Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: AusMedic on January 26, 2016, 01:14:33 PM
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Can someone explain to me what is Eny and why do we have it? Doesn't seem fair to have it just because the other countries don't have the numbers. :bhead
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It dosn't seem fair that your country has more players then all the others.
HiTech
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Easy fix.... help the lower number side.
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It dosn't seem fair that your country has more players then all the others.
HiTech
:rofl
Easy fix.... help the lower number side.
(http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o460/caldera_08/AH%20motivationals/eny.jpg~original) (http://s343.photobucket.com/user/caldera_08/media/AH%20motivationals/eny.jpg.html)
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I love when we have low numbers lol. I get more kills and more perk points. I'm usually in the F4U-1 so that's a full stomach of perk points. Btw I notice whoever the winning team is, they always seem to have the higher numbers lol. Idiots switch for free perks? I get that amount of perks in 1 sortie lol. Also I've known some guys switch to that side, leave their computer on and go to sleep so they can get the free perks lmao. I enjoy a good laugh about ENY. :salute
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:rofl
(http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o460/caldera_08/AH%20motivationals/eny.jpg~original) (http://s343.photobucket.com/user/caldera_08/media/AH%20motivationals/eny.jpg.html)
:rofl
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It dosn't seem fair that your country has more players then all the others.
HiTech
than
But seriously, ENY needs to have more punch. It's a great concept, but doesn't seem to do much balancing. IF you know your aircraft, you can find a cheap replacement that's just as good. JMHO.
...oh, except for the tools-in-jets problem.
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than
But seriously, ENY needs to have more punch. It's a great concept, but doesn't seem to do much balancing. IF you know your aircraft, you can find a cheap replacement that's just as good. JMHO.
...oh, except for the tools-in-jets problem.
What's wrong with us tools in jets :neener:
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than
But seriously, ENY needs to have more punch. It's a great concept, but doesn't seem to do much balancing. IF you know your aircraft, you can find a cheap replacement that's just as good. JMHO.
...oh, except for the tools-in-jets problem.
Oh please no. ENY kills so many good fights as it is coming on too soon with too few players...
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Oh please no. ENY kills so many good fights as it is coming on too soon with too few players...
Agreed. There should be a max population limit before ENY sets in. Maybe there is, and doesn't work.
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than
But seriously, ENY needs to have more punch. It's a great concept, but doesn't seem to do much balancing. IF you know your aircraft, you can find a cheap replacement that's just as good. JMHO.
...oh, except for the tools-in-jets problem.
The numbers in recent year were as balanced as I ever remember in the past 15 years. EU night time at least.
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Vraciu, I respectfully disagree. Even when there are fewer players, ENY should kick in. 6 against 2 is not different than 100 against 50.
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Yesterday there 9 Rooks versus 32 Knights and 32 Bishop . Then the numbers jumped up to 56 Bishop and 48 Knights. A small portion were Rooks switching with hopes of getting free perk points with an impending war win and the rest just raged logged in the face of base loss after base loss. In just logged on this morning and again 8 Rooks versus 30 Bishop and 28 Knights. I frankly could care less about the side unbalance the perk points are awesome when we are outnumbered like that. The glass is half full and it's best we just try to find the positive in every situation. Thanks for the perkies Bishop/Knight :banana: 0Rick and I defended a base well over an hour agaist a handful of enemy players. Him resupping town which was close to our spawn point and me bombing M3's / T34's/M4's/Ostwinds and killing F4's launching from mind you a CV they had right by the base. Finally after an hour or so we got 2 more Rooks to join in and we kept the base. With that said it is great action and always somewhere to defend when we are outnumbered like that. If your an adrenaline junky like myself then 6 to 1 odds are much more fun and it pays well too :bolt:
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Easy fix.... help the lower number side.
Might it be beneficial if switching to the low numbers side offered some sort of award such as a small amount of perks? It might encourage more to switch to balance the side, since right now the only reward of switching is to fly a P-51.
A stipulation could be put in place to only award points if the side is in X percentage of deficit to the other sides.
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Might it be beneficial if switching to the low numbers side offered some sort of award such as a small amount of perks? It might encourage more to switch to balance the side, since right now the only reward of switching is to fly a P-51.
A stipulation could be put in place to only award points if the side is in X percentage of deficit to the other sides.
Some folks always want more handouts. To those I just say stay and take your punishment.
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Might it be beneficial if switching to the low numbers side offered some sort of award such as a small amount of perks?
Uh, isn't the perk multiplier higher if your side is outnumbered? There's the "award such as a small amount of perks". But then again, the player would actually have to fight and get some kills. ;)
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Vraciu, I respectfully disagree. Even when there are fewer players, ENY should kick in. 6 against 2 is not different than 100 against 50.
Yes it is when five of them are in GVs on your side. So you are outnumbered in the air 2:1 and ENY hits you.
Or what I hate more, a rolling battle where I am on the low side. The fights are fun and even though the enemy is slowly taking bases there is action. Then ENY hits and those guys all log. Fight dries up.
ENY does no good when it reduces the number of players in the arena.
When ENY hits I log off. Many times it is because ENY was supposed to help me but instead chased off all my opponents.
It needs to be tweaked based on numbers. I do not have the magic answer but some sort of sliding scale or curve to bring it on more gradually would help.
:salute
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Yes it is when five of them are in GVs on your side. So you are outnumbered in the air 2:1 and ENY hits you.
Or what I hate more, a rolling battle where I am on the low side. The fights are fun and even though the enemy is slowly taking bases there is action. Then ENY hits and those guys all log. Fight dries up.
ENY does no good when it reduces the number of players in the arena.
When ENY hits I log off. Many times it is because ENY was supposed to help me but instead chased off all my opponents.
It needs to be tweaked based on numbers. I do not have the magic answer but some sort of sliding scale or curve to bring it on more gradually would help.
:salute
P-51D :neener:
Kidding but seriously
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P-51D :neener:
Kidding but seriously
Lol!
:cheers:
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Uh, isn't the perk multiplier higher if your side is outnumbered? There's the "award such as a small amount of perks". But then again, the player would actually have to fight and get some kills. ;)
Yes, but you'd get even more perk points for shooting down a low-eny plane. You used to be able to get some rediculous perk point bonuses back before eny (and before they figured out a -1 was far from helpless... I think at one point it was 40 eny!!!)
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Yes it is when five of them are in GVs on your side. So you are outnumbered in the air 2:1 and ENY hits you.
Or what I hate more, a rolling battle where I am on the low side. The fights are fun and even though the enemy is slowly taking bases there is action. Then ENY hits and those guys all log. Fight dries up.
ENY does no good when it reduces the number of players in the arena.
When ENY hits I log off. Many times it is because ENY was supposed to help me but instead chased off all my opponents.
It needs to be tweaked based on numbers. I do not have the magic answer but some sort of sliding scale or curve to bring it on more gradually would help.
:salute
The ones that log need a superior plane to what you ha v e to even have a chance to win a fight. The real fighters stay and fight.
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The ones that log need a superior plane to what you ha v e to even have a chance to win a fight. The real fighters stay and fight.
That observation may or may not be accurate. You can't force someone to fly a high ENY ride. You can cause logoffs though.
This argument has been hashed around a lot. HiTech's views are well-known. He says it serves the purpose he has in mind. Until that purpose is no longer met it will remain as is.
:salute
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That observation may or may not be accurate. You can't force someone to fly a high ENY ride. You can cause logoffs though.
This argument has been hashed around a lot. HiTech's views are well-known. He says it serves the purpose he has in mind. Until that purpose is no longer met it will remain as is.
:salute
Yes! Since it works to even sides when people choose not to..... log, change sides, or fly what you can.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk
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Yes! Since it works to even sides when people choose not to..... log, change sides, or fly what you can.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk
If the goal is to crater numbers in off peak then it is working just fine. I don't mind being at a disadvantage. At least it means I have someone to fight. I'd rather be at a numbers disadvantage than to have nothing to shoot at. But that's just me.
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If the goal is to crater numbers in off peak then it is working just fine. I don't mind being at a disadvantage. At least it means I have someone to fight. I'd rather be at a numbers disadvantage than to have nothing to shoot at. But that's just me.
Great then all you have to do is switch to the low number team. The fighters are there, the others are not.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk
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Great then all you have to do is switch to the low number team. The fighters are there, the others are not.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk
No.
Been there. Done that. It doesn't work. Every single time I have I wound up being punished by ENY because of logoffs after side switching and wind up on the high side once again unable to find fights. Then I am stuck and can't fly with my squad the next day.
Fess and I have been through this drill too many times to count.
When you only have ten guys in flight ENY causes problems and side switching doesn't help.
When you are on the low side ENY makes your opponents quit. When you switch you wind up punished for switching because the balance swings the other way. With low numbers it is counterproductive. It comes on too soon and too hard. That may be good with girls but it sucks with dogfights.
I'm going to shut up now. It isn't going to change. All the simple solutions you offer have been tried and don't work. At least in my experience.
It's HiTech's show. He has data I don't so it is what it is.
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No.
