Author Topic: FesterMA is Fester FURBALL (Read 9305 times)

Rude · « **Reply #90 on:** November 20, 2003, 09:18:42 AM »

The reason Lazs K/T went up last night was because he flew with the 13th last night.....we tend to look out for him and share our kills in a democratic fashion so as to allow for everyone to have some fun.

If those in the heavens would come down and fight instead of sightseeing, we wouldn't have these discussions.

The fight between 4 and 5 was pretty good last night....kind of a fluke.

leitwolf · « **Reply #91 on:** November 20, 2003, 09:21:59 AM »

Quote

Maybe you should read some WW2 books by some real WW2 pilots. Sometimes they would go for weeks without getting kill or even seeing the enemy. Of course, you would find that boring.

You wouldn't?

Quote

As for one or a handful of tards ruining the fun of others, would you consider a buff (or handful of 110s working together) levelling the fighter hangars at a field as "ruining the fun for many others"? I think you're quite wrong if you do. That's a perfectly legitimate purpose for buffs. Some people whine when that happens, but for buffs to destroy a ground target is sort of the whole bleedin' point. When are you dolts going to understand that?

I never said bombers or missions are the problem. Actually with the 'new' bombsight the impact of bombers is very small, maybe too small but then a single buff is perfectly capable of shutting down a field it just takes practice and skill. I would be delighted to see big bomber missions again, there used to be huge bomber formations leveling every base they came across.
For a puristic furballer this is a stretch but like you said between the furball type and the strat type are shades of grey and a huge bomber formation darkening the skies is a lot more balanced than a single pork+auger player because it takes effort and coordination and it gives the defending side a better opportunity to intercept this raid - exactly the fight we want.
Having the post-laser guided new Norden and two (relatively) new unstopable interceptors (Me262 and Me163) the effectivity of bombers is 'neutered' to a level where dive bombing with fast fighters has a higher chance of success. Nothing wrong with Jabo attacks but once the strat guys figured out their chance to kill a building is higher if they don't plan to return again the balance was completely off.

Quote

I think it's mildly insulting to HTC to describe the strat in the MA as a silly little side show. They have gone to great lengths to put it

I never said it's a side show, it is a nice aspect of a great game and I believe it's part of the success of this game. I just said that this game is evolving and has been adjusted in the past in order to (re)gain a balanced gameplay.
Bombers used to be too effective in terms of how many people it takes to close a field and how many to defend it against them; now bombers are "useless" in their primary role because a heavy fighter can accomplish the same net effect in less time.

Quote

It is a WW2 combat experience - check the caption on the HTC homepage. It is not billed as a furball fantasy, or simply a dogfight dreamland.

Sure, but dive bombing attacks by B-26s, B-17s and Lancaster formations(!) to kill a carrier, suicide runs to fly a bomb into a hangar again and again aren't realistic either.

Quote

If you're only interested in half or one third of the game that HTC has produced for the MA, you can find that third in the DA.

Furball types have no place in the main arena?

If you say so... but please don't come back and tell us the furball crowd sees themselves as superior to a strat player (like Rutilant did)

Rutilant · « **Reply #92 on:** November 20, 2003, 09:25:28 AM »

I did, lietwolf? I find that hard to believe, because all i'm doing is battling the furballers that think they're superior to a strat player.

But tell me where i did and i'll appologize for it.

Shane · « **Reply #93 on:** November 20, 2003, 09:36:49 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by leitwolf
Having the post-laser guided new Norden and two (relatively) new unstopable interceptors (Me262 and Me163) the effectivity of bombers is 'neutered' to a level where dive bombing with fast fighters has a higher chance of success. Nothing wrong with Jabo attacks but once the strat guys figured out their chance to kill a building is higher if they don't plan to return again the balance was completely off.

Bombers used to be too effective in terms of how many people it takes to close a field and how many to defend it against them; now bombers are "useless" in their primary role because a heavy fighter can accomplish the same net effect in less time.

i guess it's too much to expect PROPER[/b] fighter escort?

btw the buffs weren't used as tactical bombing platforms very often.

so much for ToD...

lazs2 · « **Reply #94 on:** November 20, 2003, 11:03:21 AM »

deja... I didn't realize you were tracking me on a daily basis... I happened to see both/ all three days stats and it appears that my K/H stayed about the same on festers map and on mindy..

