Author Topic: Becoming a Trainer  (Read 2558 times)

Offline humble

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« Reply #15 on: August 17, 2005, 09:10:53 PM »
Ted,

Most of the folks who responded here either have been trainers....or have significant experience helping others. As I stated in my original response....there is no basis to dispute Silate's selection. He is exceptionally qualified for the task....

I think you need to realize that an exceptional individual was choosen and not make it a personal issue. He'll be an outstanding addition to an already strong group. When you compare your overall experience to many in the "training corp" you'll realize that you (like many of us) have a long way to go on the open ended scale.....

"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it."-Pres. Thomas Jefferson

Offline Murdr

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« Reply #16 on: August 17, 2005, 09:11:32 PM »
Around 2 years ago, I know that Silat was assembling his own custom help file.  I know this because he asked to include material I wrote.

As a former AW CM and Trainer, I applaud your efforts, but taking your complaints here is not going to help your cause.

Offline BTW

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« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2005, 09:17:53 PM »
What I find in short supply, is not trainers, but "what next?"

So you've read Shaw. So you know what goes up must come down. So you've boiled and busted eggs. What next? How do I pursue a plan?  Where do you go from average to the next level. In AW and AH I have not seen anyone teach this. JMO - don't get mad. In the end I've found the answer was to "fight harder" but not how. I have been the target in many training sessions. I have yet to be trained- and thats over 15 years.

Show me films of a player being taken from newbie to a threat. It doesn't exist. Perseverance and ingenuity are the only things I know will get you there. Nobody is going to see you get better than them.

Offline TequilaChaser

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« Reply #18 on: August 17, 2005, 09:32:11 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by BTW
What I find in short supply, is not trainers, but "what next?"

So you've read Shaw. So you know what goes up must come down. So you've boiled and busted eggs. What next? How do I pursue a plan?  Where do you go from average to the next level. In AW and AH I have not seen anyone teach this. JMO - don't get mad. In the end I've found the answer was to "fight harder" but not how. I have been the target in many training sessions. I have yet to be trained- and thats over 15 years.

Show me films of a player being taken from newbie to a threat. It doesn't exist. Perseverance and ingenuity are the only things I know will get you there. Nobody is going to see you get better than them.


BTW ( etch ) I am reading from your post that you have hit a plateau, we can get you across this so you can "Find What Is Next!"  one thing you must consider though some people can become KILLERS in as little as 18 months and then some individuals can fly all their life in an online Sim and never get a step further than average.

As noted above, The Training Corps/Program is being restructured. As for you not seeing anyone teaching "What's Next" in AW ( I find this truely hard to believe) and  can tell you it is being worked on in AH. It is taught, but not on a regular basis. Once the restructuring is inplace I hope all find a better more productive and useful TA and Training Structure.

One more thing....don't expect  the restructuring to ressemble something like AW had. It will be uniquely formatted for Aces High  and all will gain knowledge from it...........(hoping I have not let my mouth overload my rear :( )
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline SuperDud

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« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2005, 09:42:43 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by BTW
What I find in short supply, is not trainers, but "what next?"

So you've read Shaw. So you know what goes up must come down. So you've boiled and busted eggs. What next? How do I pursue a plan?  Where do you go from average to the next level. In AW and AH I have not seen anyone teach this. JMO - don't get mad. In the end I've found the answer was to "fight harder" but not how. I have been the target in many training sessions. I have yet to be trained- and thats over 15 years.

Show me films of a player being taken from newbie to a threat. It doesn't exist. Perseverance and ingenuity are the only things I know will get you there. Nobody is going to see you get better than them.


I can say for fact that ANY of the trainers can take you from avg to being the tops. I've only been playin AH for about 8 months now and for the 1st 4 to 5 months I stayed in the TA/DA exclusively working with TC, Ren, Fuze, Hammer.... I could go on and on. Having done that I can now at least compete with the best. I have them, along with vets that I'd run into in there, to thank for it. The key IMO BTW is to dedicate yourself to it. I think most get bored mindlessly doing the same thing over and over and getting beat up. They get discourged and quit, that just doesn't work. I feel you just have to be willing to day in and day out devote a good portion of your flying time to the DA/TA. Most don't b/c it's "not as fun" but if you do it and stick with it, it pays off. Look at me, I'm one of the TA poster boys lol.
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Offline jetb123

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« Reply #20 on: August 17, 2005, 09:56:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
Maybe the training staff wanted someone that could actually teach a new player ACM and the other fine points of air combat other than how to HO?

