Dachau Waffen SS guard found in GA.

[Neubob]

Like I said Fishu, I think you just really want him to be innocent... Nothing wrong with that, I suppose.

I just really really want those that remain to pay--and not to the American authorities, but to the proper Nazi hunters... Nothing wrong with that either.

[DREDIOCK]

Originally posted by Neubob
Like I said Fishu, I think you just really want him to be innocent... Nothing wrong with that, I suppose.

I just really really want those that remain to pay--and not to the American authorities, but to the proper Nazi hunters... Nothing wrong with that either.

To get more back on topic and away from the hypothetical.

As I have stated before. If he indeed volounteered to this service. Then yes. he should be tried like the rest.

[Neubob]

Originally posted by DREDIOCK
To get more back on topic and away from the hypothetical.

As I have stated before. If he indeed volounteered to this service. Then yes. he should be tried like the rest.

Hey!

Did you just hijack a digression?

[FrodeMk3]

Originally posted by Neubob
Like I said Fishu, I think you just really want him to be innocent... Nothing wrong with that, I suppose.

I just really really want those that remain to pay--and not to the American authorities, but to the proper Nazi hunters... Nothing wrong with that either.

True, Neubob, but...If he's not given the full measure of justice, if he's simply deported, without any real evidence tying him to crimes he himself commited, then we establish a precedent that could be used against our own people.

I'm sure there will be more about this story in the days to come. This BBS took off on an emotional roller-coaster with only half the story told. He might honestly be guilty of these crimes; He might not. We don't know(yet) since this only broke recently.

[Fishu]

Originally posted by Neubob
Like I said Fishu, I think you just really want him to be innocent... Nothing wrong with that, I suppose.

I don't know what counts for "really wanting to be innocent". It just doesn't fit to describe my intentions. It's very sad to see people so willingly to lynch a 85-year old person without a second thought, only because back then a part of his organization threw people into concentration camps and killed them at will. Now some of us are prepared to do the same to him simply based on anecdoctal evidence.

Such mentality should not be part of the modern democracy. We think of ourselves civilized and value the justice system of our democracies, different from the horrible totalitarian systems, but in the blink of an eye we turn to a hysterical mass of people ready to lynch a person who was pointed out as a criminal by an organization with an ideology of their own. All that was needed was a piece of paper stating a person was listed as working at a concentration camp as part of Waffen-SS.

The SS is a magic word that makes the whole world turn around and people to forget the very principles we believe in. Injustice, which from we try to protect our society, becomes a part of us. Even Hitler himself should be given a fair trial, even though the end result would be obvious. That's how the democracy is meant to work, otherwise we will be no better than the one we're about to lynch.

This guy too deserves a fair trial and we should not jump to the conclusion without further knowledge of the scale of his involvement. The label SS is not a proof of guilt. Should he be a war criminal then let the court deal with him and let his soul burn in the hell for an eternity. In the case he's not a war criminal we owe him an apology.

It's easy to convict a person, but harder to undo it.

I just really really want those that remain to pay--and not to the American authorities, but to the proper Nazi hunters... Nothing wrong with that either.

I too want them to pay dearly, but only for the crimes they did. Although not in the hands of the nazi hunters, because they're not much better than Gestapo. We're no better if we do what we tell the others not to do.

[AKH]

Originally posted by Fishu
The SS without the "waffen"... well, that's a whole another story.

No it isn't - the waffen SS administered and guarded all concentration camps.  If you believe that the waffen SS weren't SS, you are deluding yourself.

[Fishu]

Originally posted by AKH
No it isn't - the waffen SS administered and guarded all concentration camps.  If you believe that the waffen SS weren't SS, you are deluding yourself.

I've said that majority of Waffen-SS didn't have part in it. Isn't that sufficient to say? They had about a million members, far more than they ever needed to guard the concentration camps. The other branches of SS were much worse in general and with their priorities.

[Neubob]

Originally posted by Fishu
I too want them to pay dearly, but only for the crimes they did. Although not in the hands of the nazi hunters, because they're not much better than Gestapo. We're no better if we do what we tell the others not to do.

