Author Topic: Perk US bombers  (Read 4084 times)

Offline Debonair

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Perk US bombers
« Reply #60 on: February 04, 2007, 04:25:50 PM »
here is a chart of B-17F cruise settings
http://www.zenoswarbirdvideos.com/Images/B-17/17FOIC.pdf
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Offline Krusty

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« Reply #61 on: February 04, 2007, 04:33:36 PM »
Deb: the only thing I can make out is the word "IAS" -- I can't read any of the other info. Those IAS numbers seem high, as I've seen 2 other sources that cite 160mph cruise speeds for B17s (I believe B17Gs, the E was the fastest model, if I recall, and got slower with the F and G which had much more weight and more drag)

Offline tedrbr

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« Reply #62 on: February 04, 2007, 05:02:37 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
Okay let's consider that for a second. You say lancs are more common. Maybe that's just what you see. These are from last tour.....
 


A bit out of context.   I was disputing Bronk's:
Quote
It's about over use.  90% of heavy bombers seen are 24s. If HT can perk chog for over use why not the 24?


B-24's are not 9 out of 10- bombers seen in the arenas.  Lancs are not more common than B-24's, but a very large number of Lancs get flown.  B-24's are probably seen more at higher altitudes by serious buff drivers, they are probably more effective on a sortie by sortie basis due to defensive fire abilities, but that is also probably due to the suicidal nature in which Lancs are flown in game.... low, dive bombing, carpet bombing GV's and fields.  

Of course, there are exceptions to even this; some buff drivers out there swear by the Lanc, and use it almost exclusively (and players like me who avoid using it at all).

B-24's and B-17's are also more commonly seen in missions run by players using heavy bombers.  Rarely do you see a large box of Lancs over enemy territory.  But not enough missions running B-24's to account for 90% of all bombers seen in-game.  


As the B-24's were the most common bomber seen during the war, they should be common in-game, and I don't see the need for a perk.

As to the C-Hog; it was a minor subset of a series of fighters that in that list, where all models together rank 23rd overall.... in addition to the relative combat power of a Corsair with 4-20mm cannons, it get's lightly perked.  

Or as Bronk stated: "Apples to oranges."  Not very comparable examples.


As to the score, most of those Lancs I killed were low, and I either did a quick intercept from the threatened field, or hit them with man-ack.  I've gotten away from patrols and buff hunting lately.   And my heavy bomber of choice is the B-17 with 500 #r's  loaded, as I tend to go after strats, not hangars, since strats stay down longer.

Offline Krusty

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« Reply #63 on: February 04, 2007, 05:20:44 PM »
Okay, yesterday alone I saw 1 enemy mission with 20+ B24 formations. This started low and climbed to 20k. It flew across the entire knit front (not that we had much of one at the time). At the same time I saw a friendly B24 mission with at least 6-8 formations. Possibly more. They were retaking A18.

I also saw 5-6 scattered B24 missions from a16 hitting a14. There was 1 B26 formation, and 1 B17 formation. I also saw 2 scattered B17 formations in the course of the night, as well as 3 more B24s hitting A6.

Then there was another large mission hitting our P4 and HQ that involved more B24s. Estimate half a dozen. Then afterwards a lone Lancaster formation (maybe 2, but by the time I got to it there was only 1 left) snuck around the edge of the map and finished the HQ off.

So, that's 20 + 8 + 3 + 6 = 37 B24 formations, and 3 B17 formations and 1 B26 and 1 lanc formation.

42 total, 37 of them B24s. And that's just in the area I *saw*. There were a lot more bombing missions on the front opposite of me, I know because dar bars were spiking left and right.

So 37 / 42 = over 88% of the bombers in one night alone.

EDIT: Oh, and I just remembered seeing 4-5 more scattered friendly B24 formations trying to hit a16 before the crap hit the fans. That will bring the number up as well.

The "perk the B24" isn't just because of overall use. That's one of the main reasons. The C-hog was perked because it made up 20% of all the kills in the MA. The B-24 has 90%+ of all sorties in the MAs. You can't really count kills, nor can you really count ord on target, as you may never get kills and still bomb, or you may get shot down before you drop your bombs, so you have to just count raw numbers. B-24s have the most. So the most widely used bomber, with the best defensive firepower, the best range, the best speed and second best bombload (best not counting lancaster), is the best choice to be perked.

