What if.... An abstract political question.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Boroda
27 Stinger missiles captured in Chechnya doesn't ring a bell?...

Hosting Chechen terrorists ("political asylum" for Akhmadov) is a friendly act?

hmmm maybe it didnt translate so well let me try again..


LINK IT OR FORGET IT.

I do remember Stingers in Afghanistan though and we all know how well you fared over there. Maybe you should remember that when you talk about how strong your military is and how weak ours is.

[Masherbrum]

Originally posted by Boroda
Maybe. But I doubt that Russia will want to send troops to Iran. Or that we'll need Iranian troops here. But they may help in knocking out US sattelites in Caucasus region, restoring the "influence" in Georgia and Azerbaijan that was ruined by Russian Empire in XVIII-XIX centuries. In this case Georgian government will again "beg on their knees" for being allowed to join Russia...

I prefer this scenario to an obvious decision to solve a problem once and forever...

You mean as opposed to the "Afghanistan Failure" throughout the 80's?

Karaya

[rshubert]

Originally posted by Thrawn
Sigh, and in 2003 Russia gave the US over 6 billion dollars in goods and services, over 8 billion in 2004 and over 4 billion so far this year.  Ain't that nice of the US to give a billion back.

http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c4621.html

That's "trade", thrawn.  It means the US paid for the stuff.  You know, like "bought things from Russia".

Don't confuse giving money away with paying for goods and services.

[Hangtime]

Boroda, my paranoid russian friend; had world domination been the American foriegn policy dogma of the 40's and 50's we (you anyway) would not be having this conversation.

If it was policy now, we (you) would not be having this conversation.

Here's the deal.. Play Nice, we let you have neat stuff, levi's bubble gum and coca-cola. Stuff you guys must want, or you'd still be doing May Day Parades with cardboard missiles.

Play Not-Nice, we cut off the neat stuff and you have another revolution.

Get nasty and start 'demonstrating' ala Moon is Harsh Mistress and you'll wind up wondering who the hell shut the lights off... right before you figure out there's nobody left to throw the switch.

We (and it must make you absoluety nuts to know this) have the upper hand militarily by such a large margin now that some nutball hawk republican Curtiss Lemay throwback in washington just MIGHT figure we could win a nuclear war. Which would be a true tragedy, because nobody wins if we get that far.

As for the stingers in Chechnya, what about the RPG's in Iraq? Sure, stuff gets into the wrong hands via illegal technology transfers between 'third' parties.. but lemme ask you a question.

Just WHERE did all your missing nuclear materials go? And, just WHO's responsible for the world-wide distribution of russian surplus arms?

Boroda, your country no longer has an 'elected' government (again).. it does however have a heluva problem with it's 'mafia'.

So, who's in charge there? Corrupt Criminals or Puppet Government?

Perhaps you should look to the trangressions of your countrymen against mother russia as your nations greatest challenge. You need not fear the US, you should be very afraid of yourselves.

[Boroda]

OK someone please tell me if i'll get really ugly.

Originally posted by Raider179
1)You dont hear Sirens because your 40 year old radars cant pick up stealth. You wouldnt even know if America decided to take your country back to the middle ages.

40 years old radars in Yugoslavia were able to detect your technical marvell and a 30 years old S-125 missile locked upon it and shot it down.

You speak nonsence.

Originally posted by Raider179
and by the way where are the russian mars landers again? oh thats right they ALL crashed going in.

Where are American Venus landers? All cracked by atmospheric pressure? Looks like you guys can only work in vacuum or under low pressure

Originally posted by Raider179
2)Your missile corps is a joke. You cant even secure you own nuclear arms without Funding from US.

Wanna give us some money? You are welcome, especially if it goes to securing our nuclear arsenal

Originally posted by Raider179
3)As for you quote, Notice we fought 3000 miles away from our homeland, you guys fought how many miles into yours? Dangerous does not mean effective.

3000 miles is a joke. During Manchurian operation Soviet Army defeated Japanese continental troops (1,500,000 men) loosing only 8500 men. Look at the map and see how far Manchuria and Korea are from main population centers.

We defeated the main Japanese ground force in 2 weeks, while US spent 3 years crawling around some god-forgotten islands. Learn from us, now it's still free.

Originally posted by Raider179
4)More like backed up by F-22s, Tomahawks, B-2s, and F-117s.

F-22s? They already exist? LOL!!!

B-2s? The ones that blew up Chinese embassy in Belgrad? LOL!!!

F-117s? I already told you...

Originally posted by Raider179
5)Dont be friends with our enemies and you won't have a problem but then again you signed a treaty with germany in WW2 so why should I think Russia would do anything different this time.

We are a souverign country, and we are free to sign any treaty, and it's not your ****ing business.

American B-17 bombers had special areas in Germany on flight maps that shouldn't be bombed under any conditions: there were industrial objects owned by US corporations. Like Opel factories owned by GM.

Your companies worked for nazis during the war, until the war was over. It's a fact.

