white lines, high above..."
Whats the moral of this story?
You draw a line, you create two sides.
Once the world has been split, it can never be re-united again, unless those who put titles upon themselves abandon such things and learn to "be" instead of "trying to be". Then the game and the community can start growing again like it was when it first started. Until then, all this talk is pointless, moot and most players will be a product of something in between "honourable" and "dweebish"; some unrecognisable and confusing shade of grey.
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Maybe honor is the wrong word. Possibly 'sportsmanship' would suffice. There is no 'war'. It is a 'game'.
That being said, you can only control how you play. Expecting it of someone else, is probably asking too much in the AH world. It does make me appreciate it when I see it though.
It's a game but it ain't a 'sport.' Yes, I am in charge of me and everyone else is in charge of, well, meh. If I was inclined to 'doff my hat' (which I don't, usually - I'm too busy playing the game during the precious few hours I get to), I'd do so to both 'gentlemen sportsmen' and 'unbridled killers' (face-shooters and vultchers, et al). Why? Because I actually do know how to avoid what most complain the loudest about - and - I may be inclined to play the game less gentlemanly when I feel like being less gentle (especially if it brings sack-cloth, ashes and wailing to those who apparently need to go that far). I just wish I could avoid the loud complaining as easily. Thank Cod I can at least voice squelch the squeakers on my own 'team.' ;)
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I might add that, honour; despite all its good intents and hopes does actually quite the opposite of its purposes.
Heres a little story:
"In the beginning, there was fun! Then arose some honourable few who took themselves seriously: These persons were of an exceptional sort. They looked at everything in a very prim and timely manner.
These few were much looked up to by those around them, with multitudes wanting to be them. Many who aspired, never could achieve it and became bitter and full of hatred and jealousy.
This formed the complete opposite of the honour they had so originally sought. This new form infested their minds and they made secret oaths in dark corners that they would destroy these usurpers wherever they appeared, however the means.
Thus began the dweeb wars. It was a long and hard battle, both sides exchanged countless blows from isolated valleys, to far-flung hills to creeping lines of bomber formations. Slowly and surely; time passed, their voices dimmed, their ideas diminished they were banished to wander the world, endlessly reminiscing of grander times.
If you are lucky and the wind is blowing Westward over the white-tipped coasts, they say that you can see the remnants of these great battles blowing inland, white lines, high above..."
Whats the moral of this story?
You draw a line, you create two sides.
Once the world has been split, it can never be re-united again, unless those who put titles upon themselves abandon such things and learn to "be" instead of "trying to be". Then the game and the community can start growing again like it was when it first started. Until then, all this talk is pointless, moot and most players will be a product of something in between "honourable" and "dweebish"; some unrecognisable and confusing shade of grey.
Really great story....you have too much time on your hands.
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lolwut?
Everyone's a critic :P
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Maybe honor is the wrong word. Possibly 'sportsmanship' would suffice. There is no 'war'. It is a 'game'.
That being said, you can only control how you play. Expecting it of someone else, is probably asking too much in the AH world. It does make me appreciate it when I see it though.
yeppers that about covers it. :aok
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The hypocrisy in this thread is very thick. I'm willing to bet that 100% of those that claim to play with honor very rarely do so in deed and only play lip service.
ack-ack
Ill take you up on that bet :aok
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Ill take you up on that bet :aok
Have you ever ganged another player when they were fighting another?
ack-ack
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I've ganged AkAk while he was fighting others :D
Hey, I got to get him dead somehow :lol :bolt:
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Have you ever ganged another player when they were fighting another?
ack-ack
:old: Honour is not black and white with yes or no answers to general questions.
Have you ever been in a 1 on 1 fight, had lots of victories, just wanted to get to base, almost out of ammo and wished someone would take out (or gang as you call it) that pesky Spitfire about to pwn you?
There are scenarios where it makes sense and others not.
In some cases it is honourable to lie. Can you think of one? Think of the little old lady running from a thug, quickly hiding in a building and said thug asks you "where did she go?". You going to tell him the right building or you going to lie?
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In some cases it is honourable to lie. Can you think of one? Think of the little old lady running from a thug, quickly hiding in a building and said thug asks you "where did she go?". You going to tell him the right building or you going to lie?
While I agree with you, in spirit, this has to be one of the worst 'practical examples' I've ever read. It comes off rather 'Monty Pythonish' from the image of a thug chasing down an old lady that manages to elude him and hide to the thug taking the time to ask me where the old lady is hiding. I'd like to think you can do better. I expect a decent edit when I return to the thread. :D
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While I agree with you, in spirit, this has to be one of the worst 'practical examples' I've ever read. It comes off rather 'Monty Pythonish' from the image of a thug chasing down an old lady that manages to elude him and hide to the thug taking the time to ask me where the old lady is hiding. I'd like to think you can do better. I expect a decent edit when I return to the thread. :D
:headscratch:
Said thug tripped and fell hurting his knee several yards back as the "young" lady ran around the corner where you where standing. She could have gone in the doors of either buildings on each side of the alley. She chose the 2nd building on the left side of said alley. You gonna be honourable and tell the thug said lie now? :huh
Btw, he has a gun, you don't. :uhoh
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I got the crap kicked out of me for telling one of a group that they should go home after they insulted my bartender one night. He looked at me, and although I didnt know what he said it was one of those "looking for approval statements" So I said go home.
They followed me outside and proceeded to kick the crap out of me :uhoh
In AH I play the game however I like, when I like and using the tactics I like.
When it comes to "honor" I generally disregard that ingame as much as possible. Every tactic I use may cause someone to complain if I beat them, or cause them to brag if I do not.
Ingame, I understand decent sportsmanship. I've had a few requests to break off an attack from my opponent so he could land (essentially saying I won) I have requested this for myself as well.
"decency" would be how I describe it, not honor. I understand my opponents are gamer's similar to me.