We have nothing to use our bomber perks on, or I'd not suggest this. This is not the typical "Perk the LA" thread. This is not the typical "Perk the P51!" thread. This is a thread attempting to address a problem unique to the bombers in Aces High.

What if the GVers had no perk ride. What if (for whatever reason) the Tiger's gun fired only 3 shots and had a reload speed of 1 minute, and had a top speed on level ground of 15mph? Then look at the Panzer stats. 99% of all tanks I see are panzers or the rare tiger. T-34s are more rare than tigers. I saw one last night and my jaw literally dropped. I should have taken a screenshot, it was so rare. Anyways, so if you had NO worthwhile perked GV and hundreds of GV perks to spend, it would be entirely reasonable to call for the perking of the Panzer.

Nobody would ever waste perks on the tigr in the above situation. Similarly, nobody is going to waste perks on an Ar234, when the unperked thing does the same job, only better.

So this isn't "look at the stats, look at the performance, look at the usage, add it to the perk list"  this is "We HAVE NO perk list, this is the best above and beyond all others, it should be at the top of the new perk list."
« Last Edit: February 04, 2007, 05:33:30 PM by Krusty »

Offline Spikes

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« Reply #64 on: February 04, 2007, 06:09:07 PM »
what you are saying is that the b24 is too powerful to be free?
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Offline Krusty

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« Reply #65 on: February 04, 2007, 06:16:32 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by spikes
what you are saying is that the b24 is too powerful to be free?



*sigh*


No.


No.


No.


How hard is this to explain?

The B-24 is the undefeated heavyweight champion of Aces High bombers. We have nothing useful to use our bomber perks on.

So perk the B24. It's the best by a long shot, and since we don't have anything better to perk, and since we won't get any perk-worthy bombers in the next 3+ years, perking the B-24 is the best thing to do for bomber pilots.

Offline Bronk

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« Reply #66 on: February 04, 2007, 06:20:02 PM »
Buff drivers in this game risk nothing unless in an arado.
Everything is gain.
 Go up drop one egg and hit anything points are scored.
Have 2 drones shot down but get the guy with your last plane , get points.

Put SOME risk into it.
A light perk on the 24 would do just that.

Bronk
See Rule #4

Offline Krusty

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« Reply #67 on: February 04, 2007, 06:20:44 PM »
Let me put it this way.

The only way we'll get a decent use for bomber perks is to perk a plane already in the game. There's no use waiting for some future plane to be perked.

So, out of the existing planes, what do you perk? The answer: The best plane. So out of the existing bombers, the B-24 wins hands-down in terms of usage and capability. Thus *IT* is the best bomber to perk, out of the existing bomber we have.

Offline Spikes

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« Reply #68 on: February 04, 2007, 06:21:05 PM »
exactly....what I am saying...the b24 is too powerful to be free=perk it


:O :O :O

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
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Offline Krusty

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« Reply #69 on: February 04, 2007, 06:23:12 PM »
That's not what I'm saying.

Offline Spikes

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« Reply #70 on: February 04, 2007, 06:25:50 PM »
:mad: :mad: :mad:


uhhhh, im saying the same thimg you are

:mad: :mad: :mad:
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Offline Krusty

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« Reply #71 on: February 04, 2007, 06:29:35 PM »
Who's on first! What's on second! I Don't Know's on third!

It sounds similar but it's not the same meaning.


The B-24 as it is probably is about the equivelant of the P51 for fighters.

It's generally not perk-worthy by itself.

It is ONLY perk-worthy when you consider we have nothing better to spend perks on. It is ONLY perk-worthy when you arbitrarily perk it for the sake of perking SOMEthing.

Offline Spikes

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« Reply #72 on: February 04, 2007, 06:34:53 PM »
i agree with that.....we are on the right track now :O
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Offline Debonair

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« Reply #73 on: February 04, 2007, 11:51:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Krusty
Deb: the only thing I can make out is the word "IAS" -- I can't read any of the other info. Those IAS numbers seem high, as I've seen....

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Offline Krusty

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« Reply #74 on: February 05, 2007, 12:03:56 AM »
What are you, related to Meatwad? Get serious here.