I think youre all looking at this in far too much detail.
I read Bodhi's post not as 'pro-religion' or 'anti-seperation,' but rather as an example that shows the division in our country between those who are Liberal in their views and Conservative in their views. For purposes of clarification, Im using the two terms in their definition sense of the word, not necessarily in their political meaning.
con·ser·va·tive: 1.) Favoring traditional views and values; tending to oppose change
lib·er·al: 1.) Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas. 2.) Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism.
This is not to say that Conservatives are automatically religious maniacs, as many of us detest the same firebrand types as you (Liberals) do.
We're we differ can be seen above in the simplet definitions available; one side of the argument is happy with the way things are and we wish to maintain our way of life. The other side is discontent with many things and wishes to bring change to society.
Change is a good thing in many respects. The views of a Liberal minded person are most welcome in many circumstances, and in most cases, I think you will find that many Conservatives will jump on the boat with you once a convinceing arguement is made and agree that change, in a particular area, is necessary and would improve life for the vast majority of the population.
The problem today, as I see it, is that there are no problems.
Speaking from a purely domestic point of view, what is wrong with our country?
Sure we have poor, but we also have rich. Thats capitalism. Of course we have homeless, but again, thats a byproduct of capitalism. We do everything in our power to help these people along in the form of shelters and mana's, but at the end of the day, this is the land of opportunity, not the land of free handouts.
These are irritations in the grand scheme of things.
The conservatives' frustration comes from the fact that no matter how many times we take a step back and agree that something should change, its never enough. Liberal minded people seem to be constantly searching for something wrong with everything.
Lets be honest here, how many of you are grossly offended by the fact that hurricanes dont have racially diverse names? How many of you are honestly offended by a plaque of the 10 Commandments outside a courthouse? How many of you are loosing sleep because the State of Florida wants a Muslim woman to remove her veil for a drivers liscence photo?
These are not problems. They are simple issues that people disagree on. Disagreement is ok, but its no excuse to be marching off to the Supreme Court foaming at the mouth.
You dont want to read the 10 Commandments? Dont read them. Why is it that the people in the gay thread preaching about tolerance and acceptance are the same people in this thread preaching about intolerance for somethign else? Are you only tolerant of behavior that you dont see a problem with? Being tolerant of something suggests that whatever you are tolerant of is something you disagree with. I disagree with homosexuality, but Im tolerant of it. I dont go knocking down doors of the local gay population and try and catch them pushing their **** in. I let them do what they like - Im tolerant.
You, on the other hand, take a different approach, and its the approach that causes even more anger. You do in fact knock down doors in an attempt to change the way people live their lives. You are not tolerant. You want change, and if change is not wanted by the rest, you lobby Congress for laws that force others to conform to your wishes. Liberalism today is the ultimate incarnation of hypocracy. How can you champion tolerance, acceptance, and totallack of bigotry, while at the same time, utilize meathods completely at odds with your mindset to achieve your aims?
I believe Bodhi's point was that the Liberal segment of the population has grown too large and too used to getting what they want as long as they use keywords like 'harrassment,' 'bigot,' 'caveman,' or 'discrimination.' By contrast, the Conservative segment of the population is fed up with bending over backwards in an attempt to appease you.
Where does it end? It started with the Civil Rights movement, a most worthy cause, and an instutution deserving of change, as agreed upon by both ideologies... but then you decided that cartoons were too violent, soda was bad for you, cigarettes should cost $5 a pack, and you, under no circumstances, should be complimenting a woman on the way she looks in the workplace.
What he is saying is that this trend needs to stop.
These colonies, and indeed this country were/was founded on a single principle: Freedom. In the United States, we believe in freedom, liberation to attain that freedom, and force to protect that freedom.
Our government for the passed 200 odd years has reflected this. Freedom to be an individual, ungoverned by a ruling class, is why people came here. Freedom FROM government.
Lately, it seems that this trend is dying. Some of the legislation over the past 15 years is almost scary. No longer is our government protecting our rights to be individuals in a free and safe society, but it has folded to public pressure from individuals confused enough to stand in front of an Israeli bulldozer, and is now dictating HOW we should live our lives.
Bodhi's, mine, and many other peoples' concern is that this trend has continued for long enough and at this point is only causing a wider rift between people and inflicting damage along the way.
Not everything needs to be changed. Most of the flaws have been worked out after 200 years of operation. Sure there are more, the healthcare debate, the threat of extremists terrorist organizations, and others, but they will all be dealt with in time.
Whether or not we've ever had a 'Hurricane Jay-Z' is not one of the big issues facing our society today - so please - stop treating it as such and expecting us to take you seriously. And after you figure out that we're not listening, please dont resort to taunts of 'caveman' and 'racist.' Its growing tiresome... especially when the usage of such terms is aimed only at forcing conformity through shame or embarressment.
Not everyone is interested in conforming to your rules or your definition of what the status quo should be. As Americans we are ALL different. Different in culture, race, and creed.
This is something to be celebrated, something to take pride in... it is not to serve as the fuel for some of you to continue in your crusade further sterilize this country by removing every shred of human emotion, desire, and belief.
Liberals claim to be tolerant of all - so why not let all of us be different?