Been there. Done that. It doesn't work. Every single time I have I wound up being punished by ENY because of logoffs after side switching and wind up on the high side once again unable to find fights. Then I am stuck and can't fly with my squad the next day.
Fess and I have been through this drill too many times to count.
When you only have ten guys in flight ENY causes problems and side switching doesn't help.
When you are on the low side ENY makes your opponents quit. When you switch you wind up punished for switching because the balance swings the other way. With low numbers it is counterproductive. It comes on too soon and too hard. That may be good with girls but it sucks with dogfights.
I'm going to shut up now. It isn't going to change. All the simple solutions you offer have been tried and don't work. At least in my experience.
It's HiTech's show. He has data I don't so it is what it is.
Works great for me. Even in MW it works and they sometimes have very few on. The only time it doesn't work is when no one on wants to fight. Nothing anyone can do about that. Some just like to milkrun. Some in there for perk they can't get in LW.
Which brings up another item. Wish they would seperate the perks for different arenas.
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switching sides is not always an option. if u fly a squad, you cannot necessarily ask all squaddies to switch, every time the numbers balance shifts. the numbers are also time of day based, another balancing act.
eny is as good attempt as any........................I hate it but.......................... ...
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I couldn't fly for a squad that says you can't fly against them, especially if it means getting the opportunity to fight. My squadies are my best and favorite opponents, any squad that mandates a side is just....scared....
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switching sides is not always an option. if u fly a squad, you cannot necessarily ask all squaddies to switch, every time the numbers balance shifts. the numbers are also time of day based, another balancing act.
eny is as good attempt as any........................I hate it but.......................... ...
Sometimes our squad is on different sides and we hunt each other. Hehehe
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Sometimes our squad is on different sides and we hunt each other. Hehehe
While this can be fun I think its one of the things that take away from "squads" in the game. Squads use to be a group of players with the same basic ideals, ideas of how to play, the same goals in the game. Today squads are more like "clicks". I think it one of those things we have lost and its a sad thing.
Switching or moving to high ENY planes during prime time makes sense, however during off peak times just a couple guys switching to another side can switch the ENY penalty.
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Sometimes our squad is on different sides and we hunt each other.
That is a lot of fun. I remember listening to Slash27 and 1Duke1 talk about everyday topics while they were fighting each other. Jaeger and Molsman and many others and I do it in the AvA. Lots of good thing come from having the squad split on different sides.
- oldman
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I've never ever been ENY'ed away from my A8...
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Spread the word AApache, they will not get perks unless they have been on side for so many hours.
Yesterday there 9 Rooks versus 32 Knights and 32 Bishop . Then the numbers jumped up to 56 Bishop and 48 Knights. A small portion were Rooks switching with hopes of getting free perk points with an impending war win and the rest just raged logged in the face of base loss after base loss. In just logged on this morning and again 8 Rooks versus 30 Bishop and 28 Knights. I frankly could care less about the side unbalance the perk points are awesome when we are outnumbered like that. The glass is half full and it's best we just try to find the positive in every situation. Thanks for the perkies Bishop/Knight :banana: 0Rick and I defended a base well over an hour agaist a handful of enemy players. Him resupping town which was close to our spawn point and me bombing M3's / T34's/M4's/Ostwinds and killing F4's launching from mind you a CV they had right by the base. Finally after an hour or so we got 2 more Rooks to join in and we kept the base. With that said it is great action and always somewhere to defend when we are outnumbered like that. If your an adrenaline junky like myself then 6 to 1 odds are much more fun and it pays well too :bolt:
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I have never been a big fan of side switching..... but if you are going to fix ENY with it.
Code in a few rules...
#1) Unlimited number switching to the side with the lowest numbers. (no wait times) Guys looking for fight will like this.
#2) 6 hour wait to move to any side that has more players than the one you are on. (Still can move to lowest, as that number moves about during the day.
CAVALRY
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Some folks always want more handouts.
Well of course. This is how the world works.
Uh, isn't the perk multiplier higher if your side is outnumbered? There's the "award such as a small amount of perks". But then again, the player would actually have to fight and get some kills. ;)
Well, I'm thinking of all of the other successful games that give out various login rewards and perks for doing things in the game. Pretty much any large MMO gives out free "in game premium currency" in small amounts. It is attractive to customers and players to do things within the game. For instance, I stopped playing World of Tanks for quite a while, and when I went back they gave me 500 gold for completing various "missions" or objectives, totaling about 3000 gold.
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when I cant fly my p51, I switch to the p47's. little heavier girl, but it makes up with unlimited ammo. but more than eny, what makes me log off, is either I am tired or the map itself.
eny is ok the way it is now. I may not like it but I do understand it.
semp
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ENY is the only bad idea HiTech ever had because...
It's a complaint generator, but ends no complaining. It seems to me, it's a net loss in volume under the game's happy-surface.
vinkman :salute
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ENY is the only bad idea HiTech ever had because...
It's a complaint generator, but ends no complaining. It seems to me, it's a net loss in volume under the game's happy-surface.
vinkman :salute
Not even close to the complaints that were pre ENY.
HiTech
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Not even close to the complaints that were pre ENY.
HiTech
Interested to know what specific category of complaints are lower now, then before ENY? (hoarding, rolling bases, maps won too fast, ??) Because it isn't obvious. :salute
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Interested to know what specific category of complaints are lower now, then before ENY? (hoarding, rolling bases, maps won too fast, ??) Because it isn't obvious. :salute
I think it was ganging that was the biggest culprit. There were times when one team was being attacked from both sides for the whole month never mind an hour or two here and there.
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ENY normally doesn't effect me because I fly all 20+ ENY planes for the most part anyways. If you can manage to rack up some kills while low ENY in a High ENY plane, you can easily land 35-50 perks in a flight and do way better than any ol' stinking map win.
That being said, unfortunately the game play here lends itself to the people doing the mass base rolls are also not looking for a fight, so they tend to move areas with any sign of opposition. That's when the game begins to suck, you're on the low numbers team and still can't find a fight. #growapair #chumbawamba
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ENY normally doesn't effect me because I fly all 20+ ENY planes for the most part anyways. If you can manage to rack up some kills while low ENY in a High ENY plane, you can easily land 35-50 perks in a flight and do way better than any ol' stinking map win.
That being said, unfortunately the game play here lends itself to the people doing the mass base rolls are also not looking for a fight, so they tend to move areas with any sign of opposition. That's when the game begins to suck, you're on the low numbers team and still can't find a fight. #growapair #chumbawamba
exactly, the game has become about rolling the base the quickest easiest way possible.
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I have never been a big fan of side switching..... but if you are going to fix ENY with it.
Code in a few rules...
#1) Unlimited number switching to the side with the lowest numbers. (no wait times) Guys looking for fight will like this.
#2) 6 hour wait to move to any side that has more players than the one you are on. (Still can move to lowest, as that number moves about during the day.
CAVALRY
HiTech, I hope you'll seriously consider this. This seems like the idea that could really help ENY work better (as envisioned?)...
There are only a handful of squads out there that are willing to side switch for balance, but it's tough to do with the 6 hour rule because numbers do fluctuate.
Basically we can't help you balance the arena numbers effectively with the way it is now. Help us help you hehe :)
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HiTech, I hope you'll seriously consider this. This seems like the idea that could really help ENY work better (as envisioned?)...
I already consider it many years ago .
There is a big hole in the idea. Say you are currently on the small side. You could switch to the big side, and then immediately switch back.
HiTech
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I already consider it many years ago .
There is a big hole in the idea. Say you are currently on the small side. You could switch to the big side, and then immediately switch back.
HiTech
I don't know how to prevent that, but maybe even a 1 or 2 hour side switch to the low side, but 6 to the high? That would still help.
There's a lot of things (squad nights, FSO, scenario, football games) that can cause numbers to swing wildly in 6 hours. It can make side switching pretty dicey.
It's unfortunate that some abuse this and that prevents others from using it as intended to help balance game play. I can tell you that being horded by 6 brewsters stinks just as much as being horded by 6 hellcats.
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People seem to think ENY is there to have people switch sides to even up the numbers, I don't think it is. I think it is there to force the team with the higher numbers to use less capable equipment to do the same battle.
Switching sides, and often, forces the ENY to bounce all over the place. The shorter the switch times the wilder the swings in ENY.
I think there needs to be a "tooling" for ENY and a few other things.
ENY needs to kick in harder, but it should also have a few provisions. If bish have the numbers BUT are being attacked from both sides (knits and rooks) ENY shouldn't factor in. The numbers "total" for the arena is what ticks people off about ENY. So the Bish are fighting two fronts AND have an ENY penalty, not exactly fair. While it is most likely a coading nightmare the "action" should dictate when and how the ENY kicks in.
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The problem with your thought is that a 51B or -1 hog are not inferior equipment.
5 or 6 sticks that know what they're doing and helping out the low number side is going to have a much greater impact than sticking one side in MW birds.
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The problem with your thought is that a 51B or -1 hog are not inferior equipment.
