another darwin candidate

[FiLtH]

Doctors are worth every penny. Its the hospitals, medicines, equipment usage thats out of whack.

[CAP1]

Doctors are not overpaid.

what he said.

 i'm scared...i agreed with something grizz said. 

[RTHolmes]

they operate to a pretty large degree in an oligopoly and cooperate to maintain rates above free market prices (price fixing), so many are overpaid. as a customer its hard to negotiate when the options are either pay up or die though.

[guncrasher]

my gf is a nurse, I know  a lot of doctors. they're not exactly in the poor house.  I have yet to see one living paycheck to paycheck.  actually the ones i know work their 40 hours a week and go home.  some others work more than 40  but the extra money is nice.

semp

[CAP1]

my gf is a nurse, I know  a lot of doctors. they're not exactly in the poor house.  I have yet to see one living paycheck to paycheck.  actually the ones i know work their 40 hours a week and go home.  some others work more than 40  but the extra money is nice.

semp

 one of my customers is a doctor. he works 5 days a week. he works some days 8-3, and some days 9 -11(pm) or later. he works his bellybutton off. could be why he has what he has.

[Penguin]

my gf is a nurse, I know  a lot of doctors. they're not exactly in the poor house.  I have yet to see one living paycheck to paycheck.  actually the ones i know work their 40 hours a week and go home.  some others work more than 40  but the extra money is nice.

semp

But when they go home, they aren't done.  This is what I'm stressing.  Once they go home, they have hours of paperwork to fill out and phonecalls to make.  Doctors don't work the eight hour days one might think they do, they often work eleven to twelve hour days.

they operate to a pretty large degree in an oligopoly and cooperate to maintain rates above free market prices (price fixing), so many are overpaid. as a customer its hard to negotiate when the options are either pay up or die though.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.  Have you ever thought about how much debt many of them accrue to pay for tuition in medical school?  Hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of dollars.  Also, those who work for hospitals are often cheated out of their pay (again, this happened to my mom and her friends).  The working conditions as an intern, resident, and even fellow are often inhumane.  How would you feel if you were to work a forty hour shift?  Think of it like going through the spetznaz training course, only instead of excercise and shooting, you learn the human body inside and out.

-Penguin

[dedalos]

Doctors are not overpaid.

Compared to what?  Other people that save lives?  What is the average pay for a fireman?  Sure they did not have to go to college for 8 years but the risk they take to pull you out of a burning building is a little higher than the risk you take by being in class a few more years, no?  What is the pay of a marine?   So maybe you are right about the guys performing brain surgery, but the guys that you have to wait in line so they can charge your insurance e few 100$ to tell you you have a cold, yes, grossly overpaid.

[dedalos]

Have you ever thought about how much debt many of them accrue to pay for tuition in medical school? 

-Penguin

Yes, and I am going to my boss today to ask him for a raise because I accrued some debt to pay my school.  Surprise surprise, other schools cost money too lol.

[Reaper90]

The decision to wear a helmet or not is a deliberate, consious decision... pulling into the path of an 18 wheeler or train is likely not, and if it is, it would be properly described as "suicide" but would more accurately fall into the category of an "accident." Granted, it may have been caused by recklessness or carelessness on the part of the driver, but the driver still didn't say "I think i'm going to go get into that car and go hunt for a train to pull out in front of."

Apples, oranges....

 there is no such thing as an accident. negligence, yes...accidents.......not so much.

Totally not the point. The point I'm trying to make is there was no intent by the driver of the car that got into a collision with a train or 18 wheeler (we'll call it a collision since you don't believe that any incident in an automobile can be accidental).

But there certainly was intent on the part of the motorcycle rider to not wear his helmet.

This is not to say that not wearing the helmet caused the rider to be in an incident/crash/wreck, but the lack of proper protective equipment very well have caused the rider to suffer injuries that otherwise would have been avoided.
THAT is the point.

[hyster]

for the people who don't want the safety laws (helmet, seatbelts). that's perfectly valid argument if your only thinking of yourself.

but!!!

what about the fireman, police and ambulance workers who have to scrap up the remains?? Ive seen pics of crash victims and its not pretty.
do you really want to leave your wife / kids with out a husband / dad in a survivable accident just to prove a point?

[Reaper90]

Compared to what?  Other people that save lives?  What is the average pay for a fireman?  Sure they did not have to go to college for 8 years but the risk they take to pull you out of a burning building is a little higher than the risk you take by being in class a few more years, no?  What is the pay of a marine?   So maybe you are right about the guys performing brain surgery, but the guys that you have to wait in line so they can charge your insurance e few 100$ to tell you you have a cold, yes, grossly overpaid.

Pretty simple, Ded, the  guys are not paid based on the risk involved, but on the freaking BRAINS required to be in a position to save another life by removing a tumor, replacing a heart, operating on a brain.. etc. You want a guy who's special skill in life is spraying water from a hose standing over you with a scalpel when the time comes?

You're paying for the skill, knowledge, and ability to do something you cannot do yourself. Simple as that.

[CAP1]

 there is no such thing as an accident. negligence, yes...accidents.......not so much.


Totally not the point. The point I'm trying to make is there was no intent by the driver of the car that got into a collision with a train or 18 wheeler (we'll call it a collision since you don't believe that any incident in an automobile can be accidental).

But there certainly was intent on the part of the motorcycle rider to not wear his helmet.

This is not to say that not wearing the helmet caused the rider to be in an incident/crash/wreck, but the lack of proper protective equipment very well have caused the rider to suffer injuries that otherwise would have been avoided.
THAT is the point.

 based on that, then we all should be wearing helmets in our cars. on our cycles, full leathers should then be required, along with reflective clothing. we should be required to be connected to a kill switch, much the same as bike racers use, so that when we do go down, the bike will shut off.

 and you are correct calling the car/train  thing a collision......i mean.......how do you "accidentally" pull in front of a train? really? you couldn't see 60 tons of loud diesel powered death doing 60mph comin at ya? negligence.

[RTHolmes]

But when they go home, they aren't done.  This is what I'm stressing.  Once they go home, they have hours of paperwork to fill out and phonecalls to make.  Doctors don't work the eight hour days one might think they do, they often work eleven to twelve hour days.

this applies to most self-employed people. doing billable work during normal trading hours and then administration in the evenings and weekends is SOP. once you get above subsistence income, people are a lot more likely to do overtime if they are making $100/h for it than $10/h.

the massive cost of training is a great example of a barrier to entry, an essential part of any oligopoly.

[Shuffler]

Doctors are worth every penny. Its the hospitals, medicines, equipment usage thats out of whack.

Actually the hospitol is under some duress from government requirements.


Have you noticed all the clinics that open around a hospitol in many areas. They do all kinds of specialty things like Catscans and such. The clinics are owned by Doctors. The reason for this is the fact that any Doctor doing business out of a hospitol is required to "donate" free time to treat folks who will not or cannot pay. It is a pretty large percentage of their time too. By opening a clinic and operating out of there, they circumvent this requirement.

[dedalos]

for the people who don't want the safety laws (helmet, seatbelts). that's perfectly valid argument if your only thinking of yourself.

but!!!

what about the fireman, police and ambulance workers who have to scrap up the remains?? Ive seen pics of crash victims and its not pretty.
do you really want to leave your wife / kids with out a husband / dad in a survivable accident just to prove a point?

Not the point.  I always have a sit belt on and would always wear a helmet and gear before getting on a bike.  I just don;t need a law that the tax collectors can abuse to get money for the city.  I use it because it would be stupid not too.  Not because it is a traffic violation.  I also don;t stick my fingers in electrical out lets and there is no law against that, is there?