Author Topic: "I'm very, very sorry ... " (Read 2384 times)

StSanta · « **Reply #30 on:** July 28, 2001, 12:43:00 AM »

Hm, tough one when kids are involved.

Kids aren't granted the same rights as adults, i.e they do not receive the same priviledges. The natural question that comes as a result of this is: should they receive the same punishment?

Another aspect to take into account is the possibility of rehabilitation - something our criminal system is built around to a large extent. It is my opinion that kids generally have a better chance at this.

But, to deal with the original question: should it matter in regards to the punishment within the law onf the country the crime was committed that heis sorry and remorseful? Not one bit. Even for kids, responsibility is paramount. This is a harsh cause and effect lesson for this one, but not nearly as harsh a "lesson" as he gave to the teacher and his family.

LePaul · « **Reply #31 on:** July 28, 2001, 01:21:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Kieran:
Typically a criminal serves 1/2 time with good behavior. He will be out by 27.

Maybe. After 13 years with Bubba...

texace · « **Reply #32 on:** July 28, 2001, 02:02:00 AM »

There is absolutly no way that this kid "accidentally" shot his teacher. I knew when I was 11 years old how to fire a gun, and by 16 I have become a proficiant marksman. Reading his statement saying "I thought the safty was on" is an out-and-out lie. He knew the gun was ready to fire. He knew that it was loaded. He had the INTENT to kill this teacher because of rage he felt when he was suspended. There is no way he "accidentally" shot a teacher in the face from less than 20 feet. He wanted to shoot the teacher, he wanted him to pay for suspending him. Now he believes that if he says he's sorry, he can get away free. "I know you're sorry, but do you apoligize?"

And I swear that if the media and liberals and soccer moms say "The games he played and the music he listened to propted him to do this." There is a huge thread on the Day of Defeat forums about a guy wanting parents to sue Sierra (Half-Life creator) because the game was/is "too violent" It is not the music's fault he killed someone. It is not a game's fault he killed someone. It is his own damn fault.....

[ 07-28-2001: Message edited by: texace ]

Dowding · « **Reply #33 on:** July 28, 2001, 04:04:00 AM »

"He doesn't need punishment - he needs 'gun-ishment'"

Creamo · « **Reply #34 on:** July 28, 2001, 04:21:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by blur:

Also this is a poor black kid. If he were rich and white would he be in the same predicament?

A society that eats its young is a society in decay.

Most of that post is absurd and edited out, but these points are easy targets.

If he was rich and white, would he be in the same predicament? Do you mean as far as acting like a animal and shooting a teacher in the face? I'd say no. Most rich kids are rich because they have successful, hard working parents. Usually, success comes by being reasonably intelligent. Not without exception, but it’s fair to assume that. I really don’t see where race plays a issue here though. This liberal roadkill stereotyping everyone that has had enough of the violent little toejams BUT the criminals who perpetrate these horrendous crimes is ridiculous.

I have no problem being prejudice against little gangbanging pieces of toejam, and if they tend to be young, black, shooting guns, acting like lawless barbarians, so be it. Join hands with him when he gets out of jail, sign songs of love and peace, and have him baby-sit your daughters. Me, I’m for killing the bastard, and showing the tape in schools like the bloody drivers Ed films.

As far as eating our young, I think that’s a nice nod to what nature intended. Get these criminals out of the gene pool, just like weak young getting eaten in the wild.

Have a nice day. 

Betown · « **Reply #35 on:** July 28, 2001, 05:19:00 AM »

I am sorry to have to but in at such a late date with this thread. But Eagler, you have such a clouded view of "Justice" that it is close to being unbelievable.

This kid is 14 years old. I would just like to make that point 14 He shot a teacher and killed him, which in all moral and physical senses is VERY wrong. Murder is the single biggest crime out there along with Rape. Both crimes are totally deplorable. But the main reason why I totally disagree with the death penalty is because of precisely that. Killing & Murder is wrong.

It seems like the Justice system in many States of the USA is totally dependant on Vengeance. Its the whole "If you hurt us we are going to hurt you back" syndrome.