5 or 6 sticks that know what they're doing and helping out the low number side is going to have a much greater impact than sticking one side in MW birds.
The older hogs carry less ord, and the bolded section is an issue. Yes there are a few very good "pilots" that a mid war plane would is still a top notch machine but do you realize how many players are under average players? It is something like 80% that cant even maintain a positive K/D. There are very few players that can do anything in any plane/vehicle. Others rely on the equipment to get the job done. If not, don't you think you'd see a lot more players using midwar planes to build perks if it was so much easier.
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The problem with your thought is that a 51B or -1 hog are not inferior equipment.
5 or 6 sticks that know what they're doing and helping out the low number side is going to have a much greater impact than sticking one side in MW birds.
Shhhhhhh. Don't tell him or he will drop the ENY on those, too. :bolt:
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The older hogs carry less ord, and the bolded section is an issue. Yes there are a few very good "pilots" that a mid war plane would is still a top notch machine but do you realize how many players are under average players? It is something like 80% that cant even maintain a positive K/D. There are very few players that can do anything in any plane/vehicle. Others rely on the equipment to get the job done. If not, don't you think you'd see a lot more players using midwar planes to build perks if it was so much easier.
I'm a big believer that the plane doesn't matter. So my line of thought is that the equipment isn't getting the job done for them, but numbers are. You can be just as ineffective in a P-51D as a P-51B. I think a reason we don't see more players in midwar planes that are pretty much as effective as late war planes is that most people just don't put much thought into this game. They log on, drink some beers, and have a good time. Years and years pass and they don't figure stuff out, because that's not important to them or how they have fun.
My point with the bolded section is that having 5-6 people who are halfway decent switch sides and attack the enemy dar bar is going to help out the low number side way more than just letting them have 2 extra 50 cals, or an La-7. Most of the people who routinely switch sides are halfway decent sticks (you tend to get that way when you try to fight).
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Yak9T is awesome
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Of course the life is a lot easier in planes like the Dora and the D- pony but There are several ENY 20-30 planes that are competitive, what you often lack is the speed to run away but other than that you have little problem to fight.
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Of course the life is a lot easier in planes like the Dora and the D- pony but There are several ENY 20-30 planes that are competitive, what you often lack is the speed to run away but other than that you have little problem to fight.
La5 and p51b are slow?!
There are numerous 20+ ENY planes that can go toe to toe with the ENY<10 planes. Some of which really do not deserve such a high ENY value.
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Again, you guys are talking about yourselves, all better than average players. A vast majority of players today are still, and will continue to be (because they won't try anything else) far BELOW average. Flying a ponyb or la5 to them is out of the question. They know that it isn't the best plane and that their weak skills just don't mix.
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Complaining about ENY when competitors let the biggest wallet win fights with the best birds. At least Hitech is egalitarian up to a point about what ride and when you can fly it for $14.95.
Ultimately ENY posts devolve into: I really, really, really FEEL this game would be it's best if we can switch sides at will and have no ENY. Then I can hunt down and scalp everyone with impunity to make my EGO feel really, really, really good.
If Hitech had thought unlimited side switching and no ENY would keep his mortgage paid since the day so long ago he was forced by a childish selfish game community to IMPOSE ENY on them. We wouldn't be wasting so much text on it trying to get Hitech to change his mind.
We today are no different than those players back then who forced ENY on us by abusing Hitech's good graces.
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Again, you guys are talking about yourselves, all better than average players. A vast majority of players today are still, and will continue to be (because they won't try anything else) far BELOW average. Flying a ponyb or la5 to them is out of the question.
If they are that far below average it does not matter what they fly.
ENY does not affect your chances of success and does not prevent you from flying a specific model. It is only a rather weak incentive to make you switch sides in case you get hit by ENY often during your regular playing hours.
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only reason i play this game is to fly the p51, because I grew up in the 70's listening to its awesome power. take that away and I'll fly a p47. only reason I dont fly german planes is due to the fact i cant see out of the plane. am I wrong? no.
semp
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If they are that far below average it does not matter what they fly.
ENY does not affect your chances of success and does not prevent you from flying a specific model. It is only a rather weak incentive to make you switch sides in case you get hit by ENY often during your regular playing hours.
I don't think ENY is to make people change sides. Hitech said this....
"The value chosen is base on the damping effect of oscillation do to players changing side along and with desire to keep the time long enough that an immediate change and change back can not be used for a strategic advantage."
here (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,361462.msg4811379.html#msg4811379). The "option to switch sides is there for those who MUST fly a P51 when ENY kicks in. The biggest complaint about ENY is not being able to fly the plane they want.
In cases like semp and Fess the Pony is their ride of choice. Not because it is faster, or turns better or carries more ord, it's because they like flying that plane, much like Ack-Ack likes his 38. Unfortunately most other players don't play for "history" and so fly a plane that peak an interest. More players today fly a plane to get the job done to win the game. That means the fastest, easiest plane with the best load out. Which also happens to be those that get cut out first when ENY kicks in, and so the complaints.
ENY would be less of an issue if the numbers were tied into more parameters in the game, two forces fighting one, or a local ENY setup or some such thing. Just population isn't accurate enough. It would also be less of an issue if players learned the game better. Learned that an LA5 is just as competitive as an LA7, or that a P47-25 is every bit as good as a pony when it comes to moving mud. These "gamers" who do nothing but look for and use the quickest easiest route to the win aren't doing themselves any favors.
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I think an easy fix for this is to limit ENY restriction when there are less than 80 players in the MA.
When you fight against say 40 players in the MA. You will only have between 10-20 players on each side. You have a map that's friggen huge with no boundaries. I vote Smog 8 in the off hours :rock. So realistically neither team is actually "hoarding" because only 5-12 are flying and generally spread throughout the map. The idea of "teamwork" is sparce when using more than one squad. You generally come up agaisnt 190Ds and P51Ds against your level 3 plane, and they more than likely run away after you out manuever them. With smaller #s on bigger maps, it's not one team with #s dominating the map. It's 3 or 4 pilots in different areas of the map fighting other loan wolf pilots, thus one pilot is dealt the weaker aircraft from the start.
If the players were actually compelled to fighting with teamwork limited to a smaller map radius, than ENY might have a realistic purpose. With smaller #s on such a large map the arguement is reasonable that ENY is not effective for the game.
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^^^^^ This.
With low numbers ENY is a PITA.
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I think an easy fix for this is to limit ENY restriction when there are less than 80 players in the MA.
When you fight against say 40 players in the MA. You will only have between 10-20 players on each side. You have a map that's friggen huge with no boundaries. I vote Smog 8 in the off hours :rock. So realistically neither team is actually "hoarding" because only 5-12 are flying and generally spread throughout the map. The idea of "teamwork" is sparce when using more than one squad. You generally come up agaisnt 190Ds and P51Ds against your level 3 plane, and they more than likely run away after you out manuever them. With smaller #s on bigger maps, it's not one team with #s dominating the map. It's 3 or 4 pilots in different areas of the map fighting other loan wolf pilots, thus one pilot is dealt the weaker aircraft from the start.
If the players were actually compelled to fighting with teamwork limited to a smaller map radius, than ENY might have a realistic purpose. With smaller #s on such a large map the arguement is reasonable that ENY is not effective for the game.
Absolutely not. Every single morning the j0kers get on and horde half the map, If the map is small they will roll it. Many times they have rolled multiple maps. ENY gives us half a chance to defend.
(http://i.imgur.com/zQihhjq.jpg)
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^^^ During the week, in the mornings, they will reset the smaller maps in just a few hours. One morning "Baltic" was won after being up only 5 hours. They did this with ENY in the high 20's but it wasn't enough to slow them down.
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Absolutely not. Every single morning the j0kers get on and horde half the map, If the map is small they will roll it. Many times they have rolled multiple maps. ENY gives us half a chance to defend.
(http://i.imgur.com/zQihhjq.jpg)
Can you please help me understand exactly what planes you are glad they don't get and why? I don't take bases very often so I don't get it.
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Can someone explain to me what is Eny and why do we have it? Doesn't seem fair to have it just because the other countries don't have the numbers. :bhead
Become proficient in more then just the uber rides and ENY will only mean you shrug your shoulders and fly a different plane.
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Become proficient in more then just the uber rides and ENY will only mean you shrug your shoulders and fly a different plane.
Thank gawd the Germans didn't have ENY.
ENY is stupid. At least as currently implemented. I understand the concept but it needs a tweaking.
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@Fugitive
I totally get the players who have "their ride". In fact, I am one of them. I have more kills in mosquitoes than in all other planes combined... twice. The only other planes I take with any regularity are the F6F and P47D11/25. These are my historical favorites and I play them regardless of their relative performance in the game - which is competitive enough by the way.
Luckily for me, most players do not share my enthusiasm or faith in my historically favorite planes' abilities and so they receive a high ENY score. If somehow the mossie VI will get ENY locked I will be bummed - but this is because the mossie does not have a higher ENY alternative model. Nearly all models susceptible to ENY locks have higher ENY brothers. I absolutely fail to understand P51 fans who do not consider P51B as a P51. Or LA7 " fans" if there is such a thing that do not understand just how close the LA5FN is to the LA7.