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TBH midway, the most honourable thing would be to say "get lost" or something quite dismissive of that person, showing your real intent and feeling of the situation instead of hiding behind some words so that you dont get hurt. Thats what being honourable would be, not to hide behind anything, but to bear the full brunt of the situation and repecussions of your actions.
But honour is just a word used to assert one set of order over another, like tons of other words in the dictionary, why does trying to be something matter more to you then just being? Its the people who try to be something who ruin the casual and the fun and turn it into some sort of evolutionary playground for ideology. Evolution is not a creative process, its a focal process and goes against the very essence of fun; which is essentially creative and thats what this game is all about, no?
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Have you ever ganged another player when they were fighting another?
ack-ack
I pass up jumping in on 1vs1 every time I fly....the only time, I will jump in is if asked, and even then sometimes I wont jump in, if there are a lot of red....or if a vulcher tries to vulch me while rolling....I definitely will attack him.
many times I have let nme cons go home that have put up a fight and gives a good show of it.....
hell I even flew next to AFK plane's until they got back. (I don't always do that)
anybody who has flown against me regularly knows this...
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..... Evolution is not a creative process....
I think our creator might have something to say about that :headscratch:
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Look at it this way, being creative/fun is a bunch of musicians jamming together to their own individual grooves with no intent or purpose then just to do it. Evolution is someone saying "Hey, this will make us alot of money because it emotionally manipulates people into feeling something", its just a matter of focus really.
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[quote ]
Re: wat ever happended to pilots with honor
[/quote]
only ever existed in the real world wars........
here in la la land, it is about respect for the game, respect for your fellow player and being a good sport........... noone dies here for real ( playing the game that is )......
you can take the high road and be a respectable fellow gameplayer........... or take the low road and be the biggest arse of a griefer......
the old guard(and some up and coming new ones) will tell you / show you where you exactly fit in, in to the skem of all things game related!
it is on each individual's own shoulders to show and be them true selves.......
hehe..... Torquila........... nice callsign, dude!
cheers all
TC
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I pass up jumping in on 1vs1 every time I fly....the only time, I will jump in is if asked, and even then sometimes I wont jump in, if there are a lot of red....or if a vulcher tries to vulch me while rolling....I definitely will attack him.
many times I have let nme cons go home that have put up a fight and gives a good show of it.....
hell I even flew next to AFK plane's until they got back. (I don't always do that)
anybody who has flown against me regularly knows this...
Does the BS you sling ever splatter back on you? You've picked your share of bandits, you might try and justify it however you like but the fact is you've done it just like everyone else has.
ack-ack
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Does the BS you sling ever splatter back on you? You've picked your share of bandits, you might try and justify it however you like but the fact is you've done it just like everyone else has.
ack-ack
bouncing a big hoard of nme or even a furball, is not interrupting a 1vs1 :rolleyes:
have I ever ganged you? multi cons against just you?
...I remember not engaging you while other friendlies were attacking you, yet you attacking me with plenty of friends......I also remember you running away like a little girl as soon as you lost advantage... :aok
I am sure through out the years I may have picked here or there, but it is far far from a "normal" sortie for me.
just like Vulching...I can count the times I have vulched on one hand.
and yes I absolutely stay out of 1vs1's on a regular basis. :aok
edit.....
trying to find that film of the couple fights we had, that one day, when it was just you and me... twice you died...the first fight you lasted a turn maybe 2, the second you lasted a little longer...... and the one time you killed me you had at least 2 friends with you.... I came back and wanted to kill you again for that 3on1, yet you had two of my countrymen engaging you so I did not engage you......
of course you probably don't remember that, or remember it in your own delusional way.
but honestly why do I bother :headscratch:
like I said before, anytime :aok
you love throwing out the ol DA.....DA.... anytime you wanna go a round or two, you just squeek up..... I need the target practice.
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Haha, Thanks Teq :P (from one awsome callsign to another)
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TBH midway, the most honourable thing would be to say "get lost" or something quite dismissive of that person, showing your real intent and feeling of the situation instead of hiding behind some words so that you dont get hurt. Thats what being honourable would be, not to hide behind anything, but to bear the full brunt of the situation and repecussions of your actions.
But honour is just a word used to assert one set of order over another, like tons of other words in the dictionary, why does trying to be something matter more to you then just being? Its the people who try to be something who ruin the casual and the fun and turn it into some sort of evolutionary playground for ideology. Evolution is not a creative process, its a focal process and goes against the very essence of fun; which is essentially creative and thats what this game is all about, no?
It's not just about you being unhurt, it's about helping to protect the young lady by misdirecting said thug. :)
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.....I also remember you running away like a little girl as soon as you lost advantage... :aok
:rofl :lol :rofl :lol
:airplane: :cry :uhoh Akak :airplane: :devil ink :joystick:
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Your hearing but not listening Midway, might I blame your age for that? Its quite a common problem for young people.
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Your hearing but not listening Midway, might I blame your age for that? Its quite a common problem for young people.
:D
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:lol
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If you want to fly by a certain set of rules, the DA is open for that. Once in the MA, you know anything goes. It is a simulation of COMBAT. A sergeant major told me once that combat is a team sport. So if you are engaged with a 1v1 and someone else comes in, well thats not fair, that's combat.
Sometimes I ask someone, hey you ok with that plane down there? And if they don't answer, or they say hey give me a hand, I come in, often times at a disadvantage for myself. If they say no go away, I got this, I go on and hope that he doesn't screw up and allow the OPFOR plane to get away to do damage to my mission or my team.
When we are suppressing a base for a take, you bet I will vulch you. That is why I rarely up from one of those bases, and I understand I may get vulched when I do. I up elsewhere and come in on top to break up the vulch. That is part of defending the base.
In short, I know that in the MA anything goes. I expect it. I use mission planning and tactics to try to stay alive and get home. Staying true to my team, to my wingman, are honorable.
