TOWN TOO BIG FOR AVERAGE SQUAD

[Lusche]

in the lw arenas, i don't know why no one bothers to defend.

I think because most players don't like to have the feeling being not on the initiative (after all, usually the attacker determines when & where to fight), and they may not have the feeling of having something accomplished if they held the base. When the attacker wins the base, there is a fancy announcement on system channel, one base changes colour and there will be a lot of WTG's on country. In some way, for the average player it's more "rewarding" to be part of a successful landgrab, than in a successful, but rather quiet defense.

That's why we frequently read "I'm bored by all that defending, let's grab a base!" and never "I'm bored by all that captures, let's defend a base"

Also I have the vague feeling that the sub-average and average players gravitate more towards grabbing bases (due to the feeling of accomplishment), and the better ones tend to defend more.  So one guy is part of a successful landgrab and thus thinks he has won (no matter how often he died), while the other one lost the base, but killed 20 enemies and thus also thinks he has won

[Lusche]

Thats a good point, maybe have 2 maps in rotation depending on the time of day?

You seen this?

[Lusche]

Lusch,
In the last month about 6 posts have been started camplaining or wishing for a change in town capture or how strat effects the game play. If you are willing would you pull all of them and map the varying facts and trending. Then see if a general Scatter Plot graph can result from the analysis?

I'll pass
With staying up all night for a whole week to record player numbers in LW I think I have fulfilled my extreme nerd quota for this quarter 

[Ardy123]

You seen this?

I have not seen it before but I like the idea alot.

[bustr]

Lusch.....It was worth a shot....

Late last night it was obvious how a hoard can simply overwhelm a base's defences when the fight is 30+ vs 10 defenders. For the hoard it's emmidiate catharsis because the odds of any real pain or defeat is a shared fractional of a statisticly safe initiative. The end result is a no brainer gaurantee of vulches and victory against a small number of players willing to draw a line in the sand against such odds. Some of us enjoy this occasionly. It is a visceral emediate satisfaction akin to being a meth addict. Remember all games have a biological component called endorphin and adrenalin. So to, delayed gratification is a hallmark of a mature person.

Many of us though would like a challenge before acheiving a well earned victory or even defeat. Some competition with a hard running fight that tests the whole cadre of competitors so when you win you feel tried and tested. When you loose it was worth every moment of your effort but, now you are coming back for blood. So Old School.....

The radar change initially created great fights. But, slowley the large hoard attackers have learned to simply swamp the target with so many bodies no epic battle is always possible. If a simliarly large group of defenders do not respond in the first minute of an attack, the base will eventualy fall to superior numbers. This is because the defences do not reflect the ongoing genisis and genius of the dedicated base taking AH culture. Last night I learned the magic number to overwhelm large airfeilds in 60 seconds. 30 jabo P47. 30 P47 with their red Icons clustered on an airfeild block out your monitor with a red spider web of text and make vulching any single plane a challenge. 30 P47 become their own 50.cal air defence when you pull up from a vulch and they all open up from under you.

We are arguing about symptoms that each of us are exposed to of a larger demographic shift in the game. We are seeing groups of players who feel comfortable in not fighting as an individual like many of us dialoging in this POST. A conflict of operational and generational moral codes. We see a growth in the unwillingness to fight as an indivdual. We see groups entering fights with altitiude and still being unwilling to engage agressive lesser numbers of defenders. We see an unwilligness to engage as a group unless the cost for victory is weighted heavily in that groups favor. Didn't I see awhile back a new player honestly ask how to access the AH God Mode codes or hotkeys in the tech help forum? In the Wishlist Forum is a request for perk payable feild "MODS" to gain a technological edge. Shades of the Halo and WWW first person world.

HiTech can only give us more toys to distract us and cleverly tweek the environment to engage us. How we interact with each other is the gist of our problem. You are trying to solve human nature problems by asking HiTech to program more clever puzzles and mazes to distract us with. Eventualy we will outsmart the new puzzels and mazes bringing the human nature problem back to the table. First define the real problem. Then determin how to make use of the answer to benifit the game.

[grizz441]

Lusch.....It was worth a shot....

Late last night it was obvious how a hoard can simply overwhelm a base's defences when the fight is 30+ vs 10 defenders. For the hoard it's emmidiate catharsis because the odds of any real pain or defeat is a shared fractional of a statisticly safe initiative. The end result is a no brainer gaurantee of vulches and victory against a small number of players willing to draw a line in the sand against such odds. Some of us enjoy this occasionly. It is a visceral emediate satisfaction akin to being a meth addict. Remember all games have a biological component called endorphin and adrenalin. So to, delayed gratification is a hallmark of a mature person.