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ENY 30 = always available
(http://steeljawscribe.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/brewster_239_formation.png)
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I agree with Vudak. In fact I have seen many examples of times where huge numbers of pilots on the Knights have decided it's 109k night, and fight vs swarms of base taking Spi16/La7/P51s that outnumber them, and prevail - there is a lot more to it than ENY numbers, pilot skill/experience IMO is the primary factor in the "fairness" of sides, and I know of no way to control that particular not insignificant issue.
ENY is stupid. At least as currently implemented. I understand the concept but it needs a tweaking.
I can agree with this somewhat as well. In particular how ENY and side switch time relate to one another - very "at odds", although I do accept the "data/numbers" which HTC has taken - it's in the math someplace I guess, but it still seems very odd to have a system which is meant to "nudge" players to switch sides for better planes due to an imbalance in "fairness", yet prevent them from doing it when that exact same condition happens again yet on another team, until essentially the next day of play. Again, odd. The few times I've switched teams looking for better fights, this ALWAYS has happened in fact - within an hour or two, the side I've switched to is no longer the "low numbers" team, but is now the "high" one, by a large margin, yet there is nothing you can do about it for 4 or 5 hours, which by 11pm, means...tomorrow night for most players.
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Hey HiTech!
Just so you know, there's a lot of us out there that the ENY doesn't bother one bit. Love the game the way it is! Keep up the good work.
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I love logging in as a Knight in the mornings with huge numbers against us and grabbing a 262 for 50 points and having at it! I always always want the odds 2 to 1 against me. So many red guys.............so little time..............
...............and what Zardoz said.
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I agree with Vudak. In fact I have seen many examples of times where huge numbers of pilots on the Knights have decided it's 109k night, and fight vs swarms of base taking Spi16/La7/P51s that outnumber them, and prevail - there is a lot more to it than ENY numbers, pilot skill/experience IMO is the primary factor in the "fairness" of sides, and I know of no way to control that particular not insignificant issue.
I can agree with this somewhat as well. In particular how ENY and side switch time relate to one another - very "at odds", although I do accept the "data/numbers" which HTC has taken - it's in the math someplace I guess, but it still seems very odd to have a system which is meant to "nudge" players to switch sides for better planes due to an imbalance in "fairness", yet prevent them from doing it when that exact same condition happens again yet on another team, until essentially the next day of play. Again, odd. The few times I've switched teams looking for better fights, this ALWAYS has happened in fact - within an hour or two, the side I've switched to is no longer the "low numbers" team, but is now the "high" one, by a large margin, yet there is nothing you can do about it for 4 or 5 hours, which by 11pm, means...tomorrow night for most players.
Stupid was too harsh a term. I shouldn't have said that. :salute I understand why it is there and it obviously has an effect. Just wish when numbers are low it would be turned off or ramped a little more shallowly.
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Same here, I don't really care either way, it doesn't affect me since when I'm not in a Ki43 I'm usually in a K4, and I'll fly anything really, so not having 5 ENY plane access is something I don't even notice when it happens. As Zoney said, they only time I really take notice of it is when 262s get really cheap, which is enough fun to offset the oddness of the ENY/Side Switch deal by far. If it never changes, it won't make any difference to me - I'm just pointing out the absurdity of having one system that is supposed to entice players to switch sides, then another that prevents it, when the conditions which happen for the former are prevented by the latter after the first time it's done.
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Ultimately ENY posts devolve into: I really, really, really FEEL this game would be it's best if we can switch sides at will and have no ENY. Then I can hunt down and scalp everyone with impunity to make my EGO feel really, really, really good.
I know that switching to a low numbered side and being pecked to death in 3,4,5 on 1's over and over and over again does wonders for my ego.
What I've noticed many threads devolve into is "Bustr gets another chance to play the HTC cheerleader :D "
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Can you please help me understand exactly what planes you are glad they don't get and why? I don't take bases very often so I don't get it.
I'm glad they don't get the 51, LA7, spittard16, -4, Lancasters, It's helpful when they can't fly 20ENY buffs.
It really doesn't matter. They'll still up f4f's and kill you when it's 1-2 vs 6.
You're lucky if you can get four guys to defend against a large horde.
It really dosen't matter if 262s cost 47 perks, You'll still get HOed by three guys and chased down and rocket vulched on landing.
Don't worry, Just up again, Oh wait. A p38J deacked your large field by himself and just vulches you. :mad: :bhead
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Don't up from a capped field. Simple.
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what I find funny is that some are asking for eny to be "tweaked", but they dont say how.
semp
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what I find funny is that some are asking for eny to be "tweaked", but they dont say how.
semp
I just feel like it's pointless until it gets so rediculously high that it remains pointless because of the numerical advantage. I think players enjoy a placebo effect from it and that's about it.
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what I find funny is that some are asking for eny to be "tweaked", but they dont say how.
semp
Some of us have said how. Maybe you missed it.
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Some of us have said how. Maybe you missed it.
enlighten me
semp
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I just feel like it's pointless until it gets so rediculously high that it remains pointless because of the numerical advantage. I think players enjoy a placebo effect from it and that's about it.
what?
semp
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enlighten me
semp
I'm not big into repeating myself. Maybe Violator is. Ask him.
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what?
I just don't think ENY really helps very many people/groups, be they base takers or furballers. I don't think that different planes do a very good job of evening the playing field anywhere else than in people's heads.
Look at that image that was posted by Dallas where one team has 2v1 odds but ENY is still only 22. What good is that really doing anyone? The G-14, F4U-1, La-5, Brewster and Spit V are all still available and all perfectly capable of fighting in the MA. Also there's still the Mossie, Me410 and P47D25 for taking down bases. This is a perfectly capable plane set for taking care of pretty much any job you want except perhaps some super-specific tasks like strat raiding or 163 defense.
At 25 ENY, you no longer have the G14, F4U-1, Me410, or P47D25, but the Mossie, La-5, Brewster and Spit V are all still available and frankly competitive in their roles. After 30 it does start to thin out, but by that point (really, by 20) you're so outnumbered that it just doesn't matter. It only takes one high con to dive and make you turn and you're swarmed by a horde of Spit V's, which is just as bad as being swarmed by a bunch of Spit 16's.
I think allowing willing players to go switch to a side where they can up dirt cheap 262s, F4U-4s, and Tempests will do a lot more for the disadvantaged side than ENY ever will. I find it odd that we have a mechanism that is supposed to punish one country for having too many people yet we don't have a system where excess people can easily switch to help the outnumbered side as numbers ebb and flow.
I also have to roll my eyes at the guys who don't want low country swap times due to "spies." Listen, "spies" aren't the reason no one brings a goon until after the last minute. "Spies" aren't the reason no one deacks the town or field. "Spies" aren't the reason people drop FH while the VH is still up. And "spies" really don't have much effect on task groups either considering they tend to get sunk 15-20 minutes after showing up at a field, anyway. It seems like there's been much angst over this spy issue that is a bunch of baloney when you really think about it.
Spies aren't as big of a "problem" and ENY isn't really as much of a "help," as some people think, but the issue is most people don't put much thought (at all) into this game, and these are easy things to latch on to.
Anyway, just my opinion and I'm aware many disagree...
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vudak, the G-14, F4U-1, La-5, Brewster and Spit V wont take bases. it only proves that eny works as designed. the point of eny is to stop the high side from rolling bases and spit v wont help you take bases.
what you really want is to lower the switch time, you just trying for a different way to ask for it. which is what most people in here who want to "change" eny really want.
semp
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Mossie IS ENY 30 :D
ENY 30 = always available
(http://steeljawscribe.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/brewster_239_formation.png)
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Vudak,
Since the introduction of ENY, the sides are better balanced than they've ever been before - at least on Euro and US prime time. During off hours there is a problem.
Empirical evidence says ENY globally works.
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vudak, the G-14, F4U-1, La-5, Brewster and Spit V wont take bases. it only proves that eny works as designed. the point of eny is to stop the high side from rolling bases and spit v wont help you take bases.
what you really want is to lower the switch time, you just trying for a different way to ask for it. which is what most people in here who want to "change" eny really want.
semp
Mossies and 410s are arguably better at taking down a town and ack and taking a base than a 51D or 47D40+ though. Everything you need to take a base is available well into ENY.
I mean, mossies and 110s (granted 410s are new) were how it was done for years.
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Vudak,
Since the introduction of ENY, the sides are better balanced than they've ever been before - at least on Euro and US prime time. During off hours there is a problem.
Empirical evidence says ENY globally works.
I was here before ENY was around. I don't think getting people to log off is a great way to balance sides, and unless there's a lower switch time, that's the only way to balance.
My main point is that fighting "worse" planes isn't really helping the low number side as much as a few mercenaries would, and my second point is that without a lower side switch time, the only way for numbers to balance is to frustrate people to log off and go find another hobby, which seems undesirable.
Semp is absolutely right in that I'm after a lower switch time and don't care what happens with ENY. But then I understand that it is really a paper tiger until at least 20 and arguably 30.