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If I see 10 vs 1 and i have nothing to do, then yes i jump in :D
:salute
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Sometimes I ask someone, hey you ok with that plane down there? And if they don't answer, or they say hey give me a hand, I come in, often times at a disadvantage for myself. If they say no go away, I got this, I go on and hope that he doesn't screw up and allow the OPFOR plane to get away to do damage to my mission or my team.
When we are suppressing a base for a take, you bet I will vulch you. That is why I rarely up from one of those bases, and I understand I may get vulched when I do. I up elsewhere and come in on top to break up the vulch. That is part of defending the base.
In short, I know that in the MA anything goes. I expect it. I use mission planning and tactics to try to stay alive and get home. Staying true to my team, to my wingman, are honorable.
^^^^^THISSSSSSSSSS
:)
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I'd also like to add (some already said by others here....)
- Honour is in the eye of the beholder
- it's hard to expect some honour in a mutil-player combat air game
- It's hard to expect some honour in the game if it is even sometimes hard to see some honour in the BBS
- Honour (whatever it means to you...) has nothing to do with style flying (turning, runing, vulching, ganging...)
- IMO, its not about how others play, it's just about how you do play and if you feel comfortable and happy with it, in the end.
- Some people focuse on flying with honour while they (IMO) show no honour at all in the CH200
- In the end, I also would like to recognize as a honourable attitude towards me all the pilots that have wasted lets say 5-10 k of altitude just to save my butt, even putting themselves in virtual danger.
Anycase, given even the fact that this is all about killing each other, I find the whole picture (I mean a quiet % of the population in the MA...respectful)
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I'd also like to add (some already said by others here....)
- Honour is in the eye of the beholder dont agree
- it's hard to expect some honour in a mutil-player combat air game agree
- It's hard to expect some honour in the game if it is even sometimes hard to see some honour in the BBS agree
- Honour (whatever it means to you...) has nothing to do with style flying (turning, runing, vulching, ganging...) dont agree vulching is not a "style" as TnB or BnZ
- IMO, its not about how others play, it's just about how you do play and if you feel comfortable and happy with it, in the end. absolutely agree
- Some people focuse on flying with honour while they (IMO) show no honour at all in the CH200 most who show no Honor in flying show no Honor on 200 or BBS
- In the end, I also would like to recognize as a honourable attitude towards me all the pilots that have wasted lets say 5-10 k of altitude just to save my butt, even putting themselves in virtual danger.
Anycase, given even the fact that this is all about killing each other, I find the whole picture (I mean a quiet % of the population in the MA...respectful) still thinking about this, I would agree for the most part
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Your grades were not high enough to get on the Honor Roll. Sorry... try again next year.
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you speaking out the side of your mouth again?
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you speaking out the side of your mouth again?
umm I always speak out the side of my mouth... I'm redneck :D
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umm I always speak out the side of my mouth... I'm redneck :D
:lol
touche'
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Ink, thanks for sharing your thoughts about my post.
:salute
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Ink, thanks for sharing your thoughts about my post.
:salute
:salute
back at ya
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I usually don't think much about how others fly around me, it's their $14.95. I am very used to getting hoed, for the most part I have learned how to avoid getting killed by their ho attempts by now. I am not saying that I have never hoed myself, I know I have. But that is not my style to put it that way.
I have also many times given my opponent an escort back after I have shot off half his wing or damaged him so much that the fight is over for his part, then I have my moments where I let him limp home. And that makes me feel alot better than if I line up behind him and blow him outta the sky when he tries to make it home.
But there was one night a few nights ago that I had to say to myself 'what the heck was that?!' We were defending this base from attacks from a nearby cv, and flew off to meet the lifters from this cv. I was in my Dhog twisting and turning with this spit, and was starting to get closer and closer to gun solution on him. Just as I was about to pull the trigger one of my team players zoomed by in lightning speed and killed the spit right infront of me.. Ok I thought, fair enough.. I probably took too long to kill him anyway, so I went after another. And managed to get 2-3 kills before all us remaining fighters went rtb. Halfway back to our base I looked at the map, and I saw one green dot remaining by the cv surrounded by red. So I turned back to give him a hand, as he probably got held up in a fight when the others rtb'd.. When I got closer I saw it was the same pilot that just snuck my spit, but I jumped into the fight as he was vs 3 all alone. I gave him a check6 and got the pack spread out so he could get some distance, and suddenly I was 1vs3.. After a while I started looking for help because it was limited how long I could stay alive out there in my hog on full flaps vs a couple spits and a F6F.. And where was the guy I just helped? Oh he was half way back to base allready.. :rolleyes: Offcourse I died right there.. :bhead
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I usually don't think much about how others fly around me, it's their $14.95. I am very used to getting hoed, for the most part I have learned how to avoid getting killed by their ho attempts by now. I am not saying that I have never hoed myself, I know I have. But that is not my style to put it that way.
I have also many times given my opponent an escort back after I have shot off half his wing or damaged him so much that the fight is over for his part, then I have my moments where I let him limp home. And that makes me feel alot better than if I line up behind him and blow him outta the sky when he tries to make it home.
But there was one night a few nights ago that I had to say to myself 'what the heck was that?!' We were defending this base from attacks from a nearby cv, and flew off to meet the lifters from this cv. I was in my Dhog twisting and turning with this spit, and was starting to get closer and closer to gun solution on him. Just as I was about to pull the trigger one of my team players zoomed by in lightning speed and killed the spit right infront of me.. Ok I thought, fair enough.. I probably took too long to kill him anyway, so I went after another. And managed to get 2-3 kills before all us remaining fighters went rtb. Halfway back to our base I looked at the map, and I saw one green dot remaining by the cv surrounded by red. So I turned back to give him a hand, as he probably got held up in a fight when the others rtb'd.. When I got closer I saw it was the same pilot that just snuck my spit, but I jumped into the fight as he was vs 3 all alone. I gave him a check6 and got the pack spread out so he could get some distance, and suddenly I was 1vs3.. After a while I started looking for help because it was limited how long I could stay alive out there in my hog on full flaps vs a couple spits and a F6F.. And where was the guy I just helped? Oh he was half way back to base allready.. :rolleyes: Offcourse I died right there.. :bhead
No good deed goes unpunished...I would have changed sides and kilt him. OH! You can't change sides but every 12 hours...nevermind.
