Author Topic: Can we just rename it?  (Read 3085 times)

Offline BnZ

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #75 on: May 25, 2008, 10:21:11 AM »
Uh...I didn't say I saw YOU in a gang horde...you asked me what I thought about such behavior generally, I just telling you.

As for the rest...that is the MA, it is a melee and melee dynamics will rule. There is always the inherent risk (or perhaps it is a certainty) that anchoring yourself to a maneuvering fight with bandit A will lead to bandits B, C, D, E, F, and G gang-raping you.

No offense, but you seem like a hard man to please. You said you don't like the formal duelling...which is fine, it is all a matter of taste. Yet you seem to want the MA to function more like the DA. You obviously don't like being gang-horded, no one does, yet you have contempt for the bnz/energy tactics and the prudence in engaging that are rational responses to the unpredictable and chaotic multi-bandit nature of the MA combat. I may cuss the conditions sometimes, but in some ways, they are a good thing for demonstrating why certain planes and tactics were developed. For instance, for co-alt co-E duels, the Fw-190 D9 is almost useless compared to the Spitfire. Yet for slashing through large enemy formations in the MA without getting cornered and ganged to death, its value as a combat aircraft is revealed. I've said it once and I'll say it again: Historically, prop fighters evolved from light maneuverable kites into increasingly fast, but heavy, bricks. This is because using energy tactics whenever possible proved to be a higher percentage way of killing without being killed than engaging in the old Luftberry type tactics. Being bitter over what works and what doesn't due to the dynamics of simulated air melees is a bit like being bitter over having to deal with gravity or other facts of life.

 BTW, IMHO, this is a combat flight simulation, of which "duels" in the sky are a fine part, but not the only part. While I don't personally believe in being the fourth or fifth guy chasing a lone bandit, I see "drag and bag" tactics as being perfectly valid. I think it is an all-right thing, nay, a good thing, to simulate the other 80% of air kills...you know, the ones where the victim never saw his attacker coming. Anyway, my enemy check6 key doesn't seem to work.



Where did you see me flying into a hoard? I let the A6M come to me. Sure I could see there were two other cons close by and more way off in the distance but that's sure not flying into a hoard. When I turned into the A6M because he was getting too close, I could see the first ki84 was coming so I expected him to join in. However at that time the P51 which would be the third plane was going at a different direction.

The p51 turned in when I started to engage the A6m. Then next thing you know a 109 or 190 flys in from somewhere else, another Ki84 and a Spitfire. You can also see the 110 that I tried to fight before all this even happened. The one 110 was the plane I tried to fight in the first place but he ran away and dove to the deck.

Where do you see me flying into the hoard? The hoard came to me, which is typical in this game anymore. There is rarely chance to get some good fighting in with out every noob in the sector showing up trying to pick a easy kill.

I flew for several hours yesterday and I managed to get two 1 on 1 fights that didn't end up with 5 noobs trying to jump in. One was a pretty good fight vs a LA7 I was again in the P40 and he had alt, which made it a challenging fight. I give him props (gon4beer) because he actually fought me and didn't try to run away and I killed him. 8) After the fight I felt a little sorry because I AFK cherry picked him the sortie before.  :devil

Then in the same sortie I see a P39 (rook) and a spitfire on my side fighting so I hang around the edge of the fight but I let them fight their fight. Which I think is the respectable thing to do. I saw a nikki a little lower so I lose my alt and engage him. Needless to say every pass was a HO and he's spray and praying eventually knocked off both of my elevators so wasn't much of a fight after that. (typical nikki) However a amazing thing happened which is extremely rare.

The very P39 that I didn't go gang, starts to come into my fight with the Nikki, then he turned around and RTBed. So I have to assume either the Nikki called him off or he felt like repaying me for not ganging him. After flying several hours yesterday and ending up being on the losing side of a mini hoard pretty much every sortie I managed to get two 1 vs 1 fights, which ironically happened in the same sortie.

Even though the Nikki was a spray and pay HOtard and he killed me, at least it was a fair fight that didn't end up with 2 or 3 cons flying in trying to pick the easy kill. What I don't get and it's the reason for this topic, is why does it take several hours of flying looking for fights to actually only get two "real" turn fights that don't end up with every noob in the sector jumping in?

