Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: rogwar on July 17, 2012, 01:29:48 PM
-
It's a tragic situation. I always wondered what might happen if the police came to an innocent person's house. Law officers have a right to defend themselves. Same goes for home owners.
http://www.wesh.com/news/central-florida/Deputies-shoot-kill-man-after-knocking-on-wrong-door/-/11788162/15527202/-/euk6tg/-/index.html
-
Pointing a gun straight at someone's face a you open the door is as smart as banging on a door at 0130 without identifying yourself. :uhoh For all I know, maybe the cops lured to cover their butts, they might have tried to force their way in when the poor bastard opened the door.
Dang Florida man, screewed up stuff happens there.
-
Look at photos of the front door...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2174381/Andrew-Scott-Outrage-police-shoot-kill-wrong-man-hunt-attempted-murder-suspect.html
-
I thought it was standard practice to cover the exits and then announce yourself as a police officer. If that was done this may not of happened.
This is also an example of why you should get firearm training if deciding to defend yourself with a gun. Never pull a gun if you arent ready to use it. Defensive training would not have you standing in a doorway exposed.
If they were armed Home invaders he would be dead also.
Just a sad story. :pray
-
I'm not defending anybody here, but I think the guy should not have opened the door. If strangers are knocking on your door give 911 a try.
-
Do you guys remember that mayor in Maryland who's house got raided by police because someone mailed him a package of pot. The police stormed the house, shot the guys two dogs and handcuffed him, his mother and law and wife.
-
Police are no more than human. Sad things like this can and will happen as long as there are poorly trained police on the street.
Since the deputies did not identify themselves they should be found at fault and charged with murder. They were worried about their safety and no one elses.
-
I'm all for the 2nd amendment and protecting your house and property.
Sure seems a bit extreme to open your front door pointing a gun though...frankly not very smart.
If I was suspicious of a knock at the door, I wouldn't answer it by opening it, but by calling out 'Who is it', while maintaining a defensive position in the house with my firearm. In reality you lose any tactical advantage by opening the door and exposing yourself.
Or another idea is maybe call 911 if your suspicious.
It also seems strange that the police would not identify themselves if they are going to knock on the door. I mean if it is a no-knock warrant where they have to barge in and catch everyone by surprise is one thing. But if your going to take the time to knock on a suspected killers door why not identify yourselves as police.
-
Wonder what really happened ? The story don't add up to me .
-
This sort of thing happens all too often.
Granted, not always with the same tragic result... thankfully.
The cops have a job to do, they had just better be kicking in the right door is the real issue. If they kick in the wrong door (without properly identifying themselves) and are greeted by gunfire then they are going to have a bad day.
Hell, everyone involved is going to have a bad day.
-
Here in Oregon the cops were serving a search warrant and it wasn't till after they had ripped the ... Out of this poor woman's house that they realized they had the wrong address.
-
Wonder what really happened ? The story don't add up to me .
a guy died because somebody knocked at the wrong house, that's what happened.
semp
-
Since the deputies did not identify themselves they should be found at fault and charged with murder. They were worried about their safety and no one elses.
....This is almost ignore worthy...
They were chasing someone who attempted to kill someone.
Said person then parks his bike outside of this guy's house.
The police (trying to not let the world know they were there for obvious reasons) then knocked on the door and this guy decided to open the door with a gun pointed at the cops. I would have fragged him too.
You're trained that when someone points a weapon at you, you take them down. Especially if your chasing a potential murder suspect.
Hell my neighbors next door have a hole in their house from a shotgun blast that was fired by a police officer. Why? Because my neighbor is a moron and was walking around outside with his shotgun talking about killing everyone. He's lucky they didn't frag him then and there.
-
Do you guys remember that mayor in Maryland who's house got raided by police because someone mailed him a package of pot. The police stormed the house, shot the guys two dogs and handcuffed him, his mother and law and wife.
Funny, a colleague of mine was just telling me about that last week or the week before and I instantly thought of that when I began reading the articles on this.
I believe there was a baby upstairs as well i the mayor's case...
-
I'm not buying it.
Sounds too convenient a story that he opened the door with a gun pointed at their face.
I suspect he either simply had it in hand and the cops saw the gun and shot him without ever Id'ing themselves as cops and giving him a chance to drop it or he asked "who is it?" and the cops didn't reply and forced their way in and he, not knowing what he was facing, had the gun pointed at them.
Until they identified themselves as police, they were just home invaders as far as anyone would know.
Based on what I can extrapolate from so little info, I think the cops are at fault big time here.
-
Lots of similar incidents in the last couple of years. Last year some guy in LA got shot by a sniper without even being talked to by the police because he was sitting on his porch playing with a water hose spray nozzle. He was on the porch for a couple of hours, the cops spent over an hour sneaking up on him, and then they shot him without even trying to talk to him. Last I heard, not a single officer or supervisor was so much as reprimanded.
Thank goodness the courts have started to come down on the side of the public when it comes to things like videotaping cops out in plain public view or when coming onto private property without a warrant.
-
I'm usually on the side of the cops, but they can't just go in guns blazing without even trying to get a peaceful surrender first. If someone was beating on my door like that, I'd have a gun in my hand too.
As said before, they should have covered all the exits and first tried to talk the guy into coming out hands up.
-
I don’t believe for a second that the guy opened the door with a gun pointed at anyone. Doesn’t add up. And for that matter, since when do cops have the right to bang on doors in the middle of the night without probable cause or announcing themselves. A motorcycle parked in a public parking lot isn’t probable cause to go banging on the closest convenient door you can find in an apartment complex and gun down the occupant.
Let me get this straight, The guy answers the door with his gun pointed at the cops. The cops draw and fire and the guy never gets off a shot? Wouldn’t it be ironic if it comes out that he didn’t even own a gun? hmmmm
I guarantee you if the guy had taken a position in his home and the cops busted in unannounced and he shot one of them, he would be facing murder charges. Protect and Serve? BS These cops were playing cowboy and didn’t even consider protecting anyone but themselves.
As far as I am concerned, It’s bad judgment coupled with poor training and lousy tactics. They didn’t even know that they shot the wrong guy for an hour and a half? Really? An entire police shift involved with this shooting and that’s considered acceptable police work? What a joke.
-
I don’t believe for a second that the guy opened the door with a gun pointed at anyone. Doesn’t add up. And for that matter, since when do cops have the right to bang on doors in the middle of the night without probable cause or announcing themselves. A motorcycle parked in a public parking lot isn’t probable cause to go banging on the closest convenient door you can find in an apartment complex and gun down the occupant.
Let me get this straight, The guy answers the door with his gun pointed at the cops. The cops draw and fire and the guy never gets off a shot? Wouldn’t it be ironic if it comes out that he didn’t even own a gun? hmmmm
I guarantee you if the guy had taken a position in his home and the cops busted in unannounced and he shot one of them, he would be facing murder charges. Protect and Serve? BS These cops were playing cowboy and didn’t even consider protecting anyone but themselves.
As far as I am concerned, It’s bad judgment coupled with poor training and lousy tactics. They didn’t even know that they shot the wrong guy for an hour and a half? Really? An entire police shift involved with this shooting and that’s considered acceptable police work? What a joke.
They had probable cause. They were chasing someone.
They already would have had their weapons out since the mad had just tried to crush someone's skull with a cinder block.
It was 1:30 in the morning in what seems to be a bad neighborhood. The guy probably thought they were thugs so he brought his gun -smart - BUT he opened the door all the way with it aimed in the doorway -dumb-.
If I were dumb enough to point my weapon at a doorway without peeking outside first, I would hope someone would frag me so that I couldn't help populate.
-
Look at the photos of the door with bullet holes. Angled yes but....hmmmmm
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2174381/Andrew-Scott-Outrage-police-shoot-kill-wrong-man-hunt-attempted-murder-suspect.html
-
Also this thread is not intended to bash police officers. Just to discuss this and similar cases.
-
....This is almost ignore worthy...
They were chasing someone who attempted to kill someone.
Said person then parks his bike outside of this guy's house.
The police (trying to not let the world know they were there for obvious reasons) then knocked on the door and this guy decided to open the door with a gun pointed at the cops. I would have fragged him too.
You're trained that when someone points a weapon at you, you take them down. Especially if your chasing a potential murder suspect.
Hell my neighbors next door have a hole in their house from a shotgun blast that was fired by a police officer. Why? Because my neighbor is a moron and was walking around outside with his shotgun talking about killing everyone. He's lucky they didn't frag him then and there.
No he had a gun pointed at whoever was knocking on his door in the middle of the night. Your line of thinking is just what caused this problem. If the police are afraid to do their jobs.... they need to find another line of work. The job of a police officer is dangerous enough without these types on board.
The guy answering the door should have called 911 then stayed inside.
Of course the poorly trained officers at the door probably would have caved the door in forcing the guy to start shooting.
Cops are people too. Never go to thinking they are better or worse than the general population.
So in the end you can ignore my opinion and others and possibly in the future you can be one of these poorly trained cops too.
Real shame is that the poor folks in that town now have to protect themselves from the thugs on the street and the thugs in uniform.
-
There is a lot of speculation by folks here being stated as fact. You really should figure that you have not gotten all the facts, or much of any facts form a news story..
From what I have seen so far there were mistakes on both sides of that door and the entire series of mistakes ended up in a tragedy. Breaking that chain of mistakes at any point would have rendered a far different outcome.
This was not a hot pursuit situation. The Deputies lost sight of the suspect for some time. Enough time that they ended up finding the bike at a later time from the original incident. Since this is not a hot pursuit there is no need for breaking the door, nor was there any mention in the article that the door was forced by the deputies at the scene.
This was a classic case of get a surveillance team out to the apt. complex and observe. There is no immediacy or hazard like an active shooter or hostage situation. Use plain clothes folks to watch then follow or apprehend the suspect if he comes outside.
The deceased should never have opened the door at 1:30 AM just because someone knocked. If he felt threatened enough to bring a firearm to the door he should have turned on the light, looked through the peep hole (if any) or looked out the window to ID the person(s) knocking before even thinking about opening the door. He should also have called 911 while still inside the closed locked door to report the knocking and request assistance in determining wtf was going on. Last mistake would be (assuming the news has it correct) to bring a gun to the door and have it pointing to the person(s) on the outside before determining if there is A. a real threat and B what kind of threat there is. and finally C. if you think there is a threat outside the door, do NOT open it if you are on the inside behind a locked door. Stay put, out of the deadly funnel, and call for help.
The holes on the door are angled. That is reasonable to expect as the deputies are not going to stand directly in the front of the door when they figure they are going to confront a suspect. Hell it's standard practice to stand to the side period when knocking on a door anyhow. Just a good habit to get into. The one on the hinge side of the door knows already they are in the first line of fire to be available if the door starts to open.
The person inside the door probably is likely to open the door only a bit and be standing to the side so they can look outside without having to fully open the door. Would you stand in front then open it wide for an unknown knock at 1:30 AM? Having a gun pointed to the outside as you open the door leaves little to no other options but opening fire for the deputies on the outside once the threat of the gun is noted.
Those two situations would set up the shots for angled fire into the opening.
-
Boy, these investigations usually take a week or longer. Sometimes much longer. Some of you have remarkable investigative talents. Ones that far outstrip mine. Let alone expertise in procedure and training.
I have a tidbit for all of you to chew on. "News Outlets" aren't really "News outlets". They are business's that "sell" people the news they want to hear or read. Most of all to the simple minded and most of all the newspapers. Which are desperate due to falling revenues. And nothing makes money more then a negative Police story splashed across the front page. Ive sat there and watched a stack of papers sell out with such front pages on them in 1/2 the usual time, customers grimacing as if it was Moses coming down from the mountain with breaking news. :lol My God but people are simple!
Let the investigation play out before coming out with your theorys and opinions. Ive known many guys make the papers accused of all kinds of stuff, most of all bad shoots, and when they are eventually exonerated its all old news. It never even makes print.
-
Boy, these investigations usually take a week or longer. Sometimes much longer. Some of you have remarkable investigative talents. Ones that far outstrip mine. Let alone expertise in procedure and training.
I have a tidbit for all of you to chew on. "News Outlets" aren't really "News outlets". They are business's that "sell" people the news they want to hear or read. Most of all to the simple minded and most of all the newspapers. Which are desperate due to falling revenues. And nothing makes money more then a negative Police story splashed across the front page. Ive sat there and watched a stack of papers sell out with such front pages on them in 1/2 the usual time, customers grimacing as if it was Moses coming down from the mountain with breaking news. :lol My God but people are simple!
Let the investigation play out before coming out with your theorys and opinions. Ive known many guys make the papers accused of all kinds of stuff, most of all bad shoots, and when they are eventually exonerated its all old news. It never even makes print.
The posts on this story are based on the story.... however if the story is correct folks are posting about what was wrong or right in their opinion. As far as what actually happened... that will take time.
It is commion knowledge that there are no "News" sources anymore. They all want to inject their own spin.
-
The posts on this story are based on the story.... however if the story is correct folks are posting about what was wrong or right in their opinion. As far as what actually happened... that will take time.
No. It wont. By the time the facts are hashed out it will be Old news and wont make print. All that will be left are the attitudes of the people who saw the original story.
-
Can someone tell me how so many bullet holes ended up in the door when the door was supposedly open?
-
My interpretation of the event is not in what the media is spewing out to get their ratings. It’s with the admission of the facts from the officers on scene.
1. They did not acknowledge themselves as law enforcement when knocking on an undetermined residence at 1:30 am. Add to the fact that this isn’t the best of neighborhoods.
2. They had no probable cause to knock on the door. They made this determination because they saw the motorcycle parked in the parking lot and decided to bang on the closest door they found. Chasing bad guys doesn’t give them probable cause to enter your home or attack a citizen based on the facts they had at the time.
3. One innocent US citizen is shot dead in his own home.
4. They didn’t even know they gunned down the wrong guy for an hour and a half. This is just unconceivable to me.
This has nothing to do with bashing cops. This has everything to do with our rights as citizens. You can play devil’s advocate all day about how the guy should have done this or that but you can’t beat the facts.
At the end of the day an innocent man was shot and killed in his own home. This is why we have procedures (or supposed to have) to protect innocent civilians. If we take the position of (oh well, the guy shouldn’t of done this or he should of called 911, or he should have looked out his peep hole) then where will we be 10 years from now.
What’s next, proper procedure for families to answer their own doors or the police have the right to gun you down?
This sounds more like a bad remake of Tango and Cash
-
I'm sure the police officers won't get in trouble for anything...usually never do even if they are at fault. The police will feed the news anything they want us to hear...considering the other side of the story is nonexistent.
-
No. It wont. By the time the facts are hashed out it will be Old news and wont make print. All that will be left are the attitudes of the people who saw the original story.
Your opinion.
-
I'm sure the police officers won't get in trouble for anything...usually never do even if they are at fault. The police will feed the news anything they want us to hear...considering the other side of the story is nonexistent.
Unless the deceased lived with someone that heard or saw something. I disagree that there was fault on both sides as the article states. I wonder if the police identified themselves properly, would have the deceased open the door with a gun pointing to their face? :headscratch:
-
I doubt it. I also wonder why there are 10 bullet holes in the door when it was "open".
-
The only thing certain about this is we probably will never know the facts, how things exactly went down that night. We human beings are biased, whether intentionally or not in varying degrees, and that modifies the way we see things and in our memories of events. That sort of naturally occurring bias will also affect the investigation.
Law enforcement generally wants to build a case against criminals. Law enforcement does not generally want to build a case against their own. Again this can include intentional bias as well as just the way we human beings are in terms of perception beyond our deliberate control.
For example in relation to "Law enforcement does not generally want to build a case against their own.", how are internal affairs officers/personnel generally perceived? There you have it.
-
For example in relation to "Law enforcement does not generally want to build a case against their own.", how are internal affairs officers/personnel generally perceived? There you have it.
Well we perceive them, at least we grunts with no political clout, as hangmen who will diligently work to stick it up our rear ends, "they have to make their numbers somehow too", and whom generally never even saw a statue of a Lady balancing justice. Besides, most beefs end up administrative anyways so our only recourse is to take our suspensions/firings, maybe some time on the rubber gun squad, and hope that years down the line our civil suit has a jury that hasnt read to many anti Police headlines and gives us justice.
Big city chiefs have to respond to to many bad headlines by showing pie charts that show suspensions, firings, and "findings against", are up. Its not really a case of justice and the real trick is to tip toe thru 20 to 30 years trying to stay off the pie charts. The entire time trying to do some good and risking that same rear end, IAD wants to get ahold of, to serve and protect your fellows while avoiding not only the pie chart but also the Officer Down Memorial sight.
Besides every shooting investigation, at the least, has civilian board overview.
