good book...

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Jackal1
No one here is defending Koresh. With your off the wall quotes you used as examples you could possibly do a little research on the weapons in question.
  It has became quite clear that you clearly have not got a clue as to the events or the rights of innocent people violated in this instance or any of the others discussed here.
 If one wishs to forget the fact that our rights weren`t given, they were earned and have been defended on many occasions through our history as a country and completely turn over all their rights into an absolute power I consider them dead weight. Freedom
 and rights didn`t come cheap
and will not be free now or in the future.
 Absolute power is what this country has strived and fought to avoid. Absolute power did not work out to well for the nazis and communists and it will never be tolerated here.
  Standing behind a badge does not make you right or your actions acceptable if you overstep your bounds and restraints and go against the very laws you are supposed to be protecting.
  Suspicion has to be backed up with facts, then proven.

Yeah right, Calling him and his followers innocent and law abiding is defending them. They were neither. Except for those kids.

I don't have to research I know what CONVERTED weapons are.

The rest of your speech is a common tyraid with the usual nazi/stalin rhetoric.

I don't want the government to have absolute power. Nor do I think that waco/ruby ridge have demostrated that the government is this terrible evil institution that you all are making it out to be.

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by Raider179
Louisiana has no law regarding establishing martial law.  

  Louisiana has no law because it does not  have the power or authority to do so.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
Nope, Raider is already gone.  Lost cause and all.

Do you actually contribute anything worth dsicussing to any threads or do you just come here to get in a one-liner every now and then?

 I do listen and read everything that people post to read regarding the topic at hand. Maybe you just do a poor job of putting evidence behind what you are saying???

I notice most of the Gun-lovers here do not post links to any info they put up regarding fire-arms. I wonder why that is?

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Jackal1
Louisiana has no law because it does not  have the power or authority to do so.

Yeah sorry... Should have said state of emergency.


http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_mlaw.html#examples

The governor's order limited the state of emergency, to end on 9/25/2005, "unless terminated sooner."

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by Raider179
Yeah right, Calling him and his followers innocent and law abiding is defending them. They were neither. Except for those kids.
 

  So, am I to take it that you believe there were no innocents, other than the children, at the compound?
  Who were they found guilty by and for what before the raid?

I don't have to research I know what CONVERTED weapons are.

  Let`s say I have converted weapons. Define converted. I have 'converted" lot`s of guns in my life.
  Where are these illegal weapons that you speak of?
  What is an "M-16 type weapon"?
An AR-15 or what? I have never seen an M-16 type weapon. I have seen an M-16. I have seen an AR-15, but never an "M-16 type weapon".

I don't want the government to have absolute power. Nor do I think that waco/ruby ridge have demostrated that the government is this terrible evil institution that you all are making it out to be

  Those who do not participate in the monitoring and regualtion of such agencies are doing just that. Giving the nod for absolute power.
  Sitting back with the attitude that the Federal government will protect you and serve, provide and defend you in times of chaos is being pretty damn naive. I think this has been demonstrated to the fullest in the last few days. It`s just not going to happen. That`s why it is called chaos.

  Going back to the Waco raid for just a bit......
  Let`s assume that there was suspicion of illegal weapons at the compound. Howitzers, Russian Tanks, the odd nuke laying around here and there.............whatever.
  The fact was known that David went to the lumber yard in Waco on the same day every week.
  You arrest David at the lumber yard and detain him for suspicion, questioning or whatever.
  You then take a search warrant to the compound, knock on the door and serve it in an orderly manner. There would have been no problem.
  What you don`t do is conduct a storm trooper type raid on private property and expect not to have your butt handed to you.

[Jackal1]

On second thought, I`ll up my anti.
OK, let`s assume every single sole in the compound is guilty with the exception of the children. (not legal to  assume that , but for the sake of argument)
  Now you storm in with your band of merry madmen with the backing of the heads of this Federal agency.
  We`ll even go so far as to say that the feds were fired upon first. (Not the way I saw it, but just for arguments sake).
  OK, shots are fired. You are aware of the fact that children are inside.
   You continue  the attack at this point such as they did, firing from cover, not knowing if you were going to hit an adult or a child?
  Tell me where that is anyones book of tactics and rules, etc.

[Toad]

The Waco raid aftermath:

Clinton:

"I gave into the people at the Justice Department who were pleading to go in early, and I felt personally responsible for what happened and I still do,'' the president said. ``I made a terrible mistake.''

Reno:

Reno told reporters that ``I think everybody who has been touched by Waco would like to be able to undo it. But the real issue is'' for the president and ``all of us ... what could we have done to have prevented the tragedy?''

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Jackal1
So, am I to take it that you believe there were no innocents, other than the children, at the compound?
  Who were they found guilty by and for what before the raid?

