Me 210/410

[moot]

There doesn't seem to be any reason to have the Me410A. The engines are no different and all its gun loadouts are matched by some B model's. Its lighter weight (if they really did beef up the frame for the planned DB603G) and/or bomb loadout options might make it worthwhile, or it could spread out the loadout options, if there's not enough room in the hangar for all the different configurations. If we try and remove redundant configurations to narrow down the options, we can pick pick them so that we get:
A lightweight cfg: The B1 (2x131 + 2x20mm), or B2/U2/R2 (2x20mm + 2x108). The A1 is the same as the B1, but with MG17s instead of MG131s. Ironically, both the A1 and B1 which people might pick to dogfight with, have that Stuvi gunsight.
A clean MK103 cfg: The B2/U2/R3 (2x103 + 2x20mm).
A 6x20mm cfg: The B2/U2/R5.
A BK5 cfg: The B1/U4 (lightest of the BK5 loadouts) with BK5 + 2x20mm, which probably walls up some of the glass cockpit since the BK5 is in the nose for this one.  The B2/U4 would be the next BK5 cfg to include (2x103+BK5) since it's a more useful loadout than A1/U4 (2xMG17+2x20mm+BK5) for roughly the same weight.
Maybe a maximum firepower config.. : The B2/U4 (2x103 + BK5 in the belly) for strongest instantaneous firepower, which actually isn't that strange a combo, since they might have similar ballistics (835 and 860 m/s resp.).  In a total firepower metric, it's by far either the B2/U2/R3 (a pair of 103s and 20mm's) or the B2/U4 (only if "30mm" means the MK103).  That's just 12% less total firepower than a fully gunned 110G2 (4x20+2x30).
A torpedo cfg: B2/U3 with 1 torpedo and a pair of 30mm's, either MK108 or MK103.

Then there's options for drop tanks, WGr21 rockets (4x), and 50kg bombs on the wing pylons, which are on their separate section in the hangar selection. The only complication is the internal bombs, which ought to look like the 110G2's options, maybe adding something like 1/3 or 1/2 more options to the gun package options.

[Krusty]

I don't think torpedos were ever used. Much like testing it on a 190, but not using it, I don't think we should see it on the 410.

Somebody (Pyro? Skuzzy?) has mentioned an upper limit on ord options. Anybody recall WHAT that limit was? I think it was in relation to the p47s or some other plane, that the comment was typed.

[moot]

4klbs limit. The Stuka is right on it, and the Lancaster too with one single bomb at 4klbs.

There's two configs with a torpedo. The B2/U3 and the B5.  The B5 sounds experimental.  Do you know for sure which one (or both) was just in trials?

[Krusty]

I don't mean the size of the bomb. I mean the number of different arming options the game can physically handle before it stops working.

[moot]

Do you remember if it was the combinations, or options total?

[Gianlupo]

I don't think it was so much a "1-off" as much as it was simply not used much. It could carry the gunpod like the 110 could, and like the 190As could under each wing, but like both other planes didn't do it so often.

Someone posted the source and IIRC it said the pilot had the ground crew modify his plane for it.. I can't recall if it actually said one-off, but if it did, it might have been ambiguous in that it could mean the crew or book author didn't know of anyone else who used the configuration, or if it was actually an improvised/custom mod.  Do you remember if there was a factory code for it?

It was a single, specially modified, Me-410B, of II/ZG 26, flown by Lt Rudi Dassow.

[Scherf]

There doesn't seem to be any reason to have the Me410A.

I think the A would be available mid-war Moot, might have a chance to run when necessary.

[moot]

The A looks like it could have all its options fit in the hangar.. That's a good point.  It would most likely ease the load off the B's loadout options, too.

It was a single, specially modified, Me-410B, of II/ZG 26, flown by Lt Rudi Dassow.

That's the one.. There was a comment about the guys in the report that made it sound like the configuration was considered "excessive".  Dassow died in late summer of 44, so that's a rough ballpark timeframe for the mod. Somewhere between early 44 and late August 44.  Actually, no later than sometime in July because ZG26 was disbanded in late July.

[StokesAk]

Wait,did the 410 have 6x20mm?

[moot]

The 410B-2/U2/R5, yep. 

Removing the gunner, barbettes and their ammo would save at least ~350lbs, maybe 400-500. That's without knowing how much the aiming assembly weighs.

[Krusty]

Do you remember if it was the combinations, or options total?

I don't remember. That's why I asked. Could have been either, or both.

[morfiend]

IIRC there is a hardpoint limit,{16} that would include DT,rockets,bombs,torps and guns.

 this would posibly be why the vader isn't in game...

 I see no reason not to have both the A and B models and as for the torps,I'll have to research that as to wether or not they were used in combat.I do know they had a dedicated naval attack sq. just not sure they used torps.

 PS: I'm glad to see all this interest in the Me410,it's a muderous machine...

[moot]

Hardpoints only, not gun modules?

[morfiend]

Hardpoints only, not gun modules?

 IIRC the hard points include gun modules but this is second hand imfo.

 Hopefully this will have no effect on the addition of the 410,BTW I cant find a single documentation on the use of torps,it appears that it was desperation on the Germans part to develope this feature and it never made front line service.

[moot]

Can you give the ref for no operations with the torps?
Do you remember who you got the hard point/gun module info from?

Another view of how much weight could be saved from removing the gunner and all equipment as was common in at least one unit.

It's all about 350lbs without everything between the operator and MG131s themselves (ammo incl.).. probably 500lbs total.