So that's what Islam is to these guys, eh..

[mosgood]

Hey... I just thought of something  (surprise!)

There are people that don't think that Bush has any responsiblity to apologize for the mis-treatment of iraqi prisoners.  The thinking there is that he was not in the direct chain of command NOR was he one of the individuals.  So why should he.

OK....  if none of the Islam Leaders were directly involved in the beheading, why do they have to say anything about it?  They didn't have anything to do with it... right?  They don't owe anyone anything.......  right?


I think that they should because they need to distance themselves from the act that the animals did in allah's name but, what does it have to do with them besides that?  

Just because they don't say anything about it, doesn't mean that they support it.  In our own country, our politicians always jump at the chance to get on a soup box to admonish something that everyone obviously thinks is terrible...  but that isn't the only way to handle it.


edit... i'm not sure how vocal they have been about mistreatment of iraqi prisoners but if they have been screaming about how terrible it is... then HELL YA THEY SHOULD SPEAK UP ABOUT THIS!!!!

[Toad]

Originally posted by mosgood
There are people that don't think that Bush has any responsiblity to apologize for the mis-treatment of iraqi prisoners.  

Really? Who are they? Any examples?

Clearly, Bush thought he had to apoloize, because he did.

They killed that man because of their political views... plain and simple

[/b]

Well, yes. But you don't dispute the fact that in that region, the religion is completely entertwined with the state? For example, you agree that both Iran and Taliban Afghanistan are/were Islamic States that use the Qu'ran as the ultimate source of political authority and civil law?

So, in this case, their "politics" is Islam itself?

[GRUNHERZ]

That video basically said:

We are killing this man for god.

If the big Islamic authorities dont condemn it, I may peronally  have to seriouly rethink my long held positive stance on the current staus of Islam in general.

This is one of those moments when they have an opportunity to show their true colors and hwt they really stand for.

[Steve]

They killed that man because of their political views... plain and simple

The fact that you think this is ok because of political  views makes me sick.  Charles Manson had people killed because of his political views.  I suppose his actions are then justified as well?

[Westy]

Yes.  There's always plenty of time to get "man on the street" comments as all you have to do is stop one on a sidewalk or pose a question on the web as the BBC has.  But as to there not having been time to ask religious or government leaders how do you know they have not?

 As for 24/7 arab news? Yeah.  Al Jazereera (Foxnews for the Arabs) is the only one I find that offers an English version and even then while many claim they are the most "middle of the road" as far as Arab news goes I find them to be extremely biased.  Might as well look to Pravda for the truth too.  So I don't look for news there with any hope of objectivity.  That Al Jazeera did not lace the report with an anti-American slant or Islamic extremist spin was a surprise.  However from home last night and al ltoday most links I've tried to reach for other Middle Eastern news websites is extremely slow or outright unreachable.  

 Anyway. I'd offered possible explanations.  You've drummed your fingers with dramatic impatience.  Once again Toad & Westy won't see eye to eye.  Nothing new.

[mosgood]

Originally posted by Steve
The fact that you think this is ok because of political  views makes me sick.  

I never said that it's ok for any reason.  Where do you see that?

[Westy]

"I never said that it's ok for any reason. Where do you see that?"


 See my earlier definition of  neanderthal-con.   I'd add to that they instinctually put words in your mouth or at a bare minimum completely distort what you say..



(speaking of where's Marlet and Hortlund)

[Toad]

Patience is my middle name.

However, I know and I think you know that these condemnations from Islamic authority figures isn't coming, no matter how long you or I wait.

Lastly, they can stick a mike in the face of Abdul on the street but it's beyond the ability of a major, respected news organization to call Government HQ or the most famous Mosque in all Islam and attempt to get the views of the leadership?

Even if they have to say "we called but the government/ayatolla had no comment at this time"?

[lada]

Originally posted by Toad
Really? Who are they? Any examples?

Clearly, Bush thought he had to apoloize, because he did.


{qutoe]They killed that man because of their political views... plain and simple[/quote

Well, yes. But you don't dispute the fact that in that region, the religion is completely entertwined with the state? For example, you agree that both Iran and Taliban Afghanistan are/were Islamic States that use the Qu'ran as the ultimate source of political authority and civil law?

So, in this case, their "politics" is Islam itself?

man you are non educated lame, whitch know nothing about Iranian, Afghan law....

so be quite, coz you are far away from reality.


Since your president call God name on every second public speach, we should probably consider Iraq and Afghanistan to be Crusade war, by your logic...

Go and study some of ME political system before you post sutch things

[lada]

Originally posted by GRUNHERZ

This is one of those moments when they have an opportunity to show their true colors and hwt they really stand for.

It is, but they dont need you public opinion do they ?

[GRUNHERZ]

Originally posted by lada
It is, but they dont need you public opinion do they ?

But you see its much more about them and who they are and what they stand for than it is about my opinion...

But again why are you marginalizing this whole thing?

[muckmaw]

Hizbollah Slams Beheading of American as Un-Islamic
BEIRUT (Reuters) - Lebanon's Hizbollah guerrilla group condemned Wednesday the beheading of an American hostage by Iraqi militants as an ugly crime that flouted the tenets of Islam.
"Hizbollah condemns this horrible act that has done very great harm to Islam and Muslims by this group that claims affiliation to the religion of mercy, compassion and humane principles," the Shi'ite Muslim group said in a statement.

An Islamist Web site Tuesday carried a video clip of the execution of the man who identified himself as Nick Berg, with a statement saying a group linked to al Qaeda did it in revenge for the abuse of Iraqis by U.S. troops.

Hizbollah said Berg's killing had diverted the world's gaze from an escalating furor over the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by occupation soldiers.

"The timing of this act that overshadowed the scandal over the abuse of Iraqi prisoners in occupation forces prisons is suspect timing that aims to serve the American administration and occupation forces in Iraq and present excuses and pretexts for their inhumane practices against Iraqi detainees."

The Syrian-backed group which the United States deems "terrorist" said the executors' behavior was closer to "the Pentagon school -- the school of killing and occupation and crimes and torture and immoral practices that were exposed by the great scandal in occupation prisons."

Washington blames Hizbollah, whose attacks forced Israeli troops to withdraw from south Lebanon in 2000 after a 22-year occupation, for 1980s suicide bombings against its embassy and Marines barracks and the abduction of Westerners in Beirut

[midnight Target]

Try to understand the mentality of the people who would do such atrocities as hacking a head off of a man? Even in the most jingoistic sense, wouldn't this understanding assist our cause.

"Know your enemy and you can defeat him."

I just wonder why the simple act of pointing out that others may have a completely different view of World events causes such hatred.

Peace........ ya buncha knubskulls!

[Toad]

Lada,

So you're going to say the Taliban in Afghanistan did not use the Qu'ran as the law of the state?

Iran in the same fashion to a lesser degree?

[Westy]

Toad I was expecting to see some at some point.  Not as much nor quickly given as you and a few others have expected. But certainly not because others have been so condemning of the Us and UK for prisoner abuses.  But  I also suspect the worst of their lot would simply do so to gain PR "points" and try to gain some "moral" ground (as I see in Muckmaws post while I was typing this reply out)