Many of us though would like a challenge before acheiving a well earned victory or even defeat. Some competition with a hard running fight that tests the whole cadre of competitors so when you win you feel tried and tested. When you loose it was worth every moment of your effort but, now you are coming back for blood. So Old School.....

The radar change initially created great fights. But, slowley the large hoard attackers have learned to simply swamp the target with so many bodies no epic battle is always possible. If a simliarly large group of defenders do not respond in the first minute of an attack, the base will eventualy fall to superior numbers. This is because the defences do not reflect the ongoing genisis and genius of the dedicated base taking AH culture. Last night I learned the magic number to overwhelm large airfeilds in 60 seconds. 30 jabo P47. 30 P47 with their red Icons clustered on an airfeild block out your monitor with a red spider web of text and make vulching any single plane a challenge. 30 P47 become their own 50.cal air defence when you pull up from a vulch and they all open up from under you.

We are arguing about symptoms that each of us are exposed to of a larger demographic shift in the game. We are seeing groups of players who feel comfortable in not fighting as an individual like many of us dialoging in this POST. A conflict of operational and generational moral codes. We see a growth in the unwillingness to fight as an indivdual. We see groups entering fights with altitiude and still being unwilling to engage agressive lesser numbers of defenders. We see an unwilligness to engage as a group unless the cost for victory is weighted heavily in that groups favor. Didn't I see awhile back a new player honestly ask how to access the AH God Mode codes or hotkeys in the tech help forum? In the Wishlist Forum is a request for perk payable feild "MODS" to gain a technological edge. Shades of the Halo and WWW first person world.

HiTech can only give us more toys to distract us and cleverly tweek the environment to engage us. How we interact with each other is the gist of our problem. You are trying to solve human nature problems by asking HiTech to program more clever puzzles and mazes to distract us with. Eventualy we will outsmart the new puzzels and mazes bringing the human nature problem back to the table. First define the real problem. Then determin how to make use of the answer to benifit the game.

All that being said, the town is still too difficult to destroy and capture..

[FLOTSOM]

BUSTR!!! 

i bet your kids realy hate talking to you!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

but again a pleasure to read your thoughts..................... .even if they do give me migrains!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Grizz stop being a wussy and just learn how to use those 30mm taters in the 262 to down buildings, then nobody could complain that it cant be done fast enough!!!!! but that woiuld mean you would actually have to stop attacking the attackers and become one of the hoardlings yourself....

 

 

[Ardy123]

oh god... a horde of Grizzes (or is it Grizzi??), thats when we all start avoiding combat.


lol

[FLOTSOM]

oh god... a horde of Grizzes (or is it Grizzi??), thats when we all start avoiding combat.


lol

Bunnies i flew along side you the other night, and with all the complaining the opposition did regarding you and your skill, it wouldnt surprize me to find out that they are already considering avoiding combat altogether!!!!

 

[oceans11]

Maybe it's a question of training? I checked your scores, and while scores mean nothing, they can point to different indicators. As a squad you guys don't bomb very well, nor does it look like your fighter skills reflect very well. While I could be way off base here, if your guys can't hit what they are aiming for, nor defend and cap long enough for a goon to get in then yes I agree your going to have lots of trouble capturing bases.  Maybe you used NOE's a lot before and snuck bases, but that is the kind of thing HTC is looking to do away with, the AVOIDANCE of battle/combat.

What this means is that you have to up your game. You will have to fight for them now.

prior to the town changes our bombing skills where perfect , we had it down to science.
We don't care to much About scores, ive must of spawned into a camped site 30 odd times getting instantly killed just to keep them busy on me while my other squadies where sneaking in the back door.
Please  I am not a point nor kill lander and never will work towards that goal

If you like you can look at the rest of my squadies I think there scores speak for themselves and we hold our own.

[bustr]

All that being said, the town is still too difficult to destroy and capture..

Au contraire, mon frère. The group is my safety net demographic is adapting nicely while finding creative ways to ignore and make irrelevant the old school today is a good day to die demographic.

Running away is another word for ignoring you personaly if they can't beat you. They are learning and enjoying the quick meth fix of bringing 30 or more to swamp all who might deny them thier fix. All of your incredable personal skills are nothing against 30 especially if you cannot get a single one of them to stand still and fight. They are making the spirit of conflict and combat irellevant because the cost of becoming relevent in your world Grizz costs too much in their bang for buck equation.