For folks like you war is a game, for your corporations it's a profit, for Russians it's a matter of survival. And if we'll understand that we have no chance to survive - you should expect some surprises.

[Boroda]

Originally posted by Masherbrum
You mean as opposed to the "Afghanistan Failure" throughout the 80's?

Karaya

Sorry, I thought that my innuendo was quite understandable.

I meant MAD. MAD will work only if both sides will have the guts to press a button. In case of Russia - we have "dead hand" devices that will launch in case our missile silos will receive a punch over a certain ammount of kg/cm2. So - a massive launch against Russia means MAD.

[Boroda]

Well, "american assistance" my ***... istance.

/*Edited to comply with lang rules*/

Originally posted by Raider179
Sigh

Get a glass of cold water please.

Originally posted by Raider179
$81.37 million in democratic reform programs (including Public Diplomacy exchange programs)

Democratic reform programms? Are you kidding me? $81M spent on funding groups wanting to overthrow our legitimate government? Or on increasing Coca-Cola sales?

Originally posted by Raider179
$69.44 million in economic and social-sector reform programs;

Social sector reform? You mean - on bribing our brass-hats for eliminating certain social groups like the one to which I belong?

Look, I finally speak about Putin's internal policy.

Originally posted by Raider179
$770.62 million in security, regional stability and law enforcement programs;

What the hell is this? Elaborate please.

Originally posted by Raider179
$26.10 million in humanitarian programs;

Here everything is clear. It's a humanitarian aid to Chechen terrorists, including Akhmadov's salary in DoS foundation.

Originally posted by Raider179
$9.13 million in cross-sectoral and other programs;

It's just bribes, nevermind.

Originally posted by Raider179
and
privately donated and U.S. Defense Department excess humanitarian commodities valued at $6.67 million.

It's payments to traitors who work for US Defence Department. Obvious.

I checked with a dictionary, it's spelled "defence". Who was an illiterate who compiled that pile of crap you posted for me?

Originally posted by Raider179
1)So you see we give Russia 1 billion dollars in 2003. And it got spent on a lot of different programs.

Answer my question about literacy first.

As I showed above - even if the numbers are true (that I doubt) - most of the "aid" goes on destruction of Russian state.

Want aid? - No, thanks. We'd better get by on ourselves, somehow.

[rshubert]

With all due respect, we spell differently here in the USA.  Defense is correct.  It's also labor, harbor, and armor.

Whether or not YOU personally want the aid, boroda, your COUNTRY accepts it gladly.  And if they are using it to destroy your "class" of individual, you might want to talk to your leaders.

BTW, what "oppressed class" do you belong to?

[Boroda]

Originally posted by rshubert
With all due respect, we spell differently here in the USA.  Defense is correct.  It's also labor, harbor, and armor.

Sorry, I studied English... I still understand BBC or Sky better then CNN.

I speak different Russian then Muscowites, I was born in Leningrad, I speak in a right way, and I expect others at leat to spell correctly. Maybe I am a fossil

Originally posted by rshubert
Whether or not YOU personally want the aid, boroda, your COUNTRY accepts it gladly.  And if they are using it to destroy your "class" of individual, you might want to talk to your leaders.

If someone gives to you - take it, if someone beats you - run. A basic rule.

But if it was up to me - I'll use another basic rule: don't take anything given, it means obligations.

Originally posted by rshubert
BTW, what "oppressed class" do you belong to?

I work in Academy of Science. The only thing they didn't try against us is probably DDT. We are nothing more then a resource of estate to sell for our current regime, "beloved Party and Government". <- it's an ironic definition from Soviet times.

[Hangtime]

Boroda, one day you and I gotta get drunk in the same place at the same time.



p.s.  it is an American right and obligation to mangle the english language. that includes spelling, punctuation and verbage. it seems to be a never ending source of aggravation for our cousins across the pond, and it drives euro and asian freakin nuttz.

..which is why we do it.

Conversely, and as a backhanded compliment, most americans do not have more than one skilled language.. and depending on who you talk to, even that is debateable. You, estel and several other euro's have a very good  command of our quirky impossible language while we for the most part have no comparable knowledge of yours.

well done.

now, go grab a corrupt russian government offcial by the nose and kick 'em in the ballsac a few times for both of us.

yah paranoid commie martyr dionosaur.

[Holden McGroin]

Originally posted by Boroda
American B-17 bombers had special areas in Germany on flight maps that shouldn't be bombed under any conditions: there were industrial objects owned by US corporations. Like Opel factories owned by GM.

In 1967, GM was compensated $33 million dollars as payment for the GM factory the US bombed in Russelsheim.

Apparently the maps you mention were not very accurate.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Boroda
OK someone please tell me if i'll get really ugly.

 

40 years old radars in Yugoslavia were able to detect your technical marvell and a 30 years old S-125 missile locked upon it and shot it down.

You speak nonsence.