I think many would agree that mindy is next in line behind festers map so far as a good furball map..

you act like I never flew pizza.... i hve beu coop hours on it and my perception is that 9 out of 10 times it sucks. I keep up my K/H on any map because of the way I fly not because of the map... if there is no fight I don't take off..... on crappy maps like pizza I spend a lot of time in the tower or... at a furball for an hour and then logging off when the strat sissisies have crapped in the only sandbox there is to play in.

While my time in festers map is only a few hours.... I never found a time when I didn't have choice.

As far as "them".... why do you leave them out? because the vast majority think festers map is great and pizza is crap?

And yes... I knew festers map would be a hit based on nothing but field spacing. face it... regardless of how many hours I have spent on it... the map is a hit... you can't say that OI haven't had fun on it the time I have spent on it either.... you can't say that I haven't spent enough time on pizza abortion to form an opinion either.

So... I will comprimise.... so far... in the limited time I have spent on festers map it has been the best of all of em so far as choice of places to fight..... so far... in the countless hours I have spent on the pizza abortion it is the worst map so far as choice of places to fight.
lazs

Mini D · « **Reply #95 on:** November 20, 2003, 11:55:05 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Rude
The reason Lazs K/T went up last night was because he flew with the 13th last night.....we tend to look out for him and share our kills in a democratic fashion so as to allow for everyone to have some fun.

If those in the heavens would come down and fight instead of sightseeing, we wouldn't have these discussions.

The fight between 4 and 5 was pretty good last night....kind of a fluke.

Wow... did you just say it's who you fly with that makes the difference... not the map? Oh wait... you still managed to get an alt monkey dig in there... despite being able to find plenty of good fights.

And lazs... you're K/T did not go up on fester's map. I was watching. It was the lowest it had been in 5 tours... both times you played the map. All you really did after it was introduced was play less. To summarize: You sparcely played fester's map and you're k/t was less than it was on all other maps combined. You say you just log off when there's not your type of fight going on, but you don't log on for fester's map. No... no conflicts there lazs. No real reason to question your oppinion of it. None at all.

MiniD

beet1e · « **Reply #96 on:** November 20, 2003, 01:15:16 PM »

Batz! You sound just like Toad.

Right down to your black or white assessment of every issue of this game.

Of course the MA is not real. Even the scenario arenas can't be real. I said what I thought the strat game equated to in my Chess analogy - my first post in this thread. Note that was an analogy, not a comparison - seems some folks don't understand the difference.

Quote

The difference is at one time nobody cared what the other guy did and no one made it their goal to stop the other side from flying.

I thought stopping the enemy from flying was what this game was all about. We cap bases - to stop them from flying. We get on their sixes and shoot them down - to stop them from flying. And we can bomb fighter hangars - to stop them from flying - what's the difference? It's a perfectly legitimate tactic. Fuel porkage is the act of a cad, and is as ungentlemanly as vulching. Let he who has never vulched cast the first stone.

In black and white terms, we have AH gameplay and real WW2 as black and white. But there are shades of grey in between! Actual missions with actual goals... working with who happens to be available instead of with a bunch of hand picked mates like Lazs last night. Working with the available aircraft instead of being able to fly your favourite uberplane, or the best plane for the job. OK, it's still not REAL, but would be a lot more real than the AirQuake we have now.

OK, so you're a furballer. Do not make the false assumption that every non-furballer is therefore a strat player. Again, there is more to it than black and white. Suicide Fuel Porker is not a strat player, but a tard with no interest in WW2. But even if your field does get fuel porked back to 25%, on this map, with the fields close together, you could up a 109 with 25%, fly 2 minutes to the nearest field, get a few kills and RTB. I did it yesterday. OK, I had 50% fuel to begin with, but 25% remaining at the end. Alternatively, you could act upon your own advice, and take off from one field further back. You do remember suggesting that, don't you?

I don't see why I'm being called upon to say what is not available to the strat player on Fester's map which is available on other maps. I have made observations about the gameplay that I first saw on this map - walls of LA7s, Aerial Quake... if you can find a thread where I have said that this map compromises the strat game, ask me in that thread, and I'll do my best to reply. I think that's fair enough, because right now I do not know what charges I'm answering to.

