General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: danny76 on August 07, 2015, 11:50:53 PM
Title: White teenager shot in back
Post by: danny76 on August 07, 2015, 11:50:53 PM
Police in South Carolina have shot a white unarmed teen in the back during a pot bust. I presume there will follow public outrage and rioting.
Or not
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: XxDaSTaRxx on August 08, 2015, 12:00:34 AM
And people wonder why I'm a secessionist.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Estes on August 08, 2015, 01:29:59 AM
Pot is dangerous stuff man...I really can't see this thread ending well, especially considering.. Oh man, I'm not going to say anything about it, I just got off parole on here not too long ago, don't need skuzzy marking up my account again:P I really hope the thing I read online is wrong, that he wasn't shot over a couple joints. Hell, even here I don't think the law is that bad. Seems to me, and granted I wasn't there but I don't think I Would need to shoot anyone in the back the backs of people really isn't all that threatening to me. Much less shoot them twice over, having said that if I'm ever in that situation I think i'd be ok. Theres no way I'd consider a LE career without a gopro or something along those lines, too many nutters. :old:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Estes on August 08, 2015, 01:33:00 AM
derp, forgot how to post on this board apparently.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Swoop on August 08, 2015, 04:19:15 AM
Blimey! Didn't know you were still alive Estes... :)
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Estes on August 08, 2015, 04:20:57 AM
Blimey! Didn't know you were still alive Estes... :)
Yeah, i'm still barely kicking lol. How you been? Haven't seen you online since the FDB days lol at least i think anyway. Jeez, makes me feel old I can't imagine how Lew and others feel :old:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Swoop on August 08, 2015, 04:25:46 AM
Returned about 18 months ago. Still on the lookout for various others who've disappeared though.
Anyway, thread hijack, back to the subject.
IT IS OUTRAGE!
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Scherf on August 08, 2015, 04:46:43 AM
One never knows. The young fellow may have put the officer's life in danger, for example by refusing to extinguish his cigarette.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Estes on August 08, 2015, 04:52:35 AM
I've been lucky in that regard, no accidents in all my years of driving, and only a warning or two for speeding or whatever it was at the time. But, my limited experience with the cops here at least has been pleasant. Then again, I'm not that big of a idiot to where I would disrespect the officer or anything, just "Slow 'er down" type of things is all i've got. I'm sure there are lots of little rules like that, regarding if you're putting them in danger. If the facts turn out that the officer was in the wrong, then so be it. I Just have a hard time imagining some white kid that got busted with a couple joints posed him or the public any real threat.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 08, 2015, 07:25:58 AM
Then again, I'm not that big of a idiot to where I would disrespect the officer or anything, just "Slow 'er down" type of things is all i've got.
You're not that big of an idiot? Well let me just congratulate you on that. Sad fact is you don't know what this kid was doing to get shot, getting NOT shot over weed I would think would be pretty simple, just don't grab the cops gun, reach for a knife, any of those types of things and do what the cop says. Cops don't want to kill people, I know from first hand experience. These suspects kill themselves with the smart alec moves they make.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Karnak on August 08, 2015, 07:45:26 AM
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 08, 2015, 03:35:54 PM
Ferguson is a mess because you have one guy armed shooting another guy unarmed point made.... If Brown had at least a rock in his fist it would be a totally different story....
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 08, 2015, 04:24:12 PM
Shooting a guy for running should be a crime. If that is relevant.
You come in my door, find me in the entry way, and tell me to stop. I run down the hallway. You probably want to shoot me, because unbeknownst to you, at the end of that hallway, is an arsenal that's going to RUIN your day. The same occurs on the streets. You don't know if they're running for their lives, or running to regroup or grab a better tool to fight.
Ferguson is a mess because you have one guy armed shooting another guy unarmed point made.... If Brown had at least a rock in his fist it would be a totally different story....
Well, at one point he had the cop's gun...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 08, 2015, 04:42:35 PM
The cluelessness of folks in this thread is beyond me.
Lets make this simple.
I have two sons. My oldest is white, my youngest is black. I have a photo of my oldest son in a hoody and jeans holding his favorite AK47 that he'd built. Showing that picture to the average joe, the reaction would be "Gun enthusiast".
It occurred to me when I saw that picture that my youngest son, dressed the same and holding the same gun would be seen as a 'thug".
I asked my neighbor what he thought the reaction would be and he laughed and said the same thing.
To suggest the life of a white teenage boy and a black teenage boy are the same is just not true. Mine have been and are being raised in the same house, same rules, same expectations. Regardless of this, my youngest son will face an entirely different world due to nothing more than the color of his skin.
Everyone here is capable of putting together sentences so you should be aware enough to recognize the truth in that.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 08, 2015, 04:46:14 PM
The cluelessness of folks in this thread is beyond me.
Lets make this simple.
I have two sons. My oldest is white, my youngest is black. I have a photo of my oldest son in a hoody and jeans holding his favorite AK47 that he'd built. Showing that picture to the average joe, the reaction would be "Gun enthusiast".
It occurred to me when I saw that picture that my youngest son, dressed the same and holding the same gun would be seen as a 'thug".
I asked my neighbor what he thought the reaction would be and he laughed and said the same thing.
To suggest the life of a white teenage boy and a black teenage boy are the same is just not true. Mine have been and are being raised in the same house, same rules, same expectations. Regardless of this, my youngest son will face an entirely different world due to nothing more than the color of his skin.
Everyone here is capable of putting together sentences so you should be aware enough to recognize the truth in that.
Actually, I would counter that your oldest, dressed in a hoody and jeans (Without knowing his demeanor in the image, the weather, etc.) would be labeled a thug just as quickly. I would personally roll my eyes anyway.
That being said, when I still owned an AK, I liked to wear a suit and tie while shooting it, just to confuse people...
The problem with race in this nation isn't a question of actual racism. REAL racism is dieing out, fast, as the older generations die. Perceived racism does far more damage nowadays, in my experience anyway.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: danny76 on August 08, 2015, 05:10:18 PM
I was an LEO for 7 years, I had guys driving cars at me repeatedly, I live in a country that doesn't routinely arm officers so I had to just get out of the way. I never felt the need to shoot anyone, getting out of the way of some eijit reversing a car at you isn't hard. It can't be, I am hardly an athlete and yet I have never struggled to not be run over. My issue is; despite the fact that the scrote in this story probably needed shooting, and the sky is not short of stars for his passing, there was no outcry about his killing, no "every life is important" diatribe, nobody really cares. I certainly don't. One less lawbreakers recidivist benefit claimant in the world. Nevertheless l, the fact that there has not been an outcry and.rioting is simply because the guy was white.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: guncrasher on August 08, 2015, 05:30:40 PM
The cluelessness of folks in this thread is beyond me.
Lets make this simple.
I have two sons. My oldest is white, my youngest is black. I have a photo of my oldest son in a hoody and jeans holding his favorite AK47 that he'd built. Showing that picture to the average joe, the reaction would be "Gun enthusiast".
It occurred to me when I saw that picture that my youngest son, dressed the same and holding the same gun would be seen as a 'thug".
I asked my neighbor what he thought the reaction would be and he laughed and said the same thing.
To suggest the life of a white teenage boy and a black teenage boy are the same is just not true. Mine have been and are being raised in the same house, same rules, same expectations. Regardless of this, my youngest son will face an entirely different world due to nothing more than the color of his skin.
Everyone here is capable of putting together sentences so you should be aware enough to recognize the truth in that.
so true guppy. my ex girlfriend was white, we were treated different in some places when they didnt know we were together. not all the time, but sometimes. a few times, we would go into a restaurant and while I was parking the car she would go in and be seated right away, then I would go in and asked to wait before I even would open my mouth. doesnt happen often but it does. people are stupid everywhere.
semp
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 08, 2015, 06:08:13 PM
Actually, I would counter that your oldest, dressed in a hoody and jeans (Without knowing his demeanor in the image, the weather, etc.) would be labeled a thug just as quickly. I would personally roll my eyes anyway.
That being said, when I still owned an AK, I liked to wear a suit and tie while shooting it, just to confuse people...
The problem with race in this nation isn't a question of actual racism. REAL racism is dieing out, fast, as the older generations die. Perceived racism does far more damage nowadays, in my experience anyway.
I would have agreed with you right until Matthew came into our lives.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: bozon on August 09, 2015, 05:52:24 AM
Regardless of this, my youngest son will face an entirely different world due to nothing more than the color of his skin.
...that, and the AK47 that he is holding... My reaction to a white American with an assault rifle would be "fascist" - each has his own prejudice and fears I guess.
Put your black son in a suit. Do people think "president"?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: PR3D4TOR on August 09, 2015, 05:59:42 AM
so true guppy. my ex girlfriend was white, we were treated different in some places when they didnt know we were together. not all the time, but sometimes. a few times, we would go into a restaurant and while I was parking the car she would go in and be seated right away, then I would go in and asked to wait before I even would open my mouth. doesnt happen often but it does. people are stupid everywhere.
semp
Weird... I've always pictured you as white for some reason.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: zack1234 on August 09, 2015, 07:30:25 AM
so true guppy. my ex girlfriend was white, we were treated different in some places when they didnt know we were together. not all the time, but sometimes. a few times, we would go into a restaurant and while I was parking the car she would go in and be seated right away, then I would go in and asked to wait before I even would open my mouth. doesnt happen often but it does. people are stupid everywhere.
semp
The USA is obssessed with such things.
In Britain we dont care as long as you are not loud or like France.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: caldera on August 09, 2015, 08:14:18 AM
You come in my door, find me in the entry way, and tell me to stop. I run down the hallway. You probably want to shoot me, because unbeknownst to you, at the end of that hallway, is an arsenal that's going to RUIN your day. The same occurs on the streets. You don't know if they're running for their lives, or running to regroup or grab a better tool to fight.
Well, at one point he had the cop's gun...
That was the point of my post... who's to say you couldn't mash this cops face with your fists.. he did it at the store, he did during the first struggle... and he was probably going to do it again
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Rich46yo on August 09, 2015, 11:10:26 AM
I doubt very many of you, if any, know exactly how bad these cities have become.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 09, 2015, 11:16:56 AM
It's a friggin warzone everyday, no you can't say that cuz there is not enough shooting... but there is enough to put the fear of god in your soul almost every second.....
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: jeep00 on August 09, 2015, 11:25:58 AM
I was an LEO for 7 years, I had guys driving cars at me repeatedly, I live in a country that doesn't routinely arm officers so I had to just get out of the way. I never felt the need to shoot anyone, getting out of the way of some eijit reversing a car at you isn't hard. It can't be, I am hardly an athlete and yet I have never struggled to not be run over. My issue is; despite the fact that the scrote in this story probably needed shooting, and the sky is not short of stars for his passing, there was no outcry about his killing, no "every life is important" diatribe, nobody really cares. I certainly don't. One less lawbreakers recidivist benefit claimant in the world. Nevertheless l, the fact that there has not been an outcry and.rioting is simply because the guy was white.
:salute The videos I have seen of police issues in your country back up what you say. They seem to understand they are not Judge Dredd nor a judge in any way and approach situations as though they not only received stress and tension training, they actually knew what it was intended to do, and also as though the person they are arresting actually is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. And of course just to back this up there is another case soon to come up where vandalism is now also punishable by death.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 09, 2015, 11:29:21 AM
lmao vandalism punishbable by death, depends on the extent
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 09, 2015, 11:48:24 AM
you have to realize we are human and we make mistakes... thats the reason for this whole race as it seems... nobody ever wins i know that except that those that seem to sacrifice more than others......
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 09, 2015, 11:52:38 AM
It's a friggin warzone everyday, no you can't say that cuz there is not enough shooting... but there is enough to put the fear of god in your soul almost every second.....
