Author Topic: WTG No Knock (Read 8551 times)

moot · « **Reply #105 on:** December 02, 2006, 11:34:03 AM »

Good post, Lazs.

bsdaddict · « **Reply #106 on:** December 02, 2006, 11:35:04 AM »

I suppose it's easier for us single guys to be idealistic. And I suppose it's natural for everyone to have thier own breaking point. Some may start to sing a different tune once Hillobama comes for their guns. Or if the draft is reinstituted. Or if the borders are locked down to the point where one needs clearance to leave the country. Or if detention centers start getting filled with protestors/dissidents. It's too depressing to think of more "what if's" so I digress... Anyhoo, the frog in the kettle analogy is probably appropriate, some of us just have more sensitive skin than others.

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #107 on:** December 02, 2006, 12:39:19 PM »

Who do you think did the majority of the fighting in the Revolutionary War, war of 1812 and Civil War?

moot · « **Reply #108 on:** December 02, 2006, 01:27:47 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by bsdaddict
I suppose it's easier for us single guys to be idealistic. And I suppose it's natural for everyone to have thier own breaking point. Some may start to sing a different tune once Hillobama comes for their guns. Or if the draft is reinstituted. Or if the borders are locked down to the point where one needs clearance to leave the country. Or if detention centers start getting filled with protestors/dissidents. It's too depressing to think of more "what if's" so I digress... Anyhoo, the frog in the kettle analogy is probably appropriate,

It's not pie-in-the-skyism to stand for through-and-through integrity. Either something is right, or it isn't.. You can't pretend values and yet fish flop or give lukewarm responses, arbitrarily.
Values are no use if they're all sloshing about like letters of an alphabet soup in no real correlation to each other. They must be rooted in reason.

Quote

some of us just have more sensitive skin than others.

That's tropism to comfort, I think.

lazs2 · « **Reply #109 on:** December 03, 2006, 12:04:23 PM »

Oh.. don't get me wrong.. Us older guys who have been through the mill will go through it again if the right leader shows up.

There is nothing I own that I am more fond of than my freedom or that of my family.

We just aren't martyrs and we go into anything like this with eyes wide open.

If I get a chance to change things I will. If someone, some state, suceeds from the US and forms a free country modeled after the original constitution I will move there and fight for that new country. But... my eyes will be wide open.

I have seen no plans that will work at this time... No leader.

I see no option working within the system except to vote republican so that democrats won't get in... democrats will raise my taxes and make government bigger... republicans aren't much better but... those are the only chances we have. There will allways be some shrill shrew woman democrat in power who want's to take more of my individuality and freedom for "my own good" or for "the good of society".

Maybe we deserve it or maybe... we just got too crowded... or... too soft and too PC... we let women vote. It is rare indeed to find a woman who thinks the constitution is not just a work in progress... like the men in their lives... for them to mold into something that suits their ideal of security and PC.

lazs

Chairboy · « **Reply #110 on:** December 14, 2006, 01:44:34 PM »

Debonair · « **Reply #111 on:** December 14, 2006, 02:00:52 PM »

hahaha i like the pennsylvania one.
some n0Obs say guns are phallic symbols, but the stormtrooper got it the other way around, lololol:rofl

MotorOil1 · « **Reply #112 on:** December 14, 2006, 02:08:18 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2

I watch cops practice... they yell (in their best uninteligble marine corps Di voice "POLEEZEOBENOP" and two seconds latter smash in the door and go in guns hot. Maybe throw in a flash bang grenade... they are wearing all black.. armor and masks with "police" on the back of their armor...

they are doing this in the hours decent people are assleep.

Now, if you are a law abiding citizen (impossible given the amount of laws) but.. say you are pretty much one... you have the right to defend your home. You have the right to be armed. you have the right to shoot at gun toting ninjas breaking into your home.

I hope this helps to get rid of no knock but I doubt it.

We should have all been outraged when we seen our police wearing masks and making night time raids but... we trusted em.... never thought it would be used against citizens.... couldn't imagine a real homeowner let alone a grandma being roused in the middle of the night and killed when she fought off a group of these a holes.

but it is happening.

lazs

You're absolutely right, that's the way its done and I wouldn't do it any other way, but outraged by seeing police in masks???? I'll be sure to identify myself to the next Hell's Angels club owner whose house I could be raiding so he can follow me home when he doesn't get any jail time for the crime he's committed. (finger pointed at justice system)

Right to defend your home yes and that's why a raid is conducted with the impression the structure will be defended, only makes sense. There was likely a lot of confusion for an elderly lady during the raid.