Oh and just for the record, BnZing some con or killing them with a quick pass putting your self in no danger isn't what I consider a fight. I know a lot of the people that claim they get lots of 1 on 1 fights do the typical flying in easy mode with alt picking the other con as he climbs up. That to me is not fighting and not what I consider a good 1 on 1 fight.


Offline betty

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #76 on: May 25, 2008, 10:30:48 AM »
(Image removed from quote.)




CHOOOOOOOOO CHOOOOOOOOOOO! ALL ABOARD!!!!!!!!!!
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!!!!!POTIUS MORI QUAM FOEDARI!!!!

Offline crockett

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #77 on: May 25, 2008, 10:43:36 AM »
Uh...I didn't say I saw YOU in a gang horde...you asked me what I thought about such behavior generally, I just telling you.

As for the rest...that is the MA, it is a melee and melee dynamics will rule. There is always the inherent risk (or perhaps it is a certainty) that anchoring yourself to a maneuvering fight with bandit A will lead to bandits B, C, D, E, F, and G gang-raping you.

No offense, but you seem like a hard man to please. You said you don't like the formal duelling...which is fine, it is all a matter of taste. Yet you seem to want the MA to function more like the DA. You obviously don't like being gang-horded, no one does, yet you have contempt for the bnz/energy tactics and the prudence in engaging that are rational responses to the unpredictable and chaotic multi-bandit nature of the MA combat. I may cuss the conditions sometimes, but in some ways, they are a good thing for demonstrating why certain planes and tactics were developed. For instance, for co-alt co-E duels, the Fw-190 D9 is almost useless compared to the Spitfire. Yet for slashing through large enemy formations in the MA without getting cornered and ganged to death, its value as a combat aircraft is revealed. I've said it once and I'll say it again: Historically, prop fighters evolved from light maneuverable kites into increasingly fast, but heavy, bricks. This is because using energy tactics whenever possible proved to be a higher percentage way of killing without being killed than engaging in the old Luftberry type tactics. Being bitter over what works and what doesn't due to the dynamics of simulated air melees is a bit like being bitter over having to deal with gravity or other facts of life.

 BTW, IMHO, this is a combat flight simulation, of which "duels" in the sky are a fine part, but not the only part. While I don't personally believe in being the fourth or fifth guy chasing a lone bandit, I see "drag and bag" tactics as being perfectly valid. I think it is an all-right thing, nay, a good thing, to simulate the other 80% of air kills...you know, the ones where the victim never saw his attacker coming. Anyway, my enemy check6 key doesn't seem to work.


I understand your points, but this game isn't like real war. The axis were up there in the air to shoot down the allies at any cost. The allies were up there to also shoot down the axis at any cost. They weren't in the air to run from an engagement, they were there to shoot down the other aircraft to help win the war.

Granted in real life it was typically a squadron running into a squadron but they damn sure didn't have all the pilots jumping on a single con they might have come across.

In this game half the players run from any sort of fight they don't have an advantage in. It's either run away and try to come back and pick soon as the con gets busy fighting someone else or run to your buddies so you can gangbang. In real life the pilots didn't have little radars and icons that they could easily find a buddy to help them.

Granted there were many pilots who dove to the deck in real life once they were in trouble, but they were also risking their very real lives. Unlike in this game the most that is at risk is a few perk points. So trying to compare fighting styles in this game to real life, is like trying to compare apples to oranges IMHO.
"strafing"

Offline KooLBreeZ

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #78 on: May 25, 2008, 02:15:31 PM »
If this game was anything near like real life maybe 1% would play it. No towers to end up in nor reupping at the near base. Just a flag over your casket. No 200 to whine on and no wtg's on kills in lights. So lets not compare this game to anything in real life. It is nothing but a game.

Offline Scotch

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #79 on: May 25, 2008, 05:12:49 PM »
It used to be that if a guy came upon a fight, he'd circle just outside of it and wait his turn. Guarding the fight, no matter the outcome of his countrymate below.  Whether it was in the middle of the pond, or right off of his field. Even AFK guys would get a break. Saddle up on their six and wait until he comes back to shoot him as he panics and rolls around.  :lol
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Offline xbrit

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #80 on: May 25, 2008, 07:04:23 PM »
ok let's all just listen to one person and make sure we all play the game his way, this will solve all future problems.

Offline Banshee7

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #81 on: May 25, 2008, 09:37:37 PM »
If this game was anything near like real life maybe 1% would play it. No towers to end up in nor reupping at the near base. Just a flag over your casket. No 200 to whine on and no wtg's on kills in lights. So lets not compare this game to anything in real life. It is nothing but a game.