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ENY NEVER makes me log off.
I just suck it up and fly something a little more challenging...
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It'll be interesting to see when numbers shoot up when the new game goes "live", how players will feel regarding ENY then - same, better, worse?. IMO it becomes much less of a "complaint" issue when numbers are higher. Mo numbers, less problems yo.
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If ENY convinces easy-mode hero's to log. Good.
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If ENY convinces easy-mode hero's to log. Good.
I resent that classification! :old: :joystick: :furious
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Absolutely not. Every single morning the j0kers get on and horde half the map, If the map is small they will roll it. Many times they have rolled multiple maps. ENY gives us half a chance to defend.
(http://i.imgur.com/zQihhjq.jpg)
Let's put em Sopwith Cammels! That will teach em! :old:
In all regards, normally, an abundance of airplanes with decent pilots are going to beat 1 superior plane in the sky. That being the pilot isn't a complete Ace, which many are not. Unless you fly a Temp or a Ta152 or a 190D, you generally won't be able to outrun most planes. When you get a gang on you, if you cannot out run them, it's pretty much over.
The biggest reason why the Jokers take all of your bases is because of your side's or the 3rd's teamwork.
When your side doesn't have the teamwork, or even enough players to combat the other squad, ENY doesn't really matter.
Now, if the maps were designed smaller where the Jokers had to face an opposition in order to capture a base, maybe ENY would work. The issue now, is that they can reup at another base across the map and basically avoid most opposition, thus flying higher ENY planes, but still capturing the map as there is little teamwork agaisnt them.
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If ENY convinces easy-mode hero's to log. Good.
If numbers were better, sure. But when the option is to have 20 easy-mode heroes flying around or 5 hardcores spread across a large map, I'd rather have 20 opponents.
Wiley.
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If numbers were better, sure. But when the option is to have 20 easy-mode heroes flying around or 5 hardcores spread across a large map, I'd rather have 20 opponents.
Wiley.
This.
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If numbers were better, sure. But when the option is to have 20 easy-mode heroes flying around or 5 hardcores spread across a large map, I'd rather have 20 opponents.
Wiley.
Ever have a cat poop in your house? Makes the whole place stink....
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^^^ During the week, in the mornings, they will reset the smaller maps in just a few hours. One morning "Baltic" was won after being up only 5 hours. They did this with ENY in the high 20's but it wasn't enough to slow them down.
Most times its up to 26-29....i guess team work really does work :aok
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I think it was ganging that was the biggest culprit. There were times when one team was being attacked from both sides for the whole month never mind an hour or two here and there.
I was hoping to get the answer from HiTech. :salute
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I think it was ganging that was the biggest culprit. There were times when one team was being attacked from both sides for the whole month never mind an hour or two here and there.
I was hoping to get the answer from HiTech. :salute
Fugitive drastically understates the issue.
We went for close to a year with one country having more people 24 hours a day in the arena then other 2 counties. Countries having similar numbers was a rarity.
But then when people logged because of the problem (from the low side), the problem would just get worse.
HiTech
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Interested to know what specific category of complaints are lower now, then before ENY? (hoarding, rolling bases, maps won too fast, ??) Because it isn't obvious. :salute
You never saw the threads that always resulted on Monday's after the Rookies launched one of their combined squadron operations on Sunday when the Rookies would out number the entire arena by a 3 to 1 margin.
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You never saw the threads that always resulted on Monday's after the Rookies launched one of their combined squadron operations on Sunday when the Rookies would out number the entire arena by a 3 to 1 margin.
Those were fun, but ya people got a bit hot about it.
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You never saw the threads that always resulted on Monday's after the Rookies launched one of their combined squadron operations on Sunday when the Rookies would out number the entire arena by a 3 to 1 margin.
RJO! Ya, I remember. Was allot of fun steamrolling maps at will. I'm sure it wasn't for the Bish/Knits, but RJO was partially a result of getting the old Knit/Bish gangbang a little too often.
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RJO! Ya, I remember. Was allot of fun steamrolling maps at will. I'm sure it wasn't for the Bish/Knits, but RJO was partially a result of getting the old Knit/Bish gangbang a little too often.
I had a ball as a Knit, but you did have to be a glutton for punishment. Those were the days of 40 perk sorties being normal and 80 perk sorties not being unusual, especially since the -1 at the time had a higher ENY.
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I was hoping to get the answer from HiTech. :salute
Fugitive drastically understates the issue.
We went for close to a year with one country having more people 24 hours a day in the arena then other 2 counties. Countries having similar numbers was a rarity.
But then when people logged because of the problem (from the low side), the problem would just get worse.
HiTech
And ENY balances the numbers?
Is that by causing people to switch sides?
Or
By causing people that ENY effects to log off?
Vinkman :salute
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And ENY balances the numbers?
Is that by causing people to switch sides?
Or
By causing people that ENY effects to log off?
Vinkman :salute
Yes and yes.
Now you're getting it.
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And ENY balances the numbers?
Is that by causing people to switch sides?
Or
By causing people that ENY effects to log off?
Vinkman :salute
It causes people to log off. Period. When numbers are low it is akin to cutting your head off to save blood for the body.
The days of 500000000 players are temporarily gone. When ENY takes a huge arena from 75 players to 14. Well, you all passed math.
Ditch ENY until total players = 300. Try it for goodness sake.
Adjust the ramp for ENY, Dale. Please. Just don't ditch the experiment until I get the heck out of Africa in a few weeks. Hahahahaha. :) :salute
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It causes people to log off. Period. When numbers are low it is akin to cutting your head off to save blood for the body.
Perhaps for some players it does. Likely the same players that A) never bother to improve their skills, B) get all their kills in horde attacks, C) game the game through 'bombing & bailing' & other such nonsense, and D) are still waiting for pubes to come in.
Personally, I have a hard time wrapping my head around the concept of logging simply for being deprived of an 'uber' ride, but then again, I'm not part of today's spoon-fed generation.
I'm perfectly happy with early/mid-war rides myself, so ENY doesn't mean anything to me. But what does make me log is when the numbers of hoarders are so overwhelming that bothering to defend against base takes is an effort in futility. While ENY may not be a complete solution to disparate numbers, it's one way to mitigate the damage.
So who would you rather have log? The pimply-faced Gang-Tards who won't fly without 10-1 odds, or more mature gamers who actually realize WWII was a war and not a show-down between Hulk Hogan & the Iron Sheik.
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It causes people to log off. Period. When numbers are low it is akin to cutting your head off to save blood for the body.
The days of 500000000 players are temporarily gone. When ENY takes a huge arena from 75 players to 14. Well, you all passed math.
Ditch ENY until total players = 300. Try it for goodness sake.
Adjust the ramp for ENY, Dale. Please. Just don't ditch the experiment until I get the heck out of Africa in a few weeks. Hahahahaha. :) :salute
You want to eat your cake and still have it too.
ENY makes perfect sense. Pick your loyalty: your country or your plane. You can't have both.
Or you can just whine about it.
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You want to eat your cake and still have it too.
ENY makes perfect sense. Pick your loyalty: your country or your plane. You can't have both.
Or you can just whine about it.
+1000
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people actually try to get perk points? whats up with that?!! you'd think this was a game or something!!! off with their heads!!
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I still don't get it. But maybe it's because I never played the game before it existed. I also couldn't care less who wins the war, so I don't understand the complaints about being rolled. Action is action. winning side...losing side...doesn't matter to me. :salute
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Perhaps for some players it does. Likely the same players that A) never bother to improve their skills, B) get all their kills in horde attacks, C) game the game through 'bombing & bailing' & other such nonsense, and D) are still waiting for pubes to come in.
Personally, I have a hard time wrapping my head around the concept of logging simply for being deprived of an 'uber' ride, but then again, I'm not part of today's spoon-fed generation.
I'm perfectly happy with early/mid-war rides myself, so ENY doesn't mean anything to me. But what does make me log is when the numbers of hoarders are so overwhelming that bothering to defend against base takes is an effort in futility. While ENY may not be a complete solution to disparate numbers, it's one way to mitigate the damage.
So who would you rather have log? The pimply-faced Gang-Tards who won't fly without 10-1 odds, or more mature gamers who actually realize WWII was a war and not a show-down between Hulk Hogan & the Iron Sheik.
The MA is a rich and varied ecosystem. You've got all kinds of players involved in all kinds of different things and that's a lot of what makes it great. It can also make it really, really suck.
I would LOVE to have my side being horded by aircraft the entire time I'm on. We'd be losing ground, but who cares? There are red guys to kill! Nothing makes me happier than nailing the guys that're perched above the guys turnfighting on the ground looking for a pick.
Apparently for you, fighting the horde is not all that much fun, and that's perfectly ok. But just with this example, my dream evening will make you log off. There are all kinds of different peoples' ideas of fun that are working at odds with one another.
I can't imagine anything more boring than being a strat bomber, yet I'll spend hours on a weekend hunting them. Zoney and I were laughing about that just this last weekend, the exchange went something like:
"Man, these guys have a high threshold for boredom. They just keep coming back over and over again."
