Proof P47 is handy capped

[Uriel]

http://www.zenoswarbirdvideos.com/Images/P-47/47TOCL.gif

more charts for fun

[Karnak]

You didn't make a point.

You seem very young and lacking in education regarding valid sources for highly specific things.  You will be taught this as you go through school though.

Websites are not highly regarded sources unless they can provide sourcing data.  There are a great many sites out there that have supposed performance numbers on them for this or that aircraft.  BUt without sourcing we have no way to know if they site's author didn't just make them up.


Another example is the danger of taking first hand accounts as gospel.  I have talked (via the internet) to some Mossie pilots who claimed it would do better than 370mph on the deck.  I also have comments from De Haviliand that the Mosquito's airspeed indicator sometimes read about 20mph faster than the aircraft was going.

Now, do you think the odd Mossie was about 20mph faster than the normal ones or do you think the pilots were reading 370mph while really doing about 350?

[Karnak]

Originally posted by Uriel
http://www.zenoswarbirdvideos.com/Images/P-47/47TOCL.gif

more charts for fun

Interesting, but it doesn't have anything to do with your claims.  The climb data on it peaks at 2300ft/min.  The rest has to do with runway lengths and conditions.


And FYI, LePaul is one of the biggest P-47 fans in AH.  He isn't knocking it at all.

[Panzzer]

Originally posted by Uriel
see thats 25 percent fuel.. not performing like chart above anyways.. I think some of you guys will like that site.. its got really great authentic stuff if nothing else comes of this enjoy, but Im officially done making my point

Where did you find the load-out / weight for those numbers provided at Zeno's? Can't see it in your above quotation.

[Uriel]

Originally posted by Karnak
You didn't make a point.

You seem very young and lacking in education regarding valid sources for highly specific things.  You will be taught this as you go through school though.

Websites are not highly regarded sources unless they can provide sourcing data.  There are a great many sites out there that have supposed performance numbers on them for this or that aircraft.  BUt without sourcing we have no way to know if they site's author didn't just make them up.


Another example is the danger of taking first hand accounts as gospel.  I have talked (via the internet) to some Mossie pilots who claimed it would do better than 370mph on the deck.  I also have comments from De Haviliand that the Mosquito's airspeed indicator sometimes read about 20mph faster than the aircraft was going.

Now, do you think the odd Mossie was about 20mph faster than the normal ones or do you think the pilots were reading 370mph while really doing about 350?

wow dude.. Im done. For your info Im 28, a home owner, a veteran, and scored much higher than the norm on the ASVAB.
I don't just go by military spec charts because they show the operational "safety limit", as anyone who has opened a EOSS manual would know. Yes I take into acounts historic battles and kill ratio, as they must reflect the performance of the aircraft to some degree. You people are dense- good night.

[Hoffman]

Boy your proffessors are gonna have fun with you in college.

Your documentation sucks.

You're using a .COM[/i][/u] website for 'factual' information.


You know... I was really tempted to put something mean in here the moment I saw 28 and ASVAB.  Then decided not to... then saw the part where you called me dense.

I shall now contentedly go to bed secure in the knowledge that some PFC knows basic math.  Because with an attitude like that you sure as hell didn't get a higher rank than that. Especially if you have to invoke ASVAB on an internet board.

[Ack-Ack]

ARMY AIR FORCES
PROVING GROUND COMMAND
Eglin Field, Florida
TACTICAL SUITABILITY OF THE P-47C-1 TYPE AIRCRAFT
18 December 1942


Conclusions

                 a.    The P-47C-1 is the best high altitude fighter aircraft now in production with regard to high speed, stability, pilot comfort, height and armament.

                b.    The rate of climb is not as good as desired, which fact limits its suitability as a medium altitude fighter and as an interceptor.

                 c.    All weight in the structure and accessories not vital to operational use should be eliminated.

                 d.    The aircraft is pleasant and easy to fly. New pilots should have no trouble being checked out in it.

                 e.    The rate of aileron roll is the best found in any type of American fighter.

                 f.    The view over the nose is not great enough to allow desired deflection shooting.

                 g.    The demand type oxygen installation is satisfactory, but the service type mask with this installation is bulky, heavy, cumbersome and irritating to the pilot.

                 h.    It is dangerous to attempt to take-off with mixture control in full rich position.

                 i.    In a glide with engine idling, engine tends to load up and difficulty is encountered starting up engine again.

                 j.    The hook-up of the throttle, R.P.M., and turbo control handles to operate as one if desired is very satisfactory.

                 k.    With the present ceiling now obtainable with this aircraft, and the added height with new modifications, experiments should be pushed to perfect a pressurized cockpit on this type plane now.