-
Well we perceive them, at least we grunts with no political clout, as hangmen who will diligently work to stick it up our rear ends, "they have to make their numbers somehow too", and whom generally never even saw a statue of a Lady balancing justice. Besides, most beefs end up administrative anyways so our only recourse is to take our suspensions/firings, maybe some time on the rubber gun squad, and hope that years down the line our civil suit has a jury that hasnt read to many anti Police headlines and gives us justice.
Big city chiefs have to respond to to many bad headlines by showing pie charts that show suspensions, firings, and "findings against", are up. Its not really a case of justice and the real trick is to tip toe thru 20 to 30 years trying to stay off the pie charts. The entire time trying to do some good and risking that same rear end, IAD wants to get ahold of, to serve and protect your fellows while avoiding not only the pie chart but also the Officer Down Memorial sight.
Besides every shooting investigation, at the least, has civilian board overview.
Yep those are the every day bs details you guys have to deal with. I think that kind of confirms my point about there being a negative perception toward such.
The overall point I'm trying to make is that we are all fallible and have bias. Even that civilian review board is going to have bias. This event sort of reminds me of the typical airplane crash where a series of mistakes lead to a deadly conclusion. When a police officer makes a mistake the outcome can be very serious as in this case.
Remember thousands of arrests and investigations happen every day in the USA where an "innocent" person is not harmed. :aok
It's also important to note that sometimes truly innocent people are convicted and go to jail even with the best intentions of all those involved. The human factor.
-
My interpretation of the event is not in what the media is spewing out to get their ratings. It’s with the admission of the facts from the officers on scene.
1. They did not acknowledge themselves as law enforcement when knocking on an undetermined residence at 1:30 am. Add to the fact that this isn’t the best of neighborhoods.
2. They had no probable cause to knock on the door. They made this determination because they saw the motorcycle parked in the parking lot and decided to bang on the closest door they found. Chasing bad guys doesn’t give them probable cause to enter your home or attack a citizen based on the facts they had at the time.
3. One innocent US citizen is shot dead in his own home.
4. They didn’t even know they gunned down the wrong guy for an hour and a half. This is just unconceivable to me.
This has nothing to do with bashing cops. This has everything to do with our rights as citizens. You can play devil’s advocate all day about how the guy should have done this or that but you can’t beat the facts.
At the end of the day an innocent man was shot and killed in his own home. This is why we have procedures (or supposed to have) to protect innocent civilians. If we take the position of (oh well, the guy shouldn’t of done this or he should of called 911, or he should have looked out his peep hole) then where will we be 10 years from now.
What’s next, proper procedure for families to answer their own doors or the police have the right to gun you down?
This sounds more like a bad remake of Tango and Cash
QFT
-
No he had a gun pointed at whoever was knocking on his door in the middle of the night. Your line of thinking is just what caused this problem. If the police are afraid to do their jobs.... they need to find another line of work. The job of a police officer is dangerous enough without these types on board.
The guy answering the door should have called 911 then stayed inside.
Of course the poorly trained officers at the door probably would have caved the door in forcing the guy to start shooting.
Cops are people too. Never go to thinking they are better or worse than the general population.
So in the end you can ignore my opinion and others and possibly in the future you can be one of these poorly trained cops too.
Real shame is that the poor folks in that town now have to protect themselves from the thugs on the street and the thugs in uniform.
So you admit the guy is wrong for opening the door the way he did?
BTW: He probably poked his head out with the gun through the crack. That SCREAMS "Hey, I can shoot you and have a door to hide behind."
You can call me poorly trained but I know for a FACT that I've received more training than you will ever dream of getting. As far as the officers? I can't claim to be better than them. Some of them may very well of had the same training I received. I've noticed folks who hate on the actions of police officers are normally doing something they shouldn't be in the first place. So what is it that you do that you aren't proud of?
Thugs in uniform? The man had a gun. I'm leaving it at that. Plain and simple. Your life wasn't on the line. Theirs was. I doubt you've been in a situation even close to this. Your wife gripping your balls and telling you to stop being a sweety doesn't count. You've clearly lost your grip on reality and therefore will no longer receive a reply from me. You live in a world where the police are always evil and should take every precaution possible when something goes wrong. Guess what? In serious situations; you think, you die.
You're trained to react when there is a weapon pointed at you. When we searched the huts in Afghan, if someone had a weapon pointed at us guess what? They went down. What if they were a child? Who cares. Kid points an AK at one of us, he won't get to be an adult. Does it suck? Yes. Does it haunt you? Yes. Do you wish it could have gone down differently? Yes.
In the end, a bullet travels faster than you can think about options. Anyone who hasn't been in a situation where your life was on the line really has no say in this type of situation.
Yes, people are entitled to their opinions but it pisses me off to no end when I see people ridiculing the officers for reacting when someone decided to pop a gun out that doorway.
Hell, come knock on my door and let me point a gun at you. I wanna see how you react. Btw: When you do it - I'll give you two seconds before I start firing aimlessly into my yard. You get two seconds more than most people who are in those situations that way.
I wanna see how people will react to that.
---
It doesn't matter whether or not they said "POLICE!" when they knocked. No normal human should open a door at 1:30 AM for someone they don't know, let alone with a gun. It's common sense.
*Sitting on couch watching movies with the woman at 1:30 in the morning* -BAM BAM BAM- "Who the f---?" *Grabs gun, opens door with gun pointed out the opening*
Yeah....being a badarse sure paid off. Was he planning on being Rambo? No. But he was willing to open the door with a gun in a bad neighborhood.
-
So you admit the guy is wrong for opening the door the way he did?
BTW: He probably poked his head out with the gun through the crack. That SCREAMS "Hey, I can shoot you and have a door to hide behind."
You can call me poorly trained but I know for a FACT that I've received more training that you will ever dream of getting. As far as the officers? I can't claim to be better than them. Some of them may very well of had the same training I received. I've noticed folks who hate on the actions of police officers are normally doing something they shouldn't be in the first place. So what is it that you do that you aren't proud of?
Thugs in uniform? The man had a gun. I'm leaving it at that. Plain and simple. Your life wasn't on the line. Theirs was. I doubt you've been in a situation even close to this. Your wife gripping your balls and telling you to stop being a sweety doesn't count. You've clearly lost your grip on reality and therefore will no longer receive a reply from me. You live in a world where the police are always evil and should take every precaution possible when something goes wrong. Guess what? In serious situations; you think, you die.
You're trained to react when there is a weapon pointed at you. When we searched the huts in Afghan, if someone had a weapon pointed at us guess what? They went down. What if they were a child? Who cares. Kid points an AK at one of us, he won't get to be an adult. Does it suck? Yes. Does it haunt you? Yes. Do you wish it could have gone down differently? Yes.
In the end, a bullet travels faster than you can think about options. Anyone who hasn't been in a situation where your life was on the line really has no say in this type of situation.
Yes, people are entitled to their opinions but it pisses me off to no end when I see people ridiculing the officers for reacting when someone decided to pop a gun out that doorway.
Hell, come knock on my door and let me point a gun at you. I wanna see how you react. Btw: When you do it - I'll give you two seconds before I start firing aimlessly into my yard. You get two seconds more than most people who are in those situations that way.
I wanna see how people will react to that.
---
It doesn't matter whether or not they said "POLICE!" when they knocked. No normal human should open a door at 1:30 AM for someone they don't know, let alone with a gun. It's common sense.
*Sitting on couch watching movies with the woman at 1:30 in the morning* -BAM BAM BAM- "Who the f---?" *Grabs gun, opens door with gun pointed out the opening*
Yeah....being a badarse sure paid off. Was he planning on being Rambo? No. But he was willing to open the door with a gun in a bad neighborhood.
There were a lot of wrongs. All starting with poorly trained officers. They set the whole thing in motion and then did not identify themselves. Had someone else been in the house you may have had several dead cops. The cops were concerned for their safety and no ne elses. At least based on what this story says.
I stand by my statements. Based on your posts so far I'd say your train of thought is more a part of the problem than the cure. They need to admit they made a huge mistake in handling their assult on an individuals home.
Any idiot that bangs on the door at 1:30 in the morning should be ready to see anything. If it did happen as the story goes... I hope they are charged with murder. They sure are not officers that law abiding citizens would want patroling the streets.
-
I've noticed folks who hate on the actions of police officers are normally doing something they shouldn't be in the first place. So what is it that you do that you aren't proud of?
Thugs in uniform? The man had a gun. I'm leaving it at that. Plain and simple.
You're trained to react when there is a weapon pointed at you. When we searched the huts in Afghan, if someone had a weapon pointed at us guess what? They went down.
It doesn't matter whether or not they said "POLICE!" when they knocked. No normal human should open a door at 1:30 AM for someone they don't know, let alone with a gun. It's common sense.
First off, we aren’t in Afghanistan so I am not sure how that relates. I do however thank you for your service and so much appreciate any individual that dedicates themselves to the preservation of others through their own dedication of service.
However, if you decide that a career in law enforcement is what you want to pursue then you have the obligation and duty to defend the general public. You swear an oath to this fact and I am sure protect and serve are involved in this process. If you don’t have the courage (which is what it takes to be in that line of work) then get out. Somehow this has become twisted. How did we get to shooting first and asking questions later?
If you don’t possess the mentality or decision making ability to do the job without putting innocent lives and other officers at stake for your own self-preservation then you shouldn’t be wearing the uniform.
This cop brotherhood thing doesn’t pass muster with me guys.
I have been involved with law enforcement on many levels throughout my career and I have seen good and bad alike. I have no animosity toward law enforcement and would like to think that my family and I are safe because of their presence. What scares me are comments about this situation that don’t take into consideration how this could have been avoided.
We tend to see more comments along the lines of how the guy answered the door or he was a drug user. I guess this means he got what he deserved. This is what scares me. Let’s not take the time to see how we could have done this better and focus on the fact that it was a clean shooting because the guy had a gun.
In my opinion, if you want to wear the badge then you should have the pride in yourself, common decency, and the guts to put yourself in harm’s way for the preservation of civilian life instead of making excuses for a bad call.
They were at an unknown residence in the middle of the night. Instead of calling for backup and announcing their intentions to give the occupant (and law enforcement) to make the proper call, they decided to handle this themselves.
You can cry about how the guy had a gun but you know what, he has the right to have a gun and the fact that you are a (supposedly) trained police officer doesn’t afford you the right to gun him down in your own defense. Sorry.
If the situation was reversed and I came to your house, knocked on your door at 2 am and gunned you down because you had a gun, I would be innocent? Just because you are a cop doesn’t change the facts.
Your supposed to be the only one in this situation that has the proper training and this is the best you have to offer. I would prefer you go practice your tactics in another country.
If law enforcement goes down the road of (this was an authorized shooting) instead of this is how we could have prevented the situation then you will we see continued separation between Law Enforcement and Civilians.
-
It relates in the sense we weren't their to kill everyone. We were there to help them and keep the area secure (ie prevent violence etc.). We pretty much were police.
As and officer, or any job that carries with it the weight that your life could be ended in a split second, you react on the fact there is a gun at you and the current situation. There were reports of someone who attempted to crush the skull of another victim. This guy would obviously off an officer if given the chance. This means there is pretty much a cop killer on the loose, then this bonehead decides to open his door with a gun in his hand.
It's a sad situation and it sucks it happened. Protect and Serve is a big thing.
Answering a door with a gun isn't really the brightest idea. Like many have said; answering a door at 1:30AM was a bad idea anyway. :uhoh
I wish it could have gone down differently but it happens. They left themselves unannounced for good reason, but that's no excuse to open your door with a gun pointed out.
---
Sad thing that happened but in the end, we learn to not open the door that late or with a gun lol.
-
usmarine you were in a combat zone and anybody with a gun would be considering the enemy, right or wrong. however here in the usa we are not in a combat zone and we expect to be safe in our own homes. and we are guaranteed the right to defend our homes. police cannot just show up in any house they feel like at 1 am and expect not to see somebody with a gun at the door. they should've known better.
semp
-
usmarine you were in a combat zone and anybody with a gun would be considering the enemy, right or wrong. however here in the usa we are not in a combat zone and we expect to be safe in our own homes. and we are guaranteed the right to defend our homes. police cannot just show up in any house they feel like at 1 am and expect not to see somebody with a gun at the door. they should've known better.
semp
And any person shouldn't have to worry about being shot just because they knocked on a door.
It works both ways.
EDIT: And not anyone with a gun in Afghan is hostile....just the ones who like to do the "pointy - shooty" stuff. :lol
-
And any person shouldn't have to worry about being shot just because they knocked on a door.
It works both ways.
Just because they knocked on a door? Really? You are going to break this down to that?
Let me break this down for you.
How about knocking on a door of an apartment, in a crime infested complex, that you have never been to before, in the middle of the night, without announcing yourself, on a door you have no idea who is on the other side.
This coming from the guy who posted, (and I am quoting here)
(When we searched the huts in Afghan, if someone had a weapon pointed at us guess what? They went down. What if they were a child? Who cares. Kid points an AK at one of us, he won't get to be an adult.)
If you think you should be safe in that situation, your just being a bit naive.
-
Just because they knocked on a door? Really? You are going to break this down to that?
Let me break this down for you.
How about knocking on a door of an apartment, in a crime infested complex, that you have never been to before, in the middle of the night, without announcing yourself, on a door you have no idea who is on the other side.
This coming from the guy who posted, (and I am quoting here)
(When we searched the huts in Afghan, if someone had a weapon pointed at us guess what? They went down. What if they were a child? Who cares. Kid points an AK at one of us, he won't get to be an adult.)
If you think you should be safe in that situation, your just being a bit naive.
Not saying anyone should think they were safe.
It was a bad neighborhood with some bad folks running around.
That doesn't mean the guy should have opened the door with a gun pointed out of it like he was gonna be the next Scarface. :P
-
Answering a door with a gun isn't really the brightest idea. Like many have said; answering a door at 1:30AM was a bad idea anyway. :uhoh
This is what most people don't understand, even if the police identifies themselves as police, you are not obligated to open that door for anyone (unless a search warrant is announced). People are not required to speak to the police as part of their rights, set aside anything what a good samaritan would do to help. I would not answer the door either at those hours.
This is off topic of course for this original thread.
-
This is what most people don't understand, even if the police identifies themselves as police, you are not obligated to open that door for anyone (unless a search warrant is announced). People are not required to speak to the police as part of their rights, set aside anything what a good samaritan would do to help. I would not answer the door either at those hours.
This is off topic of course for this original thread.
Bottom line this would probably not have happened had the people that instigated everything had just identified themselves. In readin it seems they were trained not to ID themselves. This does not protect the officers as it was said. It in fact places the officers at higher risk. The guy at home may have had threats thrown his way.. by phone or otherwise and been prepared for his threatened attack. This or moany other possibilities. He may have just shot through the door in fear for his life.
It is just poor training or lack thereof that caused this person to lose their life.
I am usually behind the officers as I know it is a tough job. This however was just sinceless.
-
There was a case in Mississippi where police entered the wrong apartment on a no-knock and the guy there thought it was a home invasion. He grabbed his daughter, retreated to his bedroom and got his pistol. When the cops entered he fired, killing one of them. As soon as the cops identified themselves he surrendered.
He was sentenced to death for that, though he has since been taken off of death row and maybe even released.
-
okay so I am not a cop nor will I ever be a cop but I do hunt and the FIRST thing that I was taught is MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR SHOOTING AT!!!! I understand it was 130 am but there is a HUGE difference in the appearance of the 2 men. and also I thought deadly force was a last resort??? maybe I am wrong but it dont add up to me either.
Wonder what really happened ? The story don't add up to me .
hard to say what I personally whould have done if I were the cops, but in my opinion they should not have fired not knowing exactly what they were shooting at.
-
It doesn't matter whether or not they said "POLICE!" when they knocked. No normal human should open a door at 1:30 AM for someone they don't know, let alone with a gun. It's common sense.
Actually yes it does matter. It's not against the law to be dumb. The deputies made a mistake and a man paid with his life for it. You can analyze both sides but in the end the S.O. has the responsibility to go to the right damn door and you have the right to protect yourself in your home.
-
Actually yes it does matter. It's not against the law to be dumb. The deputies made a mistake and a man paid with his life for it. You can analyze both sides but in the end the S.O. has the responsibility to go to the right damn door and you have the right to protect yourself in your home.
And the officers have the right to protect themselves if they feel threatened.
Would you NOT feel threatened if someone pointed a gun at you?
----
And what police officer isn't trained to ID themselves???? That's a 101 type thing there. Hell you can learn that from watching COPS...hell it doesn't even have to be COPS, you can learn it from Bones, CSI, NASH, hell even Walker Texas Ranger. Trying to blame it on poor training it like trying to pour purified water into the ocean and then saying the clouds are evaporating only your water due to poor chemical reactions.
I don't care who you are, where I'm at, what you do - if you point a weapon at me you WILL be dropped. If not, I'll die shooting.
Yes. Defend yourselves in your homes, but for the love of all that is holy; don't be a moron about it.
If you think you're gonna open your door at 1:30 AM, point a gun at someone and expect them to run off - you're living in a fantasy land.