I will say that the close fields means greater likelihood of interception by interlopers. They come from nowhere. I keep the warning sounds turned on when this map is up. Joann has got me out of a few potential scrapes!

lazs2 · « **Reply #97 on:** November 20, 2003, 03:11:05 PM »

I admit it.... I am nothing without the 13th tas.

oh... I had two days on festers and one on mindy... K/H was about the same so?
lazs

Jackal1 · « **Reply #98 on:** November 21, 2003, 03:52:46 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
I admit it.... I am nothing without the 13th tas.

lazs

................... and very little with em.

Batz · « **Reply #99 on:** November 21, 2003, 06:51:36 AM »

Quote

Batz, you are also sounding like Toad in your interpretation of "strat player".

You are quite wrong there. I was beating this drum when Toad and Crew were still orbiting the planet.

My interpretation of "strat players" goes back to laser guided fluffers porking FHs and knocking radar out for 2 hours. I believe at that time Laz and I were the only ones calling it what it is.

The rest were "fly how you want/whine of the week" types. It wasn’t until they got into thicker o2 that they realized furballing is fun and there’s a group of folks who hate you for doing it. But even since then it has shifted even further out of balance.

SLO · « **Reply #100 on:** November 21, 2003, 07:44:14 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Steve
Sad but true. More than once in the last couple of days I've upped a plane to go after a darbar over an undefended base. I and whoever came w/ me would kill the attackers, then the enemy would evaporate in order to find an undefended field to de-ack and wait for vulch victims....darbar shows up several sectors away... rinse and repeat.

well steve....maybe we should call you before we decide to do anything.

as for killing all....i doubt that

thats what gets on my nerves with FesterMA....so many bases.

I don't know how many times we pushed Rooks or Nits just to get nothing out of it....

front lines stretched so much....you need lots to defend it all...ain't gonna happen.

its a cycle....push then get pushed back.

and I still don't understand....Milkin a Base...factory yes....Base.....not in my book....for christ sake...its a base....up and defend it bozo:aok

not a bad map....some improvements needed....only for rooks to reset the map was gettin nits to help....and yes they where helpin

artik · « **Reply #101 on:** November 21, 2003, 07:54:02 AM »

Ok Guyes.

Looks my thread opened interesting issue.

What is strat player?
The player who flys Jabos, Buffs porking fields.
What is furball player?
NiKi, Spit9 dweeb players that likes fast action.

At least that looks like from all your descriptions

Have you ever think that most of players are not first and not the second.

Yes sometimes I roll with Spit or La7 to defend base that is vulched, or sometime enter huge furrball - because I get to wrong plane in wrong time - I not really like it.

Sometimes I do bombing strat targets - to get perks for buffs or kill a ship with Stuka's 1800kb bomb. Or make town flat with bomber. A lot of times kill VH - am I strat guye? I don't think so

Most of players IMHO like to do all things to have fights, duels, to make some bombruns. All type of things. Someone likes furballs more and someone likes jabo missions more.

I personaly like to take a part in mission - to see coaperation on-line.

So lets don't tell strat players furball players.

And my point of view is that FesterMA is much more suitable for players that likes furballs only and not something in the middle. When most of terrains are balanced to make same good environment for all types of players from furballere up to strat players as you call them, when Fester is not balanced.

That is my main point of view

Toad · « **Reply #102 on:** November 21, 2003, 07:57:42 AM »

I see nothing has changed.

So, I'll go back pheasant hunting.

BTW, you guys mentioning me don't know what the fox you're talking about. But my desire to engage on the BBS wanes sharply during bird season, so proceed.

Ta-ta. Back in 5 days or so. I expect the same ole stuff will still be served up in this thread.

"Dear Cod, please hustle up HTC and get TOD out so the "realists" can have a home.

Amen."

Jackal1 · « **Reply #103 on:** November 21, 2003, 08:46:21 AM »

Try to avoid HO with the birds.

Dead Man Flying · « **Reply #104 on:** November 21, 2003, 10:38:52 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by meddog
This is my third game. I use to play Warbirds (untill they raised their prices) and before that Air Worriior (before thay went out of bussiness) and this battle was never an issue cuz everyone seem to understand what the game was all about. , which is to take the enemy bases and win the reset.

Eh? The former producer of Air Warrior himself stated that the purpose of "strat" or base destruction/capture was to create air combat opportunities. Taking enemy bases was a means to an end and not the end itself.

That may or may not represent the design philosophy behind Aces High, but don't talk as if it was always the norm in these types of games. Hell, back in Dos AW and AW4W, you could only take a small number of neutral bases in the middle of the map. How exactly did one go about resetting that map?

-- Todd/Leviathn