Source

[thrila]

Doesn't one of the p47 D models in AH do about 360 at 5k?  Guessing the d-40. 5mph is within variations you would expect from different machines anyway.

[LePaul]

Originally posted by Karnak

And FYI, LePaul is one of the biggest P-47 fans in AH.  He isn't knocking it at all.

I love my single-engined Lancaster!  Its my personal favorite for GV plinking.  

I don't think Im quite the biggest fan, but I do like its payload and ability to survive the LTARs    (I'm usually in a P-38J, P-51B, Ar234 or Juggy)

[Kweassa]

wow dude.. Im done. For your info Im 28, a home owner, a veteran, and scored much higher than the norm on the ASVAB.

 Then how do you explain your utter lack of understanding and comprehension concerning what these gentlemen are trying to tell you? Why can't you understand what 'primary documentation' means? Or what it means to 'prove' something in these boards?

 ...
 

 At this point, I'm kinda confused as to whether continue with the insults against you or not, because now, I'm actually becoming worried that I might be talking to a mentally-challenged person. I wouldn't want to ridicule someone who can't comprehend things the way a normal person does. Making fun of retards is plain bad form.

[WMLute]

Whelp... that seals it.

It's on a website, so it MUST be true.

We have been overmatched.

Time to throw in the towel gents.

[Murdr]

Originally posted by Uriel
see thats 25 percent fuel.. not performing like chart above anyways.. I think some of you guys will like that site.. its got really great authentic stuff if nothing else comes of this enjoy, but Im officially done making my point

Welcome to 1997!  The 100s or maybe 1000s of AH players that have been flying this type of sim as early as 1987 might have missed this site in the decade its been around

[Bronk]

Originally posted by Murdr
Welcome to 1997!  The 100s or maybe 1000s of AH players that have been flying this type of sim as early as 1987 might have missed this site in the decade its been around

Bronk

[Balsy]

Originally posted by Hoffman
Boy your proffessors are gonna have fun with you in college.

Your documentation sucks.

You're using a .COM[/i][/u] website for 'factual' information.


You know... I was really tempted to put something mean in here the moment I saw 28 and ASVAB.  Then decided not to... then saw the part where you called me dense.

I shall now contentedly go to bed secure in the knowledge that some PFC knows basic math.  Because with an attitude like that you sure as hell didn't get a higher rank than that. Especially if you have to invoke ASVAB on an internet board.

A PFC is a Marine, and a Marine would never make this much of a mistake.  Uriel has already let us know he is a Navy Swabby, and well.. you've seen the results of the lack of booze, and women on those long 6 month deployments....

He once saw a ship go faster than Janes said it would... WOW.. this is classified as TOP SECRET by the government...  Also he cannot confirm nor deny the presence of nuclear weapons on his ship.

I think this one spent too much time in the paint locker of that ship he was on.  Boatswains mate???

Balsy

[SlapShot]

I mean, if we are talking numbers ... Pffft .... P-47 ... the HellCat pwns the Jug !!!

"Navy and Marine F6Fs flew 66,530 combat sorties (45% of all fighter sorties of the war, 62,386 sorties were flown from aircraft carriers) and destroyed 5,163 enemy aircraft (56% of all Naval/Marine air victories of the war) at a cost of 270 Hellcats (an overall kill-to-loss ratio of 19:1).

The aircraft performed well against the best Japanese opponents with a 13:1 kill ratio against Mitsubishi A6M, 9.5:1 against Nakajima Ki-84, 28:0 against Kawanishi N1K-J, and 3.7:1 against Mitsubishi J2M during the last year of the war.

In the ground attack role, Hellcats dropped 6,503 tons of bombs.

The F6F became the prime ace-maker aircraft in the American inventory, with 306 Hellcat aces."

After all ... with those types of numbers, the F6F HAS GOT to be a better plane than the P-47 ... right ?