He's lucky it was the Police. If it had been a thug they would have not only killed him, but the girlfriend he was supposedly watching movies with as well.
Trying to look like a badarse sure pays off.
EDIT: "Last resort" comment: When you're in the area of a potential murder suspect and someone points a gun at you - that IS your last resort.
-
Set phasers to stun next time?
-
And the officers have the right to protect themselves if they feel threatened.
Gee, I'll try to keep that in mind.
-
And the officers have the right to protect themselves if they feel threatened.
Would you NOT feel threatened if someone pointed a gun at you?
----
And what police officer isn't trained to ID themselves???? That's a 101 type thing there. Hell you can learn that from watching COPS...hell it doesn't even have to be COPS, you can learn it from Bones, CSI, NASH, hell even Walker Texas Ranger. Trying to blame it on poor training it like trying to pour purified water into the ocean and then saying the clouds are evaporating only your water due to poor chemical reactions.
I don't care who you are, where I'm at, what you do - if you point a weapon at me you WILL be dropped. If not, I'll die shooting.
Yes. Defend yourselves in your homes, but for the love of all that is holy; don't be a moron about it.
If you think you're gonna open your door at 1:30 AM, point a gun at someone and expect them to run off - you're living in a fantasy land.
He's lucky it was the Police. If it had been a thug they would have not only killed him, but the girlfriend he was supposedly watching movies with as well.
Trying to look like a badarse sure pays off.
EDIT: "Last resort" comment: When you're in the area of a potential murder suspect and someone points a gun at you - that IS your last resort.
You are wrong on so many levels. The cops here were the perps. You come to my house you better ID yourself I don't care who you are or think you are. Being a cop does not make you above the law. If nothing comes of this other than the cops murdering this guy then folks will be shooting first and asking questions later... you know like the cops do.
You said earlier he could have looked out the window.... if I see 2 folks in uniform and they wont ID themselves then they are not cops.... it's easy to get a uni.
The folks in the county where this happened are now in more danger from both sides.
-
And the officers have the right to protect themselves if they feel threatened.
Would you NOT feel threatened if someone pointed a gun at you?
----
And what police officer isn't trained to ID themselves???? That's a 101 type thing there. Hell you can learn that from watching COPS...hell it doesn't even have to be COPS, you can learn it from Bones, CSI, NASH, hell even Walker Texas Ranger. Trying to blame it on poor training it like trying to pour purified water into the ocean and then saying the clouds are evaporating only your water due to poor chemical reactions.
I don't care who you are, where I'm at, what you do - if you point a weapon at me you WILL be dropped. If not, I'll die shooting.
Yes. Defend yourselves in your homes, but for the love of all that is holy; don't be a moron about it.
If you think you're gonna open your door at 1:30 AM, point a gun at someone and expect them to run off - you're living in a fantasy land.
He's lucky it was the Police. If it had been a thug they would have not only killed him, but the girlfriend he was supposedly watching movies with as well.
Trying to look like a badarse sure pays off.
EDIT: "Last resort" comment: When you're in the area of a potential murder suspect and someone points a gun at you - that IS your last resort.
MarineUS, I don't know you but I would take it from your post that you yourself are a cop, which is fine if you are. My brother, Daryl, was a cop and I had the up most respect for him. Daryl would have given even me a ticket if he caught me breaking the speed limit, but in the same turn he had enough integrity to admit when a cop made a bad decision and was in the wrong and that's what made him a good cop IMHO. Whether these cops in this particular case were poorly trained or not I don't know, they made a bad decision that killed a man that could have easily been avoided. I live in Georgia, I have a concealed weapons permit, I have weapons, I live in a good neighborhood with no problems in the 8 years I've been here. If some one comes to my door in the middle of the night I will have a weapon in hand ready to defend my family, myself and my home.
Lambo
-
At the point that a policeman crosses a line where he looks at his job as combat in a warzone, as a combat soldier must to perform his duty to country. Instead of Service and Protection of the Public Trust that policemen sign on to do. Then all of us citizens good or bad become potential enemies in that policeman's, now quasie soldier's mind. Because his warzone is our homes, public spaces, and free country.
He does not have the right to cross that line as a servant of the public trust, even if he is a combat veteran. The combat veteran's job "was" war and to shoot first or fail his service to protect his country and his life as a combat asset. A policeman is not trained as a combat soldier nor is a combat asset. Combat occupation and active martial control of a foriegn country is not Service and Protection of the Public Trust in America. To confuse that will result in dead innocent American citizens on U.S. soil.
Serving the public trust and shooting first for self preservation are not compatable mind sets or legal concepts out side of a war zone. Otherwise we the innocent free citizens are forced into a warzone by our police not of our making, at their sole descretion, and us citizens denyed any recource but to their state of mind and temperance in each moment. Feels good this way if you are the policeman and not the citizen though. Since being a policeman seems to be inerpreted as becoming an extra constitutionaly superior citizen by a minority resulting in giving the majority a black eye and eroded citizen trust.
The actions and decisions of the dead citizen are being used to over shadow policemen not operating to first ensure the protection of all citizens and their public trust. Being a policman is a choice with no expectation of safety in the line of duty other than the protection provided by established chains of procedures. Being a citizen is the expectation of safety from policemen who identify themselves in all interactions as gaurdians of the public trust to be trusted with our lives. Criminals do not announce themselves in the dark to citizens just like criminals do not follow gun laws when knocking on your door at any time.
MarineUS,
Here is a psych profile question that shows up on government tests in one from or another that everyone with an 8th grade education knows to lie and check off "no" to.
------------------------------------------
Do you enjoy shooting people and observing anyone you think is stupid by your personal standards being harmed for being less than your expectations of the human race and of yourself?
------------------------------------------
Never met anyone who checked yes on that one at any point in their governemt careers at any of their required reEvals. And not all government groups can afford sending everyone in for a face to face where verbaly lieing to that will be caught.
-
I'm not a cop but I know it's stupid point a weapon at one.
Point a weapon at an officer, expect the repercussions.
They were in uniform, opening the door with a gun pointed out of it like a wannabe badarse was stupid on this idiots part.
-
And the story end's , don't never pull a weapon unless you plan on using it .
-
The saddest part is why that specific citizen felt he had to answer his door in that neigborhood at that time of night carrying his gun. His strong fear of personal harm by one nature of assailent got him killed by the deputys.
If the deputys didn't want to announce themselves, and being seen through the window or the peep hole in the door would compromise the secrecy they felt necessary to apprehending their suspect. It's not all unlikely only a single deputy knocked with his trappings of office covered up while his back up was just out of sight in the dark covering him and the door.
If the deputy's trappings of office could have been seen through the door peephole or window, I suspect how the door was opened would have been very different. Which goes to the heart of a policeman is resposible for the saftey of "us" citizens during the execution of "his" duties which very often are lethal. The law is not created for the convienience or saftey of policemen. Operational procedures are for the saftey of policemen and protection of the public from fatal mistakes by policemen.
I worked with an Alameda County Sherif's Deputy here in Cal for some years. Having a single deputy cover his identifying markings to perform a knock so a suspect would open the door was one strategy to see who was there if they were not sure while on a foot chase in bad neighborhoods. It was risky some of the time becasue in some neighborhoods you knocked on the wrong door like the deputys in this news story. It kept knowlege of their presence to a minimum in a community with active criminals and their supporters. Going hot was the other if they were backing up state or local drug enforcment. And banging on the door while announcing they were deputys was SOP at all times to ensure thier own saftey and the "Publics Safety and Trust".
Some of you simply enjoy the sport of laughing at the misfortunes of those you feel stupider than yourselves even if it's about their death. To which you being alive becomes the ultimite validation of your superiority post mortum.
-
I'm all for the 2nd amendment and protecting your house and property.
Sure seems a bit extreme to open your front door pointing a gun though...frankly not very smart.
If I was suspicious of a knock at the door, I wouldn't answer it by opening it, but by calling out 'Who is it', while maintaining a defensive position in the house with my firearm. In reality you lose any tactical advantage by opening the door and exposing yourself.
Or another idea is maybe call 911 if your suspicious.
It also seems strange that the police would not identify themselves if they are going to knock on the door. I mean if it is a no-knock warrant where they have to barge in and catch everyone by surprise is one thing. But if your going to take the time to knock on a suspected killers door why not identify yourselves as police.
My local police dept routinely knocks without announcing. The call it a 'knock and talk'. Basically they knock on the door and if the knob turns they force their way in and ransack the place. They do 80 of these a year along with 80 'garbage searches' and in return they get a nice grant that pays for one officer's salary and a sqaud car.
-
I'm not a cop but I know it's stupid point a weapon at one.
Point a weapon at an officer, expect the repercussions.
They were in uniform, opening the door with a gun pointed out of it like a wannabe badarse was stupid on this idiots part.
The victim was not pointing at cops.... after all they did not identify themselves.
Obviously the so called cops had their guns drawn. The poor folks living in that area should shoot first and ask questions later. That is how the so called cops there do it. The folks have to defend against criminals on both sides of the badge.
-
The victim was not pointing at cops.... after all they did not identify themselves.
Obviously the so called cops had their guns drawn. The poor folks living in that area should shoot first and ask questions later. That is how the so called cops there do it. The folks have to defend against criminals on both sides of the badge.
Lol. The dude was a drug dealer. He opened his door up (I'm assuming at this point) thinking some dope man, or addict was at his door (more than likely). You play on that side of the world, you pay the price.
And just because they didn't identify themselves removes the fact they were officers? Yes that makes sense. I guess I'm a transgender then since I don't announce I'm a male to everyone I meet either. :o
Anyone who thinks they need to pull out a gun when there is a knock on the door is better off dialing the police instead of trying to be John Wayne.
My local police dept routinely knocks without announcing. The call it a 'knock and talk'. Basically they knock on the door and if the knob turns they force their way in and ransack the place. They do 80 of these a year along with 80 'garbage searches' and in return they get a nice grant that pays for one officer's salary and a sqaud car.
First off, I find this hard to believe.
"Ransack"? As in...they flip over couches, bust windows, rip out drawers onto the floor, smash televisions and computers etc.? Yeah. I call total BS on that.
They can not legally bust into your house without a warrant.
OR do you mean they just come in and look around and search? Those are two totally different things, though doing both without a warrant is illegal.
"Knock and TALK" - Sounds more like they knock on your door and ask if they can come in. Just like if you're pulled over you can deny them the right to search your vehicle unless you give them probable cause.
They're like vampires. They can't come in unless you invite them in. (Or again; give them probable cause.)
-
Lol. The dude was a drug dealer. He opened his door up (I'm assuming at this point) thinking some dope man, or addict was at his door (more than likely). You play on that side of the world, you pay the price.
And just because they didn't identify themselves removes the fact they were officers? Yes that makes sense. I guess I'm a transgender then since I don't announce I'm a male to everyone I meet either. :o
Anyone who thinks they need to pull out a gun when there is a knock on the door is better off dialing the police instead of trying to be John Wayne.
First off, I find this hard to believe.
"Ransack"? As in...they flip over couches, bust windows, rip out drawers onto the floor, smash televisions and computers etc.? Yeah. I call total BS on that.
They can not legally bust into your house without a warrant.
OR do you mean they just come in and look around and search? Those are two totally different things, though doing both without a warrant is illegal.
"Knock and TALK" - Sounds more like they knock on your door and ask if they can come in. Just like if you're pulled over you can deny them the right to search your vehicle unless you give them probable cause.
They're like vampires. They can't come in unless you invite them in. (Or again; give them probable cause.)
Obviously you do not live in one of these areas in question. You are about as disconnected from real life as I imagine a living person could be. Regardless of what the guy was..... he ended up being murdered by poorly trained cops. I do not tolerate drug dealers but this guy was just answering his door. The trigger happy cops involved could have been at anyone of your homes.
Officers that beat on a door at 1:30 in the morn in an area like the one in this story and do not ID themselves, they are destined to be shot. You have no idea if the person in that home has been burglarized regularly, threatened, or anything else.
-
Lol. How did you find out so much about me?
I live in a trailer park in a small town. My neighbor is a crack head, across the street I'm pretty sure they make meth.
Hell I even mentioned (somewhere on this forum) about what happened two weeks ago (hell it might have been this thread) where the police came over and had to fire a shotgun at my neighbor because he was carrying a shotgun saying he was going to kill everyone. Would you like photos? An article? His name is Richard.
What else would you like to ASSume about me?
------
There is a reason they didn't ID themselves. Ignoring that fact doesn't make your argument valid.
If it's burglarized regularly, that's an even better reason to call the police, take your girlfriend (who was there as well if you even read the report), go into the safest room in your house with your pistol and you wait.
"Was just answering his door" - with a gun pointed out of it.
Have you ever even had a weapon pointed at you? Has your life ever been milliseconds away from ending based on the actions of another person? Was he going to shoot the cops? Probably not.
Should he answer the door at 1:30AM? Probably not.
Should he answer the door at 1:30AM with a gun? If he's an idiot.
----
EDIT: Give me just a minute. Gonna take some pictures to show you exactly how out of touch I am with reality.
-
My local police dept routinely knocks without announcing. The call it a 'knock and talk'. Basically they knock on the door and if the knob turns they force their way in and ransack the place. They do 80 of these a year along with 80 'garbage searches' and in return they get a nice grant that pays for one officer's salary and a sqaud car.
10 people will hear this today. By the end of the week it'll be 100,000. Within two weeks it'll be 1 million running around babbling it.
How can anyone dispute were descended from Apes?
-
Seems to me that if I lived in a "bad" area or had a history of being burglarized etc etc that the prudent thing to do would be to stay behind the closed and locked door. That means not opening it and not pointing a gun at whoever decided to knock on the door at 1:30 AM. Last I heard, knocking on the door, no matter the time, was not a deadly force situation in an of itself. Had they started to knock the door down or force it open that is something else.
-
Obviously you do not live in one of these areas in question.
The nicest trailer in the area to the right of mine.
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0087.jpg)
Where the supposed meth lab is. The man who was arrested got bailed out. His wife (who's trailer is to my left) won't let him live with her so he moved across the street.
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0088.jpg)
My trailer. It's not much, but I'll be damned if I'll let someone tell me it's no place to live. My fiancee and I have come up from nothing to get where we are and as long as we continue to strive and do our best, we'll get out of this place.
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0089.jpg)
The trailer where the police had to fire at my neighbor who wouldn't put the shotgun down and began pointing it at the officers.
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0090.jpg)
A view to the dead end
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0091.jpg)
My back yard.
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0092.jpg)
The back of my trailer
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0093.jpg)
The car I'm forced to drive because I can't find anyone who knows how to mold/bondo fenders.
(http://i750.photobucket.com/albums/xx147/MarineUS/SAM_0094.jpg)
Yes. I'm totally disconnected from reality. I live in the best suburbs of America and drive a fancy $90K sports car.
You know what's messed up? This is one of the better areas where I live. Hell I could show you photos of the areas where we built houses. The house was nice, but I wouldn't live in it. Not with knowing that every house on that street has a gang member in it. Apparently it's THEIR street and no one can walk it. You want to walk down 2nd Avenue? You better pay a toll...and that toll involves everything in your wallet.
Now. Why would anyone who lives in an area like that, open a door at 1:30 in the morning, with a gun and without calling the police?
--------
EDIT: Directions/locations of trailers are in relation to me looking FROM my steps, outwards.
-
Marine,
TBH the best part of your pictures was that you're driving a sensible car instead of living there but driving a $40,000 truck that makes you feel like a man.
Best part of the meth house - the guy (or his wife) is driving a truck that is worth more than the house. That's called being "car poor" and it's a great way to get trapped in bad conditions for life.
-
Marine,
TBH the best part of your pictures was that you're driving a sensible car instead of living there but driving a $40,000 truck that makes you feel like a man.
Best part of the meth house - the guy (or his wife) is driving a truck that is worth more than the house. That's called being "car poor" and it's a great way to get trapped in bad conditions for life.
Yeah. That car is on it's final leg. Needs new brakes, the o-rings are shot (I press the gas and it gives me the middle finger). The RPM goes up but the car accelerates like a turtle LOL. I've also got to check the fuel injector. The car likes to randomly shut off. Almost got us killed when we were crossing a four lane. :O
No A/C (I live in south Georgia >.<), no cruise control, "manual" windows :P (like a boss), windshield wipers smear the water more than clear it off, exhaust leak...the list goes on. I can't complain though. We bought the car for 500 bucks. I just wish I knew why the A/C won't work. I've tried everything.
Hell there's a guy on that place I mentioned where we built that house and he's driving a brand new charger with 24 inch rims. His house is worse than the ones you see in these pictures. It's pathetic. I'd rather live in his car than his house.
