Boy, 4, mauled to death by dog in his NYC home

[Vulcan]

mtnman go on youtube and search for new zealand pig hunting. They use them a bit for that here. Typically they use dogs to bale and hold the pig while the hunter will knife it through the heart. So the video's aren't for softies (though I doubt you'll be worried). Feral pigs are a big problem here and the thick bush makes firearms difficult, so this method is the best (short of poison drops).

[ink]

Mtnman,

 Some pits and pitcrosses are use to hunt hogs,the Dogo de Argentina is a highly develope crossbreed that specializes in wild boar hunting were the dog is used as a catch dog and holds the boar while the hunt dispatches it with his knife.

  The pitbulls and most terriers are all from some type for hunting line,mind you the pitbull was developed with a specific purpose in mind and that wasnt really anything to do with hunting. BTW,pitbulls were not used for bull or bear baiting,they came about as a result of the outlawing of baiting animals as the type of dog that was used for such things didnt make very "good" fighters. The fights ended up with 2 dogs just holding fast and nothing much came of it so in order to "liven" up the fights terrier blood was added to the bulldogs.

  The bulldogs of those days looked nothing like the modern English bulldog but more resembled the modern day American bulldogs.

   Most of the bull breeds today,with the exception of the english bulldog,are general purpose dogs,meaning they can be trained to do many different things.You could train one to retrieve ducks or pheasent but that doesnt mean they'd be good at it....

   I have a pair of English Staffordshire bullterriers ATM but I raised mostly English Bull Terriers,the ones wiith the egg shaped heads,1 of my Bullies went on to title as a UDX,basically could have qualified as a police dog. Unfortunately just because he could do the job doesnt mean he would have been good at it,he was too friendly! At a dogshow I felt him tug on his leash,this was odd,I looked down and he had a dauchsund clamped down on his face,he looked at me as if to say would you please remove this annoyance!!! 

     Ya so much for the blood thirsty pitbulls!!!




     

MtnMan...cant say too much more then what Morfiend already said... you could train them to hunt anything. me personally I don't hunt...I just know my dogs


Morfiend....that is the typical background that you will hear from someone who studied APBT for sure, and it very well may be the truth, there are some who think the APBT is the original English Bulldog and was never breed with the terriers, the Half n Half or Staffordshire terrier(the dog's you have now) is the one that was breed with the terriers, and the APBT was brought to America before the outlawing of bull and Bear baiting.
still there are others who believe that the American Bulldog is the original Bulldog...which I don't believe.   
    I fall more into the line of APBT is the original Bulldog...but I am not positive, there is no way to be actually. 
I have read every thing there is to read about the APBT's, have seen some art of the original bulldog and they are very similar, except back then they did don't breed for look at all so you got a wide range of look and stature. it wasn't until they changed the name from APBT to Staffordshire terrier did they start breeding for look, and this is were you get the modern look for the Amstaff and APBT of today.
 "fighting pitdog's" were breed for their "gameness" which I am sure you know, so thinking this,you can surmise that they came in all shapes, sizes and looks, the best fights were the smaller dogs so they eventually became smaller then they originally were in England.

also from every thing I have read the "Bull terrier" was never used for fighting itself, but his ancestors were the Half and Half or Staffordshire terrier's, mixed with the English White terrier.

ether way I love my American Pit Bull Terrier


 

[fudgums]

Summer camp starts tomorrow so I figured i'd be doing stuff. Wednesday i'm going to a firing range with the group and we are being briefed on gun safety for 2 hours, then shoot for 3 hours, then hiking Thursday and Kayaking Friday. Then the week after its preparing for camping and survival lessons. Its all about responsibility and team work. I told you a few weeks ago but everyone gave me the  face when I mentioned it.

Does this one count as a keeper?

[VonMessa]

pits are banned in ohio. doesnt stop ppl from owning some tho.

Did your parents have any children that lived?

It never ceases to amaze me how ignorant citizens are about the laws of the land where they reside

Breed specific canines repealed and stricken from the state law.
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=Ohio+Revised+Code+Section+955.22D

This may help.
http://www.rif.org/

There are still some county or city limit specific bans, but it is indeed, not state-wide.