"Yeah. Kinda like how we're hanging out over here waiting for them?"
As long as they're in the air, what people are flying and what they're doing is nearly irrelevant to me. I just want opponents I can go looking for to kill and fight with.
Wiley.
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So if a country have 120 players and the others have 40 each, don't you think a penalty would have to be in place because it's below 300 in total ?
Or should the other countries have free ME163s and ME262 from all fields to counterweight the unbalance, or no balance at all ?
ENY works, to fly a P51B instead or flying a P51D is only 2 guns less, and less ordnance.
It causes people to log off. Period. When numbers are low it is akin to cutting your head off to save blood for the body.
The days of 500000000 players are temporarily gone. When ENY takes a huge arena from 75 players to 14. Well, you all passed math.
Ditch ENY until total players = 300. Try it for goodness sake.
Adjust the ramp for ENY, Dale. Please. Just don't ditch the experiment until I get the heck out of Africa in a few weeks. Hahahahaha. :) :salute
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I would LOVE to have my side being horded by aircraft the entire time I'm on. We'd be losing ground, but who cares? There are red guys to kill! Nothing makes me happier than nailing the guys that're perched above the guys turnfighting on the ground looking for a pick.
Apparently for you, fighting the horde is not all that much fun, and that's perfectly ok. But just with this example, my dream evening will make you log off. There are all kinds of different peoples' ideas of fun that are working at odds with one another.
I can't imagine anything more boring than being a strat bomber, yet I'll spend hours on a weekend hunting them. Zoney and I were laughing about that just this last weekend, the exchange went something like:
"Man, these guys have a high threshold for boredom. They just keep coming back over and over again."
"Yeah. Kinda like how we're hanging out over here waiting for them?"
As long as they're in the air, what people are flying and what they're doing is nearly irrelevant to me. I just want opponents I can go looking for to kill and fight with.
Wiley.
I'd say we're a lot more alike than you assume. I, too, enjoy being on the side with fewer numbers (why I'm usually a knight), and I'm always looking for a good fight even when disadvantaged (often I prefer to fight from disadvantage). But there's a point where the difference in numbers becomes so great that unless you're willing to climb to 25K, you'll be jumped by 5 or more at once, and if you do climb to extreme alt and try to engage, 90% of the enemy up there will just drop into the horde to avoid a 1-1 fight (even with advantage). As you say, everyone gets something different from the game, but for me, there's no fun in enormously skewed numbers. The difference is in the magnitude. 1-1, 1-2, 1-3... fine. 1-10: doesn't matter how good you are, you'll be pick-food in short order.
I posted my personal opinion of what makes the game fun. I acknowledge that my fun does not necessarily translate to fun for others. However, if anything you've added credulity to the point I was making regarding ENY & its impact on the game. As you say, what makes me log may be what you enjoy. Likewise, for every player that logs due to ENY restrictions, there is likely at least one other player that will stay logged due to at least some measure of balance. I therefore do not accept the suggestion made by Vraciu that ENY drives players away from the game... it just changes the type of players attracted to it. From my perspective, guys who are happy jumping in an early-war ride and putting up a real fight instead of just picking from the hoard are those who I'd prefer to log in & stay logged.
:cheers:
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I'd say we're a lot more alike than you assume. I, too, enjoy being on the side with fewer numbers (why I'm usually a knight), and I'm always looking for a good fight even when disadvantaged (often I prefer to fight from disadvantage). But there's a point where the difference in numbers becomes so great that unless you're willing to climb to 25K, you'll be jumped by 5 or more at once, and if you do climb to alt and try to engage, 90% of the enemy up there will just drop into the horde to avoid a 1-1 fight (even with advantage). As you say, everyone gets something different from the game, but for me, there's no fun in enormously skewed numbers. The difference is in the magnitude.
Bolded part is likely the main difference. ;) All my point was, I'd rather have more enemies than fewer enemies. Sure when it's 20:1 you're not going to win, but it's fun to try to take as many of them as I can.
I posted my personal opinion of what makes the game fun. I acknowledge that my fun does not necessarily translate to fun for others. However, if anything you've added credulity to the point I was making regarding ENY & its impact on the game. As you say, what makes me log may be what you enjoy. Likewise, for every player that logs due to ENY restrictions, there is likely at least one other player that will stay logged due to at least some measure of balance. I therefore do not accept the suggestion made by Vraciu that ENY drives players away from the game... it just changes the type of players attracted to it.
And my point was, the world needs gang-tards too. There are a lot more people looking to gang in uber planes on any given night than there are people looking to fight from lesser planes. I highly doubt that the balance brought by ENY attracts people on a 1:1 basis with those who log due to not having all the advantages.
Wiley.
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So if a country have 120 players and the others have 40 each, don't you think a penalty would have to be in place because it's below 300 in total ?
Or should the other countries have free ME163s and ME262 from all fields to counterweight the unbalance, or no balance at all ?
ENY works, to fly a P51B instead or flying a P51D is only 2 guns less, and less ordnance.
300, 200, 100, whatever. Pick some number and try it.
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So if a country have 120 players and the others have 40 each, don't you think a penalty would have to be in place because it's below 300 in total ?
Or should the other countries have free ME163s and ME262 from all fields to counterweight the unbalance, or no balance at all ?
No.
...Because I am an individual and not part of the collective. I want to fly what I paid to fly, and I don't care how many of them there are or us there are or who's winning a war that has no leader, and no organization, no plan, and nothing riding on the outcome.
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No.
...Because I am an individual and not part of the collective. I want to fly what I paid to fly, and I don't care how many of them there are or us there are or who's winning a war that has no leader, and no organization, no plan, and nothing riding on the outcome.
ahhhh but your one guy. What about the say 30-40 people that log in day after day and find they are under attack on both fronts out numbered 3 -1 day after day and just give up in disgust because they don't have the skill or desire to fight under that. Those are the people who not only log back off, but more often than not cancel their subscriptions.
That is what ENY is for.
While many complain about it, it DOES keep the numbers more even. Not dead even, but much better than it was before.
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No.
...Because I am an individual and not part of the collective. I want to fly what I paid to fly, and I don't care how many of them there are or us there are or who's winning a war that has no leader, and no organization, no plan, and nothing riding on the outcome.
Switch sides and you then can fly what you paid to fly. Being on the high numbered side is effectively being part of the collective, no? :devil
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No.
...Because I am an individual and not part of the collective. I want to fly what I paid to fly, and I don't care how many of them there are or us there are or who's winning a war that has no leader, and no organization, no plan, and nothing riding on the outcome.
well if you are a knight, your wish is granted. btw you dont pay to fly anything. you just pay to enter the arenas. if you want to fly any airplane anytime you wish, well there's the training arena and the DA arena. heck if you ask nicely they may even let you fly whatever you want in the AVA.
semp
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So you pay -> fly best planes with no perks because you paid your $$$, even if it means 10:1 ratio to your country in LWA, because you're an individual ?
Like it or not, you are fighting for a entity of the player mass online - the green icons, and you simply want the best planes, most would, if a country can find a way to make it easier to win the war, like shutting down radar for 2 hours, they would, and do !
If they could bomb you to only fly c47's, and possible B5n's without bombs- but rather not, because it has a rear 7.7mm - they would !!!!
War is more fun when you have all the advantages .
Maybe you are looking for a duel -the DA is ther,e with all the most low ENY planes there is -even perked ones.
No.
...Because I am an individual and not part of the collective. I want to fly what I paid to fly, and I don't care how many of them there are or us there are or who's winning a war that has no leader, and no organization, no plan, and nothing riding on the outcome.
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Switch sides and you then can fly what you paid to fly. Being on the high numbered side is effectively being part of the collective, no? :devil
That's what I do. Then the numbers change and I get stuck because of the time rule (12 hours still?)
but many are country loyal. I think that's a good thing for the game, and side switching for even numbers ruins that sense of country loyalty.
Does the data say people switch and even up the sides? I remember HiTech saying ENY was not to make people switch sides. Do I remember that correctly?
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So you pay -> fly best planes with no perks because you paid your $$$, even if it means 10:1 ratio to your country in LWA, because you're an individual ?
Like it or not, you are fighting for a entity of the player mass online - the green icons, and you simply want the best planes, most would, if a country can find a way to make it easier to win the war, like shutting down radar for 2 hours, they would, and do !
I'll just turn your argument around. ...Why do you care if your outnumbered? that's the way wars go sometimes. NExt time you'll have the majority...blah blah blah.
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I dont care about ENY planes, 90% of my flying I do in ENY15+ rides.
I do care about those people who not only want the 3:1 but do it in their best planes with best ordnance, preferably with city down, all strat's destroyed.
If we had a factory for each plane type, you would see which ones they would take out first, who wants equal competition anyways ?
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That's what I do. Then the numbers change and I get stuck because of the time rule (12 hours still?)
but many are country loyal. I think that's a good thing for the game, and side switching for even numbers ruins that sense of country loyalty.