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If I'm not expecting to die, one of my rules in a situation like you described SA173 is to clear him but keep the speed to get out. I only expect people to help me if they're squaddies. Everyone else I expect to save their own skin, and I always expect to die if I get low and slow helping them.
They don't have to outrun the bear, they just have to outrun you. ;)
Wiley.
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See rule #4
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Deleted for the quotation of another posters rule #4
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See rule #4
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See rule #4
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Re: wat ever happended to pilots with honor
« Reply #346 on: Today at 06:52:56 AM »
Quote
If you want to fly by a certain set of rules, the DA is open for that. Once in the MA, you know anything goes. It is a simulation of COMBAT. A sergeant major told me once that combat is a team sport. So if you are engaged with a 1v1 and someone else comes in, well thats not fair, that's combat.
Sometimes I ask someone, hey you ok with that plane down there? And if they don't answer, or they say hey give me a hand, I come in, often times at a disadvantage for myself. If they say no go away, I got this, I go on and hope that he doesn't screw up and allow the OPFOR plane to get away to do damage to my mission or my team.
When we are suppressing a base for a take, you bet I will vulch you. That is why I rarely up from one of those bases, and I understand I may get vulched when I do. I up elsewhere and come in on top to break up the vulch. That is part of defending the base.
In short, I know that in the MA anything goes. I expect it. I use mission planning and tactics to try to stay alive and get home. Staying true to my team, to my wingman, are honorable.
Report to moderator Logged
A couple days ago my squaddie zrex and i came across u and magoo ( i believe) u 2 in ponies us in 190A8s, a great fight ensued, we had one friendly join, then u had a friendly 262 show, i believe it lasted about 10-15min with us dodging your Bnz's with the 262 coming in as well, rex and i thought it was a fun engagement even tho we were shot down.
When i get ganged or picked or whatever, i know its my own fault and that is how the MA plays out.
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Hey that was you! AWESOME FIGHT sir! We had allot of fun and finally, I forget who it was last, I glanced down at my status and called out to Magoo, "Its time to GOOOOOOOOOOOOO!" lol. It was to close to your base and way to far from ours for my taste there at the last. I had been having a few days of a slump, doing stupid things with bad judgement such as augering after taking down a hanger :bhead so I wanted to get out while it was a high point, especially after such a tough fight.
:salute
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Hey I remember a few days ago Scotty, I was climbing out of a base in a P51D for a change. And got these 3 high alt cons coming in.. That was you in the high 190 if I remember correct? I got involved with one of your teammates for a dogfight, and you and the other guy stayed out of the fight. I know I did not put up much of a fight in that P51, I mean.. I was never any danger to any of you, but the fact that you actually stayed out and let me fight for my life in a 1vs1, that is HONOR man! :aok I will remember that for a long time.. :salute
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Last times I was in the DA the HO'ing, ganging, picking...ect was even worse then the mains. I guess if you go in with ONE other player. But even then I bet you get some knucklehead lifting off to pick you off in his P-51.
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And another thing I just wanted to say.. If you ever see me in a dogfight and ask me over vox if I am ok with that enemy, and I don't answer.. It is not because I am ignoring you, it is just the simple fact that I don't use a mic and in a dogfight I am not always able to type back any answer if I'm busy twisting and turning my plane.. :joystick: :D
But as long as you see me in a 1vs1 I am usually ok with it, even if I get killed I am still ok with it. :aok
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Last times I was in the DA the HO'ing, ganging, picking...ect was even worse then the mains. I guess if you go in with ONE other player. But even then I bet you get some knucklehead lifting off to pick you off in his P-51.
I agree Rich, I used to be a hardcore DA player myself a few years back.. Now I can't stand the place anymore.. :frown:
Was in there last night because my squaddies wanted me to join them, but after 3-4 sorties I just had to leave, that place is just not for me anymore for some reason.. :uhoh
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Here's my two cents on the subject. When I sit down and log into Aces High there is one player I have control over and that's myself. I hope for the best and expect the worst which is about all you can do when dealing with a large enough population of people, if anything Aces High is a great experiment in social dynamics. I guess what I'm saying is I can't worry too much about other players and things I have no control over, instead I try to focus on what I can control and that's how I interact with other players, and how I conduct myself, some nights are better than others.
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Well put Soulyss! :aok
+1
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Here's my two cents on the subject. When I sit down and log into Aces High there is one player I have control over and that's myself. I hope for the best and expect the worst which is about all you can do when dealing with a large enough population of people, if anything Aces High is a great experiment in social dynamics. I guess what I'm saying is I can't worry too much about other players and things I have no control over, instead I try to focus on what I can control and that's how I interact with other players, and how I conduct myself, some nights are better than others.
I think this may be the best way to look at things. Also in Juggler's tag line is a good quote about revenge in the hanger I just can't think of it at the moment.
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Yes very well said Soulyss :salute
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Soulyss idea of helping a squaddie that is on the deck with 6 cons on him......
OK Shuff he fired turn left now.... ok ok that piece was not important.. just an elevator your ok keep going......
I get a play by play of what parts I lose so I know exactly what I have to work with. He is very helpful in such cases and someone we cannot do without in the 80th.
We actually developed a weight chart for partial 38s that we use regularly.
:D
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OK Shuff he fired turn left now.... ok ok that piece was not important.. just an elevator your ok keep going......
:rofl
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has anyone thought that honor comes in many different shapes and sizes?... one person's idea of honor may not be anothers
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has anyone thought that honor comes in many different shapes and sizes?... one person's idea of honor may not be anothers
does not mean they are correct :aok
Honor is not something that can not be changed or manipulated to suit ones one idea's.