EDIT: Oh and the worst part of the car I drive (worse than no A/C and living in this humid place) is the head lights.......due to a bend in the frame they can't be adjusted. One points up, the other points off the the right. Turn the brights on and it's as if they're at almost a 90º angle outwards. Driving at night is pretty much like driving with the head lights off. If there isn't other cars going in the same direction (like on a highway) we can't go out at night. We won't be able to see.
-
What Eagl describes fits the bill of my hometown pretty well. High paying, blue collar jobs are very abundant.
So are people who spend way beyond their means, live in a trailer but own a truck, sports car, a boat, and whatever else they please. No savings or anything constructive for the future. Unforeseen costs wipe clean them out all the time, but no one really "gets" it.
-
What Eagl describes fits the bill of my hometown pretty well. High paying, blue collar jobs are very abundant.
So are people who spend way beyond their means, live in a trailer but own a truck, sports car, a boat, and whatever else they please. No savings or anything constructive for the future. Unforeseen costs wipe clean them out all the time, but no one really "gets" it.
Heck I'd beat a midget with a broken lawn chair to find me a job in this town right now. The problem is since I hurt my back with the whole Afghan thing, I can't stand for long periods of time or lift heavy objects anymore (until they find a way to fix me.....they say it's a "permanent, benign condition" ..... -_- ), and with me living in such a lowly populated area, finding a job like that is next to impossible.
-
Typical cop behavior. 99% testosterone, 1% brains, on a good day... I've been saying for years that anybody who has an ambition to go into police work should be automatically disqualified from candidacy. Sure, a small minority want to protect, serve, help, etc, but a vast majority are just overgrown bullies who want the power of the badge to legitimize their abusive tendencies.
If somebody tried to beat down my door at 1 in the morning without announcing themselves, I'd be reaching for my ar-15 - as any sane, well-armed adult probably would.
-
If somebody tried to beat down my door at 1 in the morning without announcing themselves, I'd be reaching for my ar-15 - as any sane, well-armed adult probably would.
Someone didn't read the report.
They KNOCKED on the door. Didn't even touch the handle.
I'd be reaching for my ar-15 - as any sane, well-armed adult probably would.
And you say THEY'RE 99% testosterone. Hypocrite.
Why don't you come knock on my door and let me point a gun in your face. Tell me how awesome that is. Tell me how reasonable that sounds.
You ever had UPS knock on your door? or FedEx? They don't say "UPS!" etc. They just knock. You gonna point a gun at them too?
-
Heck I'd beat a midget with a broken lawn chair to find me a job in this town right now. The problem is since I hurt my back with the whole Afghan thing, I can't stand for long periods of time or lift heavy objects anymore (until they find a way to fix me.....they say it's a "permanent, benign condition" ..... -_- ), and with me living in such a lowly populated area, finding a job like that is next to impossible.
They give you much disability for your back? I also may end up with "permanent benign" sort of thing, being missing one disc and the next one up herniated torn and badly degraded. I'm ok for short periods but I'm limited to about 30 minutes of any sort of work involving lifting, bending/twisting, etc. before I'm done for the day, and it takes about an hour of stretching in the morning before I can put on my socks/shoes without pain.
Time to find an in-demand skill and job market, and switch gears... Might need to do something temporary to get that breathing room. I know of people who sell everything and move cities and get a cheapo bare apartment, take bus to work, etc., so they can work at a call center at minimum wage, only because they can also go to school there fairly cheap and learn a more marketable skill. Lots of risk and very hard to do but with a disability your job options are sharply limited so you gotta have or develop a skill that is in demand somewhere.
My fallback is small computer service... It would suck but I think I could pay the bills and maybe even open my own little company if I found the right location. It isn't much and I sure wouldn't get rich doing it, but it's something I can do practically in my sleep either in my own business or working for someone else.
-
They give you much disability for your back? I also may end up with "permanent benign" sort of thing, being missing one disc and the next one up herniated torn and badly degraded. I'm ok for short periods but I'm limited to about 30 minutes of any sort of work involving lifting, bending/twisting, etc. before I'm done for the day, and it takes about an hour of stretching in the morning before I can put on my socks/shoes without pain.
They won't give me ANY disability. TriCare is refusing to help even though I was injured on active duty. I've got to talk to a guy at the VA next month.
That's exactly what I'm like. I'm good for a minute but once I hit about 45 minutes into it I HAVE to sit down and lean back. Grocery shopping kills me. I end up having to lean on the buggy to finish shopping with the lady. I've gained almost 40 freaking pounds because I can't PT. I'm turning into a bag nasty POS and it's ticking me off. I tried running and felt like I was going to die. Like someone had shot me in the back.
I take 1600mg (that's right 1600) of "Galise" (Some experimental drug that apparently causes big mental issues if you don't eat before you take it?? O_o ) a day. It causes Insomnia like a MFer
-
They won't give me ANY disability. TriCare is refusing to help even though I was injured on active duty. I've got to talk to a guy at the VA next month.
That's exactly what I'm like. I'm good for a minute but once I hit about 45 minutes into it I HAVE to sit down and lean back. Grocery shopping kills me. I end up having to lean on the buggy to finish shopping with the lady. I've gained almost 40 freaking pounds because I can't PT. I'm turning into a bag nasty POS and it's ticking me off. I tried running and felt like I was going to die. Like someone had shot me in the back.
I take 1600mg (that's right 1600) of "Galise" (Some experimental drug that apparently causes big mental issues if you don't eat before you take it?? O_o ) a day. It causes Insomnia like a MFer
A little motrin every morning and muscle relaxants is all that works for me. Skelaxin works if I take it all the time and has very minimal impact on my brain function. Flexeril is stronger but doesn't seem very effective sometimes. Soma is very effective but makes me a total retard, impaired memory function, etc. I can't take muscle relaxants and keep doing my job, so I take a little motrin in the morning and am very careful with my activities.
I found that an inversion table really helped get me over the hump when I got really bad while deployed. I paid about $130 at big-5 for a padded board mounted to a hinge with 3 angled settings, since tricare won't pay for this treatment. Twice a day I'd get on the thing and lay on it, feet attached and angled head-down. At first I could only tolerate the 15 deg setting, but over time I could go to the steeper setting, maybe around 45 deg. I haven't used the 60 deg setting since the 45 deg setting seemed to be fine. I'd stretch on it for up to 20 minutes at a time, then go sit down for a while to let the pissed off muscles relax a bit in a normal posiiton. I grew half an inch and the nerve impingement seemed to really decrease a lot, increasing my endurance and reducing the frequency of the occurrences where it was incapacitating.
Good luck working with the VA. Remember you can always write your congressman for help. If you have a documented injury that is keeping you from working, the rules say you should be getting some sort of disability pension and health care. If that doesn't happen, call your congressman, the news media, and lawyer up. It's only the entire rest of your life at stake, so why hold back?
-
Someone didn't read the report.
They KNOCKED on the door. Didn't even touch the handle.
And you say THEY'RE 99% testosterone. Hypocrite.
Why don't you come knock on my door and let me point a gun in your face. Tell me how awesome that is. Tell me how reasonable that sounds.
You ever had UPS knock on your door? or FedEx? They don't say "UPS!" etc. They just knock. You gonna point a gun at them too?
How do you believe the "witnesses" at the scene when cops will protect thier own.
The Sheriff's Office said at first that the deputies had announced themselves as law enforcement before or while knocking, but retracted that statement and called it a "minor detail" that the deputies "didn't announce and identify themselves,"
We may never know if he pointed the gun and the bullet stream looks like the door was closed or slightly open. In darkness they fired without knowing who was behind the door or how many innocents were in the line of fire.
That minor detail was Major in this case.
-
A little motrin every morning and muscle relaxants is all that works for me. Skelaxin works if I take it all the time and has very minimal impact on my brain function. Flexeril is stronger but doesn't seem very effective sometimes. Soma is very effective but makes me a total retard, impaired memory function, etc. I can't take muscle relaxants and keep doing my job, so I take a little motrin in the morning and am very careful with my activities.
I found that an inversion table really helped get me over the hump when I got really bad while deployed. I paid about $130 at big-5 for a padded board mounted to a hinge with 3 angled settings, since tricare won't pay for this treatment. Twice a day I'd get on the thing and lay on it, feet attached and angled head-down. At first I could only tolerate the 15 deg setting, but over time I could go to the steeper setting, maybe around 45 deg. I haven't used the 60 deg setting since the 45 deg setting seemed to be fine. I'd stretch on it for up to 20 minutes at a time, then go sit down for a while to let the pissed off muscles relax a bit in a normal posiiton. I grew half an inch and the nerve impingement seemed to really decrease a lot, increasing my endurance and reducing the frequency of the occurrences where it was incapacitating.
Good luck working with the VA. Remember you can always write your congressman for help. If you have a documented injury that is keeping you from working, the rules say you should be getting some sort of disability pension and health care. If that doesn't happen, call your congressman, the news media, and lawyer up. It's only the entire rest of your life at stake, so why hold back?
The muscle relaxants did a little and they thought about putting me on Skelaxin. What's an inversion table? I guess you lay on it and it puts you upside down?
And as far as documentation I have a copy of the medical records AND a letter from the DoD acknowledging my injury lol. :lol
-
The muscle relaxants did a little and they thought about putting me on Skelaxin. What's an inversion table? I guess you lay on it and it puts you upside down?
And as far as documentation I have a copy of the medical records AND a letter from the DoD acknowledging my injury lol. :lol
The inversion table is just an incline table but instead of being permanently angled like you see inclined bench press or inclined situp equipment in the gym, it is adjustable. The big-5 I went into had about 5 of them on display near the exercise equipment.
Something like this would work, but if possible try it out first or at least make sure it's both strong enough to support your weight, and has the right adjustments to fit you and get you to a reasonable incline angle. http://www.amazon.com/BODY-POWER-Power-Inversion-Table/dp/B002MTPK70
The leg bar length needs to be adjustable, the foot attachment points should be adjustable to account for different foot/ankle sizes, and when adjusted for your height your entire upper body needs to be supported by the padded upper bench. Butt needs to be up on the table part, not left hanging below it. I have a tall upper body so my head goes a bit off the top end of my table, which is not very comfortable, but I managed to jerry-rig something that works. But you will have to adjust the leg bar length to make it so you are balanced good on the table to make it easy to rotate the thing, otherwise you can get hurt with it flipping over one way or the other or being impossible to get back upright :) It should be very close to neutral on the balance once adjusted so it doesn't require much strength to rotate. When I balance it out that way for me, my head is just a bit too high on the bench. So if you can test-fit one first that would be best otherwise just don't spend too much on gimmicks. I spent an extra $20 on a heat/massage pad for mine, and I have never used that pad so it was a waste of money.
As for medication, my pain management doc said that skelaxin was the only one he would recommend for me for longer term use since it has low side effects. The stronger ones work faster but mess with the brain too much. There are a couple of ways to deal with back injuries... One is to try to "fix" it (fusion, disc replacement, etc), the other is to go pure pain management which involves everything from massage therapy to drugs to lifestyle changes to electrode inplants to alter pain response. Lots of options and I found the key is to not rush into major treatment options. A good pain mgt doc will start with the absolute minimum treatment possible and work up from there, giving it plenty of time to work. Yea that means longer time without relief but the aggressive treatments can really screw with you and make the rest of your life absolute and literal torture. I think he basically said that if I can walk, I don't need to be cut... Just his opinion but he had me try the inversion table and it worked better than shots or drugs, so...
This is probably enough thread hijack for one day :)
-
The inversion table is just an incline table but instead of being permanently angled like you see inclined bench press or inclined situp equipment in the gym, it is adjustable. The big-5 I went into had about 5 of them on display near the exercise equipment.
Something like this would work, but if possible try it out first or at least make sure it's both strong enough to support your weight, and has the right adjustments to fit you and get you to a reasonable incline angle. http://www.amazon.com/BODY-POWER-Power-Inversion-Table/dp/B002MTPK70
The leg bar length needs to be adjustable, the foot attachment points should be adjustable to account for different foot/ankle sizes, and when adjusted for your height your entire upper body needs to be supported by the padded upper bench. Butt needs to be up on the table part, not left hanging below it. I have a tall upper body so my head goes a bit off the top end of my table, which is not very comfortable, but I managed to jerry-rig something that works. But you will have to adjust the leg bar length to make it so you are balanced good on the table to make it easy to rotate the thing, otherwise you can get hurt with it flipping over one way or the other or being impossible to get back upright :) It should be very close to neutral on the balance once adjusted so it doesn't require much strength to rotate. When I balance it out that way for me, my head is just a bit too high on the bench. So if you can test-fit one first that would be best otherwise just don't spend too much on gimmicks. I spent an extra $20 on a heat/massage pad for mine, and I have never used that pad so it was a waste of money.
As for medication, my pain management doc said that skelaxin was the only one he would recommend for me for longer term use since it has low side effects. The stronger ones work faster but mess with the brain too much. There are a couple of ways to deal with back injuries... One is to try to "fix" it (fusion, disc replacement, etc), the other is to go pure pain management which involves everything from massage therapy to drugs to lifestyle changes to electrode inplants to alter pain response. Lots of options and I found the key is to not rush into major treatment options. A good pain mgt doc will start with the absolute minimum treatment possible and work up from there, giving it plenty of time to work. Yea that means longer time without relief but the aggressive treatments can really screw with you and make the rest of your life absolute and literal torture. I think he basically said that if I can walk, I don't need to be cut... Just his opinion but he had me try the inversion table and it worked better than shots or drugs, so...
This is probably enough thread hijack for one day :)
O_o Interesting. I'll have to take a look. Thanks for the tips!
-
Lol. How did you find out so much about me?
I live in a trailer park in a small town. My neighbor is a crack head, across the street I'm pretty sure they make meth.
Hell I even mentioned (somewhere on this forum) about what happened two weeks ago (hell it might have been this thread) where the police came over and had to fire a shotgun at my neighbor because he was carrying a shotgun saying he was going to kill everyone. Would you like photos? An article? His name is Richard.
What else would you like to ASSume about me?
------
There is a reason they didn't ID themselves. Ignoring that fact doesn't make your argument valid.
If it's burglarized regularly, that's an even better reason to call the police, take your girlfriend (who was there as well if you even read the report), go into the safest room in your house with your pistol and you wait.
"Was just answering his door" - with a gun pointed out of it.
Have you ever even had a weapon pointed at you? Has your life ever been milliseconds away from ending based on the actions of another person? Was he going to shoot the cops? Probably not.
Should he answer the door at 1:30AM? Probably not.
Should he answer the door at 1:30AM with a gun? If he's an idiot.
----
EDIT: Give me just a minute. Gonna take some pictures to show you exactly how out of touch I am with reality.
Ahh so your probably a soon to be victim.
You seem to like blaming the innocent citizen instead of the criminals who instigated the murder. The officers are no better than the turd that walked into the theater.
-
How do you believe the "witnesses" at the scene when cops will protect thier own.
The Sheriff's Office said at first that the deputies had announced themselves as law enforcement before or while knocking, but retracted that statement and called it a "minor detail" that the deputies "didn't announce and identify themselves,"
We may never know if he pointed the gun and the bullet stream looks like the door was closed or slightly open. In darkness they fired without knowing who was behind the door or how many innocents were in the line of fire.
That minor detail was Major in this case.
They simply did not care if they shot anyone... including women and children.
-
Ahh so your probably a soon to be victim.
You seem to like blaming the innocent citizen instead of the criminals who instigated the murder. The officers are no better than the turd that walked into the theater.
You've obviously been brainwashed. Trying to talk to you is like arguing with a child about what is better for them between vegetables and candy.
-
They simply did not care if they shot anyone... including women and children.
Dude you need to lay off the YouTube and pick up a book....better yet, go on a "ride along". Talk with your local law enforcement officers, stop being a shut in.
I know only one other person who thinks the exact same way as you. You know what's hilarious? He's a guy that gets drunk nearly every night and smokes weed almost non-stop.
I'm thinking that is what's wrong with you. You've done something, at some point in time that has completely destroyed your ability to have a rational thought.
-
Dude you need to lay off the YouTube and pick up a book....better yet, go on a "ride along". Talk with your local law enforcement officers, stop being a shut in.
I know only one other person who thinks the exact same way as you. You know what's hilarious? He's a guy that gets drunk nearly every night and smokes weed almost non-stop.
I'm thinking that is what's wrong with you. You've done something, at some point in time that has completely destroyed your ability to have a rational thought.
Stop the insults and stick to the topic. Insulting someone does nothing for your credibility.
-
Stop the insults and stick to the topic. Insulting someone does nothing for your credibility.
At this point I don't really care (there is no credibility given to anyone on the internet anyway). After the conversation in the other thread and then predicting I'm going to be a victim, he can take his brainwashed self and go somewhere else.
If he's never been on a ride along, he has no room to talk. This is where I'm seeing him lie saying he has and that they're all a bunch of crooks.
I'm just curious as to what he's done in his life that has strewed his thought process so much.