Does the data say people switch and even up the sides? I remember HiTech saying ENY was not to make people switch sides. Do I remember that correctly?
6
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I remember HiTech saying ENY was not to make people switch sides. Do I remember that correctly?
I think so. The notion was that if you're going to get overwhelmed, you won't get overwhelmed by uber rides, and you'll have a chance to fight back with smaller numbers but superior quality.
Worked for the Germans in the war, didn't it?
...oh...wait...
- oldman
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I think so. The notion was that if you're going to get overwhelmed, you won't get overwhelmed by uber rides, and you'll have a chance to fight back with smaller numbers but superior quality.
Worked for the Germans in the war, didn't it?
...oh...wait...
- oldman
germany never requested eny to be changed.
semp
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germany never requested eny to be changed.
semp
Italians switched sides when ENY became a problem.
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Italians switched sides when ENY became a problem.
:rofl
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I think that ENY hurts new people the most as they need all the help they can get, and if their favorite ride isn't available, they get frustrated. Of course the second group that gets most effected is the uber ride group. If I can't get my Pee-51 or my Run-90, I am taking my toys and leaving the sand box. I feel worst for group two as they typically spend more time running from a fight than fighting and when you corner that group, they can't fight for beans. All they know is to run... :rofl
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That's what I do. Then the numbers change and I get stuck because of the time rule (12 hours still?)
but many are country loyal. I think that's a good thing for the game, and side switching for even numbers ruins that sense of country loyalty.
Does the data say people switch and even up the sides? I remember HiTech saying ENY was not to make people switch sides. Do I remember that correctly?
Nothing wrong with country loyalty, except for the really rabid people who actually hate anyone from the other side - just because they are on the other side. :rolleyes:
If they would switch sides for a while, they would find people from their former side doing all the same things that they hate and that their new country mates are just as fun to be around as the old ones.
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Nothing wrong with country loyalty, except for the really rabid people who actually hate anyone from the other side - just because they are on the other side. :rolleyes:
If they would switch sides for a while, they would find people from their former side doing all the same things that they hate and that their new country mates are just as fun to be around as the old ones.
Not entirely sure a lot of people could handle a demonstration of the fact that every side in the game does the stuff they hate.
Wiley.
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I dont care about ENY planes, 90% of my flying I do in ENY15+ rides.
I do care about those people who not only want the 3:1 but do it in their best planes with best ordnance, preferably with city down, all strat's destroyed.
If we had a factory for each plane type, you would see which ones they would take out first, who wants equal competition anyways ?
all of your reasoning is flawed.
1) the large number of country A could be in GVs. and country A are out numbered in the air but still victims of ENY.
2) Large umbers are scattered all over the large map but country B is concentrating on rolling bases in the corner of the map. I'm defending and grossly out numbered, and I'm a victim of ENY, so I have to defend in a P-40.
I've never seen ENY do what you say....
SAVE on 200: "Really enjoying being 3-on-1'd now that they're doing it in 109 G-14s."
That it somehow addresses a ganging problem and stops you from complaining about it is all made up theory for the BBS. Everyone complains about being ganged every time it happens. Now we can just add the complaints of people being forced out of their rides.
And it's not me usually because I fly 109s and the best one is 15 I think. But I've been on when ENY was 35! and enemy darbars were bigger than ours.
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I think so. The notion was that if you're going to get overwhelmed, you won't get overwhelmed by uber rides, and you'll have a chance to fight back with smaller numbers but superior quality.
Worked for the Germans in the war, didn't it?
...oh...wait...
- oldman
:rofl
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germany never requested eny to be changed.
semp
very funny :aok
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Italians switched sides when ENY became a problem.
Even funnier :rofl
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all of your reasoning is flawed.
1) the large number of country A could be in GVs. and country A are out numbered in the air but still victims of ENY.
2) Large umbers are scattered all over the large map but country B is concentrating on rolling bases in the corner of the map. I'm defending and grossly out numbered, and I'm a victim of ENY, so I have to defend in a P-40.
I've never seen ENY do what you say....
SAVE on 200: "Really enjoying being 3-on-1'd now that they're doing it in 109 G-14s."
That it somehow addresses a ganging problem and stops you from complaining about it is all made up theory for the BBS. Everyone complains about being ganged every time it happens. Now we can just add the complaints of people being forced out of their rides.
And it's not me usually because I fly 109s and the best one is 15 I think. But I've been on when ENY was 35! and enemy darbars were bigger than ours.
The most straw men I have seen for a while.
HiTech
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Italians switched sides when ENY became a problem.
You owe me for the ruined monitor! Totally spit soda all over the place! :rofl
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/df/14/48/df1448e38b7f4316fa53cf0eb46a2687.gif)
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As long as you realize its a game and that you can change country ENY isnt really an issue. I dont see why it is such a big issue to change country. Greens = Friends, reds = targets. thats all you need to know...
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As long as you realize its a game and that you can change country ENY isnt really an issue. I dont see why it is such a big issue to change country. Greens = Friends, reds = targets. thats all you need to know...
It is a big issue (or can be) when you fly with a squad. If you switch sides, and can't go back to the switchback time limit, you get unending feces because someone eventually notices you are on one side, and your squad mate is on the other side (SPYEZZZZ!!!!)
I guess there IS more to know, huh?
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Italians switched sides when ENY became a problem.
and the Germans ran out of perk points
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im surprised there is an ENY argument at all. looks like the ganger/ runner/ hiders cant freakin stand it. the ENY exists because people do not police themselves worth a crap. so HTC has to do it for them. if there werent an ENY it would be even worse than it is now with all the easy moders jumping to the high number/winning team, essentially, to avoid (pretend)combat at all costs.
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and the Germans ran out of perk points
see if there had been eny during ww2, the allies would have been flying bostons and p40's into germany. b29's would have been grounded, along with lancs and most other heavy bombers. the german's would have had really cheap 262's, they would have decimated the entire allied airforce.
semp
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im surprised there is an ENY argument at all. looks like the ganger/ runner/ hiders cant freakin stand it. the ENY exists because people do not police themselves worth a crap. so HTC has to do it for them. if there werent an ENY it would be even worse than it is now with all the easy moders jumping to the high number/winning team, essentially, to avoid (pretend)combat at all costs.
I find it hilarious how many posts here start with "eny dont bother me as I only fly high eny planes but....". me I fly the ponyd, I love the plane, I dont care about the eny as long as I get to fly my pony.
btw I have yet to have trouble switching and switching back to join my squadies on squad night. yesterday the knights were being double teamed. so we killed as many reds as we could, it was fun. not like we take bases anyway. bbaw still has the goons under lock and key.
semp
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see if there had been eny during ww2, the allies would have been flying bostons and p40's into germany.
And the Poles would have flown La7s against P39Ds. Again, this highlights the difference between the sim people and the game people.
- oldman
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And the Poles would have flown La7s against P39Ds. Again, this highlights the difference between the sim people and the game people.
- oldman
actualy the la7 were russians and the p39's werent germans. so not sure what to say.
semp
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They had the perks, but someone shut down the fuel, and killed the HQ, the Germans got pissed off and logged.
and the Germans ran out of perk points
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1939 russians attacked from the east side, as the germans where on the west, Typical bish-knight low ENY sandwich against the poor rooks :bolt:
Why the allied did not declare war on the Russians also, is something for historians to sort out.
actualy the la7 were russians and the p39's werent germans. so not sure what to say.
semp
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all of your reasoning is flawed.
1) the large number of country A could be in GVs. and country A are out numbered in the air but still victims of ENY.
2) Large umbers are scattered all over the large map but country B is concentrating on rolling bases in the corner of the map. I'm defending and grossly out numbered, and I'm a victim of ENY, so I have to defend in a P-40.
I've never seen ENY do what you say....
SAVE on 200: "Really enjoying being 3-on-1'd now that they're doing it in 109 G-14s."
That it somehow addresses a ganging problem and stops you from complaining about it is all made up theory for the BBS. Everyone complains about being ganged every time it happens. Now we can just add the complaints of people being forced out of their rides.
And it's not me usually because I fly 109s and the best one is 15 I think. But I've been on when ENY was 35! and enemy darbars were bigger than ours.
This year - so far - you have 18 kills in planes, 16 in 109K4's, and two in Hurri-2's.
It looks as it's a a small risk you have to outclimb someone in a 109g14 :D
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I love eny system and always hope us knit wits are out numbered.
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The most straw men I have seen for a while.
HiTech
Nothing straw about those observations. :salute
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im surprised there is an ENY argument at all. looks like the ganger/ runner/ hiders cant freakin stand it. the ENY exists because people do not police themselves worth a crap. so HTC has to do it for them. if there werent an ENY it would be even worse than it is now with all the easy moders jumping to the high number/winning team, essentially, to avoid (pretend)combat at all costs.
A valid theory....
If true there would be data showing population migrations from teams with fewer to teams with more players. And that the rate of change would increase as a function of the diffrence in player numbers.
Then there would be data after ENY that shows that it corrects the situation by creating a negative rate of change of player growth as a funtion of population, resulting in more player number stability over time.