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does not mean they are correct :aok
On both sides... ;)
Honor is not something that can not be changed or manipulated to suit ones one idea's.
I get what you're saying in spite of the typo, but people claiming their opponents have 'no honor' because they got ganged in the MA is kind of like a receiver in football claiming his opponents have no honor because he got ganged after he caught the ball.
The MA is multi on multi, not 1v1, no matter how many times people wish for it to be otherwise.
The only thing you can count on from your opponent is doing anything he can do to beat you. Some people have things they won't do, but don't expect the other guy to be playing by your particular set of rules.
Wiley.
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On both sides... ;)
I get what you're saying in spite of the typo, but people claiming their opponents have 'no honor' because they got ganged in the MA is kind of like a receiver in football claiming his opponents have no honor because he got ganged after he caught the ball.
The MA is multi on multi, not 1v1, no matter how many times people wish for it to be otherwise.
The only thing you can count on from your opponent is doing anything he can do to beat you. Some people have things they won't do, but don't expect the other guy to be playing by your particular set of rules.
Wiley.
just because anything goes in the MA which I know that is the case....does not mean Honor does not exist, or should not.
trying to say Honor is in the "eye of the beholder" is like saying morality is what one decides it is.....
so if someone thinks its ok to rape a woman, in his eyes its a good Honorable thing to do.....so its OK???????????
hardly..... he is a scumbag that should have his head removed......
I know that's a huge jump, MA play to rape, but my point stands, Honor is not something that ANYONE can change.
Honor is basically dead in today's world.....this thread is proof of that, besides the fact all you have to do is open your eyes and look at the world at large and see.
Morality
Honor
Integrity
Truth
Love
no matter how hard you/people try to change the meanings behind these words they transcend us humans, they are unchangeable.
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I agree with Ink in a manner.
When you chose to divide something by giving it a name: In order to control and harness it, it has a very specific meaning at that instant.
Although the meaning can diminish over time due to loss of information and mis-interpretation through interference, it is still completely reliant on the ability to be measured. In fact, if it couldn't be mis-interpreted it would not of had a "true" form to exist with in the first place.
As well if it could not be seen as "levels of honour" ALA: military medals/etc, it wouldn't be concrete and thus never existed.
This is not a discussion of wether interpretations of honour are "right" or "wrong" its a manner of throwing away personal agendas and admitting to yourself where you truely stand. Do you try to be honourable, or do you not?
The worst thing in the world is someone who says they are non-violent but uses all other means to express said voilence instead, because in the end; it has the same effect.
Unfortunately when names and concepts are concerned, its all about absolutes. Thats why its best to avoid them (if you can).
Lets be honest then? :cool:
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just because anything goes in the MA which I know that is the case....does not mean Honor does not exist, or should not.
trying to say Honor is in the "eye of the beholder" is like saying morality is what one decides it is.....
so if someone thinks its ok to rape a woman, in his eyes its a good Honorable thing to do.....so its OK???????????
hardly..... he is a scumbag that should have his head removed......
I know that's a huge jump, MA play to rape, but my point stands, Honor is not something that ANYONE can change.
Honor is basically dead in today's world.....this thread is proof of that, besides the fact all you have to do is open your eyes and look at the world at large and see.
Morality
Honor
Integrity
Truth
Love
no matter how hard you/people try to change the meanings behind these words they transcend us humans, they are unchangeable.
:lol so completely and utterly wrong.... think about this more. Read the newspaper, check yourself, etc....
:old: Honour is alive and well and all around us if we open our eyes and look.
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trying to say Honor is in the "eye of the beholder" is like saying morality is what one decides it is.....
Except it's ultimately subjective. Based on what I've seen from you, your idea of an honorable fight is probably along the lines of you up your plane of choice, your opponent ups his plane of choice, and it's 1v1 to the death, no HO on first merge.
Why is that more correct than if my plane of choice happens to be a Hurri 1 and I don't believe it's honorable for my opponent to fly his LA7 because he's got such a clear equipment advantage?
Wiley.
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:lol so completely and utterly wrong.... think about this more. Read the newspaper, check yourself, etc....
:old: Honour is alive and well and all around us if we open our eyes and look.
:rofl :rofl :rofl...
ya ok......read the newspaper :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
ya fill your head with what they want you to read....there ya go :aok
Except it's ultimately subjective. Based on what I've seen from you, your idea of an honorable fight is probably along the lines of you up your plane of choice, your opponent ups his plane of choice, and it's 1v1 to the death, no HO on first merge.
Why is that more correct than if my plane of choice happens to be a Hurri 1 and I don't believe it's honorable for my opponent to fly his LA7 because he's got such a clear equipment advantage?
Wiley.
it is NOT subjective.....
what I am speaking about is way beyond this game.
now as far as what I feel is an Honorable fight ingame....no it certainly don't have to be 1vs1....do I go looking for 1vs1???? or do I attack the biggest red dar there is????
anyone who knows me knows I talk/preach about Honor...if you caught me in the MA vulching a field over and over would I be true to my word? would that be Honorable? hell no...if someone who does not care about that, and vulches do I really feel they are un-honorable???? not if they don't "preach" Honor......
I do realize this is a game and don't hold much stock in how someone else plays.....but hold much stock in How I play.
as far as your LA/hurri1
if you know he is in a LA7 take a Hurri2C instead :aok that would be one dead LA.
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:rofl :rofl :rofl...
ya ok......read the newspaper :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
ya fill your head with what they want you to read....there ya go :AoM
Firefighters rescuing people, dads going into a burning house to save their kids, strangers helping car accident victims, soldiers protecting our country, medics responding quickly as possible to a situation, mangers hiring vets, kids volunteering in the community, etc, etc, etc.