[mtnman]

You could train one to retrieve ducks or pheasent but that doesnt mean they'd be good at it....

I'm not interested in the retrieving part    Retrieving is actually a pretty big "negative" in my world.  As I'm sure you're aware, any dog can be taught to do many things, but not necessarily to the level it would need to do them to be adequate for the job.

What I need the dog to do is go out and find a group of pheasants or grouse, get close enough to them to get the birds to freeze, and then lock on point so I know where the birds are.  I need the dog to hold the birds there until I'm ready, which could be as little as 3-4 minutes, or could be up to 30+ minutes, depending on circumstances.

Once I get there, I need the dog to hold its point while I "gently" flush a few of the birds.  I need the dog to not move or flush the rest of the birds, but continue holding the rest of the flock there in case I need another flush.

The dog would need an extremely good nose (my JRT can't compete with my GSH in that regard, but I bought him because for the type of hunting I use him for a good nose is actually a negative).  It'd also need to be able to function in the field in temps between 75F and -20F, in both wet and dry conditions.  The nose is a big deal, as is the drive to locate the game; but the breeding to not break in and try to grab it is paramount (the point is really just a breeding-enhanced, prolonged, "pounce").

The terrier doesn't have such a good nose (comparatively) and hunts primarily by sight.  His job is to go into every little nook and cranny, under brush piles, through small (10") culverts, etc, and flush rabbits.  Once he flushes, he can chase, but when the bird gets there he needs to break off.  I also need him to lose track of the rabbit and quit chasing if the bird misses (which can be a problem with a dog with a good nose).  I also need him to look cute and non-threatening, because he's hunting off-leash around industrial parks, golf courses, town edges, etc, and I don't want people to feel he's a potential threat.

[grizz441]

I'm not interested in the retrieving part    Retrieving is actually a pretty big "negative" in my world.  As I'm sure you're aware, any dog can be taught to do many things, but not necessarily to the level it would need to do them to be adequate for the job.

What I need the dog to do is go out and find a group of pheasants or grouse, get close enough to them to get the birds to freeze, and then lock on point so I know where the birds are.  I need the dog to hold the birds there until I'm ready, which could be as little as 3-4 minutes, or could be up to 30+ minutes, depending on circumstances.

Once I get there, I need the dog to hold its point while I "gently" flush a few of the birds.  I need the dog to not move or flush the rest of the birds, but continue holding the rest of the flock there in case I need another flush.

The dog would need an extremely good nose (my JRT can't compete with my GSH in that regard, but I bought him because for the type of hunting I use him for a good nose is actually a negative).  It'd also need to be able to function in the field in temps between 75F and -20F, in both wet and dry conditions.  The nose is a big deal, as is the drive to locate the game; but the breeding to not break in and try to grab it is paramount (the point is really just a breeding-enhanced, prolonged, "pounce").

The terrier doesn't have such a good nose (comparatively) and hunts primarily by sight.  His job is to go into every little nook and cranny, under brush piles, through small (10") culverts, etc, and flush rabbits.  Once he flushes, he can chase, but when the bird gets there he needs to break off.  I also need him to lose track of the rabbit and quit chasing if the bird misses (which can be a problem with a dog with a good nose).  I also need him to look cute and non-threatening, because he's hunting off-leash around industrial parks, golf courses, town edges, etc, and I don't want people to feel he's a potential threat.

Hopefully you are paying these dogs at least 50k/year. 

[morfiend]

Mtnman,

  Your quite correct in your assement,the terriers dont have a good nose,they are more sight hunters,there's plenty of whippet blood in the terriers and the whippets are sight hounds like greyhounds,salukies and afgan hounds.Trying to train a terrier to hold a "set" goes against everything it's been bred to do,namely to dispatch pests!

  There have been Bullterriers that have won hearding events against the best border collies around but again this is an exception to the rule.