And we all know that only reason +Silat got the job is that he looks good in heels and a skirt.  Ever thought of trying that?  



ack-ack
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Offline Ack-Ack

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« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2005, 10:24:18 PM »
And even though you're not a trainer Ted, there is nothing stopping you from continuing to help new and veteran players alike.  Do what a few of us do and post films of our fights to show certain maneuvers or tactics or even post some of your tips.  Don't need to be a trainer to do that.  



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Offline Widewing

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« Reply #22 on: August 18, 2005, 12:04:21 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by BTW
What I find in short supply, is not trainers, but "what next?"

So you've read Shaw. So you know what goes up must come down. So you've boiled and busted eggs. What next? How do I pursue a plan?  Where do you go from average to the next level. In AW and AH I have not seen anyone teach this. JMO - don't get mad. In the end I've found the answer was to "fight harder" but not how. I have been the target in many training sessions. I have yet to be trained- and thats over 15 years.

Show me films of a player being taken from newbie to a threat. It doesn't exist. Perseverance and ingenuity are the only things I know will get you there. Nobody is going to see you get better than them.


Part of the problem is that while you can tell someone to do something, you can't actually make them do it. Everyone is different. Everyone has different potential. Some guys have a naturally better grasp of their immediate environment.

The next time you drive anywhere, observe the other drivers. Some, no matter how many years they drive, will never be more than dangerous. Many are generally clueless to what's going on around them. You can try to teach them the principles of awareness, you can try to help them have a better grasp of speed and distance, but you cannot step inside their heads and engrave it into their understanding

As trainers, all we can do is provide information and examples. We cannot do any more for the poor pilot than a teacher can do for a slower student. That's why some kids excel at physics and others struggle with simple algebra. All we can do is try to help these people achieve the greatest level they are capable of. If that level is high, great! But, most players are going to be average at best and a number will never even get that good. Those are facts of life, unfortunate, but true.

Nothing anyone teaches you is more valuable than experience. People graduate college every spring with terrific grades, only to prove to be less than capable at a real job because all the education in the world cannot replace basic experience. Recently, my MA squad went to the TA and worked on merges. The fellow I was working with was appalled at how quickly I was able to reverse. Merely explaining it did not help him, he needed to apply what he heard and saw. That takes time and perseverance. He has improved and will continue to do so as long as he works at it. When I first started playing this game, I was in the same position. Players with far more experience were getting around on me so fast I was nearly convinced they had a cheat worked out. But, with time and experience I was able to improve to the point that those guys were no longer able to gain an advantage. As trainers, we can only offer explanations and provide examples, we cannot fly the plane for you.

Ultimately, the way you improve in this game is by flying, and flying often. Adding to that is a solid understanding of tactics. Adding further is the ability to fly your aircraft to its absolute limits and beyond. All of these things are almost exclusively the responsibility of the player to learn. Understanding the strengths and weaknesses of one's fighter is essential. Knowing your enemy's aircraft is equally important. Just because I can stall fight Spitfires with a P-51 doesn't mean I will do so in the MA. That's fighting to my enemy's strengths. What I want him to do is fight against my strengths. In other words, I want to force him to fight against my plane's strengths. Maximizing your advantage requires a pilot to fully understand the capabilities of both aircraft.

Another thing that is overlooked can be defined in a well known, but simple statement: "You will never rise above the level of your competition". This means that winning dogfights in the TA against other noobs is not a valid measure of ability. That is why I try to get the new players to practice dogfighting with Trainers. My personal view is that it is counter-productive to "go easy" on a new player. Sure, you give him plenty of opportunities to shoot so that he at least gets the basics of gunnery down. But, remind them that they have a long way to climb on the learning curve. However, I sometimes think that guys get a false sense of confidence, which gets shattered by the first decent pilot they encounter in the MA. Different environments call for different tactics.  