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Firefighters rescuing people, dads going into a burning house to save their kids, strangers helping car accident victims, soldiers protecting our country, medics responding quickly as possible to a situation, mangers hiring vets, kids volunteering in the community, etc, etc, etc.
and I could list a thousand things that show different :rolleyes:
I said its dead in the world, not necessarily people.
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Firefighters rescuing people, dads going into a burning house to save their kids, strangers helping car accident victims, soldiers protecting our country, medics responding quickly as possible to a situation, mangers hiring vets, kids volunteering in the community, etc, etc, etc.
I don't believe that those are examples of honor. Those things are noble.
Honor is, you just broke something in a shop. Nobody saw you. You could walk away from it with no ramifications. Instead, you pick up the pieces and take them to the cash register and offer to pay for the item you broke.
Honor is doing the right thing even when nobody else will ever know or doing the right thing when the other option would be easier and nobody else would ever know..
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and I could list a thousand things that show different :rolleyes:
I said its dead in the world, not necessarily people.
You can't ignore all the good honourable things going on and say honour is dead in the world. It is very much alive. :aok
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I don't believe that those are examples of honor. Those things are noble.
Honor is, you just broke something in a shop. Nobody saw you. You could walk away from it with no ramifications. Instead, you pick up the pieces and take them to the cash register and offer to pay for the item you broke.
Honor is doing the right thing even when nobody else will ever know or doing the right thing when the other option would be easier and nobody else would ever know..
Many people do the honourable thing in these situations. My point is Honour is not dead in the world today. :aok
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as far as your LA/hurri1
if you know he is in a LA7 take a Hurri2C instead :aok that would be one dead LA.
That's not the point. My plane of choice is the hurri 1. I don't want to fly a IIc. A case can be made it's not honorable of him to fly his LA7 against me.
If you're in your IIC and you see a Hurri 1 bandit, will you attack it? What if the bandit feels that's not honorable? Now you're the bad guy in his eyes.
Your arbitrary line isn't the same as everybody else's.
In the real world, we're on the same page. When it comes to something like a game where nothing is actually lost and anything goes, no matter how strict of a code you follow unless you're acting like some kind of Taoist monk/lawyer hybrid, somebody's going to feel you're acting with 'no honor' and treating them unfairly even if you're giving them every conceivable advantage.
Wiley.
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Except it's ultimately subjective. Based on what I've seen from you, your idea of an honorable fight is probably along the lines of you up your plane of choice, your opponent ups his plane of choice, and it's 1v1 to the death, no HO on first merge.
Why is that more correct than if my plane of choice happens to be a Hurri 1 and I don't believe it's honorable for my opponent to fly his LA7 because he's got such a clear equipment advantage?
Wiley.
You might be able to call the first fight an "honorable" fight, but it has nothing to do with whether the people involved in the fight are honorable.
The honorable thing to do in the Hurri 1 fight verses the LA is to give your best fight using the best attributes of your plane. Winning or losing isn't that important, but giving it your best is. An honorable person would give his best even if out matched, which I'm sure INK would have done facing the LA.
Honor isn't something you assign to a fight, plane, or battle, its a personal thing assigned to people. Some people think a HO is a good shot, if it's there they take it, thinking you gave it to them they "earned" it.
Firefighters rescuing people, dads going into a burning house to save their kids, strangers helping car accident victims, soldiers protecting our country, medics responding quickly as possible to a situation, mangers hiring vets, kids volunteering in the community, etc, etc, etc.
People hitting dogs and driving away, people finding money on the floor at a store by the cash register just pocket it in stead of asking around. People parking in handicap spots, people who have handicap cards who don't need them for themselves, but are for other family members but park in the handicap spots anyway. Insurance companies and many lawyers. People killing mothers who help others with car problems ( see the case in Maine this week). Managers refusing to hire someone due to race, creed, color, or having a record. Kids bullying other kids, breaking windows and other vandalism because its "cool" or "fun" etc, etc, etc.
I can list far more people with little or no honor than you could that have good honor. The world is a much sadder place these days, ask someone from Pakistan.
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You might be able to call the first fight an "honorable" fight, but it has nothing to do with whether the people involved in the fight are honorable.
The honorable thing to do in the Hurri 1 fight verses the LA is to give your best fight using the best attributes of your plane. Winning or losing isn't that important, but giving it your best is. An honorable person would give his best even if out matched, which I'm sure INK would have done facing the LA.
I agree. There are those who wouldn't though.
I personally believe you're responsible for the choices you make in the game. If you're in a lower end plane, you don't get to whine about somebody in a better plane beating you. You chose to fly it, you live with the consequences. If you wind up surrounded by bandits and get ganged, my viewpoint is you put yourself in that situation. You flew into a cloud of bandits, or stayed too long after your buddies were killed, you live with the outcome. Nobody forced you to up into the ongoing vulch at your deacked airfield.
I don't vulch unless my side is actively trying to take the base and I'm trying to protect a friendly bomber/goon. I'm not particularly fond of vulching purely for score, but that's just me. Bomb and bail or porking a field and suiciding in the ack/augering are bad form as well to me. There are many people who don't see anything wrong with those tactics.
Honor isn't something you assign to a fight, plane, or battle, its a personal thing assigned to people. Some people think a HO is a good shot, if it's there they take it, thinking you gave it to them they "earned" it.
And there are a LOT more people who claim people have 'no honor' because they got HOed, even though both sides were maneuvering and they were only 'almost close to getting guns on'. It's a word that's used as a club by whiners in a most cases.
Wiley.
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That's not the point. My plane of choice is the hurri 1. I don't want to fly a IIc. A case can be made it's not honorable of him to fly his LA7 against me.
If you're in your IIC and you see a Hurri 1 bandit, will you attack it? What if the bandit feels that's not honorable? Now you're the bad guy in his eyes.
Your arbitrary line isn't the same as everybody else's.
In the real world, we're on the same page. When it comes to something like a game where nothing is actually lost and anything goes, no matter how strict of a code you follow unless you're acting like some kind of Taoist monk/lawyer hybrid, somebody's going to feel you're acting with 'no honor' and treating them unfairly even if you're giving them every conceivable advantage.