 Ink,  not sure where you read that the APBT is the original bulldog because nothing could be farther from the truth,the APBT is a direct desendand of the Staffie,they were brought to the Americas in the early 1800 and over time were bred to be somewhat larger than the original Staffie. As for the Bullterrier not being used to fight,well Mr James Hinks developed a strain of "white" dogs for the Westminister pits,these were very "showy" dogs,being white they show the blood to the crowd and afterall pit fighting is a blood sport.

  Problems come with white dogs,they tend to develope blue eyes and as a result deafness so the Staffie came to the rescue and was mixed back into the bullterrier lines and we got the Colored Bullterrier,which is sometimes comsidered a sepperate breed from the whites!

  I've spent the last 30 years raising,showing and training dogs,I've made it my hobby to study everything I can find on fighting dogs.Now dont get me wrong,I detest this type of thing but to ignore the fact that these dogs were bred for combat wouldnt make me a very good owner.

  All Mollosor type dogs are not the kind of dog for first time dog owners or dog owners who think a tough dog makes them tough.Many of these dogs are over 100 lbs,thats a large animal regaurdless of wheter it's a pet or not and has to potential to do harm. Any dog over 30 lbs can be dangerous,they all have teeth,can bite and are much faster than any human so you need to respect these animals and not be foolish. If you see an aggressive dog steer clear of it,any roaming dog should be avoided and as much as I love dogs I wouldnt hesitate to shoot or kill any dog that threatened me.


  Unfortunately where I live pitbulls are now illegal so I will never own another staffie,I could get another Bullterrier though as they're exempt from this law! Ya stupid,I could get a 100 plus pound Cane coso or Presa but I cant get another 30 lb Staffie because it "looks" wrong.....




   

[mtnman]

Hopefully you are paying these dogs at least 50k/year.  

Well, they do get "free" room and board for the majority of their time    And free medical care...  It's just that when it's time to work, I expect them to hold up their end of the bargain!

Plus, they get to live with me, and I figure that adds infinitely to their "wages"  

There's also the side of me that feels a dog that isn't being used as its breeding intends is being wasted, or at the least robbed.  And if it's being bred without that particular breeds original intent in mind, by people who have no concept of what goes into that, I feel it's "polluting" the genetics.  There's nothing wrong with owning/loving a mixed breed, or poor-representation of a breed per se, but I definitely don't feel they should be allowed to breed.  The Cocker Spaniel used to be a fantastic hunting dog...

[ink]

 Ink,  not sure where you read that the APBT is the original bulldog because nothing could be farther from the truth,the APBT is a direct desendand of the Staffie,they were brought to the Americas in the early 1800 and over time were bred to be somewhat larger than the original Staffie.

different sources through out the years...like I said...what you are siting is the typical "history" of the APBT...you can read what you site in the wiki.
  I wasn't alive back then to know the truth of the matter.......I don't think that is the truth though. NO one can say definitively That it is FACT.

but whatever it does not matter one way or the other.

This I know- in every thing there is a top dog IE the best of the best

and the APBT is the greatest dog ever created by man

and I am extremely unhappy with the fact that they will be completely gone.

[Penguin]

If and when I get a dog, I'll get a mutt.  They're cheap, come in all shapes and sizes, and there are always more where the last came from.  I love dogs .

-Penguin

[AAJagerX]

and the APBT is the greatest dog ever created by man

My Rotties beg to differ, sir. 

[ink]

My Rotties beg to differ, sir. 

 

and the next door neighbor with the Weimaraner thinks the same.....does not matter though 

in other words its all relative...personally I do not like rottie's

[Penguin]

I'm not a fan of the fact that small dogs bark at anything and everything.  Personally, I'd probably punt one if it barked and got close to me.

-Penguin

[whiteman]

Most pit owners I've seen own one because it's an aggressive dog, Labs and other dogs just aren't cool to mouth breathers.

[ink]

Most pit owners I've seen own one because it's an aggressive dog, Labs and other dogs just aren't cool to mouth breathers.

too bad a real APBT is not aggressive, except to other dogs that is.

but I do understand what you are saying