If anything HiTech should make taking bases even harder to slow them down long enough so the sky samuria have time to be relevant. I've noticed lately the hoards seem to know the path to run a CV near shore to avoid the shore batteries. That would mean instead of polishing personal combat skills in the DA someone(s) are polishing time offline on the different maps learning the terrain. Thats a smarter time investment if you intend to adapt to the arena while taking feilds with numbers. Sounds exactly like what we did in the Pacific to the japanese and all their hot shot imperial navy samuria pilots.

This thread is about using a complicated formula to manipulate the game environment in the hope of manipulating a group of players to play the game differently than they currently are. Once manipulated that group of players still has a completely polar cultural motivation and reward demographic than you do. They will re-adapt to your change and get back to business as usual to reward themselves.

Like I said, first define the real problem. It aint technology or algorithms.
 

[oceans11]

BUSTR!!! 

i bet your kids realy hate talking to you!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

but again a pleasure to read your thoughts..................... .even if they do give me migrains!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Grizz stop being a wussy and just learn how to use those 30mm taters in the 262 to down buildings, then nobody could complain that it cant be done fast enough!!!!! but that woiuld mean you would actually have to stop attacking the attackers and become one of the hoardlings yourself.... :headscratc

 



He is not being a wuzzy . The fact remains its to big for a small squad







 

[oceans11]

Au contraire, mon frère. The group is my safety net demographic is adapting nicely while finding creative ways to ignore and make irrelevant the old school today is a good day to die demographic.

Running away is another word for ignoring you personaly if they can't beat you. They are learning and enjoying the quick meth fix of bringing 30 or more to swamp all who might deny them thier fix. All of your incredable personal skills are nothing against 30 especially if you cannot get a single one of them to stand still and fight. They are making the spirit of conflict and combat irellevant because the cost of becoming relevent in your world Grizz costs too much in their bang for buck equation.

If anything HiTech should make taking bases even harder to slow them down long enough so the sky samuria have time to be relevant. I've noticed lately the hoards seem to know the path to run a CV near shore to avoid the shore batteries. That would mean instead of polishing personal combat skills in the DA someone(s) are polishing time offline on the different maps learning the terrain. Thats a smarter time investment if you intend to adapt to the arena while taking feilds with numbers. Sounds exactly like what we did in the Pacific to the japanese and all their hot shot imperial navy samuria pilots.

This thread is about using a complicated formula to manipulate the game environment in the hope of manipulating a group of players to play the game differently than they currently are. Once manipulated that group of players still has a completely polar cultural motivation and reward demographic than you do. They will re-adapt to your change and get back to business as usual to reward themselves.

Like I said, first define the real problem. It aint technology or algorithms.



 

No offense kids but this is why you stay away from crack

                         Make them harder? Hell if you have it your way i am sure YOU would want to get rid of them...........


          And again ADHD must of gotten to most in here.

                                    ITS ABOUT THE TOWN BEING TO BIG for the average size squad which is about 10 or less .

            Aside from the LARGE squads the rest are left out in the cold . If that is what  this is heading to my squad will eventually go Also  along with the numbers of others that have left already.....

[lutrel]

Maybe it's a question of training? I checked your scores, and while scores mean nothing, they can point to different indicators. As a squad you guys don't bomb very well, nor does it look like your fighter skills reflect very well. While I could be way off base here, if your guys can't hit what they are aiming for, nor defend and cap long enough for a goon to get in then yes I agree your going to have lots of trouble capturing bases.  Maybe you used NOE's a lot before and snuck bases, but that is the kind of thing HTC is looking to do away with, the AVOIDANCE of battle/combat.

What this means is that you have to up your game. You will have to fight for them now.

Ok, here's the deal; our squad is a squad of 40+ aged guys that have careers and families that take up the majority of our time.  That being said, we are adults in an adult world, that have to work hard just to make the time to log on and fly as a squad twice a week, but we do it, just like we have for the last ten years, because we enjoy it.  None of us have anything to prove in here and do not entertain a contest at the urinal about flying skills in a cartoon world; we brought this matter up because it's our personal opinions that the changes have had a negative impact on the level of enjoyment for smaller squads.  The staff at Hytech Creations can consider our suggestions and either act on them or not, it's their company.  Vr....

[oceans11]

YEA what he ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Said