Wiley.
you said it....anything goes....that is the MA.....so yes he can fly whatever he wants, anything goes, years ago I would get so pissed if say I was already fighting a couple cons and someone else came in and picked......I figured out that anything goes in the MA, now it don't bother me at all, I can say the only thing that really bugs me is the guy you just easily got behind, for him to run away and come back when you are engaged, and vulchers. even then it does not bother me all that much, for I know that in the MA "anything goes"
I don't believe that those are examples of honor. Those things are noble.
Honor is, you just broke something in a shop. Nobody saw you. You could walk away from it with no ramifications. Instead, you pick up the pieces and take them to the cash register and offer to pay for the item you broke.
Honor is doing the right thing even when nobody else will ever know or doing the right thing when the other option would be easier and nobody else would ever know..
I would say Honor more importantly is standing up for your beliefs(if they are noble) even in the face of adversity...Honor is to Die for what you believe in, as long as your beliefs are noble, in other words if you are a rapist/murderer and the cops/anyone kills you for your deeds you did not die an Honorable death, you died a cur dogs death.
Honor is standing tall in your convictions, especially when you are ridiculed, or speaking the truth even if leads to your death.
midway has no clue what Honor is.
I have put my life on the line for pigeons.....believe it or not, I would have died for those silly birds.
long story short, some convicts were killing pigeons when I was locked up, I found out and freaked, I made them stop killing those birds, I stood before 5 guys and would have died..except they where not willing to die for it......
how many people do you know, would do what I did in that situation??????
dont get me wrong I am far from perfect...I have done wrong, sadly mostly against me wife, I know I acted unhonorable in that situation, and regret every moment of it.
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You might be able to call the first fight an "honorable" fight, but it has nothing to do with whether the people involved in the fight are honorable.
The honorable thing to do in the Hurri 1 fight verses the LA is to give your best fight using the best attributes of your plane. Winning or losing isn't that important, but giving it your best is. An honorable person would give his best even if out matched, which I'm sure INK would have done facing the LA.
Honor isn't something you assign to a fight, plane, or battle, its a personal thing assigned to people. Some people think a HO is a good shot, if it's there they take it, thinking you gave it to them they "earned" it.
People hitting dogs and driving away, people finding money on the floor at a store by the cash register just pocket it in stead of asking around. People parking in handicap spots, people who have handicap cards who don't need them for themselves, but are for other family members but park in the handicap spots anyway. Insurance companies and many lawyers. People killing mothers who help others with car problems ( see the case in Maine this week). Managers refusing to hire someone due to race, creed, color, or having a record. Kids bullying other kids, breaking windows and other vandalism because its "cool" or "fun" etc, etc, etc.
I can list far more people with little or no honor than you could that have good honor. The world is a much sadder place these days, ask someone from Pakistan.
spot on :aok
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no matter how hard you/people try to change the meanings behind these words they transcend us humans, they are unchangeable.
seeing as how we are the ones responsible for all of these i dont see the transcending that you do. especially if honor could have meant a totally different thing if humanity developed thinking bad=good and good=bad. but thats a discussion that can get very philosophical VERY fast... so im gonna stop it here
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seeing as how we are the ones responsible for all of these i dont see the transcending that you do. especially if honor could have meant a totally different thing if humanity developed thinking bad=good and good=bad. but thats a discussion that can get very philosophical VERY fast... so im gonna stop it here
we(humans) did not come up with those words/ideals......
like you said though, that can lead to a major convo that is not allowed.
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we(humans) did not come up with those words/ideals......
like you said though, that can lead to a major convo that is not allowed.
well iirc philosophy is allowed as long as its not political or religious :aok but i kid :lol
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If you're in your IIC and you see a Hurri 1 bandit, will you attack it?
If you do, you're making a big mistake.
- oldman (IIC is a pig) (but this metaphysical discussion on the AH BBS is pretty kewl)
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Holy necro-bump Batman!! ...this topic is from july 2011? ......why dredge this thing up?
Helm ...out
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I have my own personal honor code.
I won't HO you on the first pass if I'm not already engaged. If you come screaming into my face when I'm already in a fight, I'll let my .50s fly.
If there is more than one guy attacking you, I won't engage unless you try to attack me. I'll usually let 1 on 1s go unless my teammate asks for help. About the only time you'll find me in a gang is when I get "help" I didn't ask for.
I will NEVER kill you when your planes wheels are on concrete.
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I have my own personal honor code.
I won't HO you on the first pass if I'm not already engaged. If you come screaming into my face when I'm already in a fight, I'll let my .50s fly.
If there is more than one guy attacking you, I won't engage unless you try to attack me. I'll usually let 1 on 1s go unless my teammate asks for help. About the only time you'll find me in a gang is when I get "help" I didn't ask for.
I will NEVER kill you when your planes wheels are on concrete.
+1 as a witness to his flying, as both a victim and a teammate. One guy I'd fly with anytime.
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I have my own personal honor code.Me too
I won't HO you on the first pass if I'm not already engaged. If you come screaming into my face when I'm already in a fight, I'll let my .50s fly.I won't HO you as Midway, but it is an occasional possibility as Kojami.
If there is more than one guy attacking you, I won't engage unless you try to attack me. I'll usually let 1 on 1s go unless my teammate asks for help. About the only time you'll find me in a gang is when I get "help" I didn't ask for.If they're red they're dead. If 1 on 1 and con looks like he's gonna die, I won't engage.
I will NEVER kill you when your planes wheels are on concrete. I will. See previous rule. :devil
Mine. :D
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I would say Honor more importantly is standing up for your beliefs(if they are noble) even in the face of adversity...Honor is to Die for what you believe in, as long as your beliefs are noble,
Ok... I believe I understand what you're saying, and I agree. You're looking at 'honor' as being a part of your beliefs, but not completely connected to them. In other words, it's possible for 2 people to have differing beliefs in what's right and wrong (to a certain degree, as long as those beliefs are noble) but they both have the same amount of honor if they stand up for them with the same conviction.