If a 14 year old CHILD has the mental aptitude to go and KILL someone, then this child is in need of help. Send the little bastard to Prison, lock him up for 20 years but unless we do something to help him while he is there, then how is society ever going to function properly?

IMO, the process of Capital Punishment is wrong. Totally wrong. It's a Medieval practice from hundreds of years ago and has NO place in modern society. I really can't believe that in countries that are supposed to be civilised we can still resort to an action like this.

I personally find this thread very sad and hurtful. I also find it deplorable that any of you could condone killing a Child.

IMO you should be ashamed of yourselves.

Creamo · « **Reply #36 on:** July 28, 2001, 07:00:00 AM »

In the sense of knowing what killing was, I was no child at 14. Were you?

SOB · « **Reply #37 on:** July 28, 2001, 07:17:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Betown:
I personally find this thread very sad and hurtful. I also find it deplorable that any of you could condone killing a Child.

IMO you should be ashamed of yourselves.

No, the "kid" AKA Cold Blooded Murderer should be ashamed of himself. Right up until the time of his execution.

SOB

Toad · « **Reply #38 on:** July 28, 2001, 07:21:00 AM »

Supposedly no parole.

From CNN:

Under that law, anyone convicted of carrying a gun during a crime faces 10 years in prison. Those who fire a gun during a crime face a mandatory 20 years in prison, and those who fire a gun, harming or killing someone during a crime face 25 years-to-life with no parole and no time deducted for good behavior

American Justice is about Vengeance? Not at all.

Zero Recidivism? ABSOLUTELY!

"Only one murder per customer, please! Wait in line, your turn on the gurney is coming."

Never had an exectued murderer commit another crime of any sort as far as I know.

[ 07-28-2001: Message edited by: Toad ]

flakbait · « **Reply #39 on:** July 28, 2001, 08:25:00 AM »

My personal take on it is this. If you are old enough to know how to use a firearm, then you are old enough to be executed for the murder of another human being. This kid got a burr up his bellybutton about failing in school, being suspended, and a load of other crap, then killed his teacher. I didn't do so hot in school, I had access to firearms, and you know what I did? Nothing. I got pissed at the teachers, voiced my opinion LOUDLY about them, but I never thought about taking a gun to school. Another kid in similar shoes as mine used a home-made bomb to blow out a wall of lockers about a week after I quit. Sent five people to the hospital, and the kid went off to juvy. How long he was there I don't know.

As far as the death penalty goes? I think you should get two appeals, taking no longer than five years. Once year six rolls around, I say we hand your bellybutton over to the Marines for "weapons testing" purposes. Maybe send you to a foriegn country to clear landmines by walking around the mine field. Since you commited a crime warranting a punishment of death, you should have the worst possible death. No honorable little walk to a small room with loved ones, no press coverage, no last meal request, nothing. Your sorry bellybutton is blasted into kibble for the local critters to feast on. Weapons testing makes the most sense to me; how else is the Army gonna know if their new gun can kill?

Yes, I am a BAD American! I also hold no love for those convicted with such over-whelming evidence. You kill an innocent, you get killed in the worst possible way.

-----------------------
Flakbait [Delta6]
Delta Six's Flight School
Put the P-61B in Aces High
"For yay did the sky darken, and split open and spew forth fire, and
through the smoke rode the Four Wurgers of the Apocalypse.
And on their canopies was tattooed the number of the Beast, and the
number was 190." Jedi, Verse Five, Capter Two, The Book of Dweeb

Toad · « **Reply #40 on:** July 28, 2001, 08:32:00 AM »

One of the more flavorful ironies is that now the folks that think "Justice" was a little harsh on this poor misunderstood toddler are complaining that the "gun used in a crime" law is WAY TOO HARSH!

Same folks that continue to pound in the idea that the EVIL, INANIMATE guns are the problem.

So, how 'bout we get this youngsters .25 auto, strap it down on the gurney and inject it will rampant rust? Show it on national TV and all?

Kid should go free, of course. Gun is the perp.