 

Where are American Venus landers? All cracked by atmospheric pressure? Looks like you guys can only work in vacuum or under low pressure

 

Wanna give us some money? You are welcome, especially if it goes to securing our nuclear arsenal

 

3000 miles is a joke. During Manchurian operation Soviet Army defeated Japanese continental troops (1,500,000 men) loosing only 8500 men. Look at the map and see how far Manchuria and Korea are from main population centers.

We defeated the main Japanese ground force in 2 weeks, while US spent 3 years crawling around some god-forgotten islands. Learn from us, now it's still free.

 

F-22s? They already exist? LOL!!!

B-2s? The ones that blew up Chinese embassy in Belgrad? LOL!!!

F-117s? I already told you...

 

We are a souverign country, and we are free to sign any treaty, and it's not your ****ing business.


For folks like you war is a game, for your corporations it's a profit, for Russians it's a matter of survival. And if we'll understand that we have no chance to survive - you should expect some surprises.

wow you shot down 1 F117 and you think that proves your technology could stop our squadrons of f117s and b's. How many stealths did we lose in the 2x we were in Iraq? Zero.  Lay sorties against 1 shootdown and you are gonna have a very very miniscule %.

oh now you want "our money" to secure "your nukes" what a joke. Gimme gimme gimme and then be pissy about how you wished you hadnt took it.

3000 miles is the distance from the US to Europe and even farther to Japan. Your Country on the other hand couldnt even defend its own territory.

You talking WW1 or what? Russia didnt even get into the war with Japan until near the very end of  the war and the only reason you did was so you could take land.

You do have the right to treaty with anyone you want and we have the right to blow the (*#) out of your country if we feel it jeopardizes the security of ours.

Yeah helping Iran is gonna set you back not bring you forward, something I think you are missing completely.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Boroda
Sorry, I thought that my innuendo was quite understandable.

I meant MAD. MAD will work only if both sides will have the guts to press a button. In case of Russia - we have "dead hand" devices that will launch in case our missile silos will receive a punch over a certain ammount of kg/cm2. So - a massive launch against Russia means MAD.

Yeah I saw that movie, Dr. strangelove right? lmao

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Boroda
Well, "american assistance" my ***... istance.

/*Edited to comply with lang rules*/

 

Get a glass of cold water please.

 

Democratic reform programms? Are you kidding me? $81M spent on funding groups wanting to overthrow our legitimate government? Or on increasing Coca-Cola sales?

 

Social sector reform? You mean - on bribing our brass-hats for eliminating certain social groups like the one to which I belong?

Look, I finally speak about Putin's internal policy.

 

What the hell is this? Elaborate please.

 

Here everything is clear. It's a humanitarian aid to Chechen terrorists, including Akhmadov's salary in DoS foundation.

 

It's just bribes, nevermind.

 

It's payments to traitors who work for US Defence Department. Obvious.

I checked with a dictionary, it's spelled "defence". Who was an illiterate who compiled that pile of crap you posted for me?

 

Answer my question about literacy first.

As I showed above - even if the numbers are true (that I doubt) - most of the "aid" goes on destruction of Russian state.

Want aid? - No, thanks. We'd better get by on ourselves, somehow.

1)If you read my posts then you saw the link. Go read it for yourself. I always link to facts I use to support my arguments, you should try it.

2)Try an ENGLISH dictionary. But it just shows me you know you are losing this debate when you resort to grammatical errors to prove something is incorrect. nice try

3)Thats really funny. Putin has the ability to stop our money. He hasnt done it has he? Oh I guess you know more than he does or care more about the government not getting overthrown than Putin. laughable

4)Yeah I know where you will get money selling nuclear technology to Iran or weapons to Syria. Great Country you got over there.

5)Sorry to have to BRING THIS UP AGAIN but you avoid it. What about the Billions in Loans that have been forgiven? Got any comment or just more communist propaghanda?

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Boroda
Sorry, I studied English... I still understand BBC or Sky better then CNN.

I speak different Russian then Muscowites, I was born in Leningrad, I speak in a right way, and I expect others at leat to spell correctly. Maybe I am a fossil

 

If someone gives to you - take it, if someone beats you - run. A basic rule.

But if it was up to me - I'll use another basic rule: don't take anything given, it means obligations.

 

Get off your grammatical high horse.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=defense

de·fense    ( P )  Pronunciation Key  (d-fns)
n.
The act of defending against attack, danger, or injury.
A means or method of defending or protecting.
Sports. The act or an instance of defending a championship against a challenger: will box in his third defense of his title.
An argument in support or justification of something. See Synonyms at apology.
Law.
The action of the defendant in opposition to complaints against him or her.
The defendant and his or her legal counsel.
The science or art of defending oneself; self-defense.
(often defns) Sports.
Means or tactics used in trying to stop the opposition from scoring.
The team or those players on the team attempting to stop the opposition from scoring.
The military, governmental, and industrial complex, especially as it authorizes and manages weaponry production

Here is another rule for you, Dont take money from someone and then go making friends with their enemies.

And one more. I hear this a lot in the USA but maybe some less well off countries need to hear it.

NOTHING IS FREE.