That's something I can agree with. In a nutshell, you're basically saying honor is the opposite of hypocrisy if I'm reading you right.
Wiley.
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Holy necro-bump Batman!! ...this topic is from july 2011? ......why dredge this thing up?
Helm ...out
It was explained in the 3rd post after the bump.
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I have my own personal honor code.
I won't HO you on the first pass if I'm not already engaged. If you come screaming into my face when I'm already in a fight, I'll let my .50s fly.
If there is more than one guy attacking you, I won't engage unless you try to attack me. I'll usually let 1 on 1s go unless my teammate asks for help. About the only time you'll find me in a gang is when I get "help" I didn't ask for.
I will NEVER kill you when your planes wheels are on concrete.
+1bajillion......
Ok... I believe I understand what you're saying, and I agree. You're looking at 'honor' as being a part of your beliefs, but not completely connected to them. In other words, it's possible for 2 people to have differing beliefs in what's right and wrong (to a certain degree, as long as those beliefs are noble) but they both have the same amount of honor if they stand up for them with the same conviction.
That's something I can agree with. In a nutshell, you're basically saying honor is the opposite of hypocrisy if I'm reading you right.
Wiley.
never looked at it like that, but ya hypocrisy is not something a man of honor would do, to the point he would not associate with someone who practiced it....... or should I say, lived by it.
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Bailed out last night got shot in parachute. Dummy wasted his ammo. Guess he never ran out of it before fight was over. Have you? Run out of ammo. Last time I did just made two kills then had to run for my life. Then ran out of gas. What a night! Shoot a pilot in his parachute. Maybe that guy needs to feel the real thing. Not talking about coca cola either. Well, it is just a game. Think I,ll go to the air races at least there you will require skill not blood lust. I did not have the best childhood either but people tell me I turned out ok.
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Bailed out last night got shot in parachute. Dummy wasted his ammo. Guess he never ran out of it before fight was over. Have you? Run out of ammo. Last time I did just made two kills then had to run for my life. Then ran out of gas. What a night! Shoot a pilot in his parachute. Maybe that guy needs to feel the real thing. Not talking about coca cola either. Well, it is just a game. Think I,ll go to the air races at least there you will require skill not blood lust. I did not have the best childhood either but people tell me I turned out ok.
Why did you bail ?
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Well, it is just a game.
There you have it. A game.. So really there's no need to rant about a cartoon bullet in your cartoon carcus while floating under a cartoon parachute. If you're new to the game one thing you might not know yet is if you type .ef in the text buffer while in your parachute it will safely exit you to the tower. You can even type it in and wait to hit the enter key until somebody lines up to shoot you in your chute. Why not make have a little fun with the chute shooters. ;)
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I bailed because I like sky diving being an airborne ranger want to be and all that. Can I really .ef in combat? We save pilots not planes.
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Bailed out last night got shot in parachute. Dummy wasted his ammo.
Sigh, when will poepl learn? You aim for the meatbomb dangling under the chute, not the chute!!
At least until HT coads damage effects on silk, taking into account altitude, mass, air density, parasitic drag, and all kinds of other stuffz... :noid
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I bailed because I like sky diving being an airborne ranger want to be and all that. Can I really .ef in combat? We save pilots not planes.
Bailed out of my broken aeroplane last night over town next to airborne troopers... shot some with my handgun while they were floating down with me. :)
Did you know they float down at exactly the same speed as you float down? :headscratch:
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Bailed out last night got shot in parachute.
Damned rude :mad:
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Damned rude :mad:
I make a point of killing chutes.
Sorry brah.
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Damned rude :mad:
i rarely kill chutes but sometimes seeing the guy float to the ground the urge hits me :P
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Sorry brah.
:bhead
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:bhead
:lol :aok
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I got it! You chute shooters have never been able to shoot down a real airplane like being you know, unable to perform! Sorry duds.
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Unlike those who can only fantasize about shooting down a cartoon plane, but when the action starts to get hot and heavy, last less than 30 seconds before ejecting into silk?
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Unlike those who can only fantasize about shooting down a cartoon plane, but when the action starts to get hot and heavy, last less than 30 seconds before ejecting into silk?
:huh
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I got it! You chute shooters have never been able to shoot down a real airplane like being you know, unable to perform! Sorry duds.
I must first shoot the plane, before I can shoot the chute.
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No one's infallible in this sport.
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No one's infallible in this sport.
very true :aok
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Don't fly in the MA. There are bad people in there. They might curse at you on channel 200, call you a dweeb or whatnot. The only thing the MA has that other arenas do not? The misconception, that you can come to this forum, squeak about it, and really think it is going to change something.
Go to a different arena. But you may find bad people there, trying to shoot you you down and stuff like that.
Gentlemen, have fun. The war we are playing at was fought a long time ago. "Honor" the men and women who were there.
What we do in this game, is make believe. <S>
Blutik
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very true :aok
pffft
I would have a light-hearted exchange with you, but the hall monitor is acting like a tough guy.
When he should be getting us our ME-410.
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I would have a light-hearted exchange with you, but the hall monitor is acting like a tough guy.
Thanks for telling us what we're missing and all. I'll imagine it woulda been both witty and courageous. :D
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Over 400 posts for "Pilots with Honor" yet there are not enough to honor Mac & GMC to help put together a memorial flight.....WTF!
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:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: this thread is getting more stupid as you read this! :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
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Thanks for telling us what we're missing and all. I'll imagine it woulda been both witty and courageous. :D
Aww Arlo.
Have you ever been to the Calumet Theatre?
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Aww Arlo.
Have you ever been to the Calumet Theatre?
This one?
http://www.calumettheatre.com/
Not yet. But Arlo Guthrie has been. If that isn't confusing .....
:D