So long as these Nazi hunters are hunting Nazis, I frankly don't care if they microwave them. If the nazi hunters were anything like these fascist organizations you keep comparing them too, then much, if not most of Germany would have been de-populated by the end of the 40s. They are a scalpel to the Gestapo's hammer.

No, I do not want the innocent to suffer. If this man is innocent, he should be allowed to remain unharmed. I simply do not default to a sympathetic stance whenever such men are mentioned in the press. We live under the doctrine of innocent until proven guilty, and this is a good thing, and should stay this way. That being said, I very much doubt, through all my ignorance and stupidity, that anyone who ever started off in the Hitler Youth, wore the SS emblem through to his mid-20s, and then subsequently fled to a country where he knew he'd be harder to find, can ever be among the innocent. If I pre-judge then I beg your pardon. But then again my opinion is only an opinion. I do not hold a rifle to this man's chest, nor a snapping dog on a leash.

I honestly hope that he didn't kill or torture anyone, because if he did, he's already lived way, way too long, breathed far too much oxygen that would have been better spent on others, and shared too many happy moments for justice to ever be served.

I'm pretty sure that until new evidence is presented, this thread has run its course. It will undoubtedly continue with numerous accusations being leveled, against Henss as well as against fellow board members for feeling either one way or another about it, but will do so without me.

I should have known to stay out the moment I read an earlier post where some nameless fool posted the names of the people on the government statement, eluded to their Jewishness, and then said 'what chance does he have?'

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by Toad
I think our fathers and grandfathers that fought that war would be ashamed if they read this thread. And probably angry.

True. I also know two of the sons that`s not too thrilled .
One thing about it, if they drag this out it will be dealt with by the masters of the double tap without a doubt.

[AWMac]

Make him live the last years of his life as those that he guarded...with a dog looking over his every move.  

Build huge gas showers and ovens within his eyesight and let him remember.

Cold, little or no food, hard work and maybe toss a few corpse around him to make him comfy.

Let him soak in guilt.

Let that pain eat him to death.


Mac

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Fishu
Which of the majority were soldiers in the Waffen-SS with no part in war crimes.

They swore personal alliagence to Hitler and fought for his ideals and the spread of National Socialism throughout the world.  For that fact alone, they deserve all the contempt we can muster.  

ack-ack

[BBBB]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
They swore personal alliagence to Hitler and fought for his ideals and the spread of National Socialism throughout the world.  For that fact alone, they deserve all the contempt we can muster.  

ack-ack

 Well unless he could tell the future his "Sworn alliagence" to Hitler was just a requirement of duty more than an oath in blood. Just like our US military requires recruits to take an oath.  I am pretty sure at the time he was taking his Oath he had no idea what was really going on.

 I am not saying this guy is innocent. However, I am not ready to light the torches and go kicking some guys door in because some Jewish organization wants to in-act a little revenge. At this point, this whole situation seems to be the effects of some overzealous Nazi hunters, more so then facts. It seems to me at this point, this group has looked at his military record and they have connected the dots to a puzzle that does not exists. I want facts. So far all I have heard and saw have been speculation.


-Spot

[bj229r]

Originally posted by Gryphons
Nope, if you'll re-read the quote that you posted what I said was that you would be shot if you walked away, simple fact. At no point in my post did I say I would have taken part, you are putting words into my mouth.  I'm just trying to help people see both side of the story.  Your lack of comprehension does make me laugh tho.

And what I have said TWICE is that given the ONLY two options, dying is preferable.

[Angus]

Originally posted by Viking
This isn't about sympathy (or lack thereof). This is about justice by law and if we should jail (or hang) someone just because we don't like them (like the Nazis did). He has committed no crime that I can see.

Will be hard to find evidence now I guess. Could be looked into and ask some questions. Did he feed the dogs, and with what?
The dog guys were certainly not popular in the camps, but again, there were 2 functions,  - escape guards and terror guards....

[Dadano]

Leave the old man alone.