Author Topic: To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots  (Read 3293 times)

Offline Hristo

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #75 on: July 24, 2000, 04:32:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Maniac:
"From RoE wars, sneaky tricks like merge diving, spying, ack hugging and even possible sabotage, some P 51 types proved their known reputation."

Hristo, where u molested as an child by an P51D pilot or something?

OK, Runstang, here you go.

RoE wars  - on both 1 vs 1 (Hangtime vs Hristo) and The Rumble, RoE was made up by Allies (Hang, to be accurate); He was the one whpo aggressively promoted his own rules and jumped at ideas give by opponents. Paris peace talks ?! You should ask Hang to give you a lesson or two in negotating.

Luftwaffe side had just had to agree to RoE on both fights, not to be called sissies. Of course, when Luftwaffe suggested the RoE, it was turned down as biased by regular Allied supporters on this board (Toad, you there ?);

Allied side won both RoE wars in those fights;

Luftwaffe had to cope with RoE that clearly favored opposing side.


Sneaky merge diving - I did not mention that too much before; however, when Hang called me lower than cat crap, I let go too;

In no WB ladder duel have I met merge diving tactic;

He made the 10k merge rules - I trusted him, but he obviously left a hole in them, so he could dive to the merge; dirty trick, in my book.

Lesson learned: never trust a Pony pilot.

Spying - their flight leader offered to wing with me few days ago and switched from Bishes to Knights; not much he could see, but not usual too.


Ack hugging - look at the last P 51 flying.

Sabotage - given all what I mentioned here, I tend to believe MoseEAF and his own Luftwaffe were not there by coincidence.




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Stoickov
JG54 "Grünherz"

Offline Maniac

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #76 on: July 24, 2000, 04:36:00 AM »
LoL!

Conspiracy!!!  

Oh btw, your excuse for not dueling me yesterday was something about all i do is run, you better check the score pages for the "kills per time"...

Regards.

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[This message has been edited by Maniac (edited 07-24-2000).]
Warbirds handle : nr-1 //// -nr-1- //// Maniac

Offline Hristo

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #77 on: July 24, 2000, 05:28:00 AM »
Sure is, unil we get the Dora to fight your Runstang.

But don't switch then, Maniac. Keep flying the Pony in those dark days  

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Stoickov
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Offline Maniac

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #78 on: July 24, 2000, 05:34:00 AM »
Stoickov kills per time : Rank 147

Maniac kills per time : Rank 21

Is there something im missing in your runstang argument?  

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Offline RAM

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #79 on: July 24, 2000, 06:15:00 AM »
RAM: Kills per time: Rank 289

Are you calling me a running guy? in a 190A5 or A8? lol.

Scores say only what one wants them to say, Maniac. So that is not a valid argument.

Hristo, I also agree that after watching WHO were the allied pilot force I think that we did an amazing work.

And I also agree that something smells REALLY bad in the eleventh guy matter. A newbie doesnt know to start squads, isnt it?...and why the hell did he start a "luftwaffe" squad IDENTICAL to ours?

take your own conclussions.

I have mine's

Offline Hristo

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #80 on: July 24, 2000, 06:27:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Maniac:
Stoickov kills per time : Rank 147

Maniac kills per time : Rank 21

Is there something im missing in your runstang argument?  

Regards


Yes, flying in squad where it is irrelevant who gets the kill. Setting up the kill is nice too, you know.

And I speak out of occassions we two met in the arena, Maniac.

Looking at your P 51 6 view and watching the distance slowly gaining on G-10 I flew then.

Yes, I remember all that running.


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Stoickov
JG54 "Grünherz"

Offline Citabria

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #81 on: July 24, 2000, 06:31:00 AM »
hristo I was a walk on on the p51 side and ready to fly for either team.
you know I'm capable of flying either the 190 or the p51 and was cheerfully ready to do either as were most of the other pilots.

I was under the impression that this was a standard multiplane duel where there was no "group 1" or "group 2" or "B&Z flight" or fuel tactics or such nonsense. I was not a signed up player for the rumble. Hangtime no doubt regrets making me the flight leader since I had no incling of an idea in my head that the 190s were not at all interested in a clean merge or a fair fight.

in fact you personally were on my 6 after i and the others merged with the 7 190s. you never had to turn your plane to get there since your "b&z opportunist flight" group 1 stayed out of icon range till the group 2 merged with the mustangs.


you acuse me of having an agenda and call the mustangs cheaters when by your own film you convict yourself of the exact wrongs you acuse the mustangs of.


fact is by your own admission you were quite afraid the 190s were going to get clobbered so you used every tactic you could think of to ensure the fight was not a fair one.

I'm actually extremely surprised you were so against a frame 2 since the first was such a route.

we should have had no rules at all to give each side a fair chance to stack the deck in their own way.
the LW tactics were great but they were not what was outlined in the ROE at all.

Fester was my in game name until September 2013

Offline Rude

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #82 on: July 24, 2000, 06:52:00 AM »
Looks like I picked the correct week to go on vacation.

These types of rumble thingies should have no more than 4 vs.4 imho. Simple is always better.

Cyas up!

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[This message has been edited by Rude (edited 07-24-2000).]

Offline Maniac

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #83 on: July 24, 2000, 07:09:00 AM »
This pissing contest are getting out of hand...

RAM, I dont call _anyone_ an runner...

Hristo, I actually dont recall fighting you in the main arena... And secondly dont you think i set up kills?? lol! ask any knight who flys the on the same times as me(eouro friendly times) and see what he answers hehe..

Regards.



