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Author Topic: The Conservative/Liberal Debate  (Read 1183 times)

Offline 2Slow

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The Conservative/Liberal Debate
« Reply #60 on: September 20, 2002, 12:43:17 PM »
Conservative - Least government is best government.
Liberal - Let us do that for you.
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2Slow
Secundum mihi , urbanus resurrectio
TANSTAAFL

Offline 10Bears

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« Reply #61 on: September 20, 2002, 12:45:50 PM »
Kieran how is paying for something your entire working life a form of welfare? Mieta:  “He explained why it was flawed. He hinted at why it might fail....” Oh the sky is falling! Kieran it’s worked for 60 years and works for other civilized countries there’s lots of different ways to shore up social security. New immigrants come into this country all the time and pay into it. The argument that too many baby boomers will retire and not enough young people will be around to take up the slack is fallacy. Its Republican spin.

True HE DID NOT SAY IT WAS A CONSERVATIVE GOAL TO END SOCIAL SECURITY no... I said it. Conservatives have NEVER liked social security and will use every kind of trickery in the book to end it including looting the 600 billion in the SS trust fund then saying see?.. we don’t have enough to continue Social Security. BTW prior to Bush, the trust fund was solvent till 2035.
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the broke geezer w/ no job could be taken care of financially by a charity or his/her family


Translated: let em’ eat dogfood.

You can take posts from here and other places and put them in an AARP newsletter, it wouldn’t be lying to warn seniors about the Republican agenda.

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Trouble is, I can't tell why you do it for sure- lack of intelligence, single-minded pursuit of an agenda, or downright dishonesty.

Kieran your a sheep nodding it’s head in agreement to everything Rush says or Steve and Edie on Fox and Friends. You disagree with anything anyone says you call them names. I have a hard time believing your any kind of teacher. You don’t even fly in Aces High so why are you even on this board? Wouldn’t you be more comfortable at Free Republic or the Concerned Citizens Council?  

 
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But I love the term "redistribution of wealth"...

Also known as "Take from those who do...and give it to those who won't".


It's not though Curval give to those that won't.. They did! they paid for the seniors that came before them during their working life.
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Offline Curval

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« Reply #62 on: September 20, 2002, 01:04:30 PM »
10bears...

I wasn't actually trying to comment on Socal Security...merely the expression "redistribution of wealth", in general.
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Some will fall in love with life and drink it from a fountain that is pouring like an avalanche coming down the mountain

Offline miko2d

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The Conservative/Liberal Debate
« Reply #63 on: September 20, 2002, 01:10:25 PM »
10Bears: Translated: let em’ eat dogfood.
 How about this advice - let them save for retirement and actually have a child or two to work in economy and care for them in old age.

Curval: I wasn't actually trying to comment on Socal Security...merely the expression "redistribution of wealth", in general.
 Doesn't using your tax money to breed underclass bother you? Redistribution can be a static process. Directed dysgenic breeding of humans is not only immoral and blasphemous, but it is a strong positive-feedback process.

 Anyway, last elections I voted for Gore, George W. Gore

 miko
« Last Edit: September 20, 2002, 01:13:41 PM by miko2d »
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Offline funkedup

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The Conservative/Liberal Debate
« Reply #64 on: September 20, 2002, 03:05:26 PM »
Social Security is just another income redistribution system like pretty much all other government spending.
To quote Dennis Hopper from TCM 2 "BRING IT ALLLLLLLL DOWN!!!"
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Offline Curval

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« Reply #65 on: September 20, 2002, 03:09:16 PM »
Miko..my parents effected the best possible tax planning on my behalf.  I was conceived and born in a tax free juristiction.  So, the answer to your question is no, it doesn't really bother me.  But your point is well taken.
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Some will fall in love with life and drink it from a fountain that is pouring like an avalanche coming down the mountain

Offline Kieran

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« Reply #66 on: September 20, 2002, 03:15:14 PM »
Personally, I am leaning more towards "dishonest" than the other two examples.

FWIW, I am not arguing with you regarding the feasibility of SS- I pointed out that you put words in Mietla's mouth, which you have now admitted- nothing more.

You have made yet another blanket generalization about conservatives that shores up my "ignorant" assessment- I am a moderate conservative that is not against SS, nor do I want to see it end. I hope to someday collect some. It still doesn't change that it can arguably be described as welfare, or that it is in serious jeapordy.

If you are a liar I will call you one. If you cannot even quote someone on this board correctly I will call you on it. I don't call you names because I disagree with you- I am giving you the label you have earned. The way you charactarized Mietla was not the way he posted- he gave you straight figures and data, nothing more. You dishonestly turned it into something else.

Yes, I knew there was no benevolent reason for you to ask about my handle and what I flew under. Pray tell, what does that have to do with anything we discuss? Yup, I knew you would throw out the "you don't even fly here, why do you post?" comment. Predictable. We are discussing politics, not AH in the OT. Do I have to fly to have an opinion there? Nope? 'Nuff said.
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Offline ra

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« Reply #67 on: September 21, 2002, 09:56:03 AM »
'Employer matching contributions'.  What a total scam.  There would be a revolt if the average tax payer understood that 'matching contributions' are priced into wages and salaries.  Every one of us pays 100% of our social security contributions, without exception.

ra
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Offline Kieran

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« Reply #68 on: September 21, 2002, 10:13:37 AM »
"There is no free lunch."
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Offline mietla

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« Reply #69 on: September 21, 2002, 11:01:06 AM »
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Originally posted by ra
'Employer matching contributions'.  What a total scam.  There would be a revolt if the average tax payer understood that 'matching contributions' are priced into wages and salaries.  Every one of us pays 100% of our social security contributions, without exception.

ra


Of course. Corporations and business pay no taxes, they just collect them from the customers and deliever them to the government.
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Offline ra

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« Reply #70 on: September 21, 2002, 01:47:49 PM »
mietla,

I'm not sure how you meant that, but you are absolutely right.  A tax on employers is really a tax on employees, a tax on producers is really a tax on consumers.

ra
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Offline AKIron

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« Reply #71 on: September 21, 2002, 02:36:51 PM »
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Originally posted by ra
'Employer matching contributions'.  What a total scam.  There would be a revolt if the average tax payer understood that 'matching contributions' are priced into wages and salaries.  Every one of us pays 100% of our social security contributions, without exception.

ra


Some of us (self employed) do and know it. Oppresive as hell but what're  ya gonna do? Thinking of retiring in Mexico.
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Here we put salt on Margaritas, not sidewalks.
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