Author Topic: Brady, not to whine, dude..... (Read 3853 times)

Kweassa · « **Reply #30 on:** September 22, 2003, 06:39:57 AM »

Brady, just give 'em the Chog

,the IJAAF and IJN don't mind.

If it has potential of overuse or unbalancing, why not perk it at about 4 points? The Chog would be much more lethal than the Dhog for sure, but I think us flying for IJN/IJAAF can handle it.

Arlo · « **Reply #31 on:** September 22, 2003, 07:31:26 AM »

I extend the duel offer to Batz as well ... even though he supposedly no longer has any control or influence over the CT.

scJazz · « **Reply #32 on:** September 22, 2003, 08:19:52 AM »

I was going to take some time for a reply but since I received authorization for a day of flying Axis from my CO first I'm going to test things out.

najdorf · « **Reply #33 on:** September 22, 2003, 09:07:42 AM »

I find the thought that allowing the CHOG into this setup due to balance issues indefensible. I flew for quite a while in an axis squad and flew this particular setup several times. I think I qualify as a decent N1K stick and I'll tell you the plane I feared the least in this setup was a Corsair.

Corsairs have one advantage over the IJN planes, they have the potential for higher top end speed. To make this potential a reality, you have to take the required 10 minute grab flight away from the fight. It's much easier to grab up to 10K in a N1k which climbs better than 1000 fpm faster than the F4U's. Otherwise, the hog doesn't turn particularly well and it doesn't accellerate well at all. In a 1 v. 1 fight, I'd take a N1K over a any hog variant in the game.

The six .50 cals have a range ad over the N1K's, but not much of one. I've hit guys from D800 using the N1K. The real trick here is the hitting power. I can get a high deflection passing shot on any of the IJN planes with the F4U's and have plenty of hit sprites and damage it not at all. Same shot comming from an N1K is going tear the hog to pieces.

You can sit around all day long saying the Chog unbalances the arena, but it's just not true. If you don't put it into the setup, it's just because you don't want it here, end of story.

Batz · « **Reply #34 on:** September 22, 2003, 09:18:59 AM »

I got np spanking ya in your own plane, it will have to be next saturday/sunday though. I wont be around the house much this week.

The niki is a slow pos. I havent flown any ah for months and flew in the main last week a bit

Batz has 7 kills and has been killed 0 times against the N1K2.

No vulching, running or 50k climb outs either.......

Every version of the f4u is faster then the niki.

According to Fork's accel tests at sl and 18k the dhog and niki accell about the same. So I dunno why you think the niki is some super plane but whatever.

MajorDay · « **Reply #35 on:** September 22, 2003, 11:53:11 AM »

I have to agree with Najdorf, cuz he got the point lol

Halo · « **Reply #36 on:** September 22, 2003, 12:32:56 PM »

Since Okinawa is just about the only campaign that included the F4U-1C and F4U-4 in real life, it sure would be nice to allow them here, probably in very limited numbers as they were in real life.

Such a great opportunity. Next time we do Okinawa, please figure a way to include them even if have to add a couple German fighters as play-likes for any corresponding late war Japanese planes not currently in Aces High.

As I recall, Okinawa had overwhelming Allied airpower and seapower, so probably wouldn't be realistic to add much more Japanese opposition, would it?

EXCEPT -- Okinawa would be the perfect scenario to add the kamikazes that caused the Allies so many casualties. How about modelling some of them next time?

Arlo · « **Reply #37 on:** September 22, 2003, 12:48:06 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Batz
I got np spanking ya in your own plane, it will have to be next saturday/sunday though. I wont be around the house much this week.

The niki is a slow pos. I havent flown any ah for months and flew in the main last week a bit

Batz has 7 kills and has been killed 0 times against the N1K2.

No vulching, running or 50k climb outs either.......

Every version of the f4u is faster then the niki.

According to Fork's accel tests at sl and 18k the dhog and niki accell about the same. So I dunno why you think the niki is some super plane but whatever.

No, handsomehunk ... before the CT rotates. You just don't get this, do you? Making you look stupid a week after ain't gonna accomplish much since the late pac only rotates into the CT every 3 months or so. By then you'd be hard pressed to remember the butt kickin' you got. So if you're gonna stall and make excuses just save yourself the embarrassment and butt back out.

najdorf · « **Reply #38 on:** September 22, 2003, 12:53:08 PM »

I never said the N1K is an uber ride. I said it compares favorably with the hog in a coalt situation. Therefore, stating that the Chog destroys the balance of the CT in this setup is ridiculous.

Batz · « **Reply #39 on:** September 22, 2003, 01:14:55 PM »

Whats ridiculous is folks not getting whats being said. No one said the chogs a2a prowess was a problem. Its the same as a dhog.

The chog is a field porking machine. Theres no real ground war in ah. Every bullet hit adds to set amount of damage. Hizookas cause more then most other rounds. No one thinks that the chog will unbalance the air war per se. Its the milkrunners, base porkers and those types who would pork every field. These types are inherently attracted to these types of planes.

With 5k per vh a chog could put his ord and rockets into a vh and strafe it easily. Same with the fuel tanks etc. All you would see is field porking chogs and axis flyers would just leave. When the chog went un perked in the main it got 20% of the kills not because of the great fighter it is but becuase 2 out of every three players were in one.

If you acknowledge the chog is no more a challenge then any other plane then why is it needed at all?

Increasing the structure and object hardness to offset the effect of the chog would make base attacks exponentially harder on the japanese side.