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Warbirds handle : nr-1 //// -nr-1- //// Maniac

Offline Hristo

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #84 on: July 24, 2000, 07:21:00 AM »
Citabria, here's how I saw things:

RoE was made to favor the Allied side:

15k merge and higher is clearly better for P 51. In case one gets in trouble, all it has to to is point nose down and get away.

4 fields instead of 2 ?!?! THIS ALONE suggests some hidden agenda. What was it I am not sure even now. Maybe fighting over your own territory, maybe fuel tactic and maybe.....more groups ! Ask Hangtime about this, he made the RoE.

Your P 51 gaggle was so long in our radar that clean merge would mean front P 51s getting out of icon range. In fact, it was just what I expected: high speed climb way past our formation and dragging the fight high. At this point "Fight's on" would be irrelevant, the rumble would be patient and conservative BnZ flying.

Once the group is in the air, it is very hard to change strategy. Nobody of our group knew what we were up against. Only that RoE favors your side and that you circle you own back airfield.

From this perspective, you are pissed it did now work out.

Splitting our flight in two groups was a valid tactic. We could also simulate one long group too, you know. Considering all the dirty play I saw, I can assume you did just that.

The pilot who made the RoE, but leaving holes to be exploited this time did not benefit. His reaction shows how he feels about it. Next time, no icons and Doras, please.

As for turning down a rematch offer....come on guys, be serious. Once The Rumble was over it was over. We all have real life, you know. We won the battle. Why should we give the ghosts another chance ?

AllI can say, no more trusting to P 51 pilots, no more their RoE, no more these fights until we get P 51s historicl opponnent.


IMO, this fight was won by superior pilot skill of Luftwaffe pilots. You had better plane that could negate this, but you failed.
Good luck next time.


Sorry if I sound offensive, but some of you have really pissed me off by your inability to take defeat.

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Stoickov
JG54 "Grünherz"

Offline Dingy

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #85 on: July 24, 2000, 07:44:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Exile:
Well, after reading this thread yall can be damn sure the ROE for The Ladder will see some definite re-writing ... especially for the 2 on 2 and 4 on 4.

Jeez louise....just keep it simple.  Define a merge as being completed when the first two planes pass each other.  Leave it up to the different sides to decide how they want to handle the situation once the merge is complete.  Individual pilot skill can be overcome by good wingman strategy.  Do they gangbang the lead pilot and hope to kill it before his buddy can join the fray or do they blow through to engage the trailer.  

Leave some strategy in it and let the pilots sort it out like they had to in RL.  Jeeez...the 33rd used to do tons of these squad vs squad battles and there was NEVER this kind of controversey cause we kept it simple.  Remember those fites against the Shills and ARM, Crash and Jig?    Now those were fun!

-Ding


Offline Dingy

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #86 on: July 24, 2000, 07:49:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by RAM:
Oh damn, screw it, get lost hang. If you dont give a rats bellybutton I dont know why do I have to care about it.

OK Guys! Enough!

This has turned personal and it doesnt belong on the boards.  We're no longer talking about the fite..Pyro or HT...can ya lock this thread?  

RAM,Hristo and Hang....take it outside.

-Ding


[This message has been edited by Dingy (edited 07-24-2000).]

Offline RAM

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #87 on: July 24, 2000, 07:50:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Maniac:
RAM, I dont call _anyone_ an runner...


lol Maniac, never intended to say that, it was a tongue in cheek comment to make you understand that if I?m not a runner with that score, then that you have a better score doesnt mean you -ARENT- a runner (of course I dont say you run I say that the way to proof you are or not a running runstang   isnt score)

Hope it is more clear now  

BTW I know you and you are a hell of good p51 pilot  

Offline Dingy

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #88 on: July 24, 2000, 08:08:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Hristo:
mx22, after reading against who we actually flew, all I can say I am sorry I did not brag even more. It was ment as teasing the ever so loud Allied contingent, after a fair fight.

Actually Hristo, it is the LW contingent I hear braggin the most in the MA and you are one of the loudest.  If there ever was a poor winner, you were displaying it yesterday.  And its poor taste to criticize MooseEAF's ability in a public forum like this.  He may not have as much of an effect on the final outcome as you state but there is no way for an ally to know which 190 is being manned by whom...each enemy plane is a potential threat.

As far as Maniac's comment that he was confused by two groups, I can understand that.  Fact of the matter tho is that both groups were at 15K until the refs called fights on.  Look at the film that was posted earlier in this thread.  It was filmed by Hristo in the trailing group and they were at 15K.

-Ding


Offline Hristo

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To The Rumble Fw 190A-5 pilots
« Reply #89 on: July 24, 2000, 08:14:00 AM »
Maniac, I do recall our fights few months ago. Remember that little chase across the sector on the deck back in beta map. In fact, I think you were the most coldblooded runner outthere. What else could be said about a guy who watches you follow him on the deck at 450 yards distance ?

With distance increasing very slowly ...501...502...503...504..., and only at 600 yards I made fatal hits. Talk about runner. That's how remember you. And it happened more than once. Check stats of earlier tours, back when I used old handle. We surely met  


Maniac, being part of JG54 is a new experience for me. Score is not important. Teamwork and wingman tractic are esential.

If a wingman is lost, we RTB as soon as posible, no score hunting. If a wingie is damaged, he is escorted back home, again no score hunting.

If the formation is RTBing, available squaddie takes off to escort the RTB group. And lands with them. Kill per time ? No, thanks.

Such things do not benefit kill per time ratio, but are valuable for squad efficiency and cohesion.

One step further: Sometimes it is much easier to lonewulf than be a part of the squad (especially if you hunt scores). Look at top P51 K/D pilot's stats (you know who I am talking about). He has a science fiction K/D and impressive gunnery and kill per time record.

But would you like him to be your wingman ?




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Stoickov
JG54 "Grünherz"