 

  Let`s say I have converted weapons. Define converted. I have 'converted" lot`s of guns in my life.
  Where are these illegal weapons that you speak of?
  What is an "M-16 type weapon"?
An AR-15 or what? I have never seen an M-16 type weapon. I have seen an M-16. I have seen an AR-15, but never an "M-16 type weapon".

 

  Those who do not participate in the monitoring and regualtion of such agencies are doing just that. Giving the nod for absolute power.
  Sitting back with the attitude that the Federal government will protect you and serve, provide and defend you in times of chaos is being pretty damn naive. I think this has been demonstrated to the fullest in the last few days. It`s just not going to happen. That`s why it is called chaos.

  Going back to the Waco raid for just a bit......
  Let`s assume that there was suspicion of illegal weapons at the compound. Howitzers, Russian Tanks, the odd nuke laying around here and there.............whatever.
  The fact was known that David went to the lumber yard in Waco on the same day every week.
  You arrest David at the lumber yard and detain him for suspicion, questioning or whatever.
  You then take a search warrant to the compound, knock on the door and serve it in an orderly manner. There would have been no problem.
  What you don`t do is conduct a storm trooper type raid on private property and expect not to have your butt handed to you.

They were heavily armed extremists who decided to fight it out with the government and they lost.

Conversion is when you change a semi to fully. What you have "done all your life" is modification.

Your absolute power argument is ridiculous. What exactly did YOU do to Monitor and Regulate the government? lmao I will stand up against the government IF and WHEN it is ever necessary but I see absolutely NO reason for it at present. Nor do I see any reasons to walk around like any day the "Ninja's" are gonna bust in your house and take your guns or just kill you. It's ridiculous and is paranoia.

LOL look if the guy you want to arrest is hoarding automatic weapons and explosives and is talking about the end of the world and how he is the savior you don't go "Knock on the door". You go in fast and you go in strong. When you have to arrest someone whose followers believe he is Jesus and the end of the world is coming you think you should just go up and knock on the door and say "Hi, how's it going? We are the ATF and we just arrested the guy you think is Jesus, now we'd like to have a look around. " Maybe you should bring them their newpaper from the drive-way on your way up to the door too?

[Raider179]

Originally posted by Jackal1
On second thought, I`ll up my anti.
OK, let`s assume every single sole in the compound is guilty with the exception of the children. (not legal to  assume that , but for the sake of argument)
  Now you storm in with your band of merry madmen with the backing of the heads of this Federal agency.
  We`ll even go so far as to say that the feds were fired upon first. (Not the way I saw it, but just for arguments sake).
  OK, shots are fired. You are aware of the fact that children are inside.
   You continue  the attack at this point such as they did, firing from cover, not knowing if you were going to hit an adult or a child?
  Tell me where that is anyones book of tactics and rules, etc.

Perhaps you missed the cops that shot the guy and the baby a few weeks ago.(LA I think) Someone starts shooting, Police, law enforcement, whoever is gonna do what they have to, to make that threat go away.

Not only to mention as I recall no children were shot from the initial assault if even at all during the siege.

If I also remember correctly You may fire on anyone who is endangering yours or someone else's life.

[lasersailor184]

Oh, so the law is only important when you want it to be?   Another contradiction.  I still suggest you should read over everything you've written in this post alone.  It is actually quite comical.

It's ridiculous and is paranoia.

Just because you're not paranoid, doesn't mean they are aren't out to get you.  

[Raider179]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
Oh, so the law is only important when you want it to be?   Another contradiction.  I still suggest you should read over everything you've written in this post alone.  It is actually quite comical.


Just because you're not paranoid, doesn't mean they are aren't out to get you.  

1) Who said that?

2)You want to point out anything or just make generalizations?

3)I have nothing to be "GOT" for. Maybe that's why I am not paranoid.

[lasersailor184]

No, I don't want to point it out.  I want to leave it as evidence to how poor of an education you have.

[Raider179]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
No, I don't want to point it out.  I want to leave it as evidence to how poor of an education you have.

Your a waste of time in that case.

[lasersailor184]

No, I'm not.  Any single person with a third grade education can come in here and pick out your inconsistancies.  Any single person but you.


By me being here and rediculing you, I have brought all watching eyes upon you.  Any leverage or credibility you had, is now gone.


Enjoy your day.

[Silat]

Originally posted by Toad
The Waco raid aftermath:

Clinton:quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I gave into the people at the Justice Department who were pleading to go in early, and I felt personally responsible for what happened and I still do,'' the president said. ``I made a terrible mistake.''

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------






 

Wow!! What a concept. A president that actually takes responsibility and admits mistakes.