Eagler · « **Reply #41 on:** July 28, 2001, 09:36:00 AM »

thanks for the support guys, glad to see there are still some that share my views on such an atrocity.

Can't begin to image how it will affect the students that had to experience the horror 1st hand. Too bad he can't be tried for the mental anguish he cause and will cause them for the rest of their lives. Just what I'd want my child to experience at school...

Life is too precious for some street punk, no matter the age, to cut it short and then not pay for it. The 10, 20, life jail sentence is something relatively new since the election of Jeb Bush as our gov. Put a bleeding heart lib in there, with the right cabinet and it goes bye - bye, with those charged under it gaining the right for parole. I'd be surprised if the creep stays in jail past his 18th birthday.

The really sad part is this crap goes on just about everyday, somewhere in our great country. Until the punishment outweighs the thrill/benny of committing such crimes, it will continue to. A 1000 foot well with a human bug zapper at the bottom sounds good to me...give him time to think/pray on the way down.

My prayers go out to his family, friends & students.

[ 07-28-2001: Message edited by: Eagler ]

Betown · « **Reply #42 on:** July 28, 2001, 10:16:00 AM »

I actually agree with you totally up to a point eagler, I think that this little bastard should be locked away for a good many years! What he did was horrific and should be punished by the harshest way possible but I am completely against capital punishment. I have not always been against it. I used to think that Capital punishment was a good deterrent and it helped in making people safer. But in truth (imo) it's not. People will still get murdered if you have people being executed or not. So why can't we help people for the greater good of society?

And No guys, I am sorry but you can't tell me that if you are old enough to know how to fire a firearm then you are old enough to be executed for it because that isn't right. If someone leaves a loaded gun lying around then unless the kid doesn't watch TV he will know how to use it.

I agree that we need to punish and reform, but two wrongs don't make a right. By killing someone else in COLD BLOOD as retaliation for what they did makes us (imo) as bad as the person who comitia the crime.

Nashwan · « **Reply #43 on:** July 28, 2001, 11:27:00 AM »

Quote

My personal take on it is this. If you are old enough to know how to use a firearm, then you are old enough to be executed for the murder of another human being

Quote

t was your average Tuesday morning at Theo J. Buell Elementary School, just north of Flint, Michigan. Six-year-old Kayla Renee Rolland was entering the hallway with 22 other first-graders when one of them, a boy she had quarreled with the day before, also 6, pulled a .32-caliber handgun out of his pocket. He shot her once in the chest, put the gun in a desk, and walked away.

Within minutes, Kayla was dead.

Fry the six year old bastard!

Quote

Dominique Wearing, 8, was killed by a handgun her 5-year-old brother retrieved from under their mother's bed.

5 year old scum like that should be lined up against a wall and shot.

Seriously, Flakbait, if you really meant what you wrote you are probably one of the sickest individuals it's ever been my misfortune to meet.

Quote

In the sense of knowing what killing was, I was no child at 14. Were you?

No, but like I said I knew what all the other things were too. Children are deemed to be too irresponsible to vote, because they're not mature enough to make sensible descisions. They aren't allowed to drive, even though every 10 year old knows what an accident is, knows people can die in them, probably even knows people who have been injured in a car accident. You wouldn't let a 10 year old drive on the roads though, would you?
If you believe a kid shouldn't be allowed to drive, or do any of the other things reserved for adults, it's hypocritical to say they are as responsible as adults for their actions. What is the purpose of the age limit on driving? Skill? watch kids playing video games and you'll see they have the same ability to learn the skills of driving as adults do.
14 is close to adulthood, and I wouldn't find the calls to execute the kid so repugnant if the same people making them also called for adult responsibility to begin at 14 in most other areas. How many support a school leaving age of 14, or the right to marry, especially without parental consent, at 14?
We do not trust children to make value judgements like these in most important areas, and whilst we accept they have a certain degree of freedom of decision, courts, the parents and public all believe a child at 14 is subject to parental control. What is the purpose of this if a child is as responsible as an adult?

StSanta · « **Reply #44 on:** July 28, 2001, 11:51:00 AM »

Killing children?

When will it ever stop?