Does such data exist?
(http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/zz12/vinkman/POPvsTime.png)
(http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/zz12/vinkman/rocvspop_1.png)
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vinkman the point of eny is to stop one country from having 80(not sure of the actual percentage) percent of the players every day. like it has happened in the past.
so less players will switch to the high side while at the same time to give an incentive for some to switch from the high side to the low side.
semp
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I am not a fan of ENY. I understand why it is there, I am not convinced it works as intended and I am still not a fan :)
I agree that as a community the player base is incapable of policing itself. Most are here for their own gains and don't really care about whether the other guy is having fun or not.
- If they are runners they will find a plane to run in - ENY or not. I have seen slow planes run from slower planes. ENY will not affect that. It is their $15
- If they are buff pilots and prone to avoid conflict they will still milk run and bail. ENY will not affect that - It is their $15
- If they are GV drivers they will still look to spawn camp where possible. If they cannot spawn camp they will try to get a high value tank and sit on tarmac to tower at the first sign of trouble. ENY will not affect that. - It is their $15
- ENY exists to encourage players to level the sides by joining the low side. It does not work. In fact, I change sides a lot to go to the low pop side and I get regular abuse about being a spy. - Hey, it is their $15
My belief is that despite the good intentions it actually does little in terms of game play.
ENY, however, is not killing this game. The player base is! We would do well to put more effort into that than worry about ENY. But you know the biggest stumbling block to that is........yep. it is their $15.
People care about themselves. It is the way the world is sadly.
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What Eny 40 plane can they run away from a fight in ?
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The most straw men I have seen for a while.
HiTech
They never get near any kind of fire.
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What Eny 40 plane can they run away from a fight in ?
What I got from his statement is no matter the ENY, the run-from-a-fight player will run. He will just not stick around as long and run sooner (purse swinging) if he's in a high eny plane.
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What I got from his statement is no matter the ENY, the run-from-a-fight player will run. He will just not stick around as long and run sooner (purse swinging) if he's in a high eny plane.
It's amazing how many people will run from any kind of alt disadvantage, even from a far inferior aircraft. The same people will come back and try and pick you while you are fighting two of their friends.
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It should be seen as an ideal opportunity to get seat time in some of the earlier war higher ENY rides.
You'd be surprised how much fun many of them are to fly, some are a challenge and it is challenging yourself which is rewarding.
It goes without saying that you'll learn more and faster if you are being challenged.
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It goes without saying that you'll learn more and faster if you are being challenged.
Why do you always assume that the goal of every single player is to learn to be the bestest fastest?
It's amazing how many people will run from any kind of alt disadvantage, even from a far inferior aircraft. The same people will come back and try and pick you while you are fighting two of their friends.
Worse yet, it amazes me how many people will run from an alt equivalency. I'd say well over half of the people I run into at 20k dive to the deck if you're even a couple thousand feet below them... No comprende.
Wiley.
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Why do you always assume that the goal of every single player is to learn to be the bestest fastest?
Wiley.
You did not notice "fun" in my post? It was placed before learning.
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You did not notice "fun" in my post? It was placed before learning.
Same thing applies, really. You assume others' idea of fun is the same as yours. I'd say the arena behavior blatantly shows most people don't find challenging themselves fun.
Wiley.
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I'm challenging myself to have the most ho kills using rockets. so far 3 .
semp
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Oh Wiley, tell us what the others want.
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Oh Wiley, tell us what the others want.
I don't have to, they show us every time we play. You're the one on about how everybody should go about having fun.
Wiley.
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You're the one on about how everybody should go about having fun.
Wiley.
...
EDIT, Forget it.
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No one sees the clarity of the math?
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No one sees the clarity of the math?
The "math" is only what is available to us. HTC has much better sources to compile a much better picture, and so make a much better decision.
I do know that I no longer log on and see that we are out numbered AGAIN, have BOTH team attacking us AGAIN and seeing people log out as fast as they log in for weeks on end. Sure we get ganged sometimes, but so do the other teams, and it rotates almost daily it seems.
ENY works. The side are not unbalanced for long periods of time any more.
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The "math" is only what is available to us. HTC has much better sources to compile a much better picture, and so make a much better decision.
I do know that I no longer log on and see that we are out numbered AGAIN, have BOTH team attacking us AGAIN and seeing people log out as fast as they log in for weeks on end. Sure we get ganged sometimes, but so do the other teams, and it rotates almost daily it seems.
ENY works. The side are not unbalanced for long periods of time any more.
Perhaps people just aren't bothering to login any more... :(
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Perhaps people just aren't bothering to login any more... :(
I agree, but I highly doubt it is because of ENY. I think it is more due to poor game play. My squad ran an op last night covering 3 sectors.... a squad limit :D. We hit a strat, and two V bases all with in a sector of a number of bases, at a reasonable alt and only had one taker, a duce looking for a few easy buff kills. Tough to want to log in and play a combat game where most players seem to try to avoid combat :rolleyes:
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fugitive what game do you play? i was on for a couple of hours yesterday and i had no problem getting killed within 5 minutes of upping. was a lot of fun.
perhaps you will find a fight if you look at the map and find the biggest enemy dar bar and fly towards it. or you can fly towards where there's no dar bar and complain that there's no fights.
semp
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I agree, but I highly doubt it is because of ENY. I think it is more due to poor game play. My squad ran an op last night covering 3 sectors.... a squad limit :D. We hit a strat, and two V bases all with in a sector of a number of bases, at a reasonable alt and only had one taker, a duce looking for a few easy buff kills. Tough to want to log in and play a combat game where most players seem to try to avoid combat :rolleyes:
ENY limits my enthusiasm for playing.
I am surely not alone.
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We are one step from "I log off because there are other players are looking to shoot me down".
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fugitive what game do you play? i was on for a couple of hours yesterday and i had no problem getting killed within 5 minutes of upping. was a lot of fun.
perhaps you will find a fight if you look at the map and find the biggest enemy dar bar and fly towards it. or you can fly towards where there's no dar bar and complain that there's no fights.
semp
I was on for only a couple hours last night. Choices were join the rook horde attacking a base, defend a base from the knit horde, or maybe generate a fight with the squad. Squad went up created a dar bar and only had one taker.
So the choice was be one of 5 on 1, be stuck under a 5 on 1 were the game was only bag and drag tactics or just cruise around dropping bombs on undefended targets. Yup was a fun night. :rolleyes:
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a funny thing. taking off with your squad makes you part of a horde. so next time take your horde, attack the other horde and it could be an awesome fight.
or you can keep taking your horde to the middle of nowhere, hoping that another horde will attack you.
semp
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I was on for only a couple hours last night. Choices were join the rook horde attacking a base, defend a base from the knit horde, or maybe generate a fight with the squad. Squad went up created a dar bar and only had one taker.
So the choice was be one of 5 on 1, be stuck under a 5 on 1 were the game was only bag and drag tactics or just cruise around dropping bombs on undefended targets. Yup was a fun night. :rolleyes:
Knights had 3 sectors of dar on rook front and 2 sectors of dar on bish front....we had more red guys then we could handle...was a GREAT night to be a knit.
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fugitive what game do you play? i was on for a couple of hours yesterday and i had no problem getting killed within 5 minutes of upping. was a lot of fun.
perhaps you will find a fight if you look at the map and find the biggest enemy dar bar and fly towards it. or you can fly towards where there's no dar bar and complain that there's no fights.
semp
:aok
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We are one step from "I log off because there are other players are looking to shoot me down".
it practically is like that right now.
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I was on for only a couple hours last night. Choices were join the rook horde attacking a base, defend a base from the knit horde, or maybe generate a fight with the squad. Squad went up created a dar bar and only had one taker.
So the choice was be one of 5 on 1, be stuck under a 5 on 1 were the game was only bag and drag tactics or just cruise around dropping bombs on undefended targets. Yup was a fun night. :rolleyes:
I was there with you, what's new? Atleast we had a bit of fun with Junky.
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I was there with you, what's new? Atleast we had a bit of fun with Junky.
Had fun against my terrible aim :aok
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it practically is like that right now.
you can read the minds of thousands of players? amazing.
semp
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it practically is like that right now.
Map Size : Player Ratio = Too Big
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The "math" is only what is available to us. HTC has much better sources to compile a much better picture, and so make a much better decision.
I do know that I no longer log on and see that we are out numbered AGAIN, have BOTH team attacking us AGAIN and seeing people log out as fast as they log in for weeks on end. Sure we get ganged sometimes, but so do the other teams, and it rotates almost daily it seems.
ENY works. The side are not unbalanced for long periods of time any more.
I made up the numbers. My point was there would be metrics like this that prove the theory of what ENY accomplishes. Asking stats ilo anecdotal evidence. :salute
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Well you almost never get numbers out of HTC. If it is still setup in the arena, then you have to trust that the numbers still prove out it works as intended.
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It really gets down to this. It is HTC's game. They make the rules. If it were someone else, they would make different rules. If it were my game, I would make different rules, and people would be squeaking about my rules.
The guy that digs the hole, decides where the flag post goes.