Author Topic: And people think _'s are bad? (Read 2203 times)

Shane · « **Reply #150 on:** October 04, 2002, 04:19:40 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sandman_SBM
It's not a troll. Just a point. Both the Germans and the U.S. used conscription.
The notion that they all go to war willingly is just silly.

and look at how each society eventually dealt with the war in question. not gonna go thru listing various points of differences and similarities - i think you're smart enough to see that your offhand comment about Viet Nam had very little correlation to the discussion at hand.

Shane · « **Reply #151 on:** October 04, 2002, 04:34:17 PM »

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Originally posted by john9001
this whole thing started because J_A_B cant get his _ _ _ in his handle, i'm not sure but i think it has to do with the way a computer reads the "_". it could be only letters and numbers are allowed.44MAG

don't insult HTC's coding abilities, man...

JAB used his own handle whines as an illustration to shut the "free speech" mavens up before they got started (as if that did any good) because HTC has already shown the 1st Amendment does *not* apply within game, and that this concept should be quickly and consistently applied to a handle that *is* offensive in nature. The *combination* of SS (which alone can mean a variety of things) with Waffen (which is basically a word for "weapon") is *only* associated with nazis and their *political* beleifs, despite all the apologists trying to hump this issue's leg into submission.

muckmaw · « **Reply #152 on:** October 04, 2002, 04:38:09 PM »

Alright, who are you and what have you done with the real "Shane"?

I guess if I read this board long enough, I might even start to agree with Lazs.

This is getting a little silly guys, but let me make one final point.

I'm not Jewish. I never fought in WWII. I am a white, american male, 31 years old, born and raised in New York.

I find it offensive.

Now, am I overly sensitive? I don't think so. I'm of Italian descent, but I have no problem with Dago's callsign.

It's just slang, even if it's derogatory.

What SS's callsign brings to mind is the horrific offenses commited by a maligned group of people. Every time I see a callsign like this, I'm reminded of the images I've seen on TV of the camps.

I would feel the same way if there was a callsign like "Slavemaster", "Whitepower", "KillWhitey" etc.

I don't need this when I'm supposed to be relaxing.

J_A_B · « **Reply #153 on:** October 04, 2002, 04:39:22 PM »

No actually 44MAG I brought that up only to show that HTC already limits what people may or may not call themselves--it was an attempt to shut up the "free speech" crowd before they got started. Looks like it failed

I posted this thread to let HTC know the situation and I expect them to act if they haven't already. I'd be shocked if they decided to allow this guy to keep his despicable name.

Using a name like "luftwaffe" or JG2 or whatever is one thing....the germans would have had an airforce whether or not the Nazis had ever come to power. The SS though, including the Waffen-SS, existed solely because of the Nazis, which is why you cannot escape the connection. You can try to minimalize it all you want, but you cannot ever fully escape it.

Yeah the war ended 60 years ago. So what. The Nazi flag, Adolf's book, the propaganda, the gas chambers, the Nazi salute, the various SS organizations, even the word "Nazi"....they're all very hateful items unfit for a computer game, whether it's "realistic" or not.

J_A_B

Sandman · « **Reply #154 on:** October 04, 2002, 04:43:13 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by J_A_B
Using a name like "luftwaffe" or JG2 or whatever is one thing....the germans would have had an airforce whether or not the Nazis had ever come to power. The SS though, including the Waffen-SS, existed solely because of the Nazis, which is why you cannot escape the connection. You can try to minimalize it all you want, but you cannot ever fully escape it.
J_A_B

This is your argument?

Sandman · « **Reply #155 on:** October 04, 2002, 04:45:37 PM »

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Originally posted by Shane

and look at how each society eventually dealt with the war in question. not gonna go thru listing various points of differences and similarities - i think you're smart enough to see that your offhand comment about Viet Nam had very little correlation to the discussion at hand.

Are you daft?

Many of the the Waffen-SS were conscripts. The notion that every member of the Waffen-SS went willingly to war is silly. Every bit as silly as stating that every U.S. soldier sent to Viet Nam went there willingly.