----
I've met a LOT of cops in my line of work. A lot of Marines get out of the Corps and become police officers and not a single one of them had a violent bone in their body. Heck I've got a friend who just graduated from the academy. He's what the girls would call a "teddy bear". Big guy with a big heart. Does Toys for Tots every year, donates blood, donates to the homeless, works in the soup kitchens.
And he has the audacity to say they're all crooked? That's like saying all military personnel are baby killers. I think he got stuck as a hippie in the 70's and never moved on.
-
Haven't read the other thread so I don't know what he said there and this thread is what my posting was based on. Seemed, while mildly provoked, an overkill of a response.
One last thing I'll touch on and then leave you fellas alone to your own devices:
There is credibility on the internet when you have a forum board like ours. Or any forum board for that matter. There are always certain individuals who contribute more, are more knowledgeable, will have more weight to their posts, ie credibility. If not then why put AH Trainer under certain peoples names or Aces High CM or whatever the case may be. It is to add more credibility to their post.
To let people know who are unfamiliar with this BBS, who the leaders or top contributers are.
-
Haven't read the other thread so I don't know what he said there and this thread is what my posting was based on. Seemed, while mildly provoked, an overkill of a response.
One last thing I'll touch on and then leave you fellas alone to your own devices:
There is credibility on the internet when you have a forum board like ours. Or any forum board for that matter. There are always certain individuals who contribute more, are more knowledgeable, will have more weight to their posts, ie credibility. If not then why put AH Trainer under certain peoples names or Aces High CM or whatever the case may be. It is to add more credibility to their post.
To let people know who are unfamiliar with this BBS, who the leaders or top contributers are.
Hehe. Guys like that help folks like me who stink at AH. :P
And overkill is underrated. :lol
-
Typical cop behavior. 99% testosterone, 1% brains, on a good day... I've been saying for years that anybody who has an ambition to go into police work should be automatically disqualified from candidacy. Sure, a small minority want to protect, serve, help, etc, but a vast majority are just overgrown bullies who want the power of the badge to legitimize their abusive tendencies.
If somebody tried to beat down my door at 1 in the morning without announcing themselves, I'd be reaching for my ar-15 - as any sane, well-armed adult probably would.
You lost credibility at " vast majority".
-
You ever had UPS knock on your door? or FedEx? They don't say "UPS!" etc. They just knock. You gonna point a gun at them too?
Neither UPS nor FedEx knocks on doors at 1:30 AM....
If someone wants to talk to me, dial my home or my cell. I'll answer, even at O-dark thirty...
But, should someone come pounding on my door at that hour, I will be taking my .44 from the nightstand drawer or my 870 tactical from my closet when I go to find out who this or these idiots are. I sure as hell will not be opening the door until I have identified who they are. If I don't recognize them and they don't identify themselves, I will dial 911. Seriously, who pounds on a door at that time of the morning? I have an L shaped house, which means I have multiple windows overlooking the front porch and door. I also have motion sensing halogens up high, aimed at the porch (the whole property is covered by these lights). So, anyone walking on my property will trigger enough lights to make them think they're on second base during a night game.
Anyway, opening the door with or without a firearm is just plain stupid... Stay inside. Turn on any outside lights. Do not turn on lights inside. If you're suspicious, call the police. But, never open the door when you don't know who or what is on the other side, especially at that hour of the night. You must assume those outside are bad guys until proven otherwise.
-
Dude you need to lay off the YouTube and pick up a book....better yet, go on a "ride along". Talk with your local law enforcement officers, stop being a shut in.
I know only one other person who thinks the exact same way as you. You know what's hilarious? He's a guy that gets drunk nearly every night and smokes weed almost non-stop.
I'm thinking that is what's wrong with you. You've done something, at some point in time that has completely destroyed your ability to have a rational thought.
Actually I simply laugh at gung ho folks like yourself who think that a badge means a person is right all the time. I laugh but hope you never are in a posistion to harm innocent folks.
For your information I have many friends in law enforcement. I work closely with the officers in our area. We actually have quarterly meetings regarding any security issues in the area.
-
Dude you need to lay off the YouTube and pick up a book....better yet, go on a "ride along". Talk with your local law enforcement officers, stop being a shut in.
I know only one other person who thinks the exact same way as you. You know what's hilarious? He's a guy that gets drunk nearly every night and smokes weed almost non-stop.
I'm thinking that is what's wrong with you. You've done something, at some point in time that has completely destroyed your ability to have a rational thought.
I dont smoke weed or get drunk every day. but I agree with shuffler. there's way too many cowboys out there with badges. I'll give you an example. a couple of months ago I stopped at the local 7-11 to buy a beer after work. it was around 2 pm and I noticed there was an officer at the door talking to some kids. the only parking space was right where they were so I proceeded slowly as some of the kids had their backs to me, the police officer noticed me and I see him turned towards me and put his hand on his weapon while he kept talking to the kids. what exactly did I do wrong there? was I being too careful for his taste? did he just see a middle age brown skin guy as a threat? I have no idea as I wasnt gonna ask, but all the way from where I stopped turned the engine off with only one hand while the other was on the steering while then proceeded slowly to get off the truck and walk with my hands in plain view, even as I was opening the door. not until i went past him and into the store that he removed the hand from his weapon.
all I thought up at that moment was that if I had been armed as it is my legal right as a law abiding citizen, i would have gotten shot right on the spot. and he would have been found justified.
I have some friends that are officers and I hear stories about what other officers do. and they do think some dont deserve to have a badge but on the other hand there's nothing they can do about it. the majority of officers are out there doing good in the community but it's the few who have a power complex and think everybody is out to get them and that is scary.
semp
-
This is a tragic accident.
However, like I say with all these protesters being shot in Egypt and Syria. And as I say about Americans shot by the police.
Threatening and or attempting to injure\kill armed officers\ soldiers... will only EVER have one ending. If you are stupid enough to do so, you suffer the consequences.
-
This is a tragic accident.
However, like I say with all these protesters being shot in Egypt and Syria. And as I say about Americans shot by the police.
Threatening and or attempting to injure\kill armed officers\ soldiers... will only EVER have one ending. If you are stupid enough to do so, you suffer the consequences.
I don't see how he intentionally did this. Conversely, I can barely see how he unintentionally did this. If I lived in a rough neighborhood and someone was banging on my door in the middle of the night I would probably arm myself before further investigation to find out who was banging on my door.
The cop saw a gun and reacted, probably before he thought about it consciously. Something similar happened here some time ago. A local business owner's son was in the business after hours, a neighboring business called the police because they lights were on at an unusual hour. The responding officer entered the business to investigate and thought the phone that the man was holding was a gun so he immediately shot him in the back several times.
-
Accidents happen but I can't help but be a bit disturbed by sheer number of people who seem to immediately adopt a 'police can do no wrong' mentality when things like this happen.
-
And the officers have the right to protect themselves if they feel threatened.
Would you NOT feel threatened if someone pointed a gun at you?
----
And what police officer isn't trained to ID themselves???? That's a 101 type thing there. Hell you can learn that from watching COPS...hell it doesn't even have to be COPS, you can learn it from Bones, CSI, NASH, hell even Walker Texas Ranger. Trying to blame it on poor training it like trying to pour purified water into the ocean and then saying the clouds are evaporating only your water due to poor chemical reactions.
I don't care who you are, where I'm at, what you do - if you point a weapon at me you WILL be dropped. If not, I'll die shooting.
Yes. Defend yourselves in your homes, but for the love of all that is holy; don't be a moron about it.
If you think you're gonna open your door at 1:30 AM, point a gun at someone and expect them to run off - you're living in a fantasy land.
He's lucky it was the Police. If it had been a thug they would have not only killed him, but the girlfriend he was supposedly watching movies with as well.
Trying to look like a badarse sure pays off.
EDIT: "Last resort" comment: When you're in the area of a potential murder suspect and someone points a gun at you - that IS your last resort.
Dude you don't know how ignorant this post is do you ? Ever think you might be talking to an actual cop ? Maybe the kind we don't have enough of ? The kind that is willing to call it a mistake ? You can't equate what you did in Afghanistan with law enforcement here in the U.S. Before you make any more mistakes think about who else might have the same kind of experiences you do .
-
1. Not at one point did I say anyone with a badge is correct. Putting words in my mouth won't make you correct.
2. Yes. Cops mess up, BUT I'd expect any officer in the country to shoot me if I pointed a gun at him.
3. What did we learn? Don't answer the door for a random person at 1:30AM and don't do it with a gun.
4. Widewig - I lol'd at the second base comment.
You can call it ignorant but the report said they were looking for a guy who tried to crush someone's skull with a cinder block and his bike was there. It's putting two and two together. "Potential killer owns this bike. Seems to be his only way to go so he shouldn't be far. Hmm...let's be cautious."
The reason I used my experience is because most of the people on here ragging the cops have never - not ever - had a loaded firearm pointed at them.
-
The reason I used my experience is because most of the people on here ragging the cops have never - not ever - had a loaded firearm pointed at them.
I have. Lets just say a guy pointed a rifle at me and the cop I was with pointed his pistol at him, with me stuck between them.
The cop talked the guy into putting down the rifle. If it was the USA, I most probably would be dead now, caught in the middle of a shoot out.
-
Lol. The dude was a drug dealer. He opened his door up (I'm assuming at this point) thinking some dope man, or addict was at his door (more than likely). You play on that side of the world, you pay the price.
And just because they didn't identify themselves removes the fact they were officers? Yes that makes sense. I guess I'm a transgender then since I don't announce I'm a male to everyone I meet either. :o
Anyone who thinks they need to pull out a gun when there is a knock on the door is better off dialing the police instead of trying to be John Wayne.
First off, I find this hard to believe.
"Ransack"? As in...they flip over couches, bust windows, rip out drawers onto the floor, smash televisions and computers etc.? Yeah. I call total BS on that.
They can not legally bust into your house without a warrant.
OR do you mean they just come in and look around and search? Those are two totally different things, though doing both without a warrant is illegal.
"Knock and TALK" - Sounds more like they knock on your door and ask if they can come in. Just like if you're pulled over you can deny them the right to search your vehicle unless you give them probable cause.
They're like vampires. They can't come in unless you invite them in. (Or again; give them probable cause.)
The only way I've witnessed a knock and talk being carried out is like this.
They knock, if the homeowner opens the door, they force their way in and say they were let in. There is no broken door because they knocked and let the homeowner open it.
Then they search the place and make a mess of everything, if they find contraband they pick one or two items and say that those items were in plain sight when the homeowner opened the door and those items become probable cause for the ransacking that happened before they found anything.
Smart people here in town will call the local newspaper when the police don't have a warrant and won't get off the front porch because the homeowner won't answer the door.
This wasn't easy for me to believe either until I saw it happen first hand. Even though there have been more times than I can count that police officers have violated my civil rights simply because they can get away with it.
-
The reason I used my experience is because most of the people on here ragging the cops have never - not ever - had a loaded firearm pointed at them.
I have more than once, all by police too. You'd be singing a different tune if you got boxed in by 3 squad cars for failure to signal and instead of walking up to your window to talk they draw their guns and scream at you to get out of the car with your hands up one at a time. The icing on the cake is after the stop is over, when you get to take the pile left on the roadside that was your car's interior and try and put it all back together after they've left to go 'protect and serve' other citizens.
In my experience, 99% of off duty cops are nice guys but about 90% of those on duty act like they're having a contest to see how fast they can fill up the jail.
I have a lot more respect for my county Sheriff, but he's been at war with the police dept since he got elected and goes to every city council meeting to complain about the police constantly filling up his jail past capacity with people who don't belong in cages.
-
An ex-girlfriends brother (who was a friend of mine) pointed an SKS at me and not so politely asked me stop dating his sister.
He succeeded in convincing me.
-
An ex-girlfriends brother (who was a friend of mine) pointed an SKS at me and not so politely asked me stop dating his sister.
He succeeded in convincing me.
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
And I don't know where in the hell you guys live but that is completely psychotic. No one down here would believe a lick of that...but I guess that's because you folks probably live in bigger towns.
Down here folks still wave when you drive by each other on the road, our police enforce the law, and we're bored out of our minds a lot but we wouldn't trade it for a big city if you dropped 30 million on our laps.
-
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
And I don't know where in the hell you guys live but that is completely psychotic. No one down here would believe a lick of that...but I guess that's because you folks probably live in bigger towns.
Down here folks still wave when you drive by each other on the road, our police enforce the law, and we're bored out of our minds a lot but we wouldn't trade it for a big city if you dropped 30 million on our laps.
I lived in NY for my first 34 years or so...the above incident happened when I was about 21. The ex-friend in question was not entirely "stable" truth be told and he collected assault rifles (not the best mix).
I remember when I was in middle school, we had 7 riots (5 to 30 students involved each incident) in one day. A friend of mine was stabbed in school when I was in 11th grade,
and the year after I graduated someone was shot and killed during a basketball game at my high school.
Now I live in a nice small town in Virginia, and say "hello" to people as you walk down the street instead of wondering if you will get jumped, offered drugs, prostitutes, mugged or shot.
MarineUS,
Below is a quick link of recent violent crime in my home town and immediate surrounding area. I grew up in Brentwood, the above friend was from Central Islip which is also listed:
http://www.newsday.com/long-island/crime/recent-violent-crimes-in-brentwood-and-c-islip-1.1806403?qr=1
Many of the violent crimes occurred extremely close to where my mother and sister lives now, a few only one or two blocks away.
-
That's why I like living down here. It's nice.
-
:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
And I don't know where in the hell you guys live but that is completely psychotic. No one down here would believe a lick of that...but I guess that's because you folks probably live in bigger towns.
Down here folks still wave when you drive by each other on the road, our police enforce the law, and we're bored out of our minds a lot but we wouldn't trade it for a big city if you dropped 30 million on our laps.
Same here MarineUS . I would not give it up for anything . I love living in the stick's .
-
My hand is on my .45 a lot. Probably more then the Policeman that so offended you. Its training, habit, and instinct. Jeez what a sniveling post. How in hell do you know what he would have done if he knew you were lawfully armed?
The ghetto I work in almost everyone above the age of 5yo could possibly have an unlawful gun. The criminals have more and better guns then we have and I could give a running snot if some citizen is offended by my hand being on my holstered pistol. Waaa-Waaaa-Waaaa!
Thanks tho for not telling us the "stories my cop friends tell me". You spared us that at least. :lol
I dont smoke weed or get drunk every day. but I agree with shuffler. there's way too many cowboys out there with badges. I'll give you an example. a couple of months ago I stopped at the local 7-11 to buy a beer after work. it was around 2 pm and I noticed there was an officer at the door talking to some kids. the only parking space was right where they were so I proceeded slowly as some of the kids had their backs to me, the police officer noticed me and I see him turned towards me and put his hand on his weapon while he kept talking to the kids. what exactly did I do wrong there? was I being too careful for his taste? did he just see a middle age brown skin guy as a threat? I have no idea as I wasnt gonna ask, but all the way from where I stopped turned the engine off with only one hand while the other was on the steering while then proceeded slowly to get off the truck and walk with my hands in plain view, even as I was opening the door. not until i went past him and into the store that he removed the hand from his weapon.
all I thought up at that moment was that if I had been armed as it is my legal right as a law abiding citizen, i would have gotten shot right on the spot. and he would have been found justified.
I have some friends that are officers and I hear stories about what other officers do. and they do think some dont deserve to have a badge but on the other hand there's nothing they can do about it. the majority of officers are out there doing good in the community but it's the few who have a power complex and think everybody is out to get them and that is scary.
semp
-
My hand is on my .45 a lot. Probably more then the Policeman that so offended you. Its training, habit, and instinct. Jeez what a sniveling post. How in hell do you know what he would have done if he knew you were lawfully armed?
The ghetto I work in almost everyone above the age of 5yo could possibly have an unlawful gun. The criminals have more and better guns then we have and I could give a running snot if some citizen is offended by my hand being on my holstered pistol. Waaa-Waaaa-Waaaa!
Thanks tho for not telling us the "stories my cop friends tell me". You spared us that at least. :lol
I don't live in the ghetto. I live in a middle class community. I am not sure about you but when I'm minding my own business and doing nothing illegal i don't appreciate feeling threaten by those hired to protect us. because that's the only time I felt harm was coming my way in a long time.
semp
-
I don't live in the ghetto. I live in a middle class community. I am not sure about you but when I'm minding my own business and doing nothing illegal i don't appreciate feeling threaten by those hired to protect us. because that's the only time I felt harm was coming my way in a long time.
semp
I agree with semp 100%.
I get offended when talking to a cop who won't take his hand off his holster.
I'll continue to be offended and offer zero cooperation of any kind if they can't show me the common courtesy of not being ready to shoot me.
-
I agree with Semp too .
-
I'll continue to be offended and offer zero cooperation of any kind if they can't show me the common courtesy of not being ready to shoot me.