The fact remains that there are guys who will find their Spitfire being outflown by a P-47 or an F4U. They cannot understand why this happens, because they always lose to Spits when they fly the P-47 or F4U. This happens because they can only utilize 80% of the Spitire's capablility, while that F4U driver is getting everything out of his plane that it's capable of.

For every Robert Johnson and Ira Bong, there were hundreds of average pilots. Nothing anyone does can elevate them to Johnson's level. Making Johnsons and Bongs out of a Joe Average is not something a trainer can ever accomplish. Ultimately, the only person who can make you better is you.

As to Silat; there wasn't a better qualified candidate for trainer than Silat in the entire AH2 population. Lew is a good teacher and has a tremdous amount of experience. He is also a heck of a nice guy. When the trainers were asked what they thought of adding Silat, every one of us gave him the highest endorsement.

It is almost a certainty that additional trainers will be needed. However, as we all can see, the game is in transition. When TOD debuts, the demand for trainers is expected to increase and slots will likely be added. So, those of you who want to be trainers should not be discouraged. We certainly appreciate the efforts of those who pitch in and help new players. With or without a title, such contributions are important. As TC stated, their efforts will not go unnoticed by HTC.

My regards,

Widewing
« Last Edit: August 18, 2005, 12:07:22 AM by Widewing »
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Silat

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Re: Becoming a Trainer
« Reply #23 on: August 18, 2005, 12:09:24 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ted Strykker
I have played this game for long enough.


I go into the TA today and see that Silat has been made a trainer.

I havn,t seen him in there that much at all in Ah-1 or Ah-2 but now he gets a  trainer postion,when i ask how he says "well i was a trainer in AW".

So my question is this,does a person get a trainer postion based on "The Buddy System" ,or does a person become a trainer based on his time spent in the TA helping people and making sure that others don't disrupt that?



Im not sure what you mean by havent seen me much in ah1 or 2 but my addiction speaks for itself:)


Ive been helping people since beta in AH. I was in the training corp in AW. That doesnt mean that I get to be a trainer. Actually I think it was the box of New York steaks and a night with Fifi the love ewe that I arranged for TC that did the trick.

Also the hi heels and lingerie I now wear might have helped too.

And when you asked me about being a trainer I didnt really know what to say as I thought you were being sarcastic:) So all I could think of was that I had experience which was what my comment meant.

I must say though that you would be better served talking privately to the head trainer when you want information about being a trainer.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2005, 12:41:08 AM by Silat »
+Silat
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Offline Silat

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« Reply #24 on: August 18, 2005, 12:27:08 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ted Strykker
He was an example  

 

You want the person that can best interprut the game too someone that doesn,t have a clue.I heard Silat today telling a new pilot too E-mail him so he could send him the help file,the new pilot was confused,he could have just told the new pilot too go too the HiTech web site and download it from there,or gave him the address too that site,instead he chose too confuse the new pilot.


Ted I have my own helpfiles that I compiled myself which include the files from HTC. I tell the pilots to write me personally so they can have it. It has pictures so that they can setup easily. I didnt confuse anyone. Im not sure why you are critiquing me? Oh and by the way that newbie wrote me and now has the helpfiles:).

I don,t really think any of you have the patience it takes too deal with someone who doesn,t even know how too type or talk for that matter.

I have called dozens of people long distance in America and Europe to help them understand setup and the radio. Ive never left anyone hanging..

Because the majority of you that are in the MA and someone new is asking for help ,1/2 the time people tell the new pilot too go too the TA.That's where people like myself who enjoy showing the new pilots how too get started and what does what ,that has the patience and the time too do so.

 


WTG Keep up the good work.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2005, 12:33:16 AM by Silat »
+Silat
"The first time someone shows you who they are, believe them." — Maya Angelou
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Offline Roscoroo

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« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2005, 01:57:43 AM »
Silat ...When are you gonna wear those purple heals and the striped stockings again ? ...

:D
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Offline Silat

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« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2005, 02:07:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Roscoroo
Silat ...When are you gonna wear those purple heals and the striped stockings again ? ...