But if you read the whines in this thread its "the axis have a niki, therefore we must have chogs". First the type 99s on the niki are nothing compared to hizookas. The chog is 50 mph then the niki. The chog isnt the "solution" to the niki the fm2 and f6f are.

The F4u-4 only had 9 kills in ww2, add it to this setup and its all you will see with its 100mph speed advantage. Theres enough runners as is. There enough milkrunning base porkers as is.

Why do we need more?

Again brady has been consistant through out in these types of setups. Maybe you should take your campaign to another ct cm? You do know that despite all the *****ing he aint gonna change it?

Batz · « **Reply #40 on:** September 22, 2003, 01:20:30 PM »

those planes are always available in the da wtf are you talking about?

You are of no concern to me, I have killed you a bunch. My lifetime kd in your plane is higher then you anyway.

Best i can give ya cry about it all ya want...........

Sakai · « **Reply #41 on:** September 22, 2003, 01:34:44 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Batz
more of the same "po' ole allied farm boys"........

LOL, that's a keeper.

As for me, the typical US ride in WWII sported 6 .50s; the Browning .50 being their standard weapon. I can't think of any AC outside of the P-38s and P-39s as cannon armed, it just seems out of place to me. So for me, I prefer the 6 .50 loadouts on the F4Us--that was the ride most likely to encounter Jap Iron, that's a fair tradeoff for the Niki. The Paper Mache Jap planes are shredded by 6 .50s. I don't feel unergunned when against a Jap plane in any ride. It's the only time I think the Hurri I has a shot at a kill.

The tag-team of the F4U-F6F-FM2 is more than capable of stringing out any Jap AC and barbecuing its behind. I never feel bad about seeing Nikis or Ki-61s when in an FM2.

Sakai

najdorf · « **Reply #42 on:** September 22, 2003, 03:29:08 PM »

Batz, field porking wasn't even mentioned until two/thirds of the way thru this thread. If that was the reason it wasn't included, why wasn't it stated at the outset. Plus, you may be an ack killing machine, but the ack in both hardness and quantity seems somewhat excessive and I have a very hard time killing it.

Also, I don't really care much about taking land in the CT, I just like good a2a fights and since I am now a member of VF-17, I try to fly the hog when i can. The only setup that has a hog as an available ride is up right now, but the way it's going, the hog isn't very competitive. I find myself cheating and upping FM2's to deal with nikis because the only kind of shot I can get on them is high deflection passing shot which more often that not, even when I land rounds, I don't do any damage. There are probably plenty of more capable hog drivers than I, but I can't saddle up on a niki and blaze away. Hence my request for the Chog. Now you state the hog is faster and that is true, but it is just as true that the N1k turns circles around the hog. So are you trying to say that the fact that the N1K is much more maneuverable has no value, that the only thing with value is raw speed, which for the hog, unlike other late war rides, doesn't come on instantly like a 109 or an LA7 or even a P51 which out accellerates and has a higher top speed than the hog.

Your arguments are circular. You and brady have decided, for whatever reason is popular to you at the moment, that the Chog will not be available and that is the end of the story. I don't understand it, as many others don't, but that's brady's decision and he's made it and sticking with it. But don't try and justify it with this red herring poppiecock about it's ability to deack fields.

Many threads deal with trying to analyze why the CT can't hold any numbers, perhaps part of it has to do with the inflexibility of the CM's when the players ask for something the CM's don't like.

Oh, and before starting a reply telling me that you or brady don't have some conspiracy going to keep the hogs out of the CT, I never said you were attempting such a thing. I think you and brady believe you have valid reasons for not including it, I just disagree with your reasoning. What really upsets me is your unwillingness to at least experiment with something different or open it up to meaningfull discussion. It's simply stated that this is the way it's gonna be insert cliche for decision and go on like you never heard any complaints.

Oh ya, and Batz, please don't regail me with anymore of your personal stats in or against a certain plane. You're a better pilot than most so your stats in a certain plane against another plane piloted by someone of unknown ability really lend nothing to the discussion.

Sakai · « **Reply #43 on:** September 22, 2003, 03:48:08 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by najdorf
The only setup that has a hog as an available ride is up right now, but the way it's going, the hog isn't very competitive. I find myself cheating and upping FM2's to deal with nikis because the only kind of shot I can get on them is high deflection passing shot which more often that not, even when I land rounds, I don't do any damage.

Well, I find Fm2s turn inside Nikis and that F4Us out run them but I have not flown in this setup so maybe the arena adds an anchor to the corsairs and an alt limiter to the Fm2s? I mean, if you get low and slow in F4Us or are jumped when low in an FM2 you are a dead man. As with Wildcats and Zeke 2s, do not get low and slow and endlessly turn in stupid circles--the Japs'll own ya.

I think maybe the "US iron only" guys are hating the Niki because it is the single Jap plane the "headon or nothing" boys run into on PAC sets that is a draw--if they don't break at 500 yards, that is.

Perhaps we can enable the Tempest and Spit IX for these guys to make it fair? Or the La7? Would that make it even?

Sakai

Slash27 · « **Reply #44 on:** September 22, 2003, 03:54:55 PM »

Good post Najdorf.

I think maybe the "US iron only" guys are hating the Niki because it is the single Jap plane the "headon or nothing" boys run into on PAC sets that is a draw--if they don't break at 500 yards, that is. Try again.

Perhaps we can enable the Tempest and Spit IX for these guys to make it fair? Or the La7? Would that make it even?
You're having trouble keeping up are'nt you?