Examine your own mind. Cause thats the only place the thought is. Most guys you'd have to tell them where their hand is cause they aint thinking about it. If they were ready to shoot you the gun would be out. You might even get somewheres by asking, "exuse me sir would you mind taking your hand off your gun it makes me nervous".
Your assuming what he's thinking cause youv been brainwashed into thinking it. Believe it or not the Police aren't your enemy.
-
Believe it or not the Police aren't your enemy.
You would think they are down here in MS . They play the redneck roll 100% . Glad I know most of them from shooting traps so I have no trouble .
-
Examine your own mind. Cause thats the only place the thought is. Most guys you'd have to tell them where their hand is cause they aint thinking about it. If they were ready to shoot you the gun would be out. You might even get somewheres by asking, "exuse me sir would you mind taking your hand off your gun it makes me nervous".
Your assuming what he's thinking cause youv been brainwashed into thinking it. Believe it or not the Police aren't your enemy.
So you claim. Now forgive me for going off of personal experience here. They're not always my enemy but they've certainly established a track record of acting like it over the years.
I shouldn't have to ask them to take their hand off of their gun in the first place. The founders never wanted a police state and the citizens should stop tolerating it instead of embracing it.
How would you feel towards the average LEO if the overwhelming majority of people who've wronged you did it while wearing a badge?
I think your mindset would be just like mine.
(http://rlv.zcache.com/bill_of_rights_void_poster-rf7c0e8e86c0244b9880129166246dedd_2vb4_400.jpg)
-
Lol? The dude said it right. A lot of the time the hand just rests there. I know when I have my sidearm holstered, I keep it there without even realizing it. I almost got tackled on post once because I was walking into the HQ with my hand on my holster. We're not allowed to put our hands in our pockets so (along with training to be ready to grab it when needed), I just kinda started doing that.
THAT was an awkward moment.
----
You feel threatened because you can SEE he has his hand on it? How do you think an officer feels at night and NOT being able to fully see what you may or may not have on you? I'd hate to be a cop. Everyone you see hates you because a few bad folks messed up your reputation (just like people ask me if I've ever thrown a puppy off a cliff...if I ever met that junky I'd shank him...), you know that there's a lot of folks who'd like to beat you to death if they had the chance.....you're in a place trying to help people who hate you because they get speeding/parking tickets etc.
I've seen countless folks get tickets and talk about how stupid the police are and how they all should die and are useless etc. You want to get mad at THEM for being a little cautious in a world like that?
Brainwashed. That is all. Simply brainwashed and incapable of using logic to see a point that is different than your own.
-----
Just like when Deputy Garland profiled my car because it LOOKED fast and told me I was doing a speed that my car literally could not do, I didn't freak out and be like "F*** the Police! Those stupid Pigs!"
Why? Because I know there are bad apples everywhere you go and in every job out there. There are bad Marines, Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, police officers, firefighters, EMT's, truck drivers, waiters, bartenders, computer tech's/engineers, etc.
You can not base your outlook on a group based on the actions of a few (you can say a lot of officers get stupid, but look at the AMOUNT of police officers in the US). If you do, then you're a closed minded individual who is a big part of the problem in the U.S.
-
Glad I know most of them from shooting traps so I have no trouble
Bingo! you "know them". How many others just dont like them cause they dont like authority figures giving them traffic tickets? Or cause they read a few headlines?
How would you feel towards the average LEO if the overwhelming majority of people who've wronged you did it while wearing a badge?
I think your mindset would be just like mine.
I think maybe you need to talk to someone, and maybe medication. Its sounds like your not only a "Copoholic" but also suffer from "Copaphobia". Are you certain its not the entire world out to get you? Its the newspapers you know. Of course the movies and gun culture play a role in Copoholicism. But the print press is so desperate, "they know their on the way out" anything "coppie" and negative gets splashed on the front pages. Whether true or not. Everyone has been in a situation with the Police that hasnt gone their way, "and of course its Not THEIR fault" :lol, the papers fly off the shelf with a "cop did this" headline on it. When was the last time you saw an "Office Exonerated" on a front page? Then the stupid movies and ridiculous TV shows further reinforce this sillyness with even more sillyness. The only one even close to being true was "The Wire". Oh and I watch "Longmire" too but thats just to get wood over Katee Sackhoff with my "back seat of the squad car on midnights" fantasy.
I shouldn't have to ask them to take their hand off of their gun in the first place. The founders never wanted a police state and the citizens should stop tolerating it instead of embracing it.
Dude Ive been at this 28 years, AND, 4 years in USAF. 18 mos of them in Turkey under Martial Law where the Police and Military had NO constraints. So you couldnt possibly believe how silly that stuff sounds to me. Over there they would shoot you simply for running from them. At a road check they would have a tank sitting there swiveling the turret around at you. :lol You have no idea what a GD Police State is. Being in America you only know what living in a "Criminal State" is like. Vets like this Marine probably know what Im talking about. Theres nothing like a few years in uniform, in a craphole, to change your perspective on America.
Flench buddie. I couldnt imagine anyone playing the "redneck role" in MS.
Ive lost two personal friends killed with their own guns. Two guys I knew and worked with, one of the nights I was there right after it happened. Ive survived two serious attempts at disarment, and dont even talk about the shooting incidents Ive had. When Im around people, or even when Im not, the hand usually finds itself retaining my .45 . When a citizen walks by and hears my "good morning sir" they look befuddled, or at least more so then usual. That happens when the person doesnt fit the profile theyv been brainwashed with. Sort of like the racist who knows of one good person of every race they dont like.
But in mindlessly disliking complete strangers just for their jobs or the uniform they wear means you have become the very person you say you despise.
-
Bingo! you "know them". How many others just dont like them cause they dont like authority figures giving them traffic tickets? Or cause they read a few headlines?
I think maybe you need to talk to someone, and maybe medication. Its sounds like your not only a "Copoholic" but also suffer from "Copaphobia". Are you certain its not the entire world out to get you? Its the newspapers you know. Of course the movies and gun culture play a role in Copoholicism. But the print press is so desperate, "they know their on the way out" anything "coppie" and negative gets splashed on the front pages. Whether true or not. Everyone has been in a situation with the Police that hasnt gone their way, "and of course its Not THEIR fault" :lol, the papers fly off the shelf with a "cop did this" headline on it. When was the last time you saw an "Office Exonerated" on a front page? Then the stupid movies and ridiculous TV shows further reinforce this sillyness with even more sillyness. The only one even close to being true was "The Wire". Oh and I watch "Longmire" too but thats just to get wood over Katee Sackhoff with my "back seat of the squad car on midnights" fantasy.
Dude Ive been at this 28 years, AND, 4 years in USAF. 18 mos of them in Turkey under Martial Law where the Police and Military had NO constraints. So you couldnt possibly believe how silly that stuff sounds to me. Over there they would shoot you simply for running from them. At a road check they would have a tank sitting there swiveling the turret around at you. :lol You have no idea what a GD Police State is. Being in America you only know what living in a "Criminal State" is like. Vets like this Marine probably know what Im talking about. Theres nothing like a few years in uniform, in a craphole, to change your perspective on America.
Flench buddie. I couldnt imagine anyone playing the "redneck role" in MS.
Ive lost two personal friends killed with their own guns. Two guys I knew and worked with, one of the nights I was there right after it happened. Ive survived two serious attempts at disarment, and dont even talk about the shooting incidents Ive had. When Im around people, or even when Im not, the hand usually finds itself retaining my .45 . When a citizen walks by and hears my "good morning sir" they look befuddled, or at least more so then usual. That happens when the person doesnt fit the profile theyv been brainwashed with. Sort of like the racist who knows of one good person of every race they dont like.
But in mindlessly disliking complete strangers just for their jobs or the uniform they wear means you have become the very person you say you despise.
I should be the first to spew "cop hate" bet I been arrested more then anyone on these boards...probably all combined.....
I don't know what happened at that house.......but I do know an innocent man was killed and no one is gonna get into trouble for it, and that itself is wrong....
but I have to say I have met far more good cops than bad.
when I was about 10 one of the times I was arrested.... the cop was a very awesome person, he was actually very concerned that such a young person was being arrested, instead of bringing me right to the station, he brought me to a sub shop and got me food, he could tell I haven't eaten in days..... his small act of kindness always stuck with me.....
I know there are bad cops.....there are bad people in all walks of life, having a badge does not automatically make someone good or bad.....
I :salute you for putting yourself in harms way to protect and serve.
:salute :salute
-
Believe it or not, I've met a few officers who seem to see the world your way too.
http://youtu.be/kJw8tWFPpBs?t=19s
-
Bingo! you "know them". How many others just dont like them cause they dont like authority figures giving them traffic tickets? Or cause they read a few headlines?
I think maybe you need to talk to someone, and maybe medication. Its sounds like your not only a "Copoholic" but also suffer from "Copaphobia". Are you certain its not the entire world out to get you? Its the newspapers you know. Of course the movies and gun culture play a role in Copoholicism. But the print press is so desperate, "they know their on the way out" anything "coppie" and negative gets splashed on the front pages. Whether true or not. Everyone has been in a situation with the Police that hasnt gone their way, "and of course its Not THEIR fault" :lol, the papers fly off the shelf with a "cop did this" headline on it. When was the last time you saw an "Office Exonerated" on a front page? Then the stupid movies and ridiculous TV shows further reinforce this sillyness with even more sillyness. The only one even close to being true was "The Wire". Oh and I watch "Longmire" too but thats just to get wood over Katee Sackhoff with my "back seat of the squad car on midnights" fantasy.
Dude Ive been at this 28 years, AND, 4 years in USAF. 18 mos of them in Turkey under Martial Law where the Police and Military had NO constraints. So you couldnt possibly believe how silly that stuff sounds to me. Over there they would shoot you simply for running from them. At a road check they would have a tank sitting there swiveling the turret around at you. :lol You have no idea what a GD Police State is. Being in America you only know what living in a "Criminal State" is like. Vets like this Marine probably know what Im talking about. Theres nothing like a few years in uniform, in a craphole, to change your perspective on America.
Flench buddie. I couldnt imagine anyone playing the "redneck role" in MS.
Ive lost two personal friends killed with their own guns. Two guys I knew and worked with, one of the nights I was there right after it happened. Ive survived two serious attempts at disarment, and dont even talk about the shooting incidents Ive had. When Im around people, or even when Im not, the hand usually finds itself retaining my .45 . When a citizen walks by and hears my "good morning sir" they look befuddled, or at least more so then usual. That happens when the person doesnt fit the profile theyv been brainwashed with. Sort of like the racist who knows of one good person of every race they dont like.
But in mindlessly disliking complete strangers just for their jobs or the uniform they wear means you have become the very person you say you despise.
Bingo.
And just for laughs.
(http://i47.tinypic.com/1z4y2q8.jpg)
-
Going to make this a separate reply since it is kinda off topic.
I saw this today
(http://i50.tinypic.com/2najkvc.jpg)
The crazy thing is...it's true. I didn't know this until today. Pretty neat.
-
Yeah the swiss are more avid shooters than Americans in my opinion. They just tend to shoot only their gov't issued rifles.
Americans don't get a gun issued to them though so we have a lot more variety which helps encourage us to collect firearms.
-
Going to make this a separate reply since it is kinda off topic.
I saw this today
(http://i50.tinypic.com/2najkvc.jpg)
The crazy thing is...it's true. I didn't know this until today. Pretty neat.
of course ignore the posting on the other thread you saw about the Switzerland guy talking about this misinformation.
semp
-
of course ignore the posting on the other thread you saw about the Switzerland guy talking about this misinformation.
semp
I didn't see it. I do so apologize your almighty sir.
Yessuh bawss. I'z ah sorreh bawss.
I've got a buddy from there, I'll ask him when he gets on.
-------------
On an unrelated note! (To the above post anyways)
(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/576113_10150956723861884_23028831_n.jpg)
-
I didn't see it. I do so apologize your almighty sir.
Yessuh bawss. I'z ah sorreh bawss.
I've got a buddy from there, I'll ask him when he gets on.
-------------
On an unrelated note! (To the above post anyways)
(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/576113_10150956723861884_23028831_n.jpg)
ok keep telling yourself, my hand is tired, so I must rest it on my gun. but that is not a threat as I wouldnt think anybody else looking at me and putting his hand on his gun a threat. I just gonna walk over and ask if he wants to have some tea with me.
semp
-
ok keep telling yourself, my hand is tired, so I must rest it on my gun. but that is not a threat as I wouldnt think anybody else looking at me and putting his hand on his gun a threat. I just gonna walk over and ask if he wants to have some tea with me.
semp
Well, since you've displayed quite the case of paranoia, it might have been good for you to ask him to sit down for some tea. :D
-
Somebody had to do it...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSvD5SM_uI4
-
This is pretty much spot on for my experiences, minus the dashcam so go ahead and make a few assumptions.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gXnOqSZhug
-
This is pretty much spot on for my experiences, minus the dashcam so go ahead and make a few assumptions.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gXnOqSZhug
he should have his badge and gun taken immediately from him. :O
-
he should have his badge and gun taken immediately from him. :O
If that were the case we'd have a shortage of patrolmen.
I've noticed though my traffic stops that young cops tend to act this way but older ones tend not to.
Highway patrolmen tend not to as well and seem generally more professional as well as friendly. That's why I voted yes to issue them assault rifles for their cars but joined a protest when one of the local police depts began carrying more than just tasers, pepperspray and clubs.
The dept I protested had me biased though because a few years before I was going to buy a motorcycle from a friend. The bike was parked in a public ramp for 9 months and after I made my offer the owner noticed someone had stolen it at some point since he'd last parked it 9 months beforehand.
These cops (who are trusted to carry guns now) drug me down to the station and did the whole 'good cop / bad cop' thing and asked me the same 2 or 3 questions over and over for about 3 hours until I ran out of patience, asked if I was under arrest, told them they were stupid, and walked out.
Now believe it or not this is only the 2nd worst police dept where I live. Hands down the worst are the federal cops at the V.A. I have nothing but disrespect for those pTARDS.
-
This is pretty much spot on for my experiences, minus the dashcam so go ahead and make a few assumptions.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gXnOqSZhug
LOL, this is about the most fake bit of video Ive ever seen. First off we cant adjust the video cams on the cars. 2nd there is no time or date stamp on it. 3rd it couldnt possibly more then 15 seconds from the time the officer first stated typing the guys DL into the system, for a DL check, and the time he left the squad car. You could be looking at 3 different data bases and it takes far, far longer then that. Even if all he did was run the DL# it would easily take 1 to 2 mins just for the "DL clear" mssg.
And why stop there? Why not run his name on LEADS/NCIC for warrants too? Why not run his background after he admitted to arrests? It looks to me like a training video where the guys are just horsing around. Either that or its just staged. By who knows who? and probably with their own video cam.
This is what an actual Police cam footage looks like. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAIRyX_9mCs&feature=related Heres what Hollywood looks like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVV5XoXjJvo&feature=related
Yeah, its a prank. Heres two different home videos these guys did, apparently they have time on their hands down there. Heres the original full cut of their "Indie" movie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7Kw9-vTJYs Heres their second opus. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QA9HbtbBqwY
***** This video is not fake it was a "prank" done by police officers from St. Marys West Virginia. Yes it's a funny prank but we need to know why these officers were in uniform and were they on the clock getting paid? Why were they using police cars paid for by the taxpayers? Why were they turning on their overhead emergency lights when there's no real emergency? Were they punished by their department?
I received an email from a viewer and I was told the police officers in the video are officer Nathan Boron and officer Sal Travaglio of St. Marys city police department in West Virginia.
Update: 09 September 2011
The cats out of the bag! The St. Marys City Council held a special meeting yesterday September 08, 2011 to discuss possible disciplinary action against Officers Sal Travaglio and Nathan Boron.
After 15 minutes behind closed doors the council said that no action was taken and that the matter was still under investigation.
The video is a fugazzi. Made by two coppers in Mayberry with nothing else to do.
Now if I can figure out this caper in 5 mins on the Internet why cant any of you knuckleheads? Its like I said. You'v been brainwashed into hating the Police even more then the criminals. All anyone has to do is put the minnow in front of you to get you to bite. Like Lemmings following each other over the cliff.
-
Wrong Rich.
I first saw the same video on 'mainstream' news.
It also essentially mirrors actual real life experiences I've had.
-
Wrong Rich.
I first saw the same video on 'mainstream' news.
It also essentially mirrors actual real life experiences I've had.
What news? What were the officers names? When? I just typed their names, where they work, and a press release about their videos. What the heck do you think are the chances of two separate videos of this type stopping the exact same "Ford" SUV? Video shot out of the exact same type of squad car? Copper wearing the exact same uniform ?
I guess Im the only one here never treated like this by the Police, or, the only Officer who never treated a citizen like this prank. I feel awfully lonely. Like the only Lemming not jumping.
Remember. Just jump to frame 2:30 :rofl
-
As if the mainstream news never edits (manipulates) video, never ever exaggerated or misrepresents things. :rolleyes:
-
Good point about mainstream news media. Sorry for reposting what someone calling themself a journalist shouldn't have published.
My opinions remain the same as well as my first hand experiences. Rich, we might be able to use you on the force here. The town in general doesn't like the police because of their on duty behavior and even the Sheriff feels the same way.
Does this one look staged to you?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lkZSKI-kmA
Being the fact that it's youtube and I've been burned by ratings driven professionals already I'm not going to speculate.
-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVV5XoXjJvo&feature=related
That first clip in there was crazy.
-
Ok, everyone who has taken a pot shot or a carefully aimed shot at a police officer say aye.
ok now everyone who's had a cop be a jerk to them say aye.
-
Good point about mainstream news media. Sorry for reposting what someone calling themself a journalist shouldn't have published.
My opinions remain the same as well as my first hand experiences. Rich, we might be able to use you on the force here. The town in general doesn't like the police because of their on duty behavior and even the Sheriff feels the same way.
Does this one look staged to you?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lkZSKI-kmA
Being the fact that it's youtube and I've been burned by ratings driven professionals already I'm not going to speculate.
that vid is messed up also.....
What news? What were the officers names? When? I just typed their names, where they work, and a press release about their videos. What the heck do you think are the chances of two separate videos of this type stopping the exact same "Ford" SUV? Video shot out of the exact same type of squad car? Copper wearing the exact same uniform ?
I guess Im the only one here never treated like this by the Police, or, the only Officer who never treated a citizen like this prank. I feel awfully lonely. Like the only Lemming not jumping.
Remember. Just jump to frame 2:30 :rofl
you cant deny that bad cops exist :aok
-
I'm still watching that one video...I sure do hear my state an awful lot. Hell it's the first one. :lol
-
I'm still watching that one video...I sure do hear my state an awful lot. Hell it's the first one. :lol
boy i can smell the bs all the way to the other thread where you are questioning me for saying the only time I have felt in danger in my city was when I police officer looked at me and put his hand oh his gun. and yes it was also the first time for me too lol. ok not really laughing as I really thought I was gonna get shot if I showed the slightest wrong move.
semp
-
Ok, everyone who has taken a pot shot or a carefully aimed shot at a police officer say aye.
ok now everyone who's had a cop be a jerk to them say aye.
How about another one.
Raise your hand if you've been tarred with a brush for the actions, alleged or real of others. Aye.
Raise your hand if you've been shot at by a member of the general public. Aye
Raise Your hand if you've been threatened by a member of the public, had your wife threatened, your kids threatened because of your job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been stabbed by a member of the public. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been spit upon by a member of the public. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been hit by a car driven by a member of the public while doing your job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been sued because you responded to a call to protect an infant. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been told that you are a leech on society because you are doing a job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've suffered discrimination because of what you do for a living.
Raise your hand if you've been assaulted by the person you just saved from being beaten. Aye
Raise your hand because you had to defend against fantasy allegations of misconduct by a member of the public known to be a mental patient (shooting up an entire can of columbian gold purchased in a circle k store). Aye
And there are more but you go right ahead and tell us how you have been so fricking abused there Rob and semp. I love the alligator tears you shed about how tough you have had it.
-
How about another one.
Raise your hand if you've been tarred with a brush for the actions, alleged or real of others. Aye.
Raise your hand if you've been shot at by a member of the general public. Aye
Raise Your hand if you've been threatened by a member of the public, had your wife threatened, your kids threatened because of your job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been stabbed by a member of the public. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been spit upon by a member of the public. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been hit by a car driven by a member of the public while doing your job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been sued because you responded to a call to protect an infant. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been told that you are a leech on society because you are doing a job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've suffered discrimination because of what you do for a living.
Raise your hand if you've been assaulted by the person you just saved from being beaten. Aye
Raise your hand because you had to defend against fantasy allegations of misconduct by a member of the public known to be a mental patient (shooting up an entire can of columbian gold purchased in a circle k store). Aye
And there are more but you go right ahead and tell us how you have been so fricking abused there Rob and semp. I love the alligator tears you shed about how tough you have had it.
being a cop is definitely a thankless job,well I thank ya :salute
you should not take anything that has been done in that list and more..to heart, it was not YOU they were doing it to, but your badge, does not make it right, at least you should know it was not because of You personally.
-
Everybody makes mistakes from time to time. Just own up to it.
(http://i1140.photobucket.com/albums/n573/DoctorTennant/SWATwrongdoor.gif)
-
How about another one.
Raise your hand if you've been tarred with a brush for the actions, alleged or real of others. Aye.
Raise your hand if you've been shot at by a member of the general public. Aye
Raise Your hand if you've been threatened by a member of the public, had your wife threatened, your kids threatened because of your job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been stabbed by a member of the public. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been spit upon by a member of the public. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been hit by a car driven by a member of the public while doing your job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been sued because you responded to a call to protect an infant. Aye
Raise your hand if you've been told that you are a leech on society because you are doing a job. Aye
Raise your hand if you've suffered discrimination because of what you do for a living.
Raise your hand if you've been assaulted by the person you just saved from being beaten. Aye
Raise your hand because you had to defend against fantasy allegations of misconduct by a member of the public known to be a mental patient (shooting up an entire can of columbian gold purchased in a circle k store). Aye
And there are more but you go right ahead and tell us how you have been so fricking abused there Rob and semp. I love the alligator tears you shed about how tough you have had it.
raise your hand those who think it's okay to feel threatened by those hired to protect us. I should not have to fear both criminals and cops.
semp
-
raise your hand those who think it's okay to feel threatened by those hired to protect us. I should not have to fear both criminals and cops.
semp
How you feel is your responsibility and no one elses. No one can make you feel, that is always your choice.
-
I was in law enforcement for several years.I was involved with a similar situation.Nobody died thankfully,but the wrong person was wired up after putting up a heck of a fight!Wrong address,law suit people losing their jobs.A honest mistake was made and that is really too bad.That being said,if your at the wrong address and a guy has a gun in your face,tragically he will be shot.I can honestly say,I'm glad I got out of law enforcement when I did.In most of the public's eyes a cop is a bad guy,and that shouldn't be!
IronDog
-
boy i can smell the bs all the way to the other thread where you are questioning me for saying the only time I have felt in danger in my city was when I police officer looked at me and put his hand oh his gun. and yes it was also the first time for me too lol. ok not really laughing as I really thought I was gonna get shot if I showed the slightest wrong move.
semp
What bs? That I watched the entire video? Would you like my fiancee (who watched it with me after she realized I was watching the same video for 30 minutes) to speak on my behalf? I can even have her make a video and upload it for you OR I can record me watching it AGAIN (it was that good) for you.
OR are you talking about me saying where I live is safe? Are you f**king retarded? I've about had it with your blind @.$.$ assumptions. I said my STATE was mentioned a lot. My STATE, not my TOWN. Jesus H. Christ. You are one blind, closed minded piece of work. Do your children and neighbors know how brainwashed you are?
You live in a world of garbald fantasy where everyone is having sex in public and the cops want to kill everyone...oh wait, they only want to kill you. For the love of all that is holy - Go the f*** outside, get some fresh air, lay off the acid and coke (that $#!t makes you paranoid man) and see the real world. Ya know...that place with the REAL sunshine that gives off heat? Not that bright thing in the AH sky that shines through your clipboard.... *facepalm*
-
why the personal insults? do you really have to resort to them, does it make your point more valid? or do you just try to intimidate others into seeing your point of view. that's probably why you have the need to walk around with your hand on your gun. and guess what walking around with your hand on your gun is uncomfortable as heck after a few minutes unless you wear a low holster, so you must be a cowboy also.
semp
-
Pointing a gun straight at someone's face a you open the door is as smart as banging on a door at 0130 without identifying yourself. :uhoh For all I know, maybe the cops lured to cover their butts, they might have tried to force their way in when the poor bastard opened the door.
Dang Florida man, screewed up stuff happens there.
They both screwed up...but he's dead & they aren't.... :headscratch:
-
why the personal insults? do you really have to resort to them, does it make your point more valid? or do you just try to intimidate others into seeing your point of view. that's probably why you have the need to walk around with your hand on your gun. and guess what walking around with your hand on your gun is uncomfortable as heck after a few minutes unless you wear a low holster, so you must be a cowboy also.
semp
No. I did it because you're thick. You've got not just me, but MULTIPLE people telling you something, yet you defy it. You are the ONLY one defending yourself right now.
Lol yes, because my hand resting on my weapon intimidates people from here. Roflmfao. Is everyone where you're from afraid of guns? If we see someone down here doing what I do, like I said before; we shoot the $#!t and talk to each other.
If I want to INTIMIDATE someone, I'll unhook it and remove it from it's holster. :rolleyes:
Mother of Christ. You need a reality check ASAP.
-
Its not that difficult to tell whether a leo is resting a hand on his weapon to maintain control of it or just being a cowboy. It sounds like semp ran across one of the latter.
shamus
-
I'm on semp's side of this arguement.
Now the root of this issue/problem is neither police or civilians.
I think if we really get to the point we'll have to talk about the draconian penal system of these here United States. No civilization in the history of the world has locked up as much of it's population as we have. Currently over 1% of all the adults in America are either in prison or on parole.
No other nation has ever even come close to what we do here. I don't think it works unless the the intended result for everyone involved is misery. That goes for both police and civilians.
-
I'm on semp's side of this arguement.
Now the root of this issue/problem is neither police or civilians.
I think if we really get to the point we'll have to talk about the draconian penal system of these here United States. No civilization in the history of the world has locked up as much of it's population as we have. Currently over 1% of all the adults in America are either in prison or on parole.
No other nation has ever even come close to what we do here. I don't think it works unless the the intended result for everyone involved is misery. That goes for both police and civilians.
The problem is the fact that if they get 20 years it means a few months and they are out. Twenty years should be 20 years. The turds will thin out then.
-
The problem is the fact that if they get 20 years it means a few months and they are out. Twenty years should be 20 years. The turds will thin out then.
You can get 20 years for selling weed.
-
You can get 20 years for selling weed.
Therein lies the problem...... everyone wants what they do to have lesser charges or time frame.
That is why we are stuck with so many in prison.
-
Therein lies the problem...... everyone wants what they do to have lesser charges or time frame.
That is why we are stuck with so many in prison.
So the reason we have so many people in prison is because all the prisoners want lighter sentences?
I have a buddy that used to do taxidermy. He did 3 years in prison and spent another 7 on parole for selling a stuffed duck to undercover agents. I'm sure he would have liked a lighter sentence.
In college I was facing up to 10 years for possession of 4 ounces of pot and failure to affix a marijuana tax stamp.
Yet some people demand we hand out 20 years like it's deciding what to have for lunch.
-
So the reason we have so many people in prison is because all the prisoners want lighter sentences?
I have a buddy that used to do taxidermy. He did 3 years in prison and spent another 7 on parole for selling a stuffed duck to undercover agents. I'm sure he would have liked a lighter sentence.
You miss the point. If they know that will get a certain amount of time with no doubt... they may actually think before committing that crime. If not then they will be off our streets for a set amount of time.
-
You miss the point. If they know that will get a certain amount of time with no doubt... they may actually think before committing that crime. If not then they will be off our streets for a set amount of time.
I can't miss the point if you don't make one.
-
I can't miss the point if you don't make one.
Ahh you don't understand.
-
I guess we don't understand each other here.
-
Ahh you don't understand.
.....there are to many judgmental laws....if I am harming no one...like "pot crimes"....its my choice NO one has the right to tell us what we can do with our bodies...They DO NOT have the right....but might makes right :rolleyes:
-
.....there are to many judgmental laws....if I am harming no one...like "pot crimes"....its my choice NO one has the right to tell us what we can do with our bodies...They DO NOT have the right....but might makes right :rolleyes:
I remember back at the university one of my professors was explaining how drugs came to be illegal. And when congress was passing their first drug ban which was opium, the guys writing the bill believed that there was a good chance it would be struck down for being unconstitutional.
After it passed it opened the floodgates.
I also believe that every drug that's been made illegal with the exception of extacy and psychodelics has been passed out of racism.
Psychodelics were banned under Nixon after J. Edgar Hoover pointed out that a lot of his 'enemies' who were protesting (Nixon kept an actual list of enemies) liked to drop acid.
Extacy was made popular by marriage counselors in Texas before making its way into clubs. It was banned for two reasons.
The first is because the recipe was public domain because we got it through the spoils of war. The 2nd reason is because thanks to congress, it's not ok to take a drug to feel a different way if you already feel fine. The DEA's scientist that did the study that led to extacy's ban is no longer allowed to publish in any scientific journals because he intentionally used methamphetamine instead of extacy in his extacy study.
Let us not forget that a huge reason drug laws have remained draconian is the simple fact that a lot of companies are making a lot of money from the war on drugs. A huge part of our bureaucracy is dependent on the war on drugs to justify both its existence, as well as the astronomical amount of money that funds their budget.
Let's throw in the prison industrial complex just to be fair and also point out the insane growth of for-profit private prisons.
It's easy to look past freedom when we have all these other reasons to lock people in a cage for decades - life.
-
I remember back at the university one of my professors was explaining how drugs came to be illegal. And when congress was passing their first drug ban which was opium, the guys writing the bill believed that there was a good chance it would be struck down for being unconstitutional.
After it passed it opened the floodgates.
I also believe that every drug that's been made illegal with the exception of extacy and psychodelics has been passed out of racism.
Psychodelics were banned under Nixon after J. Edgar Hoover pointed out that a lot of his 'enemies' who were protesting (Nixon kept an actual list of enemies) liked to drop acid.
Extacy was made popular by marriage counselors in Texas before making its way into clubs. It was banned for two reasons.
The first is because the recipe was public domain because we got it through the spoils of war. The 2nd reason is because thanks to congress, it's not ok to take a drug to feel a different way if you already feel fine. The DEA's scientist that did the study that led to extacy's ban is no longer allowed to publish in any scientific journals because he intentionally used methamphetamine instead of extacy in his extacy study.
Let us not forget that a huge reason drug laws have remained draconian is the simple fact that a lot of companies are making a lot of money from the war on drugs. A huge part of our bureaucracy is dependent on the war on drugs to justify both its existence, as well as the astronomical amount of money that funds their budget.
Let's throw in the prison industrial complex just to be fair and also point out the insane growth of for-profit private prisons.
It's easy to look past freedom when we have all these other reasons to lock people in a cage for decades - life.
nice write up :aok
sickening :mad:
remember "reefer madness" :rofl
-
.....there are to many judgmental laws....if I am harming no one...like "pot crimes"....its my choice NO one has the right to tell us what we can do with our bodies...They DO NOT have the right....but might makes right :rolleyes:
This is not about pot. That was just brought up by rob.
It is part of the problem though. Folks want lesser time for things they may do that is currently against the law.
The prisons will fill more because we have weakened our society. As a group most want a better life but as individuals we want to cater to ourselves. Business as usual.
Look at it this way. Everyone complains about the government but they vote the same idiots in time and again. As a group we have issues with the way things are but, for the most part, folks think their guy is doing a great job.
-
Ive always thought that they banned pot because they cant tax it.. is this true?
-
nice write up :aok
sickening :mad:
remember "reefer madness" :rofl
lol reefer madness....... oh God save me from the talking hotdog....................... ......................
-
Ive always thought that they banned pot because they cant tax it.. is this true?
no
This is not about pot. That was just brought up by rob.
It is part of the problem though. Folks want lesser time for things they may do that is currently against the law.
The prisons will fill more because we have weakened our society. As a group most want a better life but as individuals we want to cater to ourselves. Business as usual.
Look at it this way. Everyone complains about the government but they vote the same idiots in time and again. As a group we have issues with the way things are but, for the most part, folks think their guy is doing a great job.
pot is just one of the many issues....I agree with what you wrote...what sux is all the ones that are there for voting for...are idiots.
what I find messed up is you have to be a millionaire to become president....
powerful words that everyone should study......
When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security
lol reefer madness....... oh God save me from the talking hotdog....................... ......................
:rofl :rofl
-
Do you know why INK?
-
Do you know why INK?
well there are a couple different "theories" I am not sure which one is correct....
hemp used to be used for manufacturing all kids of stuff....a textile giant wanted to do away with hemp, so started a campaign to have it criminalized...this seems the most correct to me...
but again I am not exactly sure of the why or how.
-
nice write up :aok
sickening :mad:
remember "reefer madness" :rofl
I own it. And even though we consider it ridiculous now, many still hold the same views today, on drugs that are not marijuana.
Ive always thought that they banned pot because they cant tax it.. is this true?
It is taxed in my state. I mentioned earlier about being charged with failure to affix a marijuana tax stamp. This is a felony.
The drug tax stamps were passed in order to effectively double all drug penalties in cases involving what the state feels constitutes distributable amounts (lets not get into an argument now about how right/wrong the regulations for this are).
In addition to the doubling, since the tax part is treated like any other tax penalties so if you can't pay the back taxes which are usually $100/gram, the dept of revenue and some state troopers come over to your house and the tax stooges decided what they need to take from you and auction off in order to pay your drug tax bill. While they are doing this the troopers are doing a thorough search looking to find more things to charge you with. At least nobody's dog has been shot yet when this happens.
Now this can be avoided if you want to own more than 1.5 ounces of pot or other drug. Just go to Des Moines and ask to buy a stamp for the particular drug you want. They only cost around $20,000 and they won't even ask what your name is. They started out costing $3000, but stamp collectors liked them. Then they raised it up to $7000 but it wasn't enough. So the logic to me looks like they don't want anyone buying these tax stamps.
-
The Justice system in the USA is a self growing business where the more people they arrest, the bigger the business grows, and the public is strong-armed into paying for it. There is no motivation to stop building prisons, stop appointing new judges, prosecutors, & prison workers. Prison industries, where inmates work for pennies on the dollar, are garnished while locked up to pay fines & restitution, child support, buy their own sneakers & soda-pop, even pay for drug which are brought in by visitors...all this & they sell manufactured products to other government agencies and they are encouraged to buy more, employing more inmates...growing & growing.... :old:
-
The Justice system in the USA is a self growing business where the more people they arrest, the bigger the business grows, and the public is strong-armed into paying for it. There is no motivation to stop building prisons, stop appointing new judges, prosecutors, & prison workers. Prison industries, where inmates work for pennies on the dollar, are garnished while locked up to pay fines & restitution, child support, buy their own sneakers & soda-pop, even pay for drug which are brought in by visitors...all this & they sell manufactured products to other government agencies and they are encouraged to buy more, employing more inmates...growing & growing.... :old:
We don't have a justice system. Supreme court justice Antonin Scalia actually addressed this very question. He said: "we do not have a justice system, we have a legal system".
I really like what Steven Fry had to say about our corrections system.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPZed8af9RI
-
We don't have a justice system. Supreme court justice Antonin Scalia actually addressed this very question. He said: "we do not have a justice system, we have a legal system".
I really like what Steven Fry had to say about our corrections system.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPZed8af9RI
here is a fact....(in NH anyway)when you get sentenced you get an inmate ID...for every ID the state gets X amount of dollars....every time you get out on parole if you go back you get a new ID....both those ID's are now in the system and the state gets funds for them....I know a guy that has 6 ID's :O
-
Well ink I disagree with you on this one bro . I think that the good cops are becoming the minority . Look on youtube it is sickening . Planting evidence . Not knowing the law . Police video taped . Hundreds and hundreds of videos . Don't follow an illegal order they freak out . Look at the West Point grad that gets arrested for filming abusive cops . Try telling a cop you will not give them id . You get lied to and laws made up . No a few dozen would be one thing hundreds and hundreds ?
-
We don't have a justice system. Supreme court justice Antonin Scalia actually addressed this very question. He said: "we do not have a justice system, we have a legal system".
I really like what Steven Fry had to say about our corrections system.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPZed8af9RI
It is certainly shocking to discover the amount of people in prison in the US. And the severe 3 strike sentences seem totally draconian, but to quote Jim Carey "STOP BREAKING THE LAW A&%#OLE"
-
Well ink I disagree with you on this one bro . I think that the good cops are becoming the minority . Look on youtube it is sickening . Planting evidence . Not knowing the law . Police video taped . Hundreds and hundreds of videos . Don't follow an illegal order they freak out . Look at the West Point grad that gets arrested for filming abusive cops . Try telling a cop you will not give them id . You get lied to and laws made up . No a few dozen would be one thing hundreds and hundreds ?
While my own personal experiences tell me that I shouldn't trust most police officers, I must say that this opinion doesn't carry over to our Highway Patrol... usually. A few years ago when I lived next to their local post 2 of them gave me a big ax to grind. I got my revenge by stopping any highway patrol car that cut through the private road I lived on and asked them to not drive their squad cars on it. They always looked at me like I was crazy before saying "ok" and complying. They liked my road because it bypassed 2 sets of stoplights if they were heading west. One of them argued with me so I told them that I was going to use their private road (which bypassed a stop sign). He didn't seem to care but he stopped using my road.\
I also give the sherif's dept the benefit of doubt due to the fact that they've always been courteous and professional towards me.
I also tend to give local cops who appear old enough to be veterans a break with my prejudice since 100% of my problems with police officers have been young cops.
I do believe that they are above the law in nearly all practical cases and this disgusts me. Last year there was an incident between two guys I've known my whole life. One was a cop, the other was getting pulled over. The officer planted a bag of weed in the victim's car and it was all caught on camera. All charges were dropped against Clifford, but instead of disciplinary action taken against officer Mike it was determined that he did nothing wrong. Even though you could clearly see officer Mike placing a bag of contraband inside Clifford's car while both of them were in full view of the camera. This is not surprising to me since I've known both of these guys since I was a kid. Mike has always been a jerk and was a bit of a bully in Jr high and High school. Although Clifford is massive and his brothers are bonified gun carrying and gun using thugs, I can't think of a single person who's ever had any problems with him or a time that he's ever done anything to get himself into any kind of trouble.
-
Well ink I disagree with you on this one bro . I think that the good cops are becoming the minority . Look on youtube it is sickening . Planting evidence . Not knowing the law . Police video taped . Hundreds and hundreds of videos . Don't follow an illegal order they freak out . Look at the West Point grad that gets arrested for filming abusive cops . Try telling a cop you will not give them id . You get lied to and laws made up . No a few dozen would be one thing hundreds and hundreds ?
The difference is when A cop is "Bad" it is so much worse....
if you really think about it, it was much worse, back many years ago....most cops (if not all) were crooked and on the "take".....
-
The difference is when A cop is "Bad" it is so much worse....
if you really think about it, it was much worse, back many years ago....most cops (if not all) were crooked and on the "take".....
I'll take exception with the all. Each dept has their own " culture" and it might surprise you how much it can vary from one side of an invisible line. Same goes for fire depts. I'm not defending bad cops what so ever either. You know this. :D
-
The difference is when A cop is "Bad" it is so much worse....
if you really think about it, it was much worse, back many years ago....most cops (if not all) were crooked and on the "take".....
I don't think this was true outside of the larger cities. I'm sure the small podunk 1 bar / 1 stopsign towns the cops weren't on much of if any take.
(http://s2.hubimg.com/u/224837_f260.jpg)
-
I'll take exception with the all. Each dept has their own " culture" and it might surprise you how much it can vary from one side of an invisible line. Same goes for fire depts. I'm not defending bad cops what so ever either. You know this. :D
I hear ya.....it is far more likely today to hear or even see a "bad" cop....due to every cell phone being a video camera....
back in prohibition days....most were on the take....I did read some great stuff about Roosevelt....when he was in charge, he would walk a beat looking to make sure the cops were doing their job, and not crooked.....so you are right even back then not all of them were bad.
we are people and with that comes being fallible...."Power corrupts......Ultimate power corrupts ultimately"
I don't think this was true outside of the larger cities. I'm sure the small podunk 1 bar / 1 stopsign towns the cops weren't on much of if any take.
(http://s2.hubimg.com/u/224837_f260.jpg)
read my response to Slash.....
also that was a TV show not real life.....just wanted to make you aware of that.
:neener:
-
There are countless officers out there who try to hang onto their own integrity, but the pressure is intense & the most dangerous thing a young cop can do is side with an accused individual against a couple of "Good Ol' Boys". I hate movies that portray these situations because they exaggerate & dramatize to ridiculous lengths making any legitimate complainant look like a conspiracy nut bag. It's aggravated by lawyers helping every scum bag in the world suing enforcement agencies for BS. It's all a nightmare....do your best to stay out of trouble & away from it as well. :salute
-
Your chances of running into a bad cop are much less if you don't do anything to attract their attention.
-
I hear ya.....it is far more likely today to hear or even see a "bad" cop....due to every cell phone being a video camera..
The plus side to that is it's a great training tool. Plenty of " what not to do" on YouTube.
-
The plus side to that is it's a great training tool. Plenty of " what not to do" on YouTube.
so true :aok
-
Slash you are like the one cop in my small town I trust and admire . This guy is honest and got guts' . He is missing the ring finger on his right hand . He lost it years ago when I was in school still . There is a small pharmacy on the edge of town that had been robbed 3 times in less than six months . They installed a silent alarm . Well on number four robbery time they trip it . First cop to respond is one that had a good career for himself right up until he barricaded him and his wife in his house for an armed standoff . He walks right in and says "we got a report of a silent alarm" . That is when the one of the 3 robbers that had just backed away from the counter with his gun concealed pointed into the ribs of a female hostage . Walked up behind him and relieved him of both of his weapons , then cuffed him . The shift supervisor is now out of the picture . Next on the scene is John Atchley . This is one of the good guys . He sees them coming out of the little store . He doesn't see Sgt. Anderson anywhere but of course knows he was the first on scene . When he tells them to halt a gunfight erupts . For the time being it is just Atchley against 3 gunmen . At some point he is hit in his right hand loses his finger and his service weapon is mangled . He pulls out a little revolver back up waepon and continues to fight . Reloading it several times one handed . A small revolver . Did I mention you can hear the metal on metal of his nutts slapping together when he walks ? He drops 2 of them and pins the third until help arrives . The man is intelligent honest and brave . Yet he never rises very far in dept. ranks . Anderson makes it to lieutenant . Go figure . Anderson screws himself when he barricades himself and his wife in his home and county has to come get him out . A town of about 15,000 he is only the first of three in a ten year span to this over an unfaithful spouse . I think he should have lost his job when he got caught diddling a hs student in his patrol car . Lucky for him he didn't get caught until right after she turned 18 instead of when they started it at the age of 15 for her . Next was Tom Henney , then Richfield son of our then police chief . Guess it takes an armed standoff in Lebanon Oregon for a cop to go too far . Unlike Kevin Martinez the local DARE officer busted with a large amount of cocaine . After treatment he was back on the force and now heads our detective squad . Then there is Willie Setszer . The city due to a large amount of high speed pursuits buys a Camaro for a pursuit car . While street racing it he T-Bones a kid pulling out of McDonalds and the kid will walk with a limp for the rest of his life . Not content with crippling a kid for life Willie makes up a story and blames it all on the kid . Well his folks had money so they hire a P.I. The whole story falls apart and the price Willie has to pay ? A one year suspension . No criminal charges . Well at least he now works over in Corvallis . I included names and enough info. so anyone that doubts me can research and check my work . Oh lets not stop at the cops . A few years back the local judge had to do a few weeks or months in jail for coercing female defendants into sexual favors .Larry Houchin is his name . I have paid the price for standing up to these thugs a few times over the years . Been charged with all kinds of made up stuff . Brawled with them twice . The last time finally earning myself a criminal record . The only reason I have that is because of mandatory sentencing Shuffler . Measure 11 had me looking at one of those 20 year sentences . Believe me length of prison sentence was not something I was thinking about when I decided I was not going to tolerate the illegal orders or the abuse any longer . My only thought was I am retired less than two years from defending what these guys are urinating all over . BS ! I plead to menacing <misdemeanor> so I would not have face the possibility of 10-20 years in prison . Out of state because my wife at the time was a corrections officer for the state . To give you an idea of how out of line the 7 officers I fought were . I got 2 years bench probation no fine no jail time . I broke one cops arm . Martinez got his head split open and a bad concussion still carries the scar quite visible over his eye to this day . The other 5 had similar lumped onions and strained limbs . The only two that didn't get lumped up were the State Patrolman that finally showed up . These boys knew what they were doing . They pretty quickly had me under control . I would like to say that it was because I had been fighting for almost 10 minutes by then , but I am pretty sure it would have been the same if they were the first two instead of the last two that night . Although I have a hunch it never would have happened if they had been the first two I had interaction with that night of Martinez and O'Malley . Sorry for the length .
-
Slash I will make any kind of statement anywhere you want me to if I need to make amends to you . I always figured you for one of the good guys . When you called the incident that started the thread a mistake . I KNEW you are one of the good guys . I would ride the river , share a two man defensive position or go Squatching with you any time . Not once would I worry about my back . Well unless we had been away from civilization for too long and you had begun taking long lust filled gazes at me . That has more to do with you being a Muppet than a cop . :bolt:
-
Slash I will make any kind of statement anywhere you want me to if I need to make amends to you . I always figured you for one of the good guys . When you called the incident that started the thread a mistake . I KNEW you are one of the good guys . I would ride the river , share a two man defensive position or go Squatching with you any time . Not once would I worry about my back . Well unless we had been away from civilization for too long and you had begun taking long lust filled gazes at me . That has more to do with you being a Muppet than a cop . :bolt:
:rofl
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
damn man....all I can say to that story is.......hell man..... I don't know what to say..... :salute
-
Your chances of running into a bad cop are much less if you don't do anything to attract their attention.
Words of wisdom right there I tell ya . Took me a long time to figure that one out , lol .
-
Your chances of running into a bad cop are much less if you don't do anything to attract their attention.
yup but what are the chances of a bad cop running into you?
navy vet gets shot in her backyard by police officer.
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/family-navy-vet-shot-startled-deputy-seeks-answers-193729306.html
I two rules to avoid a bad cop:
#1 dont answer the door in the middle of the night.
#2 dont go in the back yard in the middle of the morning.
semp
-
Slash I will make any kind of statement anywhere you want me to if I need to make amends to you . I always figured you for one of the good guys . When you called the incident that started the thread a mistake . I KNEW you are one of the good guys . I would ride the river , share a two man defensive position or go Squatching with you any time . Not once would I worry about my back . Well unless we had been away from civilization for too long and you had begun taking long lust filled gazes at me . That has more to do with you being a Muppet than a cop . :bolt:
Oh Noooooooooooosssss :rofl
-
Your chances of running into a bad cop are much less if you don't do anything to attract their attention.
Just because this is true, doesn't give them the right... :noid of course...
-
Slash I will make any kind of statement anywhere you want me to if I need to make amends to you . I always figured you for one of the good guys . When you called the incident that started the thread a mistake . I KNEW you are one of the good guys . I would ride the river , share a two man defensive position or go Squatching with you any time . Not once would I worry about my back . Well unless we had been away from civilization for too long and you had begun taking long lust filled gazes at me . That has more to do with you being a Muppet than a cop . :bolt:
Sicko :huh
I'm in.
-
I don't think this was true outside of the larger cities. I'm sure the small podunk 1 bar / 1 stopsign towns the cops weren't on much of if any take.
(http://s2.hubimg.com/u/224837_f260.jpg)
Ohhhhh some small towns with one cop, one sheriff, one jail cell, were much worse. No checks & balances, fox guarding chicken-house etc. Also 50+ years ago, if a cop "Thumped" you, most folks figured, you had it coming, or you were poor/black etc. & it was OK to kick your arse.... :old:
-
I tell ya the cops are not that bad around here you don't never see them but the Gamewardens are not to mess with . Most look like they came right out of Vietnam with 2 to 4 side arms on each one . I get harassed two to three times a year by them . They don't need a warrant to search your truck or home eather .
-
I tell ya the cops are not that bad around here you don't never see them but the Gamewardens are not to mess with . Most look like they came right out of Vietnam with 2 to 4 side arms on each one . I get harassed two to three times a year by them . They don't need a warrant to search your truck or home eather .
Same here, although ours have always been friendly and professional to me, their ability to run over the bill of rights has not been seriously brought into question through the courts yet. Then again everyone seems to strongly believe in the importance of conservation.
-
There not so friendly around here . I had them check me 3 time's in one day in 2009 . It's not just me they treat all the people around here the same way and if your out of town you have not a prayer .
-
I tell ya the cops are not that bad around here you don't never see them but the Gamewardens are not to mess with . Most look like they came right out of Vietnam with 2 to 4 side arms on each one . I get harassed two to three times a year by them . They don't need a warrant to search your truck or home eather .
Yes they do need a warrant...unless they have probable cause. :rolleyes:
-
There not so friendly around here . I had them check me 3 time's in one day in 2009 . It's not just me they treat all the people around here the same way and if your out of town you have not a prayer .
We had a couple abusive game wardens up here in Idaho that earned a reputation...screwed with the wrong mountain man & made him a strange kinda mountain folk hero who could not be imprisoned in Idaho because of all the death threats. Took years to catch him, then he escaped. :bolt:
(http://www.jefflongbooks.com/jackets/outlaw.jpg)
http://www.jefflongbooks.com/desc-outlaw.html (http://www.jefflongbooks.com/desc-outlaw.html)
-
Until about four years ago a Texas Game Warden did have authority to search a residence as well as a vehicle or any other area where he/she believed there may be evidence of illegal game. The law was changed to exclude residences, including tents, where now they do have to get a search warrant for most any type of dwelling. As for Probable Cause, it is the foundation of any search warrant. You can not get the warrant without establishing the Probable Cause in an affidavit.
Fred