 :pray
Amen
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Offline crockett

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #82 on: May 26, 2008, 04:10:52 AM »
It used to be that if a guy came upon a fight, he'd circle just outside of it and wait his turn. Guarding the fight, no matter the outcome of his countrymate below.  Whether it was in the middle of the pond, or right off of his field. Even AFK guys would get a break. Saddle up on their six and wait until he comes back to shoot him as he panics and rolls around.  :lol

Hehe, my personal favorite, is fly up right beside them or buzz past them and see how long it takes before they realise I'm a bad guy.
"strafing"

Offline SD67

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #83 on: May 26, 2008, 04:25:33 AM »
Even AFK guys would get a break. Saddle up on their six and wait until he comes back to shoot him as he panics and rolls around.  :lol
:O You did this to me the other week :lol
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Offline ColKLink

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #84 on: May 26, 2008, 04:30:48 AM »
"Get me in a fight I like the dirty tricks" dire straights , "heavy fuel".. The aussies are responsible for all that is not holy in the MA!!! pffffft, its a game. :rock
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Offline wantok

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #85 on: May 26, 2008, 08:11:59 AM »
Crockett, if you're really looking for good one on one fights in LW MAs, don't go near furballs.  Search the map for likely spots where just one or two bandits are.  If there aren't any, create that kind of situation yourself.... up somewhere lonely and head for an undefended field.  With luck you'll get just one or two upping to fight you.  There are likeminded players around looking for 1v1s as well.

Other than that, MW.
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Offline bj229r

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #86 on: May 26, 2008, 10:00:57 AM »
It used to be that if a guy came upon a fight, he'd circle just outside of it and wait his turn. Guarding the fight, no matter the outcome of his countrymate below.  Whether it was in the middle of the pond, or right off of his field. Even AFK guys would get a break. Saddle up on their six and wait until he comes back to shoot him as he panics and rolls around.  :lol
I did the 'mig insulter' move from Top Gun on a guy the other day in lake, was a hoot. Guy looks up, and an inverted P47 is mere feet above his Ki.....he didnt appreciate the humor....typical
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Offline crockett

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #87 on: May 26, 2008, 01:04:29 PM »
Crockett, if you're really looking for good one on one fights in LW MAs, don't go near furballs.  Search the map for likely spots where just one or two bandits are.  If there aren't any, create that kind of situation yourself.... up somewhere lonely and head for an undefended field.  With luck you'll get just one or two upping to fight you.  There are likeminded players around looking for 1v1s as well.

Other than that, MW.

I do that already, I will very rarely be spotted in a furball. I go out of my way to fly away from green guys just to make sure they don't pick my kills. I do everything possible to look for 1 on 1 or even 2 on 1 fights. Problem is most of the time, the cons I do run into tend to be the ones that don't want to fight. I'm apparently bothering them on their way to go kill radars or ords.. ect..ect.

I've tried MW and EW in the past as well but seems to be filled with milk runners, that and my squad flys in the MA's.
"strafing"

Offline BiPoLaR

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #88 on: May 26, 2008, 01:53:02 PM »
This game has little to do with Aces or actual fighter combat...

Lets just call the game what it really is..

Toolsheders vs Gangtards

Just toss in some air spawns and and instant power up blinky things and I'm sure that will make the average AHer happy. I just flew that last 2 hours and not a single sortie could I get a 1 on 1 fight. It was either a minimum of 4 vs 1 or nothing. Any chance of a 1 on 1 soon ended by the so called other pilot diving to the deck or running to his buddies.

Of course the toolsheders can't be left out. I mean hell they have a map to play on the size of Texas but what base do they capture? Why of course the one base that provided the only 3 way fight on the map.

I keep taking these short breaks hoping when I come back maybe just maybe something changed... I always end up being disappointed sad to say. One of these days I think I'm just gonna take a break that I don't come back from. There is really little to be desired anymore if you actually enjoy air combat that don't consist of being one of the 6 tards on the noob train chasing the single enemy.

you know whats sad...this is true
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Offline Getback

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Re: Can we just rename it?
« Reply #89 on: May 26, 2008, 02:01:02 PM »
This subject is sooooooooooooooooooooo very hold and tired.   :rolleyes:

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