Shane · « **Reply #156 on:** October 04, 2002, 04:51:48 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sandman_SBM
Are you daft?
Many of the the Waffen-SS were conscripts. The notion that they went willingly to war is silly. Every bit as silly as stating that every U.S. soldier sent to Viet Nam went there willingly.

the conscription of people to fill the depleted ranks of the waffen-ss occurred because of the aforementioned reason - depletion of willing nazis - considering these units were the apple of hitler's eye, one can understand why they chose to conscript people into a political unit instead of other services - to avoid having these units disappear from the OOB.

now the whole issue of volunteer vs conscritpion is nothing more than a revisionist attempt to gloss over the underlying concept of the waffen-ss, that of a military arm of an entriely political branch that espoused, to put it bluntly, genocide. we're not talking individuals here, "SSWaffen" is not an idividual identifier, as much as it is a political and conceptual identifier.

Sandman · « **Reply #157 on:** October 04, 2002, 05:29:01 PM »

What? You don't believe Wulfie's accounting of the Waffen-SS.

So far, he sounds far more knowledgeable on the subject than anyone else here.

Of course... that's just my opinion.

Sixpence · « **Reply #158 on:** October 04, 2002, 06:27:15 PM »

Well, one mountain out of a molehill.

And I don't see lost revenues for HTC, maybe some lost BB space though.

BOOBS!!!

Mogi · « **Reply #159 on:** October 04, 2002, 06:43:42 PM »

It's a disgusting call sign.

LLv34_Camouflage · « **Reply #160 on:** October 04, 2002, 09:02:13 PM »

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Originally posted by muckmaw
Many of you here know your history. You can differentiate between what the Waffen SS did, and what they did not do.

The crux of the matter here is the fact that you are much more informed than the average AH gamer.

Exactly. Here's a quote from my previous post: "I hope people would take a minute and study the topic before making wrong assumptions."

Best regards,

Camo

Creamo · « **Reply #161 on:** October 04, 2002, 09:42:01 PM »

It's a digusting, horrible thing. Almost as bad as cat juggling.

Tumor · « **Reply #162 on:** October 04, 2002, 10:36:28 PM »

sswaffen got booted... done deal so ya'll can stfu now.

Before anyone starts the usual chest-thumpin routine...

Shane · « **Reply #163 on:** October 04, 2002, 10:44:02 PM »

if that screenshot is relevant to the subject at hand, i'd say that it kind of disturbs me considering what was said. so waht was he booted for, tumor? that lil screen shot gives no contextual info.

i dunno if HTC made any email contacts suggesting he *change* his handle.... i would most definitely hope so. if not... then i'm just very disappointed that HTC would allow and/or encourage through silence this kind of handle.

Mogi · « **Reply #164 on:** October 04, 2002, 10:49:38 PM »

Cat juggling never resulted in thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of dead people. It never resulted in the wholesale execution of civilians, children, or captured POW's.

Ask the 60 or so POW's from the 3rd Canadian Army. Wounded tankers and infantrymen, machine gunned by the SS and buried in a shallow grave near a French villa in the days immediately after D-Day, while their capturing SS Unit retreated. A documented War Crime for which the SS Commander escaped the noose.

This is not about free speech. The Waffen SS were horrible, murderous bastards. Don't try and rewrite history. Visit a War Museum some time, even in Germany, and see the tales of their handywork.

Yes, in WWII bad things were done by both sides. Most by theirs. War is not a nice affair. But the cruelty and disregard for norms of behaviour, and Law exhibited by the SS deserve a special place in the memory of the World as a warning to us all of what can happen when the goals of the State outweigh the moral fabric of one's society.

Stop making excuses for the SS! Following the arguments of their defenders the Jews should be considered simple casualties of war. The Death Marches the Japanese held in Asia are simply a movement of people.

When is the last time American, Canadian, UK or other Units had wholesale approval to put bullets in the the heads of civilians, or torch occupied homes, or torture and kill POW's? Or round up entire segments of an occupied population, and execute them? Do our troops carefully dig great big holes and fill them with bodies, hoping no one will ever notice?

I'll tell you. NEVER. Stop apologizing for the poor little persecuted SS.