Oh 'bout 40 since Fri. night alone. Last night they were tossing rocks and bricks. Cant shoot so you just drive on.
Lotsa luck with that America. War zones with entire swaths controlled by gangsters. But do keep up with the anti-cop stuff. You dont want to deny your programming and think for yourself. More then a one Liner takes to much effort and original thought.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 09, 2015, 12:03:03 PM
Rich i know your a cop and former soldier i give deepest respects to you for doing what you do... why cant crime be cured why can't criminals be answered for... Why can't people just get along with eachother is what i want to know.........
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Rich46yo on August 09, 2015, 12:24:54 PM
Rich i know your a cop and former soldier i give deepest respects to you for doing what you do... why cant crime be cured why can't criminals be answered for... Why can't people just get along with eachother is what i want to know.........
Its a little late in the game for such questions. Most people can, the ones who cant are most often criminals. Who now fear neither the system or the Police.
From the first day in the Baltimore riots, when I saw the stores being hit and who was hitting them, I said this was an organized riot by street gangs in order to break into pharmacies and steal their highly valuable drug product. Freddie Grey, or whatever his name was, had nothing to do with it. Other then to be used as a tool by the same gangs who sold him junk for his entire life.
So now we have gangs organizing riots to steal valuable stuff. We've had the same thing happen here on our main shopping drag. Beating up shoppers and stealing THEIR stuff as well. And the funny thing about it is they are using cell phones paid for by the tax payers to organize it all. Ha, Ha, Ha, ha.
Its like scenes from The Walking Dead out there some nights. I'd forget about finding a "cure" and instead worry about yourself and your family. A carry permit and good dog is a good place to start. Its only going to get worse.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 09, 2015, 12:40:56 PM
The only way to fix it is to put the bad guys away for good... and release the innocent!!
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: NatCigg on August 09, 2015, 01:42:01 PM
You come in my door, find me in the entry way, and tell me to stop. I run down the hallway. You probably want to shoot me, because unbeknownst to you, at the end of that hallway, is an arsenal that's going to RUIN your day. The same occurs on the streets. You don't know if they're running for their lives, or running to regroup or grab a better tool to fight.
Well, at one point he had the cop's gun...
9.999/10 hes running to get away. maybe hes in a warzone and running to set up a ambush? maybe hes got a nuke in his trunk? maybe the cop KNOWS hes being disrespected and failing, and resorts to his training and emotions, and shoots a kid in the back, as the kid runs from large fine and another stint in the slammer with 5 years probation, and a seemingly failed life that's already been hard. but now hes dead and the cop got his man, or a, saved the community from the degenerative thug running in their yard.
The good, the bad, the ugly. it is important to respect the police, but the police need to respect the people. the police can get out of line with their authority and become expelled from the community. Us vs. Them. Something is out of sync.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 09, 2015, 02:12:47 PM
You are seeing things from a white perspective. Go to a place where your color is in the minority and tell me you aren't looked at differently.
Never seen a thug with an AK. If it's a moron holding the gun sideways, then it's a thug (or wanna be) - regardless of color.
Jeez how you miss the point. I have lived in a situation where I was the minority. Stood out like a neon light. It was not the same thing. The perceptions of who I was and what I was doing there were not ever seen as a potential threat purely on my skin color. I was never viewed immediately as suspicious. No cop ever Stopped while I was walking in the projects.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: danny76 on August 09, 2015, 03:03:49 PM
The simple fact is that in order to not be shot by police you simply have to
a: Do as you are told by police officers (who really aren't conspiratorial racial bigots all complicit in a giant plot to kill ethnic minorities)
b: STOP COMMITTING CRIMES
Does anyone honestly believe that police officers are not scared to death of making a mistake? No LEO is going to open fire unnecessarily on anyone, especially if they are from a minority, because he not only wants to avoid jail, he/she also does not want an innocent life on their conscience. It's been a while since I policed but I had the race card played on a daily basis. Nobody I investigated, pursued, arrested and brought before the court ever suggested that I was victimising them.because they were Caucasian :old:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: zack1234 on August 09, 2015, 05:06:16 PM
The simple fact is that in order to not be shot by police you simply have to
a: Do as you are told by police officers (who really aren't conspiratorial racial bigots all complicit in a giant plot to kill ethnic minorities)
b: STOP COMMITTING CRIMES
Does anyone honestly believe that police officers are not scared to death of making a mistake? No LEO is going to open fire unnecessarily on anyone, especially if they are from a minority, because he not only wants to avoid jail, he/she also does not want an innocent life on their conscience. It's been a while since I policed but I had the race card played on a daily basis. Nobody I investigated, pursued, arrested and brought before the court ever suggested that I was victimising them.because they were Caucasian :old:
all cops are human and they bring their own prejudices into their work. some have mental healths, stress, whatever the rest of the population has officers have it.
and I know plenty of white people that think they have been victimized by cops.
semp
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 09, 2015, 07:45:12 PM
cops are nice people till they get bullied, get a gun grabbed etc. I still don't believe what occurred here was the result of a cop trying to kill someone for the heck of it....
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: guncrasher on August 09, 2015, 07:47:34 PM
this incident was not a cop shooting just because, the guy put his car on reversed then forward and moved towards an officer that shot him.
he wasnt shot because he had a small amount of weed. he got shot because he accelerated towards and officer. think the cop camera film has not been released yet.
semp
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 09, 2015, 07:50:04 PM
i can admit that maybe the cop pulled the trigger fast but was that because a past experience, one never knows...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: zack1234 on August 10, 2015, 01:41:00 AM
The simple fact is that in order to not be shot by police you simply have to
a: Do as you are told by police officers (who really aren't conspiratorial racial bigots all complicit in a giant plot to kill ethnic minorities)
b: STOP COMMITTING CRIMES
Does anyone honestly believe that police officers are not scared to death of making a mistake? No LEO is going to open fire unnecessarily on anyone, especially if they are from a minority, because he not only wants to avoid jail, he/she also does not want an innocent life on their conscience. It's been a while since I policed but I had the race card played on a daily basis. Nobody I investigated, pursued, arrested and brought before the court ever suggested that I was victimising them.because they were Caucasian :old:
I still contest me borrowing unserwear of washing lines is a hobby and not a crime...its opression Danny!
Serenity is in to chicks who were blokes and no one arrests him!
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 10, 2015, 09:03:21 AM
its no joke when your taking someone's life, it's a very personal decision where you have to balance a million equations in your head to know if your doing the right thing or not at that time.. its a very serious matter... I hope for godsakes that this shooting was justified in the end.. only that cop really knows it, the other person involved is now deceased..
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: zack1234 on August 10, 2015, 11:16:13 AM
Crimminals always have a reason and a excuse :old:
If your a dirty crimminal and get owned i feel warm inside :old:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 10, 2015, 11:18:46 AM
yeah but what if said kid accidentally pulled ur untretented tazer off ur belt... it boggles the mind
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Rich46yo on August 10, 2015, 12:45:52 PM
There will always be mistakes made cause we live in an imperfect world and we are imperfect creatures. Doctors, Lawyers, Soldiers, Teachers, Cops...ect all make mistakes.
Over the weekend we had 2 killed and 43 shot in what is actually only limited areas of the city. Now these are just bullets that hit someone that we know about. Its a maelstrom of violence we have to enter, mostly involved are angry young people who have no respect for authority and are just ignorant to the bone. Theres no real leadership cause nobody knows what in hell to do when you have tens of thousands of gang members, associate gang members, and other criminal types running wild. I mean just listen to the sound of silence from D.C. when a Police gets killed or hurt.
I almost killed an unarmed guy once. It was very dark, he was drunk at his ex-girlfriends house, he was pointing what looked like a gun at us and himself and he wouldnt drop it. I had him dead to rights at 75' on a rest and some instinct prevented me from finishing that trigger squeeze. Or maybe it was just luck. Anyway it turned out being one of those old time flip out cell phones. A black one. On that dark street it looked just like a gun to all of us. This balloon head wanted to get killed with his 'ex watching not caring a damn for what it would do to any of us.
The only way to never make a mistake , or to cut the odds, is to just avoid playing the game. Its a damn shame when a lawful citizen cant enjoy their neighborhood because of gangsters and criminals. But nobody is marching because of them right? And in the big cities at least the ability of the Police to make a meaningful impact is lessening more each year.
We just had a little boy killed by gangsters gunning for his daddy who was on the porch with him. Despite numerous felony gun and drug convictions this guy was on that porch because the heat was on the judges to avoid putting these offenders in prison because local congresspersons think doing so is a racist response which means these knuckleheads get pass after pass. This kids father had 45 previous pinches and a 7yo ends up having to pay for it. And like a good little gangster "Daddy" refused to cooperate with Police.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 10, 2015, 01:11:43 PM
There will always be mistakes made cause we live in an imperfect world and we are imperfect creatures. Doctors, Lawyers, Soldiers, Teachers, Cops...ect all make mistakes.
Over the weekend we had 2 killed and 43 shot in what is actually only limited areas of the city. Now these are just bullets that hit someone that we know about. Its a maelstrom of violence we have to enter, mostly involved are angry young people who have no respect for authority and are just ignorant to the bone. Theres no real leadership cause nobody knows what in hell to do when you have tens of thousands of gang members, associate gang members, and other criminal types running wild. I mean just listen to the sound of silence from D.C. when a Police gets killed or hurt.
I almost killed an unarmed guy once. It was very dark, he was drunk at his ex-girlfriends house, he was pointing what looked like a gun at us and himself and he wouldnt drop it. I had him dead to rights at 75' on a rest and some instinct prevented me from finishing that trigger squeeze. Or maybe it was just luck. Anyway it turned out being one of those old time flip out cell phones. A black one. On that dark street it looked just like a gun to all of us. This balloon head wanted to get killed with his 'ex watching not caring a damn for what it would do to any of us.
The only way to never make a mistake , or to cut the odds, is to just avoid playing the game. Its a damn shame when a lawful citizen cant enjoy their neighborhood because of gangsters and criminals. But nobody is marching because of them right? And in the big cities at least the ability of the Police to make a meaningful impact is lessening more each year.
We just had a little boy killed by gangsters gunning for his daddy who was on the porch with him. Despite numerous felony gun and drug convictions this guy was on that porch because the heat was on the judges to avoid putting these offenders in prison because local congresspersons think doing so is a racist response which means these knuckleheads get pass after pass. This kids father had 45 previous pinches and a 7yo ends up having to pay for it. And like a good little gangster "Daddy" refused to cooperate with Police.
its a crazy world out there but i guess you just have to roll with the punches...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 10, 2015, 03:31:50 PM
nobody does it for you, you have to do it for yourself.....
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 11, 2015, 04:02:58 PM
The cluelessness of folks in this thread is beyond me.
Lets make this simple.
I have two sons. My oldest is white, my youngest is black. I have a photo of my oldest son in a hoody and jeans holding his favorite AK47 that he'd built. Showing that picture to the average joe, the reaction would be "Gun enthusiast".
It occurred to me when I saw that picture that my youngest son, dressed the same and holding the same gun would be seen as a 'thug".
I asked my neighbor what he thought the reaction would be and he laughed and said the same thing.
To suggest the life of a white teenage boy and a black teenage boy are the same is just not true. Mine have been and are being raised in the same house, same rules, same expectations. Regardless of this, my youngest son will face an entirely different world due to nothing more than the color of his skin.
Everyone here is capable of putting together sentences so you should be aware enough to recognize the truth in that.
I saw this story today. Made me think of your post. It will be interesting to see what the follow up reporting reveals. (First reports are often modified after some of the dust settles).
Quote
A group of young black men were incorrectly arrested on suspicion of firearm possession during a protest in Ferguson, Missouri, as a group of white militiamen, armed with automatic rifles and wearing body armour and camouflage claimed they were granted permission to walk through the protests by police officers.
