No Icons for enemy

[Karnak]

its been so long, that must be air warrior. if its an early version of aces high, someone was definitely infringing on copyrights.

That is Air Warrior.

[Arlo]

That is Air Warrior.

Sigh ... almost a shame to have to clarify.

[Slade]

please disable all enemy icons. lets keep it real.

There were numerous spotters and related positions on both sides in addition to the remedial radar of the time. It is already accurate.

Could the spotters and dar miss a plane? Sure.  Just fly under 200 if that is what you want to ensure.

[The Fugitive]

making perks count will get players in the arena. no one wants to play for nothing.

Funny, perks AND points are available in EW and MW and you don't see people in there that often. Your not going to lure people in to play "no icons" that way.

[muzik]

Hello this is Hitech.

Enemy Icons Off brought to you by seano and muzik.
PM them if you are not happy with the results.
PM me to change it back before canceling your account.

     I made one small comment after 15 long pages of comments and I get the blame for this?

I'm sensing a small personal grudge here.

The FACT is, I'm up in the air about this. I havent even read 90% of this thread. And the side I lean most to is that icons should stay how they are for one reason.

Nitwits already complain they cant find good fights because they have the patience and intellect of six year olds. SO harder to locate = fewer engagements. I have ALWAYS known that the icons, despite being cheesy eyesores, are an important part of maintaining high levels of action for time strapped players.

Get what you wanted out of that ankle love?

Or were you trying to give me a compliment for a brilliantly concise and effective argument? If you were, I retract the previous comment and  <S> you. 

[Nr_RaVeN]

Finding a fight using no icons is about map size base location and directing action to  intersect at a specific area of engagement by directing players flight paths to intersect  in those areas of engagement.
No icons will not work as well on huge MA maps and finding a fight would be as Hi tech states ...BORRRRINGGG spending way to much time looking for action.
 A MA type arena IS NOT THE PLACE FOR NO ICONS..
 
But in custom arenas the host can focus directed objectives to a specific area or areas on a terain allowing take off from limited base locations. Setting attack and defend objectives at these limited specific locations outlined in a MOTD..

 Here is an overly simplified MOTD example...

 Axis objectives: Axis aircraft is enabled at only bases A10 A3 using a compass heading of 270 attack and capture Allied bases A2 A4 As well as defend your home fields of A10 A3 ...  
Allie objectives: Allied aircraft is enabled at bases A2 A4 only. Attack and capture axis fields A10 A3 using a heading of 90,As well as defend home fields of A2 A4
  
This will focus action, making finding a fight fast and exiting. The amount of fields used along with the distance traveled between bases is the key to action.

For instance if you have a very few players the bases need to be close.... and terrain needs to be small.

As you develop a following and outgrow smaller terrains you increase either the distance of the base locations or the size of the terrain so the its scaled to the population of the arena.

None of this will work in an MA environment using true full no icons either side.

Further using no icons either side means air craft must be either AXIS or ALLIED to determine who is friend or foe,hard to pull off with 3 countries.

NO enemy icons is a half measure. It is a recipe for gang banging and the play simply devolves as population grows. With no enemy icons only, players simply glob on to the friendly icons picking, ganging and shoulder shooting become common place. It cheapens the purity and intensity of the concept.

[Ninthmessiah]

No icons=greater handicap for people with smaller monitors or poor vision. 

For this reason alone, I'm giving this wish a -1. 

In my opinion, all the arguments in favor of no enemy icons do not overcome this negative impact.  Just my $0.02.

[jimson]

No icons=greater handicap for people with smaller monitors or poor vision.  

For this reason alone, I'm giving this wish a -1.  

In my opinion, all the arguments in favor of no enemy icons do not overcome this negative impact.  Just my $0.02.

Well, there are a ton of things that give some players advantages or disadvantages.

We don't outlaw more expensive, better functioning hotas joysticks because some can only afford a 20 dollar Logitec.

We don't outlaw trackir and rudder pedals because not everyone can use or afford them.

An additional, optional arena shouldn't have to worry about such things.

But -1 for the LW main.

[Vinkman]

Finding a fight using no icons is about map size base location and directing action to  intersect at a specific area of engagement by directing players flight paths to intersect  in those areas of engagement.
No icons will not work as well on huge MA maps and finding a fight would be as Hi tech states ...BORRRRINGGG spending way to much time looking for action.
 A MA type arena IS NOT THE PLACE FOR NO ICONS..

You are confusing "no enemy icon" with no dar and no radar. Fights will no be harder to find with Enemy Icon Off because dar and darbar will still be working.

[Nr_RaVeN]

Well that it depends on the dar settings.. If you set them so the dar dot always shows up that's one thing... obviously....  But at MA dar settings and a huge map it would be bad...especially with 3 country's . Besides no enemy icons should not be considered "no icon play".... 400k/ 400k or 200/200 both sides would give a far better playing experience IMO....

[muzik]

You are confusing "no enemy icon" with no dar and no radar. Fights will no be harder to find with Enemy Icon Off because dar and darbar will still be working.

I have to disagree, though I don't agree with most of what Raven said.

We became heavily dependent on the icons to locate other aircraft. I would challenge anyone to turn off icons for a while, fly into the combat area while scanning for other aircraft. When you cant see any, conduct a test by turning icons back on. See how often some aircraft you didn't know was there is suddenly lit up, friend or foe. Now, because you are aware of this being a test, I think the odds are not going to be as great as if your normal every day routine was to fly without icons for years on end.

I like the idea of icons off, but I think there will be a huge percentage of missed engagements. Think about how often you've just barely caught the icons of some aircraft at treetop and max icon range, turned to go after them and knew if it hadn't been for that flash of icon that they would have gotten away.

Think about how many times you were limping home wounded. You were sneaking along tree tops watching some enemy a/c that don't appear to know you're there, then they notice you. It happens a lot, and we don't realize how much more it would happen with icons off.

Dar bar is definitely part of that, but if I had to put numbers on it, I'd say you have an 85% chance of catching sight of an aircraft that is obscured or in an inconspicuous relation to yourself. With icons off, I believe that goes down to around 10%.

I would accept this drawback as a more realistic experience. It would be an additional challenge. But for the sake of the game, I think it's a better business decision to leave them on. Maybe someday it will have a large enough population to support arenas for all tastes.