:D



Rosco this weekend.
+Silat
"The first time someone shows you who they are, believe them." — Maya Angelou
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Offline WMLute

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« Reply #27 on: August 18, 2005, 02:10:16 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Silat
I have called dozens of people long distance in America and Europe to help them understand setup and the radio. Ive never left anyone hanging.


About a year and 1/2 ago (possibly less) Silat called me at home and tried to help me out with a technical issue.  We exchanged many emails, and the bottom line is he went above and beyond.

He's one of the "good guys".  Those rare someones that make the game better every chance they get.

Don't be to distressed about not makin' the Training Corps.  I once asked Ghost about being a trainer, and spent an hour a day, every day for several months (ish, i'm sure i missed a couple days) helping out in the TA.  

Never did get the invite...  and I would like to think I'm one of the "good ole' boys" but come to think of it, maybe not....  I woulda had the Trainer slot if I was eh?

I'm MORE concerned that Silat choose the Training Corps over the Campaign Managers (yeah, yeah lew, I know, your schedule) but I woulda been happy to duel TC over who get's Silat.

All in all, from the sour grapes that I have read here, and in many, many other posts by you, I would say you need look no further as to why you were not invited.  Why would HTC want someone helping them out, that exhibit this sort of behavior?  THAT is the question to ask oneself.  It wouldn't matter HOW many new players someone helped out if they go off the deep end on a consistent basis.  That is just a headache that neither TC, nor HTC needs or wants.

Me? It worked out in the end with me.  I found a home as a CM for SnapShots and King of the Hill, and am quite happy with getting AH special events to a new level of "coolness".  

My advice Ted would be to just keep pluggin' away.  Get involved in the game as much as possible.  Get yourself "known" as a level headed, helpful sort, and I am positive you will see the opportunities you seek come your way.  Many who have chimed in on this thread have your best interests (and the game of course) at heart, so please take the constructive criticism as it is intended, to help YOU out.
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Offline Ted Strykker

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« Reply #28 on: August 18, 2005, 02:47:25 AM »
You know lute this was a thread directed at 1 of the trainers not anyone else.

for the 3rd and final time i was not saying anything bad about silat,everyone else that responed turned it into that just like in every other thread.

And as far as coolness in the SEA,It will never be the way itr was when the 880 had a Hand in it.

Offline Ghosth

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« Reply #29 on: August 18, 2005, 06:12:12 AM »
How many people do you think have active accounts in Aces High?

Personally I'm guessing between 5 & 10 thousand, but it could be quite a bit higher.

There are exactly 10 trainers.

So for every 1000 people who ask "how can I be a trainer?" we have to find a way to let them down easy, keep them still interested, keep them still helping.  And keep an eye on them to see if they really do have potential.

1 of those 1000 people will "at some point" be selected to be a trainer. That one has to not only be good, he has to excell. Of all our current trainers, all of them excell at something.  Silat excells in many areas, it was literally no contest.

Last, Silat did not ask to be a trainer.
He knew the job, had the tools for the job, and was doing the job long before we had a open spot.  All we did was make it offical.

Yes I am no longer the head Trainer, TC is. However, if I have taught this bunch of maroons ANYTHING.  It is that trainers have to be chosen.  Power corrupts, trainers have close to absolute power in the TA. Enough so that that trainers have to be selected not only by what they know, and can teach,  but by how well they can deal with power.
 Temptation comes in many forms
and its more seductive than Brittany Spears. Trainers must be solid mature adults to be able to deal with it.

I'll even give you an example.

Artlaw = Great pilot, nice guy, terrible trainer. Not because he couldn't teach, because he can. But because he lost control.

Silat = Great pilot, nice guy, good trainer.  Not because he can teach (50% of AH pilots can teach) But because he is ROCK SOLID.

Ted, for all practical purposes you can pretty much figure that this thread has removed any chance you had for the next year or 2.  Yes you have been flying AH long enough to be able to pass at least some of that on. Its a shame that you'll probably stop doing that.


As for you WmLute, glad to see that you found another home.  You'd of made a good trainer, in a year or so.
You gave up way too soon bro.
Patience is a virtue  :)


Of course the real test of any trainer is time. Looking back at the choices I've made I see some good, some bad, some exceptional.

TC got lucky, he picked one solid gold winner right off the start. That alone tells me that the TA corp is in good hands.