Remember the average citizen doesn't have to fear a masked cop cause they are not seeing it. If your home is being raided it's because you are a threat to society. Assuming mistakes don't happen. If you were living in some kind of military state this kind of thing wouldn't hit the news.

When was the last time you or your neighbour had your door kicked in by masked cops and then hauled away never to be seen again?

Like I said this raid was a mistake, the error was made before the door was kicked in. The tactics of the raid are irrelevant.

lazs2 · « **Reply #113 on:** December 14, 2006, 02:10:03 PM »

not one person has ever been proven to have been executed unfairly and yet we have thousands, maybe millions of people who protest the death penalty on the off chance that even one person may be executed unfairly yet no one seems to care that the police are gunning down citizens in their homes after breaking into them in the middle of the night.

lazs

bsdaddict · « **Reply #114 on:** December 14, 2006, 02:14:46 PM »

Do you read Reason, Chairboy? I read it online, thinking about subscribing...

lazs2 · « **Reply #115 on:** December 14, 2006, 02:23:19 PM »

motor oil... seriously... when was the last time a hells angel looked at some cops face and then followed em home and killed em?

sure seems to me that these "tactics" that you are defending are killing a lot of citizens that don't seserve to die. Lot more citizens are dieing at your hands than unmasked cops dieing at hells angles hands.

If you have no balls then you should get another job. or..... you could just stick with sending 100 swat guys in on every granny suspected of haveing an ounce of pot or maybe a legal firearm.... do it in the middle of the night in masks too because after all.... your guys are much more important than the lives of citizens right?

lazs

bsdaddict · « **Reply #116 on:** December 14, 2006, 02:25:20 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by MotorOil1
You're absolutely right, that's the way its done and I wouldn't do it any other way, but outraged by seeing police in masks???? I'll be sure to identify myself to the next Hell's Angels club owner whose house I could be raiding so he can follow me home when he doesn't get any jail time for the crime he's committed. (finger pointed at justice system)

Right to defend your home yes and that's why a raid is conducted with the impression the structure will be defended, only makes sense. There was likely a lot of confusion for an elderly lady during the raid.

Remember the average citizen doesn't have to fear a masked cop cause they are not seeing it. If your home is being raided it's because you are a threat to society. Assuming mistakes don't happen. If you were living in some kind of military state this kind of thing wouldn't hit the news.

When was the last time you or your neighbour had your door kicked in by masked cops and then hauled away never to be seen again?

Like I said this raid was a mistake, the error was made before the door was kicked in. The tactics of the raid are irrelevant.

To say that the tactics are irrelevant, while knowing that mistakes can, and WILL, happen is foolish, shortsighted and shows a callousness to the welfare and rights of your fellow citizens that I find disgustingly unamerican. Irrelevant my you-know-what.

I'd better stop before I get this thread locked.

lazs2 · « **Reply #117 on:** December 14, 2006, 02:42:07 PM »

yep BS... I agree.. if any cops here think the American people are proud of them breaking into citizens homes in the middle of the night they are very much on the wrong side of this whole thing.

Sorry but we see sections of the cities that you brave ninjas won't go into even heavily armed. we don't see hells angels breaking into your homes in the middle of the night in riot gear and stomping your pets and shooting everyone in your house... we see you wearing masks and going 10 against one on slumbering citizens.

It wasn't allways this way... the joke is.... one riot.... one Texas Ranger.... One wino..... 400 swat. And the ranger isn't even wearing a mask.

lazs

MotorOil1 · « **Reply #118 on:** December 14, 2006, 03:07:17 PM »

I've been on close to 100 raids and never have we ever mistakenly raided the wrong place or killed someone innocent. Every mistake made by the police is widely publicised and criticised. You need to analyse the mistakes and correct them.

A doctor may do 1000 operations in his career, makes one mistake, someone dies. What do we do, get rid of all the doctors? Stop surgeries because someone died? No, you learn from it, perhaps punish those responsible and move on.

Funny how all but one of the raids I was on never made the news. We used the same tactics on all of them.

Also funny how no criminal has ever followed me home to murder me or my family. Perhaps it has been the results of the tactics used which have been developed over time?

When you find Osama or the residence you think he's at you should just gather around in a suit and tie, knock and politely ask him to come out, so no one gets hurt. That might work.

Shuffler · « **Reply #119 on:** December 14, 2006, 03:10:06 PM »

I for one find the hands of Cops being tied too often. Criminals have more rights, where they should have NONE.

Now that being said, I would find it dificult, if some ninja cops broke into my parents home and shot them in the middle of the night for trying to defend their home. Hunting season would be open just as if a criminal broke in and did the same. When lives are on the line.... there is no room for mistakes. Everything should be checked and rechecked to confirm such tactics.