The quote you put up from that headline alone proves that the original author is a clueless ****ing idiot, and his work holds absolutely no water.
The issue remains the same though Serenity. A white guy with a AR-15 is a militia man. A black guy with an AR-15 is a threat. That's why I used that example with my two sons. My neighbor is about as average American Joe as you can get. Great guy, his son and my oldest were best friends and did ARs and AKs together. He said that same thing. With Andrew my oldest and his AK it was that it was just a kid with an interest in guns. He knows my youngest and they love Matthew as much as they did Andrew. He said it loud and clear. Matthew could never get away with the same things Andrew and his buddy did with guns as the perception is totally different.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 11, 2015, 08:11:36 PM
The issue remains the same though Serenity. A white guy with a AR-15 is a militia man. A black guy with an AR-15 is a threat. That's why I used that example with my two sons. My neighbor is about as average American Joe as you can get. Great guy, his son and my oldest were best friends and did ARs and AKs together. He said that same thing. With Andrew my oldest and his AK it was that it was just a kid with an interest in guns. He knows my youngest and they love Matthew as much as they did Andrew. He said it loud and clear. Matthew could never get away with the same things Andrew and his buddy did with guns as the perception is totally different.
While I certainly don't have the same life experience as you, that particular situation does NOT prove your point. In that individual situation, the black people with weapons HAVE used them to destroy peoples property, and hurt/kill people, whereas the white people with guns are attempting to discourage said destruction and violence.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 11, 2015, 08:38:34 PM
its not a black or white issue its a wtf are you doin issue... guy was yelling burn the town down after the mike brown decision if i remember correctly, it's just wtf are you doing...?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 11, 2015, 08:39:50 PM
The quote you put up from that headline alone proves that the original author is a clueless ****ing idiot, and his work holds absolutely no water.
Serenity: Normally when I see a response like yours, I usually chose not to reply. No real point in it. It does not matter if the response I see is articulate or incoherent; if there is just too much distance between our positions a result that ends in sour feeling is a fairly predictable outcome. I hold a few exceptions; when I will plow ahead and dam the torpedoes. I should state that your response does not fall within my exception list.
So why am I replying to your response?
I am genuinely curious as to what you see in “…that headline alone proves that the original author is a clueless…” What short coming, inconsistency, illogic or perhaps fabrication is it that you see in “that headline” that leads you to, as I see it, such a strong emotional response?
(And please do not let my causation suggestions dictate your line of reasoning).
And just so that you know, I have no interest in, and I am not willing to get into, a gun rights debate or such. But if the roots of your opinion sprout from there, I would be interested in knowing that and then I guess we can just leave it at that.
:salute
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 11, 2015, 08:59:45 PM
Serenity: Normally when I see a response like yours, I usually chose not to reply. No real point in it. It does not matter if the response I see is articulate or incoherent; if there is just too much distance between our positions a result that ends in sour feeling is a fairly predictable outcome. I hold a few exceptions; when I will plow ahead and dam the torpedoes. I should state that your response does not fall within my exception list.
So why am I replying to your response?
I am genuinely curious as to what you see in “…that headline alone proves that the original author is a clueless…” What short coming, inconsistency, illogic or perhaps fabrication is it that you see in “that headline” that leads you to, as I see it, such a strong emotional response?
(And please do not let my causation suggestions dictate your line of reasoning).
And just so that you know, I have no interest in, and I am not willing to get into, a gun rights debate or such. But if the roots of your opinion sprout from there, I would be interested in knowing that and then I guess we can just leave it at that.
:salute
I don't mind answering. Those are NOT automatic weapons. There is NO WAY for them to be. If the author of an article cannot be bothered to do enough research to understand this, and is willing enough to use words like that just to incite a reaction, then it calls into question the integrity of everything else. Clearly, the use of the word "automatic weapons" was chosen, despite being factually wrong, to sway your opinion, so how should I believe any of his other "facts" are true?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 11, 2015, 09:21:31 PM
I don't mind answering. Those are NOT automatic weapons. There is NO WAY for them to be. If the author of an article cannot be bothered to do enough research to understand this, and is willing enough to use words like that just to incite a reaction, then it calls into question the integrity of everything else. Clearly, the use of the word "automatic weapons" was chosen, despite being factually wrong, to sway your opinion, so how should I believe any of his other "facts" are true?
OK thanks.
BTW this is interesting: I went just went back to reread the article and I saw this:
Quote
A group of young black men were incorrectly arrested on suspicion of firearm possession during a protest in Ferguson, Missouri, as a group of white militiamen, armed with rifles and wearing body armour and camouflage claimed they were granted permission to walk through the protests by police officers.
The original article said:
Quote
A group of young black men were incorrectly arrested on suspicion of firearm possession during a protest in Ferguson, Missouri, as a group of white militiamen, armed with automatic [emphasis added] rifles and wearing body armour and camouflage claimed they were granted permission to walk through the protests by police officers.
Interesting. So they corrected their article. As I said in my original post
Quote
(First reports are often modified after some of the dust settles).
So as a follow on question let me ask, if someone corrects an error they made do you still ascribe to them your original impression?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 11, 2015, 09:29:27 PM
BTW this is interesting: I went just went back to reread the article and I saw this:
The original article said:
Interesting. So they corrected their article. As I said in my original post
So as a follow on question let me ask, if someone corrects an error they made do you still ascribe to them your original impression?
It would depend on what I felt of their overall intent and integrity. In a situation like this, misidentifying an agency involved, sure, I can accept that, but the use of the word "automatic rifle" is something else. This is a term used VERY often by media outlets in order to make a situation seem more scary, and try to incite a reaction. It's not a simple mistake to use those words. It's intentionally deceitful. I would put it up there with an article claiming an unarmed black man being shot in the back by police recanting to say that he was actually carrying a knife and swinging a bat. It's not a small mistake. You KNOW what you wanted people's knee-jerk reaction to be, and you lied to get it.
(By "you", I don't mean you, SysError, I mean the author of the article")
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: DREDIOCK on August 11, 2015, 09:34:19 PM
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Scherf on August 11, 2015, 10:36:33 PM
Sorry, don't mean to stir the pot, legit question as a confirmed civilian with next to no knowledge of such things - beeb website describes the dudes in question as carrying assault rifles. Is that the correct term for, say, an AR-15?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: zack1234 on August 12, 2015, 01:20:11 AM
If i lived in the US i would have lots of guns not to protect myself from the North koreans but because i could.
And it would be nothing to with my constipated rights.
like it has been said if a dirty scum crimminal has a gun i would shoot him stone dead and then go make a cup tea and eat a biscuit.
Your all obssessed by colour in the US, but not particularly offened by fat people, they make my blood boil :old:
I ex wife was fat and has a enormous effect on my viewpoint
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 12, 2015, 06:55:15 AM
Sorry, don't mean to stir the pot, legit question as a confirmed civilian with next to no knowledge of such things - beeb website describes the dudes in question as carrying assault rifles. Is that the correct term for, say, an AR-15?
No. The original use of the term meant a select fire (read: capable of fully automatic fire) rifle shooting an intermediate cartridge from a detachable magazine. I've read it in other places, but even Wiki credits Nazi Germany propaganda, and maybe Hitler himself, with first using the term to describe a weapon.
Like Serenity said, the word is used by reporters today to scare the hell out of everyone.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Zimme83 on August 12, 2015, 07:41:22 AM
Semi automatic should be the used term. Automatic reload but can only fire one round at the time.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 12, 2015, 07:50:11 AM
No. The original use of the term meant a select fire (read: capable of fully automatic fire) rifle shooting an intermediate cartridge from a detachable magazine. I've read it in other places, but even Wiki credits Nazi Germany propaganda, and maybe Hitler himself, with first using the term to describe a weapon.
Like Serenity said, the word is used by reporters today to scare the hell out of everyone.
Spot on. It's use shows a major lack of journalistic integrity.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 12, 2015, 08:27:42 AM
Semi automatic should be the used term. Automatic reload but can only fire one round at the time.
Can't. Doesn't sound scary enough. That term is really just a sideshow though. The point of that article was to make the readers think that St. Louis is the old west, complete with dirty cops and vigilantes who just want to make the streets turn red with the blood of very peaceful and docile protesters. Especially considering it's audience is largely outside the US, it's effective.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 12, 2015, 08:55:12 AM
It's the other way around with Mike Browns robbery, assaulting and grabbing the gun of the officer (and who knows after that), and of course all the looting, fires and all around hooliganism that occurred after the incident. Like I said before, it's not a white or black thing its a wtf are you doing thing cuz i saw plenty of white people joining the protesters in Ferguson.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: NatCigg on August 12, 2015, 12:23:58 PM
I don't mind answering. Those are NOT automatic weapons. There is NO WAY for them to be. If the author of an article cannot be bothered to do enough research to understand this, and is willing enough to use words like that just to incite a reaction, then it calls into question the integrity of everything else. Clearly, the use of the word "automatic weapons" was chosen, despite being factually wrong, to sway your opinion, so how should I believe any of his other "facts" are true?
That's not accurate Serenity. I've owned AR-15s going back to my college days in the late 70s early 80s. While illegal you could certainly make them automatic. And lets not pretend that folks with semi-auto ARs can't pump out the rounds in a hurry.
Those guys were in vests carrying AR-15s. If this was about just some guy with his hunting rifle out it would be one thing. An AR-15 in that situation is for pumping out the rounds. They wanted to look military. Why else add the camo to your black rifle. It's guys like that who give the AR-15 a bad name as they're out there trying to realize their combat-commando fantasies and looking idiotic doing it.
I have always enjoyed shooting ARs, but don't try and sell it like its just another rifle. You start sounding like the NRA mouth pieces then trying to minimize the killing power of the poor misunderstood AR-15 :)
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: guncrasher on August 12, 2015, 09:03:28 PM
wasnt the ar15 sold when first made as an assault weapon? isnt the m16 based on the ar15? maybe my mind is going out, somethings I remember from boot camp
semp
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Scherf on August 13, 2015, 12:51:36 AM
Thanks gents.
If I'm reading the comments correctly, if it's not full auto, it's not an assault weapon. So the guys in the military have the full-auto assault rifle, the guys in Ferguson have semi-auto, therefore not assault weapons but semi-automatic rifles. Have I capiched?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Mar on August 13, 2015, 01:36:32 AM
Not an assault rifle. Of course not. Doesn't even look like one. Not a chance. Could never be mistaken. Anyone can tell. Just a pea shooter. Couldn't hurt a fly. It's just too cute. Only for hunting rabbits. The big magazine is just in case you miss... you know, 19 or 29 times.
It's like, no big deal to brandish it out in public or anything.
Zack rules. :old:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 13, 2015, 07:39:24 AM
If I'm reading the comments correctly, if it's not full auto, it's not an assault weapon. So the guys in the military have the full-auto assault rifle, the guys in Ferguson have semi-auto, therefore not assault weapons but semi-automatic rifles. Have I capiched?
Correct. Many popular hunting rifles operate in a mechanically similar way to the AR-15, but presumably because they have wooden stocks and remind one of hunting with Grandpa, escape the ire of reporters and activists.
It's also not quite as easy as you might imagine to make a semi-auto AR into a full auto. I'm no expert, but a quick glance at the part differences tells me it's at least an armorer level job. The potential reliability issues you'd have combined with the $250,000 fine and/or 10 years in prison makes it kinda not worth it.
So what are we upset with this gun toting "militia" members for? Carrying rifles that I presume Missouri legally allows them to do and protecting private property and/or people against what recent history proved to be a not so non-violent protest? Did anyone get shot by these gun toting crazies? Kinda makes them not very crazy if not.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 08:24:49 AM
You rang? No I agree with triton, with all the rioting going on, why wouldn't you want to protect the city. It's like hurricane Katrina, except people are actually there to help the police with the overwhelming looting/violence etc..
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 08:34:34 AM
If I'm reading the comments correctly, if it's not full auto, it's not an assault weapon. So the guys in the military have the full-auto assault rifle, the guys in Ferguson have semi-auto, therefore not assault weapons but semi-automatic rifles. Have I capiched?
The cops would have full auto.. at least in Massachusetts it's that way
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 13, 2015, 08:39:45 AM
Correct. Many popular hunting rifles operate in a mechanically similar way to the AR-15, but presumably because they have wooden stocks and remind one of hunting with Grandpa, escape the ire of reporters and activists.
It's also not quite as easy as you might imagine to make a semi-auto AR into a full auto. I'm no expert, but a quick glance at the part differences tells me it's at least an armorer level job. The potential reliability issues you'd have combined with the $250,000 fine and/or 10 years in prison makes it kinda not worth it.
So what are we upset with this gun toting "militia" members for? Carrying rifles that I presume Missouri legally allows them to do and protecting private property and/or people against what recent history proved to be a not so non-violent protest? Did anyone get shot by these gun toting crazies? Kinda makes them not very crazy if not.
How many rounds in Grandpas hunting rifle?
The mini-14 is as much grandpas hunting rifle as an AR. Not many hunters need a 30 round magazine. And of course an AR-15 doesn't come with a neon sign announcing its only semi auto.
Who were those guys " protecting" btw?
Again I'll say it. I've been an AR owner for a long time. I know what it is. For me to go wandering around the neighborhood with it for whatever reason would be totally irresponsible.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 13, 2015, 09:01:18 AM
So what are we upset with this gun toting "militia" members for? Carrying rifles that I presume Missouri legally allows them to do and protecting private property and/or people against what recent history proved to be a not so non-violent protest? Did anyone get shot by these gun toting crazies? Kinda makes them not very crazy if not.
"St Louis County police chief Jon Belmar, who was present during the protests on Monday, distanced himself from these claims, describing the group’s [Oath Keepers],presence as “both unnecessary and inflammatory”."
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 13, 2015, 09:46:48 AM
The mini-14 is as much grandpas hunting rifle as an AR. Not many hunters need a 30 round magazine. And of course an AR-15 doesn't come with a neon sign announcing its only semi auto.
Ok, so if these guys had Remmy 7400's shouldered there isn't an issue? It's not that they had firearms, it's the magazine capacity? As for "need", you know where I'm going there. Slippery slope personified.
Again I'll say it. I've been an AR owner for a long time. I know what it is. For me to go wandering around the neighborhood with it for whatever reason would be totally irresponsible.
I'd say if your neighborhood had been looted as the one in Ferguson had been you'd be completely within logical bounds. Look, I get that the people there feel and in some cases know that there's racism directed at them from the police. Protests to that are completely within their rights and something that should be done. Destroying things they don't own because they're mad isn't. I really don't see how or why citizens other than the police aren't allowed to help ensure that.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 13, 2015, 09:52:49 AM
"St Louis County police chief Jon Belmar, who was present during the protests on Monday, distanced himself from these claims, describing the group’s [Oath Keepers],presence as “both unnecessary and inflammatory”."
Ok. Tell me what you'd have said if the quote would have read, "St. Louis Police Chief Jon Belmar, who was present during the protests on Monday, embraced the presence of the Oath Keepers, describing the group as being a "lawful, polite, and completely within their rights as citizens."
Without knowing how he really feels, I have a hunch he'd have said what he said regardless. Police chiefs aren't usually quick to admit their departments can't handle rioting/protests when a reporter is the one asking the question.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 13, 2015, 10:12:28 AM
The cluelessness of folks in this thread is beyond me.
Lets make this simple.
I have two sons. My oldest is white, my youngest is black. I have a photo of my oldest son in a hoody and jeans holding his favorite AK47 that he'd built. Showing that picture to the average joe, the reaction would be "Gun enthusiast".
It occurred to me when I saw that picture that my youngest son, dressed the same and holding the same gun would be seen as a 'thug".
I asked my neighbor what he thought the reaction would be and he laughed and said the same thing.
To suggest the life of a white teenage boy and a black teenage boy are the same is just not true. Mine have been and are being raised in the same house, same rules, same expectations. Regardless of this, my youngest son will face an entirely different world due to nothing more than the color of his skin.
Everyone here is capable of putting together sentences so you should be aware enough to recognize the truth in that.
I completely agree
and think it is extremely screwed up...
people say that the Blacks need to get over "slavery"
the simple fact is they have been being murdered beaten and abused by the system that is suppose to protect them....simply because they are "black" and poor....more often then not even a rich black man will get treated worse then a poor white man...
they have been being abused for so long it has become common and the typical white American now believes they are getting what they deserve or the police must have been provoked to action by the thugs....and only now with massive amount of cameras are people waking up to the abuse by those in "power" Long after "slavery" was abolished they were treated less then dogs....even right up into my life time...if people cant see how this would effect them as a race....then they are blind and cant see beyond their own nose.
that's not to say I think they should be crying "whoa is me" I Believe....it is not how many times you get hit that matter...it is how many times and with what manner you get up that matters.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 10:27:53 AM
You should see the way the individual acts before you go on grouping certain people together... I wasn't the one selling a black person into slavery so don't blame me.. it's all on the individual or individuals that commit the acts they do..
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Aspen on August 13, 2015, 10:32:24 AM
Full auto weapons are legal to own and use. It requires some paperwork and paying some extra tax. The incidence of gun related crimes committed by folks who do jump through the hoops to legally own one doesn't even register on a graph. So, if you happen to know someone with a legal full auto, thats one guy or gal that isn't a likely threat.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 10:54:42 AM
I wonder what mike brown would've been if he got into music instead of grabbin cops guns...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 13, 2015, 10:55:25 AM
Again I'll say it. I've been an AR owner for a long time. I know what it is. For me to go wandering around the neighborhood with it for whatever reason would be totally irresponsible.
These guys aren't wandering around a peaceful neighborhood. They are in an area of KNOWN violence, knowing the police CANNOT adequately protect people or property. If you were to stay there with anything BUT an AR-15 and at least 4 mags, I'd think you were mentally deficient. This wasn't some Sunday stroll, or the million man march. They KNEW violence would ensue, and they attempted to diffuse it in areas of innocent victims. You don't take a bolt action rifle to riot, especially one even the police can't control. The local citizens and businesses were happy to have the oath keepers there as their only real line of defense. They were professional, respectful, and they did their jobs preventing violence where they stood their beat, without hurting anyone or breaking any laws.
Fear does not trump truth.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 11:07:35 AM
truth serenity...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Rich46yo on August 13, 2015, 11:27:04 AM
Quote
dressed the same and holding the same gun would be seen as a 'thug".
Im only guessing but the lack of parenting in their community and the % of violent crime in their neighborhoods, that far outstrips the % of the other population, may have something to do with it. The glorification of thug culture, the generational gang membership... I mean Micheal Brown was a gang member and a felon when he robbed that store and then tried to disarm that Police officer. And then what does his ex-gangster with a long criminal record "play Daddy" say when the camera's are on him? He incites the crowd to burn down the town. "Oh they forgot to mention all that on the one year anniversary"?
I bet even black citizens who saw the pic of your black kid with the AK would think "Thug".
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 11:30:17 AM
Even his partner described the door opening and closing on Darren Wilson as a ricochet... wtf are you trying to describe here....
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: NatCigg on August 13, 2015, 11:36:52 AM
Cmon guys everyone knows thugs wear choppers not ar-15s. Plus the have to stand with their chest up and nostrils showing. :old:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 12:36:11 PM
true true choppers attract the women moreso than gunfire....
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SlipKnt on August 13, 2015, 12:44:26 PM
The simple fact is that in order to not be shot by police you simply have to
a: Do as you are told by police officers (who really aren't conspiratorial racial bigots all complicit in a giant plot to kill ethnic minorities)
b: STOP COMMITTING CRIMES
Does anyone honestly believe that police officers are not scared to death of making a mistake? No LEO is going to open fire unnecessarily on anyone, especially if they are from a minority, because he not only wants to avoid jail, he/she also does not want an innocent life on their conscience. It's been a while since I policed but I had the race card played on a daily basis. Nobody I investigated, pursued, arrested and brought before the court ever suggested that I was victimising them.because they were Caucasian :old:
It really is this simple. Avoid getting shot, just let the cop do his/her job and you can be on your way. Breaking the law, then deal with the consequences of your actions. If you run and the cop says, STOP or I'll shoot and you keep running, then deal with the consequences.
I have many friends on both sides of this fence. The ones filled with the most hate out of this all are the minorities. What I can't seem to get them to understand is that there is no reason to believe the white man wants to keep anyone down. Quite the opposite is true. We want people off the streets trying to make easy money in drugs or theft. We want everyone that wants to work, to have a job. We don't want violence. We don't want poverty. We don't want people living off of the government.
I went on the system over a year ago when I lost a very good paying job. I lost everything. I wound up homeless for a few months and fought like hell to get out of poverty. I am a normal, white average guy with a HS diploma and 8 years active service in the Marines with combat action and currently 40% disabled.
My resume didn't say what color I was. But it got my foot in a few doors and I worked my way out of it. It was the hardest thing I have had to do in my life. But I made it. I am just about to finally spring past break even (pay check to pay check) after working for a year. I finally have what I need to by a house again.
People need to learn to fight through it and do your thing to make it in this life. It is a cruel and unforgiving world. There is no such thing as being kept down when you are poverty stricken. You either lay there and continue to be a victim and do nothing, or you get off your rear and make the world what you want it to be.
This shooting & rioting crap... ...needs to be dealt with. Enforce our laws. Regardless what a cop does or doesn't do. Follow the law. If a cop screws up, let that cop deal with the consequences. It isn't up to us to deal with that situation. Allow the law do do its job. But if you break the law or riot, or whatever you do in protest, then deal with the consequences. I support law enforcement. I also support an investigation for a shooting. And I support that person dealing with the consequences of their actions.
***Steps off soap box, extends hand, drops microphone, walks away...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 13, 2015, 01:16:16 PM
It really is this simple. Avoid getting shot, just let the cop do his/her job and you can be on your way. Breaking the law, then deal with the consequences of your actions. If you run and the cop says, STOP or I'll shoot and you keep running, then deal with the consequences.
I have many friends on both sides of this fence. The ones filled with the most hate out of this all are the minorities. What I can't seem to get them to understand is that there is no reason to believe the white man wants to keep anyone down. Quite the opposite is true. We want people off the streets trying to make easy money in drugs or theft. We want everyone that wants to work, to have a job. We don't want violence. We don't want poverty. We don't want people living off of the government.
I went on the system over a year ago when I lost a very good paying job. I lost everything. I wound up homeless for a few months and fought like hell to get out of poverty. I am a normal, white average guy with a HS diploma and 8 years active service in the Marines with combat action and currently 40% disabled.
My resume didn't say what color I was. But it got my foot in a few doors and I worked my way out of it. It was the hardest thing I have had to do in my life. But I made it. I am just about to finally spring past break even (pay check to pay check) after working for a year. I finally have what I need to by a house again.
People need to learn to fight through it and do your thing to make it in this life. It is a cruel and unforgiving world. There is no such thing as being kept down when you are poverty stricken. You either lay there and continue to be a victim and do nothing, or you get off your rear and make the world what you want it to be.
This shooting & rioting crap... ...needs to be dealt with. Enforce our laws. Regardless what a cop does or doesn't do. Follow the law. If a cop screws up, let that cop deal with the consequences. It isn't up to us to deal with that situation. Allow the law do do its job. But if you break the law or riot, or whatever you do in protest, then deal with the consequences. I support law enforcement. I also support an investigation for a shooting. And I support that person dealing with the consequences of their actions.
***Steps off soap box, extends hand, drops microphone, walks away...
I wonder where we would be if people told those who planned the Boston Tea party...that they should just let The crown deal with the law breakers......
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 01:56:49 PM
I feel you slipknt and feel for you... your all guts and glory and all you got to show for it is your home that you recently bought.... you make me think of others in here that have given there all for their country and have to fight to show it... Don't worry it will all work out for you in the end... Service is service is and no one can take that away from you, your a warrior till the end...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Serenity on August 13, 2015, 03:39:41 PM
I wonder where we would be if people told those who planned the Boston Tea party...that they should just let The crown deal with the law breakers......
Are you really trying to draw a parallel between the Ferguson riots and the Boston Tea Party?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 13, 2015, 03:53:59 PM
Are you really trying to draw a parallel between the Ferguson riots and the Boston Tea Party?
people are angry for a reason.....
as I am sure back then they said we should follow the rules of those who rule us...for they have our best interests in mind.
there is a part in the declaration of Independence that we should read.....
something along the lines..."We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government,"
:salute
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 04:58:02 PM
so your saying get punched in the face get your gun grabbed and possibly more when you just robbed a store and it should be ok....?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 13, 2015, 04:59:41 PM
Full auto weapons are legal to own and use. It requires some paperwork and paying some extra tax. The incidence of gun related crimes committed by folks who do jump through the hoops to legally own one doesn't even register on a graph. So, if you happen to know someone with a legal full auto, thats one guy or gal that isn't a likely threat.
Correct, I owned 2 "class III" firearms. It's a matter of a $200 tax stamp, and being cleared by your local LEO to be able to own it (form 4)It must be a transferable gun (built pre 1986 if your a non FFL lic. Holder) You must also have the paperwork available for inspection by any Fed or state LEO upon request. Ie if you go to the range the paperwork goes with you.
Making the AR full auto isn't all that easy , it's the matter of a sear change, bolt carrier and disconnector. Thing is guns post 1986 are near impossible to do it to, and the above parts I've mentioned are all Class 3 components. Look to spend in the 5 digits range if you want to get into the full auto game.
Edit......Corrected should have said owned....have a mortgage wife and twins now.....they were sold when the kids were born for a hefty down payment on a house.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 05:19:31 PM
Correct, I own 2 "class III" firearms. It's a matter of a $200 tax stamp, and being cleared by your local LEO to be able to own it (form 4)It must be a transferable gun (built pre 1986) You must also have the paperwork available for inspection by any Fed or state LEO upon request. Ie if you go to the range the paperwork goes with you.
Making the AR full auto isn't all that easy , it's the matter of a sear change, bolt carrier and disconnector. Thing is guns post 1986 are near impossible to do it to, and the above parts I've mentioned are all Class 3 components. Look to spend in the 5 digits range if you want to get into the full auto game.
not to mention its a five year felony in massachusetts at least if your playing with these things, maybe more in your home state
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: mbailey on August 13, 2015, 05:25:06 PM
as I am sure back then they said we should follow the rules of those who rule us...for they have our best interests in mind.
there is a part in the declaration of Independence that we should read.....
something along the lines..."We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government,"
:salute
While I will be the first to agree that the government is not beyond reproach, and I believe governments should fear their citizens, I think you're making a big mistake standing with Ferguson. Just because a group is fighting a government does NOT make them someone to idolize, lest we find ourselves in another Al Qaeda situation.
Ferguson is NOT a group standing against tyranny or oppression. The case is closed, the officer was in the right. Ferguson is a bunch of lawless individuals looking for an excuse to cause mayhem.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 05:43:03 PM
can we agree on the fact that this teenager was road raging against a police officer on foot and that is why he was shot....? yea or nea...?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: mbailey on August 13, 2015, 05:44:21 PM
whats the penalty for owning a firearm (handgun) without license in PA...? Massachusetts is s commonwealth as well if that makes any difference...
You don't need a license to own a handgun or any gun in PA. 2 forms to fill out (Federal and state) , one phone call to the PA instant check and go home with it the same day (entire process takes about 20 mins. You do need a conceal carry permit to carry one concealed, but open carry is legal.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Someguy63 on August 13, 2015, 05:46:29 PM
You are joking right? You just said the reason I would not say the kid in the picture is a thug is because I'm black, when I say you're wrong you come up this this^^?
I'm not sure if you're purposely being obtuse or just have a low ability in the reading comprehension department.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 05:48:16 PM
You don't need a license to own a handgun or any gun in PA. 2 forms to fill out (Federal and state) , one phone call to the PA instant check and go home with it the same day (entire process takes about 20 mins. You do need a conceal carry permit to carry one concealed, but open carry is legal.
oh really i didn't know anything about that, good to know
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 05:49:48 PM
You are joking right? You just said the reason I would not say the kid in the picture is a thug is because I'm black, when I say you're wrong you come up this this^^?
I'm not sure if you're purposely being obtuse or just have a low ability in the reading comprehension department.
i'm sorry if i thought you were something else than what you were not my intention
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Someguy63 on August 13, 2015, 05:57:01 PM
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Scherf on August 13, 2015, 06:25:00 PM
Anyway, full-auto or not, assuming some hotheads take it on themselves to loot a Walgreens in front of the AR-15 guys, latter open fire, hit and kill a looter - normal murder prosecution or are they actually operating under some kind of special legal arrangement?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 06:28:19 PM
special prosecution under protection of property i say... i don't know what the law is in missouri is though...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 13, 2015, 06:28:36 PM
These guys aren't wandering around a peaceful neighborhood. They are in an area of KNOWN violence, knowing the police CANNOT adequately protect people or property. If you were to stay there with anything BUT an AR-15 and at least 4 mags, I'd think you were mentally deficient. This wasn't some Sunday stroll, or the million man march. They KNEW violence would ensue, and they attempted to diffuse it in areas of innocent victims. You don't take a bolt action rifle to riot, especially one even the police can't control. The local citizens and businesses were happy to have the oath keepers there as their only real line of defense. They were professional, respectful, and they did their jobs preventing violence where they stood their beat, without hurting anyone or breaking any laws.
Fear does not trump truth.
Who asked them to come? which local businesses? Did the police ask for thier help? I've seen nothing to suggest they were asked to assist. Feel free to point me to that information. Only thing I've seen was that they said a reporter asked them although he claimed he had not. Has something new come to light? Who decided it was thier job?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: mbailey on August 13, 2015, 06:34:28 PM
Anyway, full-auto or not, assuming some hotheads take it on themselves to loot a Walgreens in front of the AR-15 guys, latter open fire, hit and kill a looter - normal murder prosecution or are they actually operating under some kind of special legal arrangement?
Murder charge more than likely 1st degree. They could not do anything to protect the Walgreens. If it were their business or home it's different. Or if it were self defense.... But a prosecutor would have an easy time convicting them of (more than likely) a lesser murder charge/manslaughter You can't go looking for trouble
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 06:36:49 PM
mbailey is always looking for that hit
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 06:39:20 PM
we've all toked a ton and we need to know who the efff is out of hand/control. cuz if we don't i'd die without you...... lol
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: mbailey on August 13, 2015, 07:08:17 PM
Actually use to teach a conceal carry class in conjunction with a retired Judge and retired Cou nty District Attorney. I did the mechanics and shooting portion, they did the legal end/ramifications of a self defense oriented shooting
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 07:12:28 PM
do you still do it is that the question...?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: guncrasher on August 13, 2015, 07:18:20 PM
Ok. Tell me what you'd have said if the quote would have read, "St. Louis Police Chief Jon Belmar, who was present during the protests on Monday, embraced the presence of the Oath Keepers, describing the group as being a "lawful, polite, and completely within their rights as citizens."
Without knowing how he really feels, I have a hunch he'd have said what he said regardless. Police chiefs aren't usually quick to admit their departments can't handle rioting/protests when a reporter is the one asking the question.
So let me get this straight.
You want me to pretend that the Police Chief didn't say what he said. :headscratch:
And Then:
You want me to, I guess, Magic Think that he said the Oath Keepers were from some sort of Sisters of Mercy cloister, because, -- wink - wink -- we really know what he meant to say. :huh :huh :huh :huh
OK, give me a minute to do that. :pray :pray :pray :pray
You know, as hard as I try, I still see the same outcome.
Look, it is really disappointing all around. The whole thing shows a complete failure of leadership at the local, county and State level. And yes, you have to question local community leaders and wonder what they did, or perhaps didn't do, to mark the one year anniversary.
It appears as if the Oath Keepers did not help to diffuse the situation. The piece says that the Southern Poverty Law Center identifies them as a “fiercely anti-government, militaristic group”. And "Dennis Kenney, a professor of criminal justice at John Jay College in New York, said that the organization prides itself on being provocative."...."They are as much trying to pick a fight with the police as anyone else.”
Not helpful.
I think that the term that comes to my mind is vigilante.
And BTW, IMO, as things stand right now, we will be discussing the exact same stories from Ferguson a year from now.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 07:42:03 PM
no not vigilante peacekeeper...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 13, 2015, 07:45:39 PM
vig·i·lan·te ˌvijəˈlan(t)ē/ noun a member of a self-appointed group of citizens who undertake law enforcement in their community without legal authority, typically because the legal agencies are thought to be inadequate.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 13, 2015, 07:49:19 PM
you'd be surprised with all the unpeacekeeping that goes round the city day after day..
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 13, 2015, 08:06:05 PM
you'd be surprised with all the unpeacekeeping that goes round the city day after day..
To me, a peacekeeper is someone like my Dad, who spent two years as a civilian medical logistics officer in Bosnia first with IFOR and then with SFOR with nothing more than a blue helmet and flak jacket for protection.
Those guys are vigilantes and they did not, and they are not, helping the community.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 13, 2015, 08:07:34 PM
You want me to pretend that the Police Chief didn't say what he said. :headscratch:
And Then:
You want me to, I guess, Magic Think that he said the Oath Keepers were from some sort of Sisters of Mercy cloister, because, -- wink - wink -- we really know what he meant to say. :huh :huh :huh :huh
OK, give me a minute to do that. :pray :pray :pray :pray
You know, as hard as I try, I still see the same outcome.
Look, it is really disappointing all around. The whole thing shows a complete failure of leadership at the local, county and State level. And yes, you have to question local community leaders and wonder what they did, or perhaps didn't do, to mark the one year anniversary.
It appears as if the Oath Keepers did not help to diffuse the situation. The piece says that the Southern Poverty Law Center identifies them as a “fiercely anti-government, militaristic group”. And "Dennis Kenney, a professor of criminal justice at John Jay College in New York, said that the organization prides itself on being provocative."...."They are as much trying to pick a fight with the police as anyone else.”
Not helpful.
I think that the term that comes to my mind is vigilante.
And BTW, IMO, as things stand right now, we will be discussing the exact same stories from Ferguson a year from now.
No. I'm saying that politically the chief needed to say what he said, regardless of how he felt personally or any impact the group may have had. It's not hard to understand why.
How did the Oath Keepers further inflame the situation? Because The Guardian wrote a titled article and the SPLC thinks guns are icky and labels most who own them extremists? Seems to me one year ago things were a bit worse, what with the fires and looting and whatnot. Was that because they were there this time? Dunno, but it wasn't any worse than the first time the news was covering this.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 13, 2015, 09:42:32 PM
Again I ask, who asked those guys to show up armed to keep the peace?
If I make a decision to go to some other neighborhood with my AR-15 with a bullet proof vest and my AR equipped like I think I'm some sort of combat commando, how do you know or the police know what my intentions are?
How would that not be seen as provocative? What gives me the right to take the law into my own hands? Defending my home I get. Deciding to "defend" someone else's home without checking with the police or the homeowner to me is crossing the line.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 13, 2015, 09:53:37 PM
No. I'm saying that politically the chief needed to say what he said, regardless of how he felt personally or any impact the group may have had. It's not hard to understand why.
How did the Oath Keepers further inflame the situation? Because The Guardian wrote a titled article and the SPLC thinks guns are icky and labels most who own them extremists? Seems to me one year ago things were a bit worse, what with the fires and looting and whatnot. Was that because they were there this time? Dunno, but it wasn't any worse than the first time the news was covering this.
I would agree that the chief needed to be careful in want he said. And once you get to be Chief, you must learn to be pretty careful with your words. I think that we agree on that. In fact, from what I can tell, the next day the chief refused comment and stood behind the county exc. (I think that is who it was). But you know, as long as we are playing make believe, this is sort of what I think he might have said if he really wanted the Oath Keepers around but could not say so.
"We appreciate the well meaning sentiments and offers of assistance we are receiving from throughout the country during this difficult time. But right now our focus is to work with local and state law enforcement to bring claim to the situation."
As for charges against the Guardian, I think that you guys have presented sometimes weak, and in all honesty sometimes silly, arguments for an egregious bias on the part of the paper and the reporter.
In the space of about 10 minutes, I sequentially collected, (in order) a number of news links from Google as they popped up.
There is everything from the left to the far right (and a bunch of stuff in the middle) in the array list that came up. They all had a common theme. Any guesses as to what that theme might be?
… some local officials say the Oath Keepers aren't helpful, or even welcome. …
Another protester, Mary Chandler, said the police failed to confront the Oath Keepers in the way they challenge some of the protesters in Ferguson. "We can't even stand on this side of the street without the weapons being pointed at us," Chandler said during a street demonstration on Tuesday night. "But yet you can bring those people that can come in, no questions asked, with rifles and things strapped across their body and everything is OK and you don't feel any sense of danger at all."
Both St. Louis County Police Chief Jon Belmar and County Executive Steve Stenger say the Oath Keepers aren't welcome in Ferguson.
Stenger told St. Louis Public Radio's Jason Rosenbaum, "The last thing you need in a situation like we have are people walking around with semi-automatic weapons. It's inflaming a situation that's already inflamed."
…, St. Louis County Police Chief Jon Belmar described their presence as "both unnecessary and inflammatory."
The organization — which claims to have more than 30,000 members — was founded in 2004 by former U.S. Army paratrooper and Yale Law School graduate Stewart Rhodes.
Rhodes has referred to Hillary Clinton as "Hitlery" and earlier this year said that Sen. John McCain should be tried for treason and "hung by the neck until dead" for going "along with the program of the destruction of this country."
Bearing Arms - Guns & Patriots - SAVING LIBERTY AND LIVES http://bearingarms.com/oath-keepers-go-home/
It seems quite clear that the four white Oath Keepers self-deployed to a black neighborhood in which there is considerable racial tension, in what many regard as nothing more or less than a show of force. They interjected themselves into a community where they were neither wanted nor requested, and raised tensions instead of assuaging them as the prior group of Oath Keepers did in December of 2014.
I don’t know anything about the individual Oath Keepers involved in this most recent appearance of the Oath Keepers in Ferguson, but then again, their intentions and pedigrees are all but irrelevant. The public perception of what they were doing, and why they were there, is what matters.
Oath Keepers, go home.
Chicago Tribune http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-ferguson-oath-keepers-armed-militia-20150811-story.html
Nabeehah Azeez called the presence of the armed men "a contradiction in how things work."
"The rules don't apply to everyone," she said. "If those were black men walking around with rifles, they probably wouldn't be living today
County police ordered them [Oath Keepers] to leave then, but group members intermittently returned.
Why is it that white Americans carry high-powered weapons openly in the name of "property," while African Americans constantly risk the full wrath of state power for virtually no reason?
BBC http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-33867245
One protester was filmed asking an Oath Keeper member "If you're armed, why can't the protesters be armed? Doesn't the second amendment apply to them too?"
Another man remarks, "what about protecting black people?", to which the so-called Oath Keeper replied: "All lives matter, sure."
St Louis Today http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/metro/armed-members-of-oath-keepers-return-to-ferguson-streets/article_e1275f62-db42-5cf5-9bac-6b5c8fb43981.html
St. Louis County Executive Steve Stenger however decried the arrival of the Oath Keepers on Ferguson streets. "Their presence is unnecessary and it is inflammatory," the county executive told reporters Tuesday evening. "The last thing we need in this situation is people walking around with automatic weapons. They are inflaming a situation that is already inflamed."
"You're going to bring some uncommissioned citizens, white citizens, into a black community like this? It's disrespectful," said Talal Ahmad, 30, who is black and has been a fixture of the last year's protests, which prompted a Justice Department review that found Ferguson's police department routinely violated city residents' civil rights.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 13, 2015, 10:17:48 PM
You'd think there would have been, you know, like violence and stuff since these racist, trigger happy, machine gun toting white guys were running around pointing guns at everyone.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 14, 2015, 12:32:40 AM
You'd think there would have been, you know, like violence and stuff since these racist, trigger happy, machine gun toting white guys were running around pointing guns at everyone.
was thier presence requested? Do you believe it is reasonable for them to have placed themselves into a situation as they did. You seem to be suggesting that somehow they are responsible for less violence. Do you really believe there would have been more violence without them? Do you believe the police couldn't handle things on thier own? Do you believe they went to Ferguson for some higher calling or might thier motivation have been a bit more self serving?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 14, 2015, 07:29:40 AM
You'd think there would have been, you know, like violence and stuff since these racist, trigger happy, machine gun toting white guys were running around pointing guns at everyone.
I never said that these guys are racist. Now, as I understand it, they have a membership of around 30,000. Within that population I would not be surprised if there were some, but I have no reason to a priori paint the entire group with that brush. (BTW, and this may go to a point closer to yours, I would not be surprised if there was a high degree of tolerance for such people within the group. I may be wrong.)
What is clear, however, is that they are maneuvering within a volatile environment where racial prejudices (whether conscious or unconscious) are a significant factor in bringing significant risk to life, liberty and property.
When they freely roam the streets with exposed armaments which (and here I’m going to lose a whole bunch of you guys) to the general population appear to be instruments of violence teleported in from some far off distant savage conflict, it is not unreasonable for people to feel and express a strong concern. And when they freely roam the streets unchallenged while local residents of the community are swiftly and forcible pounced upon based on nothing more than an anonymous tip at a police station, a strong sense of concern easily transforms into a sense of alarm and perhaps fear or terror.
A failure in civic agency does not dictate that we should turn to a Thunderdome theory of justice.
They are not helping. They are inflaming the situation. They need to go home.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SlipKnt on August 14, 2015, 07:55:08 AM
I am more a Patriot than most. I am a ][][][%er and I understand what you are trying to say, Ink, however I refuse to believe the rioters and looters are trying to do anything patriotic for the good of the country and an American way of life.
I am against big government.
The Boston Tea Party was about oppressive and over taxing government. Taxation without representation. They rose against a tyrannical government.
Law enforcement isn't collecting the King's taxes and they are not taking up residence in the people's quarters.
There is a huge difference between the Ferguson / Baltimore rioters and the Boston Tea Party. HUGE difference...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Rich46yo on August 14, 2015, 11:22:01 AM
Quote
There is a huge difference between the Ferguson / Baltimore rioters and the Boston Tea Party. HUGE difference...
Of course, but it sounded good. Never underestimate the ability of some people to legitimize what is clearly Lawless behavior. Ha ha ha ha, The "Boston Tea Party"?
From here I guess this kid was heading to the harbor to protest all his over-taxation and Po-Po taking over his crib to lay their heads down and steal from his people.
More overtaxed people tossing tea into the sea...I mean pickup.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: DmonSlyr on August 14, 2015, 11:32:24 AM
Of course, but it sounded good. Never underestimate the ability of some people to legitimize what is clearly Lawless behavior. Ha ha ha ha, The "Boston Tea Party"?
From here I guess this kid was heading to the harbor to protest all his over-taxation and Po-Po taking over his crib to lay their heads down and steal from his people.
More overtaxed people tossing tea into the sea...I mean pickup.
Wow I've never seen that first video before but that dude thought he was just too damn big and bad for nothing to happen to him. Looks like a real thug to me.
What those people did to that guys store was insane.
Changeup had a pretty meme with the picture of him after they louted his store.
Those people are savages.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 14, 2015, 11:47:27 AM
what i can't understand is why they are looting and rioting after the robber, officer assaulter, was shot and killed, Ferguson is a dumb city probably be looking like detroit soon enough...
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 14, 2015, 11:53:07 AM
lol pickup says rich lol
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 14, 2015, 01:02:59 PM
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Rich46yo on August 14, 2015, 01:52:05 PM
Well it all went to hell when the first big settlement was handed out. Many of these encounters are started by people who want to force a violent encounter with police, catch a few cracks "filmed of course", and an easy $10 K settlement to quickly follow just to get the footage off of you tube.
The other night we had large groups of yutes throwing rocks at the cars and I saw some of them running around with their cell phones attached to one of these http://www.abt.com/product/85568/ProMaster-PRO6168.html?utm_source=google&utm_medium=sc&utm_campaign=PRO6168&camptype=cpcGooglePLA&kwid=productads-plaid^169455101284-sku^85568-adType^PLA-device^c-adid^77416723924 Its reached the point of insanity.
Now theres only two ways to get 20yos to stop throwing rocks at your car. Get out and make them wish they didnt even know what a rock was or drive away. So if you do the first then who knows how much tax payer $$ will be given away by stupid juries? Let alone getting fired when the video goes viral.
So if it aint your car and it aint your 'hood then why get your blood pressure up? Feel me?
Thats what its come to.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 14, 2015, 01:55:33 PM
Again I ask, who asked those guys to show up armed to keep the peace?
I don't know. I'd assume the property owners would have told them to move along if they didn't want them to be there. Of course, they could have been standing on the sidewalk, in which case I'd imagine it wouldn't matter.
If I make a decision to go to some other neighborhood with my AR-15 with a bullet proof vest and my AR equipped like I think I'm some sort of combat commando, how do you know or the police know what my intentions are?
You'd probably wanna go talk to one of the cops in sight if you were going to do that. I'd imagine there was some conversation with the police.
How would that not be seen as provocative? What gives me the right to take the law into my own hands? Defending my home I get. Deciding to "defend" someone else's home without checking with the police or the homeowner to me is crossing the line.
It's only crossing the line because the guys in the article were white, which is... ummm... well, you know. :)
FWIW, one of the protesters in one of the articles was eluding to that fact, and even asked how come the 2nd Amendment didn't apply to them. I'm of the opinion that there would have been much less in the way of violence the first go round if there had been more community members armed and ready to protect their property. Oh, and the cops might have helped out a bit too.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 14, 2015, 02:11:23 PM
I never said that these guys are racist. Now, as I understand it, they have a membership of around 30,000. Within that population I would not be surprised if there were some, but I have no reason to a priori paint the entire group with that brush. (BTW, and this may go to a point closer to yours, I would not be surprised if there was a high degree of tolerance for such people within the group. I may be wrong.)
lol... why? Unless you know more than I do about them, you're just projecting some sort of prejudice you picked up along the way.
What is clear, however, is that they are maneuvering within a volatile environment where racial prejudices (whether conscious or unconscious) are a significant factor in bringing significant risk to life, liberty and property.
Like I eluded to earlier, there was actually less violence with their presence. On the surface it appears it actually may have prevented property damage and crime.
When they freely roam the streets with exposed armaments which (and here I’m going to lose a whole bunch of you guys) to the general population appear to be instruments of violence teleported in from some far off distant savage conflict, it is not unreasonable for people to feel and express a strong concern. And when they freely roam the streets unchallenged while local residents of the community are swiftly and forcible pounced upon based on nothing more than an anonymous tip at a police station, a strong sense of concern easily transforms into a sense of alarm and perhaps fear or terror.
Freely roaming the streets unchallenged sounds familiar... kinda like a... RIOT! And looting! :)
As for the guys just standing there who were searched or whatever because of the anonymous tip... I don't know where you're going with this. Did the Oath Keepers make the phony call to prank these guys? It would seem to me that mass demonstrations like this, in an area that was recently ravaged because of social unrest, this sort of thing probably happens more than normal. I wouldn't like it either if I were the one searched for no reason, but unfortunately there's little you can do except not be standing where the cops are going to look at you.
A failure in civic agency does not dictate that we should turn to a Thunderdome theory of justice.
They are not helping. They are inflaming the situation. They need to go home.
Thunderdome is pure hyperbole. I'd agree with you if they were out making citizens arrests and rummaging through refrigerators, but as it was they came (I suppose anyway from the articles) to help keep a lid on violence and it appears they might have helped do that.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 14, 2015, 02:15:13 PM
I am more a Patriot than most. I am a ][][][%er and I understand what you are trying to say, Ink, however I refuse to believe the rioters and looters are trying to do anything patriotic for the good of the country and an American way of life.
I am against big government.
The Boston Tea Party was about oppressive and over taxing government. Taxation without representation. They rose against a tyrannical government.
Law enforcement isn't collecting the King's taxes and they are not taking up residence in the people's quarters.
There is a huge difference between the Ferguson / Baltimore rioters and the Boston Tea Party. HUGE difference...
I am gonna say this nice and slow so you who are heard headed can understand....
not that you will....because you guys of course know it all and back one of the most crooked governments to ever exist.
after hundreds of years of rape murder and abuse....people have had enough....they are pissed...
they have no clue how to express that anger...or what to do to change the way they are treated.....
if you cant see the condition of this country is straight in the toilet...you are blind.
and if you think the Tea party was only about taxation....... :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl
you probably think Christopher Columbus was a great man.
here drink some more koolaid.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 14, 2015, 02:15:20 PM
Correct, I owned 2 "class III" firearms. It's a matter of a $200 tax stamp, and being cleared by your local LEO to be able to own it (form 4)It must be a transferable gun (built pre 1986 if your a non FFL lic. Holder) You must also have the paperwork available for inspection by any Fed or state LEO upon request. Ie if you go to the range the paperwork goes with you.
Making the AR full auto isn't all that easy , it's the matter of a sear change, bolt carrier and disconnector. Thing is guns post 1986 are near impossible to do it to, and the above parts I've mentioned are all Class 3 components. Look to spend in the 5 digits range if you want to get into the full auto game.
Edit......Corrected should have said owned....have a mortgage wife and twins now.....they were sold when the kids were born for a hefty down payment on a house.
I am sorry, sometimes I am a little slow. Just so that I understand, you are saying that under certain conditions a civilian can own a machine gun (something that fires off some number of bullets in a burst) if the gun was made before 1986 and that a licensed civilian can own any full auto gun. Yes? No?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 14, 2015, 03:25:35 PM
I don't know. I'd assume the property owners would have told them to move along if they didn't want them to be there. Of course, they could have been standing on the sidewalk, in which case I'd imagine it wouldn't matter.
You'd probably wanna go talk to one of the cops in sight if you were going to do that. I'd imagine there was some conversation with the police. It's only crossing the line because the guys in the article were white, which is... ummm... well, you know. :)
FWIW, one of the protesters in one of the articles was eluding to that fact, and even asked how come the 2nd Amendment didn't apply to them. I'm of the opinion that there would have been much less in the way of violence the first go round if there had been more community members armed and ready to protect their property. Oh, and the cops might have helped out a bit too.
For me them showing up armed is the issue. It was just as Stupid for the Black Panthers to show up in Waller Texas two days ago exercising thier right to open carry with thier assault rifles. "Legally" they were within thier rights. That doesn't make it any less idiotic.
Are you just as supportive of them in that situation? My understanding the police response was a lot different to them than it was in Ferguson to the Oath Keepers. That probably had nothing to do with race either :)
If the suggestion here is we will be a better country if we all carry guns, then we are truly screwed.
Are you just as ok with that?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Changeup on August 14, 2015, 03:32:52 PM
I am sorry, sometimes I am a little slow. Just so that I understand, you are saying that under certain conditions a civilian can own a machine gun (something that fires off some number of bullets in a burst) if the gun was made before 1986 and that a licensed civilian can own any full auto gun. Yes? No?
Yes and fully suppressed as well and you can hunt with it in Texas. Thought I'd throw that into the discussion.
I found a fully automatic, fully suppressed HK MP5 here in Dallas for 34,000.00. Not in my price range but legal.
Edit: here is one in FL. http://www.avguns.com/class3/machine_guns/mp5-subgun-suppressed-package.html
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Changeup on August 14, 2015, 03:41:51 PM
For me them showing up armed is the issue. It was just as Stupid for the Black Panthers to show up in Waller Texas two days ago exercising thier right to open carry with thier assault rifles. "Legally" they were within thier rights. That doesn't make it any less idiotic.
Are you just as supportive of them in that situation? My understanding the police response was a lot different to them than it was in Ferguson to the Oath Keepers. That probably had nothing to do with race either :)
If the suggestion here is we will be a better country if we all carry guns, then we are truly screwed.
Are you just as ok with that?
How did you get from property owners allowing armed security to guard their property during possible riots to it would be a better country if we all carried guns?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 14, 2015, 03:50:23 PM
For me them showing up armed is the issue. It was just as Stupid for the Black Panthers to show up in Waller Texas two days ago exercising thier right to open carry with thier assault rifles. "Legally" they were within thier rights. That doesn't make it any less idiotic.
Are you just as supportive of them in that situation? My understanding the police response was a lot different to them than it was in Ferguson to the Oath Keepers. That probably had nothing to do with race either :)
If the suggestion here is we will be a better country if we all carry guns, then we are truly screwed.
Are you just as ok with that?
You'd think shouting, "No more pigs in our community" may have had something to do with a different reaction from the police... right outside of the jail. :uhoh
But honestly, no, I don't have any problem with that. Even though in this case, the people with guns weren't really there to protect anything, they were there to protest and show force, but given that it was just a show and I'm not inherently afraid of a gun that isn't pointed at me, it's all good as long as everyone (to include the police) keeps their cool.
That being said, your point is not lost on me. If you're in the Oath Keepers or the Black Panthers and you take your gun to a rally or Ferguson or wherever, you accept the potential consequences if gunpowder and emotion mix. But making that decision is up to the individual or group, not you or I.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: SysError on August 14, 2015, 03:57:03 PM
Yes and fully suppressed as well and you can hunt with it in Texas. Thought I'd throw that into the discussion.
I found a fully automatic, fully suppressed HK MP5 here in Dallas for 34,000.00. Not in my price range but legal.
Edit: here is one in FL. http://www.avguns.com/class3/machine_guns/mp5-subgun-suppressed-package.html
I did not know that. I thought that they only went to the military and certain LEs.
Not sure why, but I used to think that the most civilians could get was a semi-auto with some sort spring assisted trigger. At $34k maybe it is an issue of practical vs. possible.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 14, 2015, 04:01:14 PM
there is a war brewing...to many it was started a long time ago.....
sadly it is gonna get much worse before it gets better.
you have to break down to restore.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 14, 2015, 04:03:18 PM
You'd think shouting, "No more pigs in our community" may have had something to do with a different reaction from the police... right outside of the jail. :uhoh
But honestly, no, I don't have any problem with that.
That being said, your point is not lost on me. If you're in the Oath Keepers or the Black Panthers and you take your gun to a rally or Ferguson or wherever, you accept the potential consequences if gunpowder and emotion mix. But making that decision is up to the individual or group, not you or I.
Interesting trade off don't you think? Those who bring thier guns have to live with the conseqences of thier choice. Sadly those who don't bring guns have to live with the choice too.
So it still those compensating for the smallest joystick who set the tone. And that to me is frightening. So much for a civilized society.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 14, 2015, 04:04:40 PM
And sadly for many on both sides of that war seem to be wishing it would happen fast so they can "go tactical"
The truly sad part is 90% don't know what "going tactical" means, how it's used, or when it's used. They believe if you have a ghillie suit you ordered from bushrag.com and a deer rifle with a scope, you're a sniper. Virtually none of them can fire their weapons in a straight line under duress. But they sure dress the part. Oath Keepers and Black Panthers remind me of baseball's 5'Oclock hitters. Ever heard the term? All of these paramilitary groups are 5 O clock hitters.
It's defined here for your information and viewing pleasure.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Triton28 on August 14, 2015, 05:50:55 PM
Interesting trade off don't you think? Those who bring thier guns have to live with the conseqences of thier choice. Sadly those who don't bring guns have to live with the choice too.
So it still those compensating for the smallest joystick who set the tone. And that to me is frightening. So much for a civilized society.
The time honored debate: Individual liberty vs. Safety of society.
There's never an easy answer, but I enjoy the conversation. :cheers:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 14, 2015, 05:57:48 PM
The time honored debate: Individual liberty vs. Safety of society.
There's never an easy answer, but I enjoy the conversation. :cheers:
"In a state of tranquillity, wealth, and luxury, our descendants would forget the arts of war* and the noble activity and zeal which made their ancestors invincible. Every art of corruption would be employed to loosen the bond of union which renders our resistance formidable. When the spirit of liberty, which now animates our hearts and gives success to our arms*, is extinct, our numbers will accelerate our ruin and render us easier victims to tyranny. If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquillity of servitude than the animating contest of freedom—go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen!"
this is quite powerful
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Changeup on August 14, 2015, 06:10:54 PM
"In a state of tranquillity, wealth, and luxury, our descendants would forget the arts of war* and the noble activity and zeal which made their ancestors invincible. Every art of corruption would be employed to loosen the bond of union which renders our resistance formidable. When the spirit of liberty, which now animates our hearts and gives success to our arms*, is extinct, our numbers will accelerate our ruin and render us easier victims to tyranny. If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquillity of servitude than the animating contest of freedom—go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen!"
this is quite powerful
INK,
Sam Adams speech has nothing to do with vigilante peacekeepers. Sam was motivating people to do the very thing you claimed earlier to not understand....prepare to commit violence in the name of freedom. Ferguson people arent fighting for freedom. They're just pissed off and too stupid to do something the right way
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Aspen on August 14, 2015, 06:33:37 PM
"He who has strength to chain down the wolf is a madman if he let him loose without drawing his teeth and paring his nails."
Regardless of where this thread drifted, that was a badass speech Adam's gave.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 14, 2015, 06:54:23 PM
Sam Adams speech has nothing to do with vigilante peacekeepers. Sam was motivating people to do the very thing you claimed earlier to not understand....prepare to commit violence in the name of freedom. Ferguson people arent fighting for freedom. They're just pissed off and too stupid to do something the right way
I do not understand how some people Love violence....
maybe I do understand it better then I realize, I lived a life of violence...but I was also blind and did not see what life was about or how important the gift of life is....
people are angry...not just over that shooting that caused the riots...people everywhere are tired of being abused...its been going on for a very long time....
its so far deeper then just Ferguson...
violence should be the last resort...the very last resort...I do believe that...
some people understand only violence though....no matter how much you try to change a thought process some people will only learn through pain.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 14, 2015, 07:01:44 PM
The truly sad part is 90% don't know what "going tactical" means, how it's used, or when it's used. They believe if you have a ghillie suit you ordered from bushrag.com and a deer rifle with a scope, you're a sniper. Virtually none of them can fire their weapons in a straight line under duress. But they sure dress the part. Oath Keepers and Black Panthers remind me of baseball's 5'Oclock hitters. Ever heard the term? All of these paramilitary groups are 5 O clock hitters.
It's defined here for your information and viewing pleasure.
Amen to that.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 14, 2015, 07:08:44 PM
I do not understand how some people Love violence....
maybe I do understand it better then I realize, I lived a life of violence...but I was also blind and did not see what life was about or how important the gift of life is....
people are angry...not just over that shooting that caused the riots...people everywhere are tired of being abused...its been going on for a very long time....
its so far deeper then just Ferguson...
violence should be the last resort...the very last resort...I do believe that...
some people understand only violence though....no matter how much you try to change a thought process some people will only learn through pain.
I remember as a little kid seeing the riots in Detroit, Watts, Plainfield etc on TV and asking my parents what it was about. They did their best to explain it to me, but I was too young to really get it. Having been lucky enough to have been born into a family that was settled and safe, and allowed the chance to get a good education and go out and make a life for myself, I can't claim to know what its like, but I've worked with enough kids over the years who didn't know where the next meal was coming from. It made it easy to understand why paying attention in school was less important and why that anger begins to fester.
My daughter teaches at a school where 90 percent of the kids get their breakfast and lunch at school. Again smart kids with little hope, just wondering if they'll have supper when they get home, and where home might be that night.
It isn't all about 'pulling up by the boot straps". A lot of it is that history you are talking about where that anger is the only thing you can really claim as your own.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: guncrasher on August 14, 2015, 07:11:57 PM
a few years back, my mom was stopped in arizona on the way to mexico. when she explained she was a us citizen, the police officer said that there was no way she could be a citizen. she has a heavy mexican accent, made even worst as she got scared.
I can go on and talk about the time when I used to be in north carolina and every now and then I would go into a store and some clerk would tell me to go somewhere else, because he/she wasnt gonna help me. when I was with my ex girlfriend who was white a couple of times we were looked at different because they saw me as another illegal alien trying to get a green card.
just last saturday I was waiting for this girl to come and have a couple of drinks with me. there was a wedding going on next door and saw this 3 kids, 20 something talking about how they were bored and should try to pick up a girl. when my friend showed up, they looked at her and said she looked nice and too bad she wasnt white.
even at work, I hear my coworkers talk about this black guys and call him demeaning names like "maya" and "hediondo". I always tell them how would you guys like to be called wetbacks.
when I first joined the marines, this white kid, he meant nothing, but just asked me why I wanted to join, he asked me if it was the money. I told him I was making 1800 a month and quit to earn 599 I think. I also told him because this was my country too. he kindda looked at me weird first. then he just smiled and walked away. I guess he understood.
some guys say, it wasnt me and that is probably right. it wasnt you, but then again we all know prejudiced people and sometimes we stopped them and some other times we dont.
point is we are all screwed up as a group due to a minority from each side and either we all help each other for the best or we all are really are gonna pay for it.
keep saying it wasnt me and it will really soon come out that it was actually you too.
semp
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 14, 2015, 07:36:37 PM
I remember as a little kid seeing the riots in Detroit, Watts, Plainfield etc on TV and asking my parents what it was about. They did their best to explain it to me, but I was too young to really get it. Having been lucky enough to have been born into a family that was settled and safe, and allowed the chance to get a good education and go out and make a life for myself, I can't claim to know what its like, but I've worked with enough kids over the years who didn't know where the next meal was coming from. It made it easy to understand why paying attention in school was less important and why that anger begins to fester.
My daughter teaches at a school where 90 percent of the kids get their breakfast and lunch at school. Again smart kids with little hope, just wondering if they'll have supper when they get home, and where home might be that night.
It isn't all about 'pulling up by the boot straps". A lot of it is that history you are talking about where that anger is the only thing you can really claim as your own.
:salute
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: bustr on August 14, 2015, 08:10:34 PM
Semp it distills down to, love others as you love yourself, forgive others as you ask to be forgiven, and love the sinner but, hate the sin. None of us get off this ship alive in the end.
It's been 2000 years since this was first spoken, and still these three states of mind are the hardest for humans to achieve about those not their family, tribe, or race. And barely at times towards the aforementioned. Condemnation becomes the coin of the realm.
Most people do not understand the original language source for two very important admonishments or laws from the original Hebrew.
"Judge not lest ye be judged" was really "Condemn not lest thy be condemned.".
"Thou shalt not kill" was really "Thou shalt not murder.".
You judge every moment of your day to make choices. Condemnation is permanent and reserved for someone else who can condemn you for eternity versus you as a human cannot actually condemn someone to anything in this life but physical death. As long as you are alive you can judge your circumstance and make changes. You have the right to kill to save your life or defend that of others. No one has the right to murder another, which was what many Kings in Europe up to and past King James did to force obedience and worship of their power. Or be condemned to physical death.
Short of a mental defect, anyone can be trained without knowing it visa poor life choices, or willingly like a soldier, to respond without conscious thought with violence. If it is not impaired by a mental defect, you can also choose to train that out of yourself by conscious effort and the help of a professional. Or by choosing to walk away from the original bad choices and life style. Everyone knows someone who when young was a criminal who now is a family man with kids.
The real miracle is that we can changes these things by exercising our power of choice.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Mar on August 14, 2015, 08:35:25 PM
Semp it distills down to, love others as you love yourself, forgive others as you ask to be forgiven, and love the sinner but, hate the sin. None of us get off this ship alive in the end.
It's been 2000 years since this was first spoken, and still these three states of mind are the hardest for humans to achieve about those not their family, tribe, or race. And barely at times towards the aforementioned. Condemnation becomes the coin of the realm.
Most people do not understand the original language source for two very important admonishments or laws from the original Hebrew.
"Judge not lest ye be judged" was really "Condemn not lest thy be condemned.".
"Thou shalt not kill" was really "Thou shalt not murder.".
You judge every moment of your day to make choices. Condemnation is permanent and reserved for someone else who can condemn you for eternity versus you as a human cannot actually condemn someone to anything in this life but physical death. As long as you are alive you can judge your circumstance and make changes. You have the right to kill to save your life or defend that of others. No one has the right to murder another, which was what many Kings in Europe up to and past King James did to force obedience and worship of their power. Or be condemned to physical death.
Short of a mental defect, anyone can be trained without knowing it visa poor life choices, or willingly like a soldier, to respond without conscious thought with violence. If it is not impaired by a mental defect, you can also choose to train that out of yourself by conscious effort and the help of a professional. Or by choosing to walk away from the original bad choices and life style. Everyone knows someone who when young was a criminal who now is a family man with kids.
The real miracle is that we can changes these things by exercising our power of choice.
Good stuff right there! :aok
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: ink on August 14, 2015, 08:36:17 PM
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Changeup on August 14, 2015, 09:25:35 PM
My favorite on man...and his decisions
"Can anything be imagined so ridiculous, that this miserable and wretched creature man, who is not so much as master of himself, but subject to the injuries of all things, should call himself master and emperor of the world, of which he has not power to know the least part, much less to command the whole?"
de Montaigne
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Guppy35 on August 14, 2015, 10:34:45 PM
It will be 10 years ago August 28th that I lost my oldest son and youngest daughter in a car wreck. The only 'gift' I got from that horrific event was the understanding that in the end all that matters are the people.
You don't go to your grave with power, or the most stuff or with a kill board for your conquests. You do go knowing how you treated those around you. That's why it drives me nuts some times when I see how so much of what we're told is important is based on power, greed or conquest.
It should be what have we done to make life better for all of us, not just ourselves. But of course that makes me a socialist and that's bad :)
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Changeup on August 15, 2015, 12:33:11 AM
It should be what have we done to make life better for all of us, not just ourselves. But of course that makes me a socialist and that's bad :)
Sometimes being tough on people or helping people make difficult decisions is making life better for them. Its not all about gifting or legacy programs. Teach someone to fish...that's not socialist but if you've never fished before, it'd sure be easier to let someone else do it. Instead, you have to fight through the failure. Is life better for the person who can now fish for themselves? Yup. But it wasn't necessarily easy.
You aren't a socialist until you gave them fish everyday and the address and cell number of the fishermen in the event you were out of town, lol.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: zack1234 on August 15, 2015, 01:35:10 AM
I am sorry, sometimes I am a little slow. Just so that I understand, you are saying that under certain conditions a civilian can own a machine gun (something that fires off some number of bullets in a burst) if the gun was made before 1986 and that a licensed civilian can own any full auto gun. Yes? No?
Yes as a generic answer.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Meatwad on August 15, 2015, 05:19:16 PM
Ink why are you saying such things it very cruel to upset the dream.
Its North Koreas fault, well next month it will be.
Funny that Greece and EU not collasped yet?
Paranoid is the new pie :old:
I think they should ban guns as well in the US especially those in the midwest :)
My constipated rights and that. B
Banning guns in the midwest would make us resort to having to run all our food over instead of shooting it. Coons and possums get boring for supper after a while
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: guncrasher on August 15, 2015, 07:11:08 PM
Ink why are you saying such things it very cruel to upset the dream.
Its North Koreas fault, well next month it will be.
Funny that Greece and EU not collasped yet?
Paranoid is the new pie :old:
I think they should ban guns as well in the US especially those in the midwest :)
My constipated rights and that. B
zach it basically comes down to this, you arent here, we are. you think you know, but you dont really know.
the turning point for me was watching this movie "the wild geese". when a south african guy comes to term with a black man. they both realize the need each other to survive.
prior to that even though I had never seen a black guy, I hated them, based on what my family had taught me. they had never seen a black guy either. that is sad isnt it? hating a group of people you had never even seen just based on what others told you.
first time i had interacted with a black person was in 1985 when I got a job at this insurance company. then I found out they were not different than me, I dated this beautiful black girl. she was Golly-geen gorgeous, then we broke up. it just happens she was just full of herself, things happens.
we are all different in a way. but we better stick together or we are all screwed.
semp
semp
semp
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: PR3D4TOR on August 15, 2015, 07:35:12 PM
I love that movie Semp.
You were taught to hate black people? For what?
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: craz07 on August 15, 2015, 07:44:15 PM
black women may be not what ur used to but i know and they are a lot to handle, similair to white chicks now that i think about it
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: danny76 on August 19, 2015, 12:30:39 AM
I would expect an investigation, the 'unarmed' kid was armed with a 2000lb metal blunt instrument, I have no issue whatsoever with him getting nailed. Rightly or wrongly the US standard LEO response to having a vehicle driven towards them is to open fire, and that's fine. My rules of engagement on active service said the same thing, that I could open fire without warning if someone was "deliberately driving a vehicle at a person and there was no other way of stopping him/her".
Every police shooting is investigated,, and officers either punished or exonerated. My OP was merely suggesting that because in this instance the backstop was a white guy, there would not be collective mass indignation from the white community, followed by rioting and more deaths.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: NatCigg on August 19, 2015, 01:02:18 AM
We invented the system in Scotland and used it to make the British Empire.
That Ferguson scene has not affected the IMF.
Wrong.
The only two things Scotland invented were:
1. Ghillie suits 2. The troll. (Scotland never really wanted to be free of England, eh? 1 million Scots died over the centuries so that the vote would be NO, lmao). That is a 10 century troll.
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: zack1234 on August 19, 2015, 03:44:54 PM
If they left the UK they would have to scrounge of the EU :old:
Title: Re: White teenager shot in back
Post by: Zoney on